Possible TCF Beer Garden that has U support?

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Equating Division 1 college football and t-ball is absurd. Also, for someone who really criticizes others who name call, you sure call a lot of people names.
 

A couple of thoughts......

1st - for the record, I am a recovering alcoholic. I went through outpatient treatment twice, and then I was court-ordered into Inpatient treatment as a condition of getting my drivers' license back. I haven't had a drink since Easter Sunday, 1986.

dpodoll - I have to take issue with your assertion that anyone who can't go through a game without a beer has a problem. I can't drink "responsibly" - I don't have an off switch when it comes to booze and chemicals - If I have 1 beer, I want to keep drinking until I pass out. But, there are many other people who are not alcoholics, and simply like to enjoy a beer or two at social events - including the rest of my family. If someone wants to have 1 or 2 beers at a game, I have no problem with that. Just because I can't (or shouldn't) drink, that doesn't mean that I want to deny everyone else the opportunity to enjoy a beer at a game. We're talking about a football game - I think the vast majority of people can draw the distinction between a sporting event, and other university-sponsored functions where alcohol use may not be appropriate. (although I could have used a beer or two during some of my college classes - talk about dry...........)

I think the idea of allowing alcohol in suites, and establishing a beer garden is a reasonable compromise. And I'm shocked that anything resembling a reasonable compromise came out of the dysfunctional mess that is our glorious MN State legislature. I think the key to making it work would be education - use it as a teaching opportunity to reinforce on the students what "responsible" drinking means, and stressing the absolute need to avoid driving under the influence. Hey- how about a discount on ticket prices for designated drivers? I'd go for that.......

As somebody else pointed out, people who really want to drink will find ways to smuggle booze into games. I would rather make it available in a controlled setting, in hopes of discouraging clandestine drinking.
 

dpodoll68 said:
You are watching amateur athletes. If you can't go 4 hours without having alcohol, you have a problem and need treatment. Why should we stop at college games? Should they start selling beer at HS football games too? How about Little League? Piano recitals? Can't sit through Timmy's t-ball game without a brewski in your hand?

A university should not be in the business of selling alcohol to its own students, regardless of whether they are of legal age or not. The purpose of a university is to educate, not inebriate. If available to the suites only, it is true that some University students would undoubtedly be sold alcohol by the University, but they would be a select few and would have paid handsomely for the privilege. Under no circumstances should a university be selling alcohol to its own students when the barrier they had to overcome was a $10 (or less) ticket to a football game.

It is good to be a trailblazer and start a trend in some aspects, but being the first to sell alcohol to the general student population, at a university function, on university property, is not one of them. There are many reasons why not a single Big Ten university sells alcohol to the general student population at university events.
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Wrong!...We've been to UW Madison many many times, and they serve beer every single day to students and staff at the student union right on the banks of Lake Mendota. The U should not have to be at an economic disadvantage just because they don't serve beer in certain areas. I've been to so many luncheons and other gathering at TCF Stadium and would love to have a beer with friends before and after, but no such luck. If you don't want a beer, then don't drink one, but why put the U at a disadvantage. Get with the times....almost all of the Big10 schools are selling it in their suites.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
A couple of thoughts......

1st - for the record, I am a recovering alcoholic. I went through outpatient treatment twice, and then I was court-ordered into Inpatient treatment as a condition of getting my drivers' license back. I haven't had a drink since Easter Sunday, 1986.

dpodoll - I have to take issue with your assertion that anyone who can't go through a game without a beer has a problem. I can't drink "responsibly" - I don't have an off switch when it comes to booze and chemicals - If I have 1 beer, I want to keep drinking until I pass out. But, there are many other people who are not alcoholics, and simply like to enjoy a beer or two at social events - including the rest of my family. If someone wants to have 1 or 2 beers at a game, I have no problem with that. Just because I can't (or shouldn't) drink, that doesn't mean that I want to deny everyone else the opportunity to enjoy a beer at a game. We're talking about a football game - I think the vast majority of people can draw the distinction between a sporting event, and other university-sponsored functions where alcohol use may not be appropriate. (although I could have used a beer or two during some of my college classes - talk about dry...........)

I think the idea of allowing alcohol in suites, and establishing a beer garden is a reasonable compromise. And I'm shocked that anything resembling a reasonable compromise came out of the dysfunctional mess that is our glorious MN State legislature. I think the key to making it work would be education - use it as a teaching opportunity to reinforce on the students what "responsible" drinking means, and stressing the absolute need to avoid driving under the influence. Hey- how about a discount on ticket prices for designated drivers? I'd go for that.......

As somebody else pointed out, people who really want to drink will find ways to smuggle booze into games. I would rather make it available in a controlled setting, in hopes of discouraging clandestine drinking.
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well said!
 


Well said Shorty! It is nice to see that somebody understands the term balanced and knows how to compromise.
 

go4rob said:
Wrong!...We've been to UW Madison many many times, and they serve beer every single day to students and staff at the student union right on the banks of Lake Mendota. The U should not have to be at an economic disadvantage just because they don't serve beer in certain areas. I've been to so many luncheons and other gathering at TCF Stadium and would love to have a beer with friends before and after, but no such luck. If you don't want a beer, then don't drink one, but why put the U at a disadvantage. Get with the times....almost all of the Big10 schools are selling it in their suites.
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I think only four of the 12 stadiums serve booze in the premium areas. Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue and Illinois.
 

go4rob said:
Wrong!...We've been to UW Madison many many times, and they serve beer every single day to students and staff at the student union right on the banks of Lake Mendota. The U should not have to be at an economic disadvantage just because they don't serve beer in certain areas. I've been to so many luncheons and other gathering at TCF Stadium and would love to have a beer with friends before and after, but no such luck. If you don't want a beer, then don't drink one, but why put the U at a disadvantage. Get with the times....almost all of the Big10 schools are selling it in their suites.
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What is the "Wrong!" about? Nothing you said has anything to do with anything I've said, nor anything to do with the topic at hand. Try harder.
 

Gopher07 said:
I think only four of the 12 stadiums serve booze in the premium areas. Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue and Illinois.
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I don't know which do, but I do know 3 schools that for sure do not: OSU, Michigan, Nebby.
 



GoAUpher said:
I don't know which do, but I do know 3 schools that for sure do not: OSU, Michigan, Nebby.
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The four most successful football programs, historically, in the Big Ten: Ohio St., Michigan, Minnesota, and Nebraska. None of them serve beer, at all, in their stadiums, and many of you want us to be the first. And not only that, you want it to happen via a redneck beer garden. Unbelievable. When my wife got home from work last night, I asked "Sum up your reaction, in one word, to the phrase 'beer garden in TCF Bank Stadium'." Her response: "Tacky." I couldn't have said it better myself.
 

Can't wait until spring practice begins! When does it begin?
 


dpodoll68 said:
The four most successful football programs, historically, in the Big Ten: Ohio St., Michigan, Minnesota, and Nebraska. None of them serve beer, at all, in their stadiums, and many of you want us to be the first. And not only that, you want it to happen via a redneck beer garden. Unbelievable. When my wife got home from work last night, I asked "Sum up your reaction, in one word, to the phrase 'beer garden in TCF Bank Stadium'." Her response: "Tacky." I couldn't have said it better myself.
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Well since your wife said it was tacky, I guess we should all change our opinions. No offense, but whenever a guy quotes his wife to help prove his opinion about beer and football, you instantly lose all credibility. It's funny how you don't respond to most objective post on here: Short Ornery Norwegian's response. Why is drinking to you always "redneck?" I don't get that?
 



savagerube said:
Well since your wife said it was tacky, I guess we should all change our opinions. No offense, but whenever a guy quotes his wife to help prove his opinion about beer and football, you instantly lose all credibility.
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Because how could a WOMAN know sh!t about sports and beer? Back in the kitchen they belong, am I right, bud?
 

savagerube said:
No offense, but whenever a guy quotes his wife to help prove his opinion about beer and football, you instantly lose all credibility.
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Whenever a misogynist dink instantly thinks women are complete idiots about "guy" things, they instantly lose all credibility. And "no offense" doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want. Sort of like "bless his heart" is a nice way of couching your opinion that someone is basically functioning at a low level. I'm sure my wife isn't offended that you automatically discount her opinion because she has a vagina.

savagerube said:
It's funny how you don't respond to most objective post on here: Short Ornery Norwegian's response.
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I was unaware that there is a dictum that I cannot respond to whomever and whatever I please. I will PM you before each message I post from now on, so that I have your approval as to my posting behaviors. Sound good?

savagerube said:
Why is drinking to you always "redneck?" I don't get that?
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Please cite where I said that. Thanks! It's a lot easier to have an honest debate when you don't make up the other person's opinions for them.

Beer gardens are, by their inherent nature, redneck. Period. I know. I grew up in Redneckville, USA (rural SD), and I've been to plenty of beer gardens in my life. They have their time and place, and it's not at a college football game. I want them nowhere near my University. It's more of an open debate as to whether you think a University serving its own students alcohol is indicative of redneck behavior. I happen to think it's in direct contravention with everything a university is supposed to stand for. Then again, I also want my University to maintain class and dignity, so obviously I'm in a tiny minority who post on this board.
 

The "legal product" argument doesn't work. We keep hearing "Beer is a legal product, therefore, it must be sold at Gopher games." But that conclusion doesn't follow from the premise. There needs to be another premise to link them together. The only thing that would seem to connect them is "All legal products must be sold at Gopher games."

Then you have an argument:

Beer is a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, beer must be sold at Gopher games.

But the problem with this argument is that the argument has to work whatever legal product we put into the initial premise. Thus we could have:

Fireworks are a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, fireworks must be sold at Gopher games.

If there are legitimate reasons not to sell fireworks at Gopher games, then the second premise is incorrect. If it is not the case that all legal products must be sold at Gopher games, then the argument that beer is a legal product, and therefore must be sold at Gopher games fails.

It of course doesn't mean that the University must not sell beer at Gophers games, that is up to the University. However, the status of beer as a legal product doesn't have anything to do with selling it at Gopher games. If beer was an illegal product it could not be sold at Gopher games, but being legal does not mean it must be sold at Gopher games.
 

My wife would have said "You're telling me you spent your whole day agruing with people on Gopherhole about a beer garden? Grow up."
 

dpodoll68 said:
The four most successful football programs, historically, in the Big Ten: Ohio St., Michigan, Minnesota, and Nebraska.
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Which one doesn't belong among the other 3 anymore? This is a stretch dpodoll. The other 3 don't offer it because they don't have to. To be fair, Nebby banned it a few years ago after some bad suite holder behavior I think. But the fact remains, that it's easier for them to stand on principle. They can take the financial hit.
 

I don't know if it's been brought up yet (didn't feel like reading all 8 pages of previous posts), but UMD Hockey has the "Blue Line Club" (not sure if they changed the name in the new arena) that is essentially an indoor beer garden. It's part of the fun of our Gopher hockey road trips to Duluth. You can leave the arena to grab a beer at the Blue Line Club and then re-enter. Most people just go there between periods so as not to miss any of the game. It is well-monitored (I'm almost 40 and I get carded) and pretty low-key.

I know the situation is different at TCF (outdoors, 50,000 vs 7,000 people), but I think if it was done right, a beer garden wouldn't be that big of a deal. How many people would want to miss a big chunk of the game just to have a beer? I would think it would be busy before the game and at halftime and that's about it. I'm assuming you wouldn't be able to bring your drink back to your seats.
 

I've asked this question multiple times on this thread, and (unsurprisingly) have received zero responses. I'll try phrasing it a different way and see if anyone will actually answer it this time.

This is direct from the Gopher Sports website and outlines their stance on football gameday policies:

"Items prohibited: (included but not limited to): aerosol cans, alcohol, animals (except assistive animals), backpacks, luggage, duffle bags, camera cases, cameras with lenses over 6” long, camcorders & tripods, bags larger than 12” x 12”, balloons, balls, banners, beverages, cans, bottles, thermoses, chairbacks, coolers, fireworks, food, laser pointers, markers and/or paint, noisemaking devices, strollers and car seats or carriers, and tobacco"

If I'm not mistaken (and I'm nowhere near 100% on this), I believe there is a sign at all entrances that more or less states the same thing. So, I ask again: why beer? What about beer is so inherently important that it must be made available to all individuals of legal age in the stadium? Why not air horns? Why not thermoses? Why not laser pointers? Why not tobacco? Why is there no one fighting or lobbying for any of these things? And if you are of the opinion that you must be served beer, why only beer? Why not hard alcohol? Should a full selection of vodka, gin, brandy, rum, schnapps, and assorted liqueurs be available? And if not, why not? What is the inherent difference between beer and hard alcohol?

No one will answer the "If beer, then why not x, y, and z" because they know it will speak volumes about what they hold important in their lives. If "having beer in my hand at a college football game" is anywhere near the top 100 priorities in your life, or anywhere near the top 1,000, for that matter, you have a problem.
 

savagerube said:
Well since your wife said it was tacky, I guess we should all change our opinions. No offense, but whenever a guy quotes his wife to help prove his opinion about beer and football, you instantly lose all credibility. It's funny how you don't respond to most objective post on here: Short Ornery Norwegian's response. Why is drinking to you always "redneck?" I don't get that?
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Hey, I drink, but not like this...

redneck-beer.jpg
beerandbourbon-225x300.jpg


2276_image.jpg
 

RodentRampage said:
The "legal product" argument doesn't work. We keep hearing "Beer is a legal product, therefore, it must be sold at Gopher games." But that conclusion doesn't follow from the premise. There needs to be another premise to link them together. The only thing that would seem to connect them is "All legal products must be sold at Gopher games."

Then you have an argument:

Beer is a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, beer must be sold at Gopher games.

But the problem with this argument is that the argument has to work whatever legal product we put into the initial premise. Thus we could have:

Fireworks are a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, fireworks must be sold at Gopher games.

If there are legitimate reasons not to sell fireworks at Gopher games, then the second premise is incorrect. If it is not the case that all legal products must be sold at Gopher games, then the argument that beer is a legal product, and therefore must be sold at Gopher games fails.

It of course doesn't mean that the University must not sell beer at Gophers games, that is up to the University. However, the status of beer as a legal product doesn't have anything to do with selling it at Gopher games. If beer was an illegal product it could not be sold at Gopher games, but being legal does not mean it must be sold at Gopher games.
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Thank you! I'm glad someone of intelligence is stating, more succinctly than I can, what exactly I've been saying through this entire thread. Of course, the shake-with-convulsions-if-I-can't-have-a-beer-in-my-hand-for-4-consecutive-hours crowd won't answer my questions as to why beer is more necessary and important than any other widely available legal product.
 

RodentRampage said:
The "legal product" argument doesn't work. We keep hearing "Beer is a legal product, therefore, it must be sold at Gopher games." But that conclusion doesn't follow from the premise. There needs to be another premise to link them together. The only thing that would seem to connect them is "All legal products must be sold at Gopher games."

Then you have an argument:

Beer is a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, beer must be sold at Gopher games.

But the problem with this argument is that the argument has to work whatever legal product we put into the initial premise. Thus we could have:

Fireworks are a legal product.
All legal products must be sold at Gopher games.
Therefore, fireworks must be sold at Gopher games.

If there are legitimate reasons not to sell fireworks at Gopher games, then the second premise is incorrect. If it is not the case that all legal products must be sold at Gopher games, then the argument that beer is a legal product, and therefore must be sold at Gopher games fails.

It of course doesn't mean that the University must not sell beer at Gophers games, that is up to the University. However, the status of beer as a legal product doesn't have anything to do with selling it at Gopher games. If beer was an illegal product it could not be sold at Gopher games, but being legal does not mean it must be sold at Gopher games.
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Philosophy 101?:)
 

dpodoll68 said:
No one will answer the "If beer, then why not x, y, and z" because they know it will speak volumes about what they hold important in their lives. If "having beer in my hand at a college football game" is anywhere near the top 100 priorities in your life, or anywhere near the top 1,000, for that matter, you have a problem.
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All it means is that beer is more important to them than air horns, tobacco products (they might not smoke or chew), laser pointers, etc. You have no idea what anyone's priorities are (just as other posters have no idea what your upbringing was like or your own drinking habits are). Pointing out the other prohibited items makes sense if people are trying to claim that beer is "special" (it's not). But otherwise you're just making assumptions about their priorities in life.

Your general opinion is pretty straightforward and makes sense. Folks might not agree, but that doesn't matter because it's an opinion. But trying to win this argument by turning anyone who supports beer in GA as "having a problem" is getting silly. There are plenty of people who probably don't care that TCF is currently dry, but if given the opportunity would choose to have a beer or two at halftime or some other point. That's not having a problem.
 


dpodoll68 said:
Thank you! I'm glad someone of intelligence is stating, more succinctly than I can, what exactly I've been saying through this entire thread. Of course, the shake-with-convulsions-if-I-can't-have-a-beer-in-my-hand-for-4-consecutive-hours crowd won't answer my questions as to why beer is more necessary and important than any other widely available legal product.
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Because that is not the discussion those who don't agree with you are stating.

Look...I'm not here to try to change you mind. Would I like a beer during the game? Maybe. I probably would not because I really have a hard time justifying paying $8 for $0.50 worth of product. I may or may not have a beer or cocktail before the game, depending on whether or not I'm driving, and whether or not my kids are with me.

I think the people who disagree with you can understand your hard line in the sand belief that you oppose the idea. But they can justify, within themselves, that a person should have the right to responsibly enjoy an adult beverage if that option is made available to them.

Like I said, even if I wanted to change your mind, I don't think I could, simply because that is your belief, and you have every right to that. So I don't think you should believe that you can change everyone else's opinion. You may sway a few people who couldn't really care, but you won't sway everyone that does not agree with you.
 

I like to drink beer. If they have a beer garden at TCF, I will probably have one occasionally unless there is a long line and is a pain in the ass to get (which I assume it will be). If they don't have a beer garden, my life will not really change at all. I don't really know why this is such a huge deal. If it passes, will it really be that god awful for everyone involved? If it doesn't pass, will it really be that god awful for everyone involved?

I would prefer the "U" spent its time and effort making the tail-gate environment more available and affordable for students. I live and go to grad school on the StP campus and it would be nice to have a more available tailgate environment. State fair lot DOES NOT COUNT! Its stupid to tailgate miles from the stadium and get ineffectively bussed over.

I believe the only reason this is even being considered is because we have an NFL team looking over our shoulder. Football fans are used to having beer at football games and feel they should at their "other" football event (Making the assumption that a good portion of Gopher fans are Viking fans; I am not personally- wish they'd move to LA). College isn't professional and its a silly argument, but that is all I can rationalize.
 



gophervet said:
I like to drink beer. If they have a beer garden at TCF, I will probably have one occasionally unless there is a long line and is a pain in the ass to get (which I assume it will be). If they don't have a beer garden, my life will not really change at all. I don't really know why this is such a huge deal. If it passes, will it really be that god awful for everyone involved? If it doesn't pass, will it really be that god awful for everyone involved?
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Couldn't agree more. But I am more laid back than most. I do like the idea of the additional revenue though, and the ability to sell in those suites will bring that.
 

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