Tarik Black Watch Thread UPDATED 5/20: Black to Kansas

[Rouser]

What would lead you to believe they can afford this expense. They had to borrow money to pay off the fired coaches which they are still paying off as well as couldn't afford to even add lights to the baseball stadium initially. The AD appears to be far from flush with money.

If they could afford paying Tubby almost $1M more in annual salary, they can afford it.. borrowing is not a gift, it means they make loan payments, which means they can afford it.. unless they default on their loan payments to the general U fund, they can afford it. BTW- the general fund comes out ahead because of interest.

 

[littlebigboy]

Maybe Doogie isn't like the other writers, he was pretty bad and took alot of grief, maybe the board got to him. He has done alot better the last few months. If his supervisors let him write the crap etc, maybe he needed this board to get the point!

 

[savagerube]

Good luck - about 10 schools want this guy..including Duke and Kansas. Pipe Dream!

If only we still had Tubby. With his recruiting prowess, Black would be a shoe in..

 

[scher215]

Originally Posted by Rouser

If they could afford paying Tubby almost $1M more in annual salary, they can afford it.. borrowing is not a gift, it means they make loan payments, which means they can afford it.. unless they default on their loan payments to the general U fund, they can afford it. BTW- the general fund comes out ahead because of interest.

It's not about politics you idiot. It's about shortsighted, ignorant ecomonic philosophy! How is the BB program ultimately stronger if it has to pay interest and loan principle payments?

Down with Credit Cards! That caused the depression! Credit is evil!

Every business runs on credit, interest, and loans. They lease things and they amortize expenses. It is called accounting.

 

[station19]

The Athletic Dept can afford pretty much anything they desire. It's a matter of what other things they must give up.

They don't seem to have any income left over at the end of the year.

 

[scher215]

The Athletic Dept can afford pretty much anything they desire. It's a matter of what other things they must give up.

They don't seem to have any income left over at the end of the year.

And that's called creative accounting.

Also, my guess would be the athletic profits all flow into a master account so the income line for athletics is always zero. Just a guess though.

They probably can afford just about anything, but they do not want you to know their true profits and you never would because we don't know how they account for or classify certain expenses.

 

[station19]

And that's called creative accounting.

Also, my guess would be the athletic profits all flow into a master account so the income line for athletics is always zero. Just a guess though.

They probably can afford just about anything, but they do not want you to know their true profits and you never would because we don't know how they account for or classify certain expenses.

So you're saying they actually are making a profit every year? Those losses they show are not real?

 

[bga1]

Down with Credit Cards! That caused the depression! Credit is evil!

Every business runs on credit, interest, and loans. They lease things and they amortize expenses. It is called accounting.

Well one thing we can know- the University does do projects based on using debt. I found three major projects -at a glance- in their capital budget involving substantial debt. I'm sure to do that someone has to stick their neck out and show that money has to be spent to make more money or to somehow fulfill the University mission by fulfilling a need or patching a hole in the U's product offering.

That's where it gets dicey in athletics where you probably don't have a ton of buy in internally that athletics are core to the U's mission. I think it could be effectively argued that a practice facility would be spending money to make money by improving the program and interest in it. But it's a thin argument that has to stand in line for other projects that appear to be more mission critical. Personally, as an outsider I'd love to see them go ahead and finance the project while raising the funds as I think it would help make basketball more successful and in the long term more profitable. That said it's probably a tough sell internally and therefore they are probably stuck with fundraising as the source.

 

[howieramone]

Well one thing we can know- the University does do projects based on using debt. I found three major projects -at a glance- in their capital budget involving substantial debt. I'm sure to do that someone has to stick their neck out and show that money has to be spent to make more money or to somehow fulfill the University mission by fulfilling a need or patching a hole in the U's product offering.

That's where it gets dicey in athletics where you probably don't have a ton of buy in internally that athletics are core to the U's mission. I think it could be effectively argued that a practice facility would be spending money to make money by improving the program and interest in it. But it's a thin argument that has to stand in line for other projects that appear to be more mission critical. Personally, as an outsider I'd love to see them go ahead and finance the project while raising the funds as I think it would help make basketball more successful and in the long term more profitable. That said it's probably a tough sell internally and therefore they are probably stuck with fundraising as the source.

+1

 

[GopherGod]

And that's called creative accounting.

Also, my guess would be the athletic profits all flow into a master account so the income line for athletics is always zero. Just a guess though.

They probably can afford just about anything, but they do not want you to know their true profits and you never would because we don't know how they account for or classify certain expenses.

I guess the U's accountants must just be that much smarter than the other schools that actually show a profit on their books. Good thing the U's accountants are so much smarter than those other school's. The secret is out now, the best and brightest in finance and accounting skip all that money in the private sector to work for the U. The U is doing a good job of fooling everyone on what they can afford. They could afford to fix the leaking Bierman roof and put lights on the baseball field, they just decided not to then, right.

 

[station19]

I guess the U's accountants must just be that much smarter than the other schools that actually show a profit on their books. Good thing the U's accountants are so much smarter than those other school's. The secret is out now, the best and brightest in finance and accounting skip all that money in the private sector to work for the U. The U is doing a good job of fooling everyone on what they can afford. They could afford to fix the leaking Bierman roof and put lights on the baseball field, they just decided not to then, right.

 

[Gopher Warrior]

They could afford to fix the leaking Bierman roof and put lights on the baseball field......right.

We're getting off topic here, but take a look at the University's budgeted capital expenditures for the coming years.

 

[Gopher Teeth]

And that's called creative accounting.

Also, my guess would be the athletic profits all flow into a master account so the income line for athletics is always zero. Just a guess though.

They probably can afford just about anything, but they do not want you to know their true profits and you never would because we don't know how they account for or classify certain expenses.

Tarik Black is being recruited for his accounting abilities?

 

[dtrain19]

Tarik Black is being recruited for his accounting abilities?

+1

 

[GopherGod]

We're getting off topic here, but take a look at the University's budgeted capital expenditures for the coming years.

When you have to budget and hold off on basic repairs like holes in a roof, you obviously aren't flush with money.

 

[Halsey Hall]

I guess the U's accountants must just be that much smarter than the other schools that actually show a profit on their books. Good thing the U's accountants are so much smarter than those other school's. The secret is out now, the best and brightest in finance and accounting skip all that money in the private sector to work for the U. The U is doing a good job of fooling everyone on what they can afford. They could afford to fix the leaking Bierman roof and put lights on the baseball field, they just decided not to then, right.

Kind of ironic that the Black story is talking about being in the red!!

 

[scher215]

I guess the U's accountants must just be that much smarter than the other schools that actually show a profit on their books. Good thing the U's accountants are so much smarter than those other school's. The secret is out now, the best and brightest in finance and accounting skip all that money in the private sector to work for the U. The U is doing a good job of fooling everyone on what they can afford. They could afford to fix the leaking Bierman roof and put lights on the baseball field, they just decided not to then, right.

Look, I have no idea how much money the U athletic department makes. My point is none of us do. I'm not sure what rules the U has to follow, but they are not a publicly traded company so their financial records are not an open book and without reviewing them fully we have no clue what their financials look like.

What are their policies on what they amortize? Over how long? What is on their balance sheet? Like the beer sales profit issue, how did they classify security expense? How do they move money between departments? How do they accrue expenses? How much do they value cash flow and cash on hand?

You point out that they "couldn't afford" to fix a leaky roof and get some baseball lights, but then they could afford to not play UNC and to fire a basketball coach, assuming we base that judgement solely on how much time it takes to happen.

For all I know the U athletic department could have tons of money or be a billion in debt. Just saying without full access to their financials or a stock price we have no idea. It isn't as simple as revenue - expenses.

 

[tmvander]

Is this Gopherhole or Economics 101? Just curious if I need to update my Favorites tab.

 

[Gopher Warrior]

I'm not sure what rules the U has to follow, but they are not a publicly traded company so their financial records are not an open book and without reviewing them fully we have no clue what their financials look like.

What are their policies on what they amortize? Over how long? What is on their balance sheet? Like the beer sales profit issue, how did they classify security expense? How do they move money between departments? How do they accrue expenses? How much do they value cash flow and cash on hand?

Well, uhh.. actually.. we can see much of this at a consolidated University of Minnesota level and their audited consolidated financial statements are available to the public.

The issue is getting clarity. Just like with many public companies there are parts of their organization that are not material to the consolidated entity and do not require the enhanced disclosure some might desire.

Now, athletic departments do provide financial reports that are 'stand alone', but they are not done on a consistent basis (i.e., the consolidated U of M is subject to GASB, etc) and there is great freedom in choice as to allocation methods, etc. That is the issue.

The same athletic department came come up with multiple answers to the question of "what were your revenues and expenses?" Regarding the same year, they routinely provide different answers to this very question depending on who they are answering. (And that's OK.)

Per last year's audited financial statements, the U had $3.4 billion in net assets with more than $700 million of that being unrestricted.

 

[scher215]

Well, uhh.. actually.. we can see much of this at a consolidated University of Minnesota level and their audited consolidated financial statements are available to the public.

The issue is getting clarity. Just like with many public companies there are parts of their organization that are not material to the consolidated entity and do not require the enhanced disclosure some might desire.

Now, athletic departments do provide financial reports that are 'stand alone', but they are not done on a consistent basis (i.e., the consolidated U of M is subject to GASB, etc) and there is great freedom in choice as to allocation methods, etc. That is the issue.

The same athletic department came come up with multiple answers to the question of "what were your revenues and expenses?" Regarding the same year, they routinely provide different answers to this very question depending on who they are answering. (And that's OK.)

Per last year's audited financial statements, the U had $3.4 billion in net assets with more than $700 million of that being unrestricted.

Wasn't exactly sure what all they had to disclose being a public institution and not a publicly traded company.

 

[Unregistered User]

Can the mods move this to the off topic board, or can we actually get back to talking about Tarik Black in this thread?

 

[scher215]

Can the mods move this to the off topic board, or can we actually get back to talking about Tarik Black in this thread?

NO!!!!!

actually agreed, got a bit OT. now lets just sign Black!

 

[GameDay]

Yes, this thread is about Tarik Black, not Minnesota's athletic financial budget. Good points brought up for sure, but a new thread should be started because people are coming here for updates on the Tarik Black situation, which hopefully comes to a conclusion soon. Im intrigued to see where he ends up.

 

[Gopher Teeth]

I love the fact that we are in a recruiting battle with Duke regarding an out-of-state recruit!


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[GopherInPittsburgh]

I love the fact that we are in a recruiting battle with Duke regarding an out-of-state recruit!


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I'm drinking the Pitino kool-aid, and hell, why not!

Ski-U-Mah!

 

[jaymil]

I love the fact that we are in a recruiting battle with Duke regarding an out-of-state recruit!


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I could get used to this!

 

[Cayman]

I say if he goes to Duke we get dibs on Tyus Jones.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

I never thought I'd see the day that we were in a battle with Duke. A real one, not the pity that Tyus is showing us. Real him in!

 

[Johnnyboy18]

I never thought I'd see the day that we were in a battle with Duke. A real one, not the pity that Tyus is showing us. Real him in!

Does Humphries count?

 

[howeda7]

Does he want to come here and start or play 10 min/game at Duke?