Gophers in CSUF G transfer Latrell Wrightsell Jr. top 3

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GopherPlaya said:
I think his worry was losing freshmen to the portal (even though it still happened) I think Ben is focused on his development of the 2022 Class so they can be his core for the 24-25 season. JOJ, Carrington, & Payne will be juniors, Betts & Christie will be sophomores, Garcia will decide if he wants to be a super senior but we’ll still have Mitchell (hopefully). If we can show progress this season & pull off strong 2024 recruiting class. The 24/25 season should be a tourney year. I don’t know if Ben will survive if we don’t bring at least 2 impact transfers this off-season
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Operation 2027 activated
 

bga1 said:
If so it was a terrible decision. IF, however, he is able to land a good transfer portal group this spring- it actually could pay off for him. Obviously our guys got a baptism of fire in the Big Ten that was more than they were ready for. Will it help them develop faster?
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All we need from the portal are the right guards. Mitchell is one. Have to get at least one more. More is always better. I want a full squad of 13 where all can see minutes due to their ability. But for injuries CBJ would have had an acceptable 2nd year. The experience of the young guys can be a springboard.
 

eker0016 said:
It did not pay off for him. We had our worst season in the history of the program. One of the guys being baptized by fire transferred after starting over half the games as a freshman. Cooper transferred as well, after playing more minutes and taking more shots in the B10 than he did in the Ohio Valley. Carrington was hurt for 1/3 of the year, and Samuels had to end up playing major minutes for us and shot 26% from the floor. It was an unmitigated disaster.

I hope that Ben learned from it and lands Wrightsell, and has enough depth to make freshmen earn minutes in the future.
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Of course it did not pay off for him last year. I am saying that we might end up getting some benefit from accelerated development this coming year. Just trying to inject a little hope. Ben needs to continue to learn and the bad mistakes need to be over. The margin for error is gone now.
 


GopherPlaya said:
I think his worry was losing freshmen to the portal (even though it still happened) I think Ben is focused on his development of the 2022 Class so they can be his core for the 24-25 season. JOJ, Carrington, & Payne will be juniors, Betts & Christie will be sophomores, Garcia will decide if he wants to be a super senior but we’ll still have Mitchell (hopefully). If we can show progress this season & pull off strong 2024 recruiting class. The 24/25 season should be a tourney year. I don’t know if Ben will survive if we don’t bring at least 2 impact transfers this off-season
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Fair analysis. Objective without lacing it with an agenda or false optimism.
 


skiumah1 said:
His first official visit is to Nebraska on Friday. Seems like NEB likely has the inside track if they can sell him. I'd imagine we're right behind them though.

We need to be able to win this IMO as NEB has an abundance of guards. We have a starting spot for him Day 1.

I'll say 25% we land him.
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Maybe for Creighton but not with Nebraska. 60% for us. We may know this weekend.
 

GopherPlaya said:
I think his worry was losing freshmen to the portal (even though it still happened) I think Ben is focused on his development of the 2022 Class so they can be his core for the 24-25 season. JOJ, Carrington, & Payne will be juniors, Betts & Christie will be sophomores, Garcia will decide if he wants to be a super senior but we’ll still have Mitchell (hopefully). If we can show progress this season & pull off strong 2024 recruiting class. The 24/25 season should be a tourney year. I don’t know if Ben will survive if we don’t bring at least 2 impact transfers this off-season
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Without fan support and NIL I don't see any way Ben survives. Garcia will be gone no matter what the outlook is, you don't ignore a big paycheck, heck you've got guys like Caleb Love leaving NC probably because he got a better offer at Michigan. College basketball truly is a microcosm of a free market economy.
 

bga1 said:
Of course it did not pay off for him last year. I am saying that we might end up getting some benefit from accelerated development this coming year. Just trying to inject a little hope. Ben needs to continue to learn and the bad mistakes need to be over. The margin for error is gone now.
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It didn't pay off at all. The other guards/wings who got playing time last year are all gone with the exception of Carrington. Carrington would have gotten a ton of PT regardless.

If it was a decision last year to not bring in another guard, it was about as dumb of a decision I've ever seen a coach make. If he just swung and missed and was stuck with a crappy roster, that sucks but it's more defensible.

Either way, it looks like he's learned his lesson and he's going heavy on the guards this year which does give me some hope for next year. That's a different team last year with just remotely passable guard play - not good but not horrific. If we bring in three veteran guards who are competent, next year's team will be a lot more fun to watch.
 

jovs said:
Without fan support and NIL I don't see any way Ben survives. Garcia will be gone no matter what the outlook is, you don't ignore a big paycheck, heck you've got guys like Caleb Love leaving NC probably because he got a better offer at Michigan. College basketball truly is a microcosm of a free market economy.
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This is the scary truth, even if Ben builds momentum, what happens to Payne and Garcia after this year? If they both have big seasons, they'll be offered a lot of money by other programs.
 



jovs said:
Without fan support and NIL I don't see any way Ben survives. Garcia will be gone no matter what the outlook is, you don't ignore a big paycheck, heck you've got guys like Caleb Love leaving NC probably because he got a better offer at Michigan. College basketball truly is a microcosm of a free market economy.
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I truly believe that the Twin Cities would fully support a winner.....put a good product on the floor and the NIL money will start showing up. Right now, it's a dumpster fire.

Imagine the boosters that would've shelled out money when the Barn was packed and the place to be. I would be willing to bet the money would've been flowing when Mychal Thompson was playing (who knows....maybe it was?)
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
I truly believe that the Twin Cities would fully support a winner.....put a good product on the floor and the NIL money will start showing up. Right now, it's a dumpster fire.

Imagine the boosters that would've shelled out money when the Barn was packed and the place to be. I would be willing to bet the money would've been flowing when Mychal Thompson was playing (who knows....maybe it was?)
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I was there and the Musselman and Dutcher days were awesome events. I would love us to have another McHale. A rare performer and a fun guy.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
It didn't pay off at all. The other guards/wings who got playing time last year are all gone with the exception of Carrington. Carrington would have gotten a ton of PT regardless.

If it was a decision last year to not bring in another guard, it was about as dumb of a decision I've ever seen a coach make. If he just swung and missed and was stuck with a crappy roster, that sucks but it's more defensible.

Either way, it looks like he's learned his lesson and he's going heavy on the guards this year which does give me some hope for next year. That's a different team last year with just remotely passable guard play - not good but not horrific. If we bring in three veteran guards who are competent, next year's team will be a lot more fun to watch.
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Hope so, although not convinced. Guess the only way I get convinced will be answered by who he signs.
 

Blackhammer said:
We signed Cooper and then essentially had a starting two guard spot available and couldn’t get anyone sums it up Could never understand how selling major playing time and as a main scoring option in the Big Ten can’t get you a player.
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I don't agree that we "couldn't get anyone." I agree with Johnnyboy (above). This was a choice made by the coach and a bad one. Two years in a row Johnson gave up on the portal recruiting too quickly. I understand it in the first year. He was a new coach, he had already had to recruit an unusually large number of players from the portal in a short period of time, and he had to get to work on securing his freshman class. Last year he didn't have a good excuse. He didn't recruit that many transfers and he had only one more player to get. There were guards available who could have helped after Samuels committed and likely some of them would have come here considering the offers they took. I suspect he wanted to have ample playing time for his freshman guards.

This year we see Johnson & Company casting a wider net and appearing to be more active in the portal. Perhaps he finally realizes that his "Year Zeroes" are over.

As far as the attraction of playing time in the Big Ten, well, not all college basketball players (not even all of the good ones) have maximizing their exposure as their primary goal. King Rice's son (who played at Bucknell) could have received P6 offers but he committed fairly quickly this offseason to Monmouth. He's from New Jersey and it looks like he wanted to go back to that region. Ryan Larson, as a one year player, could have received some P6 offers after his Wofford career but obviously wanted to stay in South Carolina. Woodbury's Michael Jones could have gone to many P6 schools after his Davidson career. He went to one (Stanford) but it wasn't the place to maximize your exposure. Obviously, his primary goal was to add a very elite graduate degree to his elite undergraduate degree from a hoity toy private school. I wrote on this board prior to his committal that I believed there was a good chance he would go there considering where he went as an undergrad.
 



bga1 said:
Of course it did not pay off for him last year. I am saying that we might end up getting some benefit from accelerated development this coming year. Just trying to inject a little hope. Ben needs to continue to learn and the bad mistakes need to be over. The margin for error is gone now.
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Whose development was accelerated by the lack of guards, that will benefit us next year? Carrington shot 32% on the year and I don’t think really developed much. JOJ annd Payne didn’t see the time/development they did because of our lack of guards. Everyone else is gone.
 

fan of Ray Williams said:
Hope so, although not convinced. Guess the only way I get convinced will be answered by who he signs.
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At the very least, Ben's looking for guards this year.

Some of the folks in here think it was calculated decision by him to not go after more guards. If that's true, it's exponentially scarier to me than if he just missed on recruits. I'd rather have a coach who missed on a few recruits than a coach who fundamentally doesn't understand the game.
 

eker0016 said:
Whose development was accelerated by the lack of guards, that will benefit us next year? Carrington shot 32% on the year and I don’t think really developed much. JOJ annd Payne didn’t see the time/development they did because of our lack of guards. Everyone else is gone.
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I think Carrington made a huge improvement, he was injured a good part of the B1G season, at the end he was starting to play. He has the physical tools, I watched the matchup between Carrington and Essegian in their last game against each other pretty closely, from that outing I would take Carrington every day of the week. He needs some consistency he's got a big upside that is starting to show. It hurts that Henley left but that is the brave new world.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
If it was a decision last year to not bring in another guard, it was about as dumb of a decision I've ever seen a coach make. If he just swung and missed and was stuck with a crappy roster, that sucks but it's more defensible.
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It was a decision. I've watched the portal very closely and continuously since 2021. Few transfers have been mentioned here that I haven't checked out before they were mentioned on this board. There were almost 1800 players in the portal last season and there were more than a few guards who could have helped and likely would have come here (considering their eventual destinations) at the time that Ben seemed to stop recruiting.

Ben may have a down program located in an area that is not appealing to a significant portion of the population but he is not without some advantages over the majority of D1 programs and, given the commitments he has obtained over his career, he can't be called a horrible recruiter.
 

the guard situation: CBJ missed on 3 PGs. might have been a case of a new coach learning not to have "happy ears". First year bottom was ogele. last year was ramberg (or samuels) - so a little better. if this year's bottom is better yet CBJ may be able to stay out of the bigten cellar.
 

I have to think the system you play also has an impact on perception of playing time. If you play a slow, methodical system 15 minutes a game can seem like not a lot of playing time. More up tempo style can be different.

I don't remember what team it was but I believe it was one of the F4 teams that had 6 guards that played more than 14 minutes a game. And none played 30. So far Johnson has played his top players 33-35+ minutes a game, many times out of necessity. If you have good depth, you can get lots of guys decent playing time.
 

cjbfbp said:
It was a decision. I've watched the portal very closely and continuously since 2021. Few transfers have been mentioned here that I haven't checked out before they were mentioned on this board. There were almost 1800 players in the portal last season and there were more than a few guards who could have helped and likely would have come here (considering their eventual destinations) at the time that Ben seemed to stop recruiting.

Ben may have a down program located in an area that is not appealing to a significant portion of the population but he is not without some advantages over the majority of D1 programs and, given the commitments he has obtained over his career, he can't be called a horrible recruiter.
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I'm not disagreeing with you that it was a decision. I actually tend to think that's most likely what happened, especially in light of the "Ihnen can play guard" talk. I was just re-iterating that it was as bad of a decision that I've seen a coach make.

All of that said, he does seem to have learned from that mistake this season. There is a real skill in not repeating past failures. We are aggressively going after guards who seem like they could help our program and make the basketball season a lot more fun.
 


jovs said:
I think Carrington made a huge improvement, he was injured a good part of the B1G season, at the end he was starting to play. He has the physical tools, I watched the matchup between Carrington and Essegian in their last game against each other pretty closely, from that outing I would take Carrington every day of the week. He needs some consistency he's got a big upside that is starting to show. It hurts that Henley left but that is the brave new world.
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Carrington does so many things that if he can turn into a good scorer, he's going to be a really good player because he defends, rebounds, can handle the ball, etc.
 

GopherOhana said:
the guard situation: CBJ missed on 3 PGs. might have been a case of a new coach learning not to have "happy ears". First year bottom was ogele. last year was ramberg (or samuels) - so a little better. if this year's bottom is better yet CBJ may be able to stay out of the bigten cellar.
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Samuels, at least on paper, was a reasonable choice at the time for Johnson's likely goals: a one-year backup point who would play limited minutes. His mistake was not getting another transfer guard which he could have done. If you look at Johnson's recruiting career (freshmen and transfers as an assistant and head coach), he can't be called a terrible recruiter and he has some advantages as well as disadvantages.
 



howeda7 said:
It seems like lots of guys who shouldn't be worth much NIL are getting $$$ though.
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Legend or fact
eker0016 said:
Talon Cooper was a pretty good "get" for us. He was being recruited by USC, Iowa State, Georgetown, Vanderbilt, Oklahoma State, Kansas State, South Carolina and Florida. He ended up not being a particularly good fit, but part of that IMO was roster construction/coaching.

IMO the real failure was basically shutting down our backcourt recruiting with signing Taurus Samuels, and thinking that Henley/Carrington/Ihnen were going to be anything more than a last place place B10 finish group of guards. I'm curious if they even went hard after another guy, or if Ben was worried about taking away too many minutes from his new recruits.
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What is your source for "basically shutting down" guard recruiting after Samuels?
 


eker0016 said:
It did not pay off for him. We had our worst season in the history of the program. One of the guys being baptized by fire transferred after starting over half the games as a freshman. Cooper transferred as well, after playing more minutes and taking more shots in the B10 than he did in the Ohio Valley. Carrington was hurt for 1/3 of the year, and Samuels had to end up playing major minutes for us and shot 26% from the floor. It was an unmitigated disaster.

I hope that Ben learned from it and lands Wrightsell, and has enough depth to make freshmen earn minutes in the future.
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If your statement that Ben shut down guard recruiting is not true -- a load of horseshit, in fact -- what lesson should he have learned?
 


Dakota2 said:
Legend or fact

What is your source for "basically shutting down" guard recruiting after Samuels?
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Check the transfer thread from last year after Samuels commits. It's completely crickets as far as any news of us reaching out to more players, and is just a bunch of us Gopherholers arguing.

Funnily enough, you are mocking GopherWeatherGuy for being concerned about our ability to bring the ball up the floor, and I am concerned about our lack of guard commits because of the chance that Carrington or Cooper is hurt (but also relieved we got Samuels).
 

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