bemidjigopher
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Pretty much sums up our situation. A year from now this decision will be easier one way or the other
Time to start looking fora new head coach
- Thread starter frannyjunk
- Start date
I think Kill worked out great with football (so far anyways and Claeys as an extension of Kill), but who knows if a better candidate would have came here with the new AD? Maybe the choice for basketball not knowing their boss will be a disaster and be worse than Pitino will ever be? That's not to say keep Pitino forever, but don't set yourself up to already make a not super appealing job even less appealing right off the bat.
I much prefer Kaler to get off his duff and get an AD hired. It's been 6 months. 4 more isn't going to change anything. He should be able to have someone selected by March.
bemidjigopher
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Or he could just do what everyone already believes happen. Hire Beth, I don't think he's fooling anyone by giving her a tryout, so if she wants the job and they want to give it to her, than just do it already. He might even get those Title IX crusaders off his back in the process. This doesn't mean I necessary want Beth Goetz to get it, I believe this is what Kaler wants to do and I am sure in private Goetz is lobbying for this job. I am sure Goetz has her own thoughts on how Pitino and Lucia are leading their programs
I agree. And I'm not sure how waiting until June to make her official does anything except tie our hands from making any changes in any sport due to the delay.
dpodoll68
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Who, how, where, and why did this false rumor get started? This is at least the second time I've seen this posted here. Kill was hired in December 2010. Maturi's retirement (effective June 2012) was announced in February 2012. Kill was on the job for 14 months before it was announced that Maturi would retire.
IronRanger91
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Why do you assume it will be her? I don't believe that for a second. There are going to be some money people pushing for others more than likely with ties.
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A) The U has money people? B) They've pressured the U in regards to athletics and the U responded in the past?
Edit: Those that I can think of were Voelz/Borton folks.
IronRanger91
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Uh. Yeah! There's a lot of cash floating around in the athletic village and they still need more. They have more say than you realize.
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Ewert86PC
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Is the administration waiting for more of the Athletics Village to be constructed to name Goetz AD? It would be a dumb rationale, but not out of scope for how things get done.
After all when Tubby took the BB job he got promised new training facilities. The concept of needing new facilities never got further than admitting something needed to be done while he was here. Real efforts were not made until Pitino was here for a year.
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After all when Tubby took the BB job he got promised new training facilities. The concept of needing new facilities never got further than admitting something needed to be done while he was here. Real efforts were not made until Pitino was here for a year.
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Seems like the same group that would've contributed to TCF Bank Stadium and aside from some public b*tching by Bob Stein and Adam Kelly...nothing happened after that other than firing Tubby, firing Brew, hiring Kill, hiring an AD from VCU with zero ties, hiring Pitino.
Maybe some with influence wanted Tubby gone? I doubt those three hires were decisions influenced by the money people.
Ewert86PC
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Can anyone tell me why there needed to be a Title IX investigation on behalf of the Track & Field team before AV could break ground?
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bemidjigopher
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There shouldn't been one, but the nuts and bolts of it are they were pissed about being moved to the St. Paul campus, despite the fact that they were going to get a world class facility over there.
HOOP DREAMS
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To the T&F folks (poetically); piss-off and move your a$$ east.
Ewert86PC
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I'm wasn't sure, hence the IIRC. Perhaps I recalled the other time it was mentioned. Perhaps Maturi announcing his retirement sooner was wishful thinking.
But that timeline only reiterates that if they could get a new AD in place in 4 months last time, why do they need 10 months this time?
It's just a very U of M thing to do. It's safe. It will help deflect additional criticism over Teague, etc. If they pass her over for a guy like Najarian it will ruffle feathers and Kaler seems risk averse. There have been multiple articles about Beth in both papers about her 'readiness' for the job that seem like they may have a had a wink and a thumbs up from someone, etc.
FWIW, I'm not opposed to her, she may well be the best person. But these other things will factor in her favor, IMO.
Maturi announced in February and was gone by June. Seems like the better time period (early spring) to get the best candidates rather than the start of the football season when Teague left.
Of course, those better candidates resulted in Teague so clearly I'm typing out of my.....
dpodoll68
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I'm wasn't sure, hence the IIRC. Perhaps I recalled the other time it was mentioned. Perhaps Maturi announcing his retirement sooner was wishful thinking.
But that timeline only reiterates that if they could get a new AD in place in 4 months last time, why do they need 10 months this time?
Teague was hired in April, which is the preferred timeline (after the Final 4) and is seen in the AD community as sort of the "year end", when candidates feel like it's a good time to make a break for a new job if that is an option. I almost guarantee that the new AD will be announced and/or hired in April.
With all due respect, that logic is kind of absurd (but don't feel bad; you're not the only one who espouses it). An interim AD just hired a football coach at Pitt during the last couple of years. I'm sure one could find other examples although there aren't a lot of interim ADs at any given point.
Some ambitious mid-major coach with the chance possibly to triple his compensation and have access to much higher levels of exposure and recruiting ranks isn't going to refuse an opportunity simply because there isn't a "permanent" AD in place. And the last thing a newly hired "permanent" AD is going to do is try to do is stir up a bunch of sh!t to get a coach who is performing adequately fired so he can hire his guy. Perhaps Teague did some of this but subsequent history has shown that he was a man of very poor discretion.
If you are a good and successful coach, the AD is almost irrelevant. If you are an unsatisfactory coach, the ADs is also irrelevant because you're going to get fired eventually no matter who is in the job. Hiring and firing coaches is a very small part of an AD's job. Mostly they are business managers. Some ex-jocks and coaches are ADs but a lot of ADs are more like executive types.
Some Day...Is Coming!
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Seems to me the Gophers centers are nowhere near Big Ten caliber. Non-existent. Will never win in Big that way.
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Winasota Gopher
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The interim AD at Pitt had been with the University since '79. He gave up the interim role shortly after Narduzzi was hired. He was then chair of the search for the permanent AD. Narduzzi was going to have a say.
Juhl, who recently announced his intention to retire, said he hopes to have a new athletic director in place by the spring. He said Pitt will hire “somebody that Pat Narduzzi wants to hire” and that the interest in the position has been significant.
Minnesota's interim ad has never overseen a football or mbb program outside of the last few months. Not to mention the Prez is still the guy that hired an AD that fired Tubby Smith less than a year later (deserved or not)...interim AD and Kaler? Not ideal. Full time AD, plus facilities, plus next year's recruiting class...much better.
MennoSota
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Can someone explain how any D1 coach can have three years to at least maintain a status quo of competence and somehow bring the team to an epic low, and yet still have people advocating for him?
How did Minnesota get to be this bad in three years. This is new territory bad, and that's saying something for a mediocre program.
How did Minnesota get to be this bad in three years. This is new territory bad, and that's saying something for a mediocre program.
The team he took over finished 8-10 in the B1G the year before he was hired and was losing 3 of its top 6 or so players to graduation (Mbawke, Williams, and Welch). It was going to have to play Andre Hollins at PG, it had no known option at PF, and Mo Walker was north of 300lbs and a non contributor. Flash forward a year and Richard Pitino was able to match that 8-10 record despite losing Andre Hollins to injury for a few crucial games. The second year was a major disappointment, but how much of that was on coaching is certainly up for debate. Following that second season, Richard landed his best recruiting class to date with Coffey, Hurt, and Curry. For the first time in a long time, the Gophers got the top player in Minnesota to commit to them in back to back season (unfortunately Jarvis won't play). The third season has been a disaster. I think most people realized there was a good chance for this season to be bad, but very few if any saw this disaster coming. I can think of one poster who is consistently defending Pitino, but I've also seen some fairly strong Pitino defenders start to waver on him in the last week. The last two games and 8 minutes or so have really been hard to digest. First you had the inexcusable meltdown against Penn State, then a historic loss to Northwestern, followed by another pathetic effort at Nebraska. The program has seemingly hit a new rock bottom every game recently.
I am not going to advocate for Pitino, because I don't think a coach who can't get guys to at least play hard deserves that. However, I'd rather seem him stick around for next season for the following reasons assuming we don't have a slam dunk hire waiting in the wings (attached to an AD candidate?).
1. Keeping the 2016 class together. This team lacks talent and I'd hate to see us lose a very good class and use two or three more scholarships on Spring recruits. Amir Coffey is the highest ranked kid to choose Minnesota in a while (since Royce?) and Eric Curry gives us yet another Rivals 150 kid to add to Dorsey, McBrayer, and Murphy. There was a time early in Richard's tenure where I believe Andre Hollins was the only Rivals 150 kid on the entire roster. EDIT: Mo Walker was also a top 150 kid, so we had two guys.
2. Maybe he's learning on the job. A number of posters suggested Pitino would need to learn on the job, but most were focused on X's and O's when they made that statement. I'd look at recruiting. I think Pitino overestimated his ability to turn projects in to players or possibly more accurately how many projects he could handle at one time. Morris needed to gain weight and become comfortable in a more structured system (played in a bad zone at Chipola) while Bakary and Gas needed work in virtually every area other than being tall. Instead of taking guys with lower ceilings, but a better base of skills, Pitino went for the upside pick most of the time. When you put these three on the team with Buggs, all of a sudden you've got four of your ten players who really need a lot of work on fundamental basketball. I think it's possible that only one or two of these guys are on the roster next year despite only Morris exhausting his eligibility. Pitino is to blame for his roster construction (don't forget Josh Martin or Daquein McNeil), but maybe it is getting better.
3. Transfers: I am very skeptical of Reggie Lynch and Davonte Fitzgerald. We have recent history of Pitino hyping Zach Lofton that by itself is enough to be skeptical of how much help Lynch and Fitzgerald will bring. Going back further, I can't think of a single Gopher transfer who met or exceeded expectations during his transfer year. From Terrance Simmons to Adam Boone, everybody I can remember was rumored or expected to provide a greater impact than they actually did. With that said, Pitino took those two transfers with the idea that he wasn't coaching for his job this year and expects them to be nice pieces next year. It feels like the fair thing to do is to let him coach with a full/close to full roster next year. If he's failed in his evaluation of these guys, then clearly reason 2 is invalid and reason 1 will also no longer exist because the 2016 class will be on the floor and will have to sit a year if they want to transfer. If things aren't vastly improved next year (probably needs an NCAA berth), then it will be time to move on.
This is a rare instance where keeping a guy an extra year when things look bleak is actually the right move. Unlike the Mason and Monson decisions which were made at least one year too late and resulted in one or two more questionable recruiting classes to further dilute the roster for the next guy, Pitino would actually be leaving a better roster after 2016-17 than he would after this season. I'd rather look for a new coach after next year with a Coffey/Curry/Hurt/Murphy/Mason/possibly others depending on development roster and being one year closer to a practice facility being a reality than make a move after this year. I could be wrong, but I think the job is more attractive in ~15 months than it will be in 3.
Gold Vision
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Agree. Hollins actually played better with the ball than off it.
I'm not saying you can't find a coach. That every coach in America will say, oh nos. what ever will I do without a boss, oh woe is me.
But. If I'm candidate X and I am a hot commodity and have done great at my mid-major and there is a chance Duke will want me in a few years and am deciding between MN and multiple other HM jobs, I'm taking the one where I know who my boss is. So sure, you could hire someone without an AD. no doubt about it. But are you going to get the best candidate you could have with an AD? I'd guess no. And when MN is and always has been a fairly unattractive job, do you really want to start off even further behind?
Now, if MN is your only high major offer. Sure. The AD won't matter. But in that scenario, how good of a coach are you? Well, you're just a Richard Pitino we hope will be different this time. Which may happen, but doesn't really fit the narrative of "we need an experienced, proven coach!!!!"
Gopher2017
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Because some fancy themselves a hero and much like the captain of the Titanic they will go down with the ship.
GopherWeatherGuy
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Because what has been said time and again by myself in others in multiple threads: Tubby leaving nothing in the cupboard younger than a JR and Pitino missing on a few recruits his first 2 years = this year. It's not rocket science and you're blind if you couldn't see it coming.
I've been on the boat saying that he deserves next year no matter what, but a few more games like the last two and it will be difficult to keep that opinion.