How bad could Buggs be? ... 2/25/14 Update: Not bad at all!

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Costa Rican Gopher said:
My position has always been that the coaches know who gives us the best chance to win, not posters on GH. If Oto is playing better than Buggs & Pitino plays him again I will absolutely support that. That said, Oto is not playing like he was earlier in the season, Buggs is obviously more talented physically & it's always seemed like a matter of time for Buggs to finally figure it out. Is that time now, we'll see? It'll be a big positive if it is!
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+1 - well said.
 

Its not black or white, its grey. He obviously struggles with the finer points of the game, but so do our other options. He has a lot of other physical attributes that the other 4s have so he's definitely going to play. If anyone expects hi to have the same "impact" on another game should prepare themselves to be disappointed. I think some of his deficiencies on the defensive end are masked by the fact that this game had a combined total of 185 points scored in it. His offensive issues could also have come from the fact that he was playing the 5 for a stretch in that game as well... Who knows.

I like Buggs, hope he keeps playing and having an impact, but it's going to be rocky, just like the other two, if it were as black and white as some of you want to make it, he would have been playing long ago.
 

MadtownGopher said:
You should read the post game notes. Oto is injured. Pitino doesn't know if he is playing poorly because of that or not, but you could tell he's kind of moved on from Oto at the moment.
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I'm the one who informed this forum that Oto is injured before the post game notes ever came out. I agree with your assessment of Pitino. He's frustrated with Oto because Oto clearly isn't playing like he was earlier in the season.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
I'm the one who informed this forum that Oto is injured before the post game notes ever came out. I agree with your assessment of Pitino. He's frustrated with Oto because Oto clearly isn't playing like he was earlier in the season.
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Ok, then why do you think Buggs won't play next game? That was the most confusing point in your long post.
 

I still think that Buggs doesn't really know where to go on the court, but this was the perfect game to play him in. Iowa sped it up, and we played quick, and Buggs is definitely at his best in an up and down game. Pitino was smart to play him big minutes, but then take him out when it was time to slow the game down. All that being said, I love this kid's enthusiasm. I think his basketball understanding will grow over the years, and when it starts catching up to his athletic and shooting abilities, he could be very useful.
 


I definitely get the preserve his confidence angle with sitting him in the second half, but I'd be curious to know if people would still be saying that if King cost us the game at the end (like he almost did numerous times).
 

As Buggs was heating up tonight, I was thinking of MadtownGopher as no doubt he was pumping his fists!! It sure was fun to see Buggs' confidence and impact. Without him in the first half, we probably would have been down 15.

I have no idea what his future is with us, but if we can get consistent production out of him, it changes a lot heading into the offseason.

Go Buggs!!
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Yeah, teachers are stupid. Of course James is also the basketball writer for GI, a High School basketball coach, studied under Clem Haskins for 4 years as Team Mgr (including the Final 4 run) at the U, is plugged into the AAU/Pulley scene as is generally acknowledged as the best basketball opinion in the Twin Cities.
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I don't read the GI, so I won't comment on its quality. I know two individuals who have "studied" under Bo Ryan for several years and I am not inclined to agree with their opinions without thinking about them critically myself, and I'm unlikely to do so with someone I am not personally familiar with. Being plugged into an aau scene does not impress me to great lengths, nor does coaching at a high school level. If these qualifications make him the best basketball opinion in mpls, then I'm concerned.

Obviously the guy has a good knowledge of the game, my point was that he blows smoke and says some pretty idiotic things at times.

I agree with your general opinion that the GH posters do not know nearly enough to argue for him to get more PT. I leave that up to the coach's discretion.


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Costa Rican Gopher said:
I'm the one who informed this forum that Oto is injured before the post game notes ever came out. I agree with your assessment of Pitino. He's frustrated with Oto because Oto clearly isn't playing like he was earlier in the season.
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Anyone that expected Oto to keep producing much as the year went on was being silly. Oto was going to regress back to being Oto and should never have been counted on to do much. I'll give him credit for playing hard but it was time to try anything else (even Wally before he quit).

I guess I really never remember those glorious Oto moments earlier this year, but I suppose if I culled the stat sheets I would find them. I see a veteran player who somehow is a turnover machine, a shooter lacking confidence, and a generally nervous player, who does not resemble a guy who been in the Big 10 forever.

King is a different situation and has had some rough moments but still has way more upside than I expected to see.
 




MadtownGopher said:
Ok, then why do you think Buggs won't play next game? That was the most confusing point in your long post.
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When did I say "Buggs won't play next game"? I guess that's what you heard, but here's what I actually said...."Will he play extensively next game? My guess would be "no".

I didn't realize the extent of Oto's injury, so maybe he will get extended minutes but I still doubt it. I think he'll get some spot duty behind King (unless both EE & Mo are both in foul trouble again), but not 19 minutes a game.
 

oak_street1981 said:
Anyone that expected Oto to keep producing much as the year went on was being silly. Oto was going to regress back to being Oto and should never have been counted on to do much. I'll give him credit for playing hard but it was time to try anything else (even Wally before he quit).

I guess I really never remember those glorious Oto moments earlier this year, but I suppose if I culled the stat sheets I would find them. I see a veteran player who somehow is a turnover machine, a shooter lacking confidence, and a generally nervous player, who does not resemble a guy who been in the Big 10 forever.

King is a different situation and has had some rough moments but still has way more upside than I expected to see.
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Why, I thought Pitino knew how to develop players?
 

I'll admit I've always thought Buggs looks a little lost at times when he's out there, but I think he is talented enough to make up for it and has an overall positive impact on the game. I'll be disappointed if he doesn't get 15+ minutes against Michigan.
 



Costa Rican Gopher said:
When did I say "Buggs won't play next game"? I guess that's what you heard, but here's what I actually said...."Will he play extensively next game? My guess would be "no".

I didn't realize the extent of Oto's injury, so maybe he will get extended minutes but I still doubt it. I think he'll get some spot duty behind King (unless both EE & Mo are both in foul trouble again), but not 19 minutes a game.
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Because King has been playing so well?:rolleyes:

Not saying Buggs will start, but he is going to be a sparkplug off the bench for us and average more minutes than Oto. So he'll be our primary back up at PF and I could even see him getting some minutes at the 3 occasionally like he did in the first half tonight.
 


What position do we think Buggs would play next year? Wouldn't it be awesome if we could have his size and athletic ability at the 3 and josh Martin at the 4?
 

GopherDude said:
What position do we think Buggs would play next year? Wouldn't it be awesome if we could have his size and athletic ability at the 3 and josh Martin at the 4?
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Yeah I definitely think it's at the 3, unless Martin for whatever reason can't contribute for us next year. Then Pitino may be tempted to play him at the 4. That is one thing that both Costa Rican Gopher and myself have agreed on for a while now. Front court 2-deeps could be EE/Mo, Buggs/Morris, Martin/King.
 

I'm not sure why people are attacking MadtownGopher here. This is weird.

New information leads to new opinions. MadtownGopher has been hoping to see Buggs get more PT all season long. He specifically mentioned some good run in the Florida State game.

Last week there was discussion on potential multiple transfers, and the fact that Buggs has played so few minutes in Big Ten play, it's an obvious person to mention as a potential transfer.

Then Buggs gets his chance, has a huge first half and is a key contributor in a big win. Thus, a new set of information is used to form an opinion.

We won a big game, we got a contribution from a seldom used freshman and there is now new hope for the Tourney and new hope for Buggs. Let's enjoy both.

Go Gophers!!
 

GopherDude said:
What position do we think Buggs would play next year? Wouldn't it be awesome if we could have his size and athletic ability at the 3 and josh Martin at the 4?
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I think Buggs would have to dramatically improve his ball handling to play the 3, but it sure would create some mismatches if he can.

One thing that I haven't seen brought up on Buggs was the amazing amount of court he was able to cover on his fast break lay-up last night. He had two monster strides as he glided in for that lay-up. I was afraid they were going to call a traveling (it wasn't) as you don't see many guys cover that amount of court like that. That was probably four steps worth of court coverage for Mathieu!

Go Gophers!!
 

BleedGopher said:
One thing that I haven't seen brought up on Buggs was the amazing amount of court he was able to cover on his fast break lay-up last night. He had two monster strides as he glided in for that lay-up. I was afraid they were going to call a traveling (it wasn't) as you don't see many guys cover that amount of court like that. That was probably four steps worth of court coverage for Mathieu!
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Wow, I just saw the fast break again in the highlights and you're right. His right foot appeared to be about 12 inches inside the 3 pt line when he got the ball and he turned that into a layup.
 

MadtownGopher said:
Yeah I definitely think it's at the 3, unless Martin for whatever reason can't contribute for us next year. Then Pitino may be tempted to play him at the 4. That is one thing that both Costa Rican Gopher and myself have agreed on for a while now. Front court 2-deeps could be EE/Mo, Buggs/Morris, Martin/King.
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Yeah I definitely agree, but I also agree with BG in the fact that he needs to improve his handles. I think Pitino will focus on that all offseason with him.
 

GopherDude said:
Yeah I definitely agree, but I also agree with BG in the fact that he needs to improve his handles. I think Pitino will focus on that all offseason with him.
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Agreed. Buggs with good handles is a scary thought.
 

I think Buggs has lots of potential, and in the right situation will get his chance to shine. For whatever reason though, sometimes certain players are not a coach's player. I think that is what we have here. I don't subscribe to the theory that out of the blue, a player just "gets it". I think Buggs has had the same ability all year, but there is something that Pitino doesnt like. Not sure what it is, but I think there is something.
The fact is, Buggs was used out of necessity last night. If he is used by choice going forward, then my theory is clearly wrong.
 

Tommy Flanagan said:
I think Buggs has lots of potential, and in the right situation will get his chance to shine. For whatever reason though, sometimes certain players are not a coach's player. I think that is what we have here. I don't subscribe to the theory that out of the blue, a player just "gets it". I think Buggs has had the same ability all year, but there is something that Pitino doesnt like. Not sure what it is, but I think there is something.
The fact is, Buggs was used out of necessity last night. If he is used by choice going forward, then my theory is clearly wrong.
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Well it sounds like Oto's injury could be something that lingers so he may be used out of "necessity" for the rest of the season. I kind of agree with you that there seems to be something more going on with Buggs. Something beyond him not following his prescribed diet and weight goals. Should be interesting to see how the rest of the season plays out.
 

If Buggs gets stronger I don't think there is any doubt that he plays the 4 next year. Just because someone can shoot doesn't make them a wing player. We need his length and athleticism (and shooting) at the 4. Pitino wants to create turnovers via the press and he has talked about how important the PF is when trying to do that. He has also specifically said Buggs is the best of the PFs in the press.
 

Safe to say that this turn of events answers the questions as to whether Buggs should be on the team next year. Hopefully this playing time and presumably what follows will dissuade him from any thoughts of transferring he might have been harboring.

If the Gophers utilize statistical analytics - and I know they do - they'll come to the conclusion that good things happen when Charles is on the floor. First and foremost, he brings an energy and activity that some other players simply don't. After the Illinois game I complained about how, at one point in the first half, the Gophs were suddenly dead out there, even though they had had energy just before that in building their early lead. Knowing what we know now, when you recognize that's happening, that's the time to get Buggs in the game. He's the classic spark plug.
 


Bad Gopher said:
Safe to say that this turn of events answers the questions as to whether Buggs should be on the team next year. Hopefully this playing time and presumably what follows will dissuade him from any thoughts of transferring he might have been harboring.

If the Gophers utilize statistical analytics - and I know they do - they'll come to the conclusion that good things happen when Charles is on the floor. First and foremost, he brings an energy and activity that some other players simply don't. After the Illinois game I complained about how, at one point in the first half, the Gophs were suddenly dead out there, even though they had had energy just before that in building their early lead. Knowing what we know now, when you recognize that's happening, that's the time to get Buggs in the game. He's the classic spark plug.
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No doubt Buggs's 13 points were huge, but just his presence and energy gave the team what it needed last night IMO. Kind of like, "hey this guy barely plays and he's out here loose and confident, maybe we should be too".
 

Buggs is not the first, nor will he be the last, Gopher player to be pronounced an all-american after one game.:rolleyes:
 


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