All Things 2021-2022 Minnesota Twins Off-Season Thread

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short ornery norwegian said:
MLB and the MLBPA had a negotiation session - it lasted all of 15 minutes, with apparently virtually no movement.

I'm starting to think there is a real possibility that there is no MLB season in 2022.

if there is a season, I would bet that it will be 100 games tops.

this sport is in deep doo-doo.

and I'm ticked. my 1st year in retirement. I was looking forward to being able to sit down and watch a lot of baseball, and now this.

I hope somebody televises some minor-league games, at least.
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You might have to take up the USFL...This could be a boon to them.
 

howeda7 said:
How do 30 billionaires not realize their industry is headed for a cliff and they're flooring the accelerator?
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MLB revenues are at an all time high. This myth that baseball is a dying sport is just that, a myth. Sure it will never be "America's pastime" again, and won't ever be as popular as the NFL again, and a lockout would hurt, but baseball is nowhere near heading off a cliff.
 

I think the season starts 7/1 and it's 90-100 games. All of the real negotiations will take place in two days when both sides realize the entire season could be toast.

The whole thing is silly and unnecessary. The owners won the last round big time. For the health of the industry, they should give some of it back.
 



Gophers1992 said:
MLB revenues are at an all time high. This myth that baseball is a dying sport is just that, a myth. Sure it will never be "America's pastime" again, and won't ever be as popular as the NFL again, and a lockout would hurt, but baseball is nowhere near heading off a cliff.
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Well, if you look at TV ratings for the World series - the 2020 WS had the lowest TV ratings in history. 2021 was 2nd worst. 2019 was the 5th worst. In other words, the last 3 seasons posted 3 of the 5 worst TV ratings in WS history.

In a recent poll, when asked to name their favorite US professional sport, 37% said Football, 11% Basketball, 9% Baseball and 7% soccer.

Average attendance per game peaked in 2007 at 32,696 per game. (based on tickets sold)
2019 avg attendance per game was 28,303 - the 4th consecutive year with lower attendance.
(obviously, 2020 & 2021 were impacted by covid)

average time of game hit a new high in 2021 at 3:11 per game.

Longer games - lower attendance - falling TV ratings - falling public interest. Not the signs of a healthy sport.
 

Gophers1992 said:
MLB revenues are at an all time high. This myth that baseball is a dying sport is just that, a myth. Sure it will never be "America's pastime" again, and won't ever be as popular as the NFL again, and a lockout would hurt, but baseball is nowhere near heading off a cliff.
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The cliff might be pretty far away. Like a decade or two. But it's coming. And this will accelerate it. I don't know many people under 40 who will voluntarily watch a baseball game on TV. They might go to one 2-3 times/year to drink, but that's it.
 


howeda7 said:
Who ever thought we'd pine for the days of Bud Selig?
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Right! Bud looks like the second coming of Pete Rozelle compared to Manfred Mann's Earth Band -

one of my favorite jams ever and the intro is legendary-

 



howeda7 said:
The cliff might be pretty far away. Like a decade or two. But it's coming. And this will accelerate it. I don't know many people under 40 who will voluntarily watch a baseball game on TV. They might go to one 2-3 times/year to drink, but that's it.
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I have a lot more time (and patience) than when I was in my 20's and 30's and there's no way I can sit through an entire Twins game anymore (in person or on TV). I'm a lifelong baseball fan and I find the games ridiculously and needlessly long now. The time between innings is double what it used to be. I understand that because it's revenue production. I don't understand the time between pitches, the time between hitters, the time between pitchers, the number of pitching changes, etc.

Fans will tolerate 3.25 hour NFL and 3.5 hour college football games because they are events and spectacles. 162 three and a half hour baseball games? Nope.

Networks do need content between the NBA and the NFL seasons. However, eventually the dwindling MLB fan base will shrink or kill the sport.
 

jamiche said:
I have a lot more time (and patience) than when I was in my 20's and 30's and there's no way I can sit through an entire Twins game anymore (in person or on TV). I'm a lifelong baseball fan and I find the games ridiculously and needlessly long now. The time between innings is double what it used to be. I understand that because it's revenue production. I don't understand the time between pitches, the time between hitters, the time between pitchers, the number of pitching changes, etc.

Fans will tolerate 3.25 hour NFL and 3.5 hour college football games because they are events and spectacles. 162 three and a half hour baseball games? Nope.

Networks do need content between the NBA and the NFL seasons. However, eventually the dwindling MLB fan base will shrink or kill the sport.
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I only watch games on DVR. I can watch them in about an hour and not miss anything. But most people won't do that. They simply must get the time of game back under 3 hours. Pitch clocks, shorter breaks between innings. Whatever it takes.
 

First batch of cancellations have been announced. Spring Training games through March 4th, gone.

www.startribune.com

MLB cancels spring games through March 4 due to lockout

Major League Baseball canceled the first week of spring training games through March 4 in the first public acknowledgement of the disruption caused by the lockout.
www.startribune.com www.startribune.com
 

I'm going to miss those Spring Training radio broadcasts where they interview some person from the local Chamber of Commerce about all the fun things to do in the Fort Myers area.

Last year, I actually heard Dan Gladden talking to some woman about Sea Shells for 5 minutes. It was riveting radio.

at least with Spring Training games, the players are trying to get them over with as fast as possible so that they can go golfing.
 



Haven't been to a Twins game for 4-5 years and don't plan on taking any in this season. The game is very boring. Pitch and catch. Pitch and catch. Repeat. It would be more tolerable if I could bring my own beer and just chill.

Widen the strike zone to force the hitters to swing the bat, establish a pitch clock, and keep the batter in the box between pitches.
 

When can we bulldoze the stadium?
 

I noted in a recent story that Twins RP Taylor Rogers is part of the group of players who are taking part in the new round of CBA negotiations.

Sounds like things are going very slowly. one side makes a minor offer and the other side makes a minor counter-offer, but they are still far apart on most of the economic issues.

at this point, I don't see the season starting before June 1st. Hope I'm wrong.

But the Twins are still making minor-league signings, so I suspect they know that the guys on the 40-man roster are not going to be available when the minor-league season gets underway.
 

I have heard the deadline for getting in all 162 is March 4th.

Good luck with that.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
I noted in a recent story that Twins RP Taylor Rogers is part of the group of players who are taking part in the new round of CBA negotiations.

Sounds like things are going very slowly. one side makes a minor offer and the other side makes a minor counter-offer, but they are still far apart on most of the economic issues.

at this point, I don't see the season starting before June 1st. Hope I'm wrong.

But the Twins are still making minor-league signings, so I suspect they know that the guys on the 40-man roster are not going to be available when the minor-league season gets underway.
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It's depressing when you hear them going backwards on some areas. At least have a "no back-tracking" agreement. Ugh.
 



GophersInIowa said:
Owners of professional teams should love the sport, but it's so apparent many don't.
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I don't know that they should all "love" the sport, but I get the feeling some hate it or are just flat out ambivalent. Maybe I'm swayed by Major League, Slap Shot and Ted Lasso.
 

Ope3 said:
I don't know that they should all "love" the sport, but I get the feeling some hate it or are just flat out ambivalent. Maybe I'm swayed by Major League, Slap Shot and Ted Lasso.
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In some cases, like the Twins, it's an inherited asset and the new generation doesn't have the passion for it. I have heard Joe Pohlad (Carl's grandson but I'm on sure which brother is his dad) is all in. Unfortunately, he's not in charge yet.
 


It's not a case of not loving baseball. It's a case of the Owners being ticked off because they believe they have "lost" in recent CBA negotiations - which, to be fair, is due to their own mis-calculations.

So the owners want to "win" these negotiations. Meanwhile, the player think they're getting hosed because some owners don't want to spend more on salaries, and because teams manipulate service time to keep players from becoming arbitration-eligible.

So you have two sides who really don't like each other and neither side wants to blink first.

that's why each side is making these proposals with small incremental moves, and it's taking forever to reach any type of agreement.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
It's not a case of not loving baseball. It's a case of the Owners being ticked off because they believe they have "lost" in recent CBA negotiations - which, to be fair, is due to their own mis-calculations.

So the owners want to "win" these negotiations. Meanwhile, the player think they're getting hosed because some owners don't want to spend more on salaries, and because teams manipulate service time to keep players from becoming arbitration-eligible.

So you have two sides who really don't like each other and neither side wants to blink first.

that's why each side is making these proposals with small incremental moves, and it's taking forever to reach any type of agreement.
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Yep. The owners are petty and the players are almost entirely correct about all their demands.
 

Lock out the roster players and go 162 full bore with a roster of minor leagueres. Give the kids a chance to experience the ML first hand.
 

Bayfieldgopher said:
Lock out the roster players and go 162 full bore with a roster of minor leagueres. Give the kids a chance to experience the ML first hand.
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How many of the top ones would refuse to be scabs? A large % I'm guessing.
 


Bayfieldgopher said:
Lock out the roster players and go 162 full bore with a roster of minor leagueres. Give the kids a chance to experience the ML first hand.
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To pull that off, each franchise would have to sign a lot of extra players in order to be able to fill the roster at every level.

Then, you have the question of salary. Assuming games would be played under the old CBA, you would have to pay everyone the MLB minimum wage.

So, the teams would be taking on a lot of extra expense.

And the TV networks might balk at paying full price to show games involving minor league players.

It's the kind of thing that sounds fun in principle, but a lot harder to pull off in reality.

If there is no major league season, I would rather have TV show AAA and AA games.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
To pull that off, each franchise would have to sign a lot of extra players in order to be able to fill the roster at every level.

Then, you have the question of salary. Assuming games would be played under the old CBA, you would have to pay everyone the MLB minimum wage.

So, the teams would be taking on a lot of extra expense.

And the TV networks might balk at paying full price to show games involving minor league players.

It's the kind of thing that sounds fun in principle, but a lot harder to pull off in reality.

If there is no major league season, I would rather have TV show AAA and AA games.
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The majority of MLB players make more than the minimum. Assuming you pay most of the “scabs” the minimum or close to it, you’re saving a bunch of money. The MLB players aren’t getting paid when they don’t play.
 

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