Have we officially caught up to Wisconsin?

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GVBadger said:
I read for months on this board the Badgers were terrible this year. No idea why you were so excited on Saturday about beating such a garbage team.
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The “House of Pain” rival troll was so epic, it will live on my DVR until my dying day.
 

MNVCGUY said:
There has been a running gag around here about the demise of the Badgers for years. And while I don't think that demise is coming anytime soon, I do think that we have caught up to them after the win on Saturday.

2018 - Dominant win in Madison
2019 - Badgers returned the favor with a win over us at home
2020 - OT Loss in Madison
2021 - Convincing win at Home

So in 3 of the last last 4 years we have either beaten them or taken them to the wire. The Badgers days of bullying the West seem to be coming to a close as we enter a new era with lots of contenders for the division and no dominant program.

Still looking for that breakthrough win against Iowa. Oddly enough, our 3 matchups with them at Kinnick have all been close games while the ones in Minneapolis have been lopsided loses. Hopefully we reverse that trend in 2022 and get that monkey off our back by finally bringing the Pig back home.

So what do you all think......have we finally caught up to Wisconsin?
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Iowa is a bigger porker to fry.

PJ Fleck is getting close, and he knows it. He has to beat Iowa.

There are going to be lots of transfers in and out of Gopher Football. It is big boy pants time. There is no time for settling for mediocrity.
 

Slim Tubby said:
The “House of Pain” rival troll was so epic, it will live on my DVR until my dying day.
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Next year if we win they are going to play the “Do the Goldy” music after the game. That will really show you.

Nobody cares about Jump Around. We care we lost a game that cost us a trip to Indy.
 


Glad that everyone is answering no. I will refer you to this board after our last win over Iowa where a lot of posters were conviced we had passed Iowa. We've lost a program record 7 straight to them since we "passed" them.

My biggest question is was the Gophers ability to win in the trenches on both sides of the ball a sign that things are getting closer...or just Minnesota taking advantage of a rare opportunity to have almost exclusively Seniors or super Seniors on both sides of the line?

The first step is actually keeping one of these trophy's for more than one year.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
and then Alvarez did this for the next five years

1995: 4-5-2 (3-4-1)
1996: 8-5 (3-5)
1997: 8-5 (5-3)
1998: 11-1 (7-1) won Rose Bowl
1999: 10-2 (7-1) won Rose Bowl

so Fleck has some work to do to keep pace.
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Well, of course. He has to keep pace, or (dare I say it) outpace Alvarez. But, you must admit it is "so far, so good." Fleck is pretty much right there with legend coaches from our biggest rivals at this point in his career.

It will be fun to update the Alvarez/Ferentz/Fleck comparisons after each season, going forward.
 

EG#9 said:
Glad that everyone is answering no. I will refer you to this board after our last win over Iowa where a lot of posters were conviced we had passed Iowa. We've lost a program record 7 straight to them since we "passed" them.

My biggest question is was the Gophers ability to win in the trenches on both sides of the ball a sign that things are getting closer...or just Minnesota taking advantage of a rare opportunity to have almost exclusively Seniors or super Seniors on both sides of the line?

The first step is actually keeping one of these trophy's for more than one year.
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The great thing about this particular set of goalposts is: you can keep moving them.
 

If All Big Ten teams matter (and perhaps they do a little for recruiting), the answer today is that the Gophers have not caught up to Wisconsin or Iowa, who both are very well represented on the all conference teams. Minnesota not so much.
 

Digging up a thread I started 1 year ago. After last year's game against Wisconsin there were still a lot of posters unwilling to say we had officially caught up to Wisconsin. After yesterday's game I really don't think there is any doubt at this point that we have fully caught the Badgers.

And we are right there nipping at the heals of Iowa. We have outplayed the Hawkeyes in a few of the recent matchups but just haven't quite found away to come away with the victory.

The talent gap between us and our main rivals is gone. Wisconsin game is fully a rivalry game again and hopefully in 2023 we finally get the Iowa monkey off our backs and get the W.

This may not seem like much to some fans. But it wasn't that long ago that we were mired in a 14 game losing streak to Wisconsin and we were clearly quite a bit behind them in a lot of ways program wise. Those days are gone.
 



MNVCGUY said:
Digging up a thread I started 1 year ago. After last year's game against Wisconsin there were still a lot of posters unwilling to say we had officially caught up to Wisconsin. After yesterday's game I really don't think there is any doubt at this point that we have fully caught the Badgers.

And we are right there nipping at the heals of Iowa. We have outplayed the Hawkeyes in a few of the recent matchups but just haven't quite found away to come away with the victory.

The talent gap between us and our main rivals is gone. Wisconsin game is fully a rivalry game again and hopefully in 2023 we finally get the Iowa monkey off our backs and get the W.

This may not seem like much to some fans. But it wasn't that long ago that we were mired in a 14 game losing streak to Wisconsin and we were clearly quite a bit behind them in a lot of ways program wise. Those days are gone.
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I think it’s a difficult question to wrap head around.

I think the answer is yes.

For two reasons:
Minnesota has taken a step up
AND Wisconsin has taken a step back.

I think people who don’t see Wisconsin has taken a step back don’t think Minnesota had caught them because we clearly aren’t what Wisconsin was from 2008-2012…but neither are they.
 
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Gophergrandpa said:
Not sure we have quite caught the perennial top 10-15 WI. I think WI, which is starting to slip some, has finally "caught" the Gophers. WI ended the regular season ranked 26th in both AP and Coaches polls. Gophers ended up at 29 and 30 in those polls. WI's losses were all to good teams. Though we just drubbed the Badgers, our inexplicable loss in the game that cannot be mentioned still haunts the "rating" of this year's team, as it and the IL loss speak to some fundamental weakness either in the 2021 team's coaching intelligence or our player's ability to execute (I think it is the former).

Have we caught Iowa? I think we are damn close. There have been blow out games, but they have gone both ways. In many of the recent games we were right there, and ended up being beaten not by Iowa's physical dominance or play calling brilliance, but by Iowa's bulldog-like determination to win coupled with our inability to finish off. I think that both WI and IA are true rivalries going forward. We need to match Iowa in mental toughness (among coaches as well as players) and dogged determination, and we are there.

As much as I personally disfavor the coach of Neb, I think Neb might be about to get into the mix. It fired virtually all of its offensive side coaches. It has lots of talent (poorly used). It lost the most one score games in a season in modern major college history this year. And it played one of the most difficult schedules of the year. With a new QB and a perhaps running a system that doesn't make the QB the team's principal running back, Neb might stop killing itself with late game errors and could suddenly start winning some close games.
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This first paragraph is spot on
The second paragraph is annoying but I agree
Love the third paragraph and wish frost was back with the hope train again this year.
 



Some guy said:
I think it’s a difficult question to wrap head around.

I think the answer is yes.

For two reasons:
Minnesota has taken a step back
AND Wisconsin has taken a step back.

I think people who don’t see Wisconsin has taken a step back don’t think Minnesota had caught them because we clearly aren’t what Wisconsin was from 2008-2012…but neither are they.
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I agree that Wisconsin has taken a step back. I don't think one can conclude that the Gophers have taken a step back unless one believed that 2019 was going to be the norm.

Yes, I do believe that the Gophers have caught up with Wisconsin. Perhaps we've caught up with Iowa as well but we still seem to choke against them.
 

Minnesota got better, then got consistent
Wisconsin got steadily a little worse

Minnesota is now a little better than wisconsin in football. Not by much...the whole Quadrangle is a set of peers. But we've got 5 years of evidence that has both schools almost dead even in overall record and the Gophers winning head-to-head. The Gophers are also on the better trend.
 

The gophers are equal to wisconsin now. If not ahead of them. wisconsin isn’t as good as they were 10 years ago but that isn’t the gophers fault
 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. We have an off-season ahead with the impact of the Transfer Portal, recruiting, unforeseen changes to the roster, and, possibly, unforeseen changes to the coaching staff (Rossi getting a HC job). But, I like what I see in the Illinois Rifleman and his young receivers and the coaches recognizing that the PJ mindset may change a bit in terms of game planning. Next year's schedule is a challenge, UNC away, Michigan, Iowa away, Purdue away , and OSU away.
 

cjbfbp said:
I agree that Wisconsin has taken a step back. I don't think one can conclude that the Gophers have taken a step back unless one believed that 2019 was going to be the norm.

Yes, I do believe that the Gophers have caught up with Wisconsin. Perhaps we've caught up with Iowa as well but we still seem to choke against them.
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I typo
Minnesota has taken a step up in the past 5 years
Wisconsin has taken a step back
 

GVBadger said:
Next year if we win they are going to play the “Do the Goldy” music after the game. That will really show you.

Nobody cares about Jump Around. We care we lost a game that cost us a trip to Indy.
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It would have been nice of the Camp Randall staff to play “Do the Gopher” song after the game last night :)
 

I think so they were 5th in the West and the Gophers 4th… exciting
 

Is "caught up" really the right way to phrase it?

I think the Wisc program of the covid year and this year .... they just don't look anything like the 2016 and 2017 Wisconsin teams, certainly not like 2010 and 2011.


Wisc fans certainly would phrase it as "we've sunk down to Minnesota's level".


The truth is usually somewhere in the middle of the ends of the spectrum.
 

The questions are like this (to me):
- why was Bert able to get the level of talent to come to Madison, Wisc that he was for the 2010 and 2011 seasons?
- why was Chryst able to get the level of talent to come there for the 2016 and 2017 seasons?
- what changed??


Obviously NIL is one part of the equation, but that change has been so abrupt and recent, that it doesn't feel like that should be the majority of the answer.


They still have beast guys on the team. Herbig, etc.


QB play is probably one major reason.
 

And then: do we expect that a 40 year old (sorry ... but it is part of it) white guy from Wisconsin, is going to be able to do significantly better than the two of those that came before him?

In-state recruiting for them has to be a big part of it, getting the best that the state produces to stay home.
 

Gophers_4life said:
The questions are like this (to me):
- why was Bert able to get the level of talent to come to Madison, Wisc that he was for the 2010 and 2011 seasons?
- why was Chryst able to get the level of talent to come there for the 2016 and 2017 seasons?
- what changed??


Obviously NIL is one part of the equation, but that change has been so abrupt and recent, that it doesn't feel like that should be the majority of the answer.


They still have beast guys on the team. Herbig, etc.


QB play is probably one major reason.
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The biggest thing that changed was that Ohio state isn’t on sanctions, penn state isn’t recovering from the largest scandal of the century, Michigan has a good coach, and Purdue, Illinois, and Minnesota are competitive.

The conference much deeper now than it was 10 years ago
 

GVBadger said:
Next year if we win they are going to play the “Do the Goldy” music after the game. That will really show you.

Nobody cares about Jump Around. We care we lost a game that cost us a trip to Indy.
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The Wi team was showed the video of Jump Around being played in Minneapolis every day at practice last week. Apparently the team cared. You are your own island apparently.
 

GVBadger said:
I read for months on this board the Badgers were terrible this year. No idea why you were so excited on Saturday about beating such a garbage team.
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This is still a garbage take. You’re acting like Badger fans never celebrated beating bad or even very bad Minnesota teams.
 

Gopher 461 said:
Let's not get ahead of ourselves. We have an off-season ahead with the impact of the Transfer Portal, recruiting, unforeseen changes to the roster, and, possibly, unforeseen changes to the coaching staff (Rossi getting a HC job). But, I like what I see in the Illinois Rifleman and his young receivers and the coaches recognizing that the PJ mindset may change a bit in terms of game planning. Next year's schedule is a challenge, UNC away, Michigan, Iowa away, Purdue away , and OSU away.
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Embrace uncertainty/ change don’t be scared of it; it’s the essence of the off-season.
 

I think MN is a minimum at least in the ballpark with Wisconsin and Iowa, where 5 years ago we were hoping to get there. Maybe year by year we are a little better or a little worse, but the gap has really closed.
 

I’d say yes…. Playing then on par the last few years, we’ve won 3 of the last 5 with one going into OT, their players talent level seem about even with ours, and our recruiting classes the past few years have been rated pretty similarly.
 

Triple D said:
I’d say yes…. Playing then on par the last few years, we’ve won 3 of the last 5 with one going into OT, their players talent level seem about even with ours, and our recruiting classes the past few years have been rated pretty similarly.
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Which is why I can't understand how they got the talent level they had in 2016 and 2017, let alone in 2010 and 2011, to go there .... what changed, in talent level?

Unless you really don't believe the talent level is any different, and it was just luck and/or other circumstance of the conference that let them just win a bunch more games those previous years.


I haven't looked, but I assume they had significantly more talent those years.
 

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