Doogie Again

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Golden Shower said:
Clearly you had no idea that Iowa State went into Nebraska and beat Nebraska 9-7. He was referring to the number of points that Nebraska scored AT HOME AGAINST IOWA STATE you MORON!!
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Is this how you think it's appropriate to discuss things with fellow Gopher fans?
 

Golden Shower said:
Clearly you had no idea that Iowa State went into Nebraska and beat Nebraska 9-7. He was referring to the number of points that Nebraska scored AT HOME AGAINST IOWA STATE you MORON!!
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OK.....really.........moron???????

Let's throw more meaningless stuff out there.

We put up 35 points in a victory over Purdue, only for the next week Purdue to go out and beat Ohio State 26-18.

We also put up 35 points in a victory over Northwestern, only for them to go out and defeat both Wisconsin and Iowa in the month of November.

Those items still have nothing to do with the fact that we put up a measly 13 points against Iowa State.
 

Golden Shower said:
Clearly you had no idea that Iowa State went into Nebraska and beat Nebraska 9-7. He was referring to the number of points that Nebraska scored AT HOME AGAINST IOWA STATE you MORON!!
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And it only took a fluke of 8 turnovers by Nebraska including multiple inside the Iowa State 5 yard line for it to happen. Also, one of those fumbles inside the 5 yard line the receiver was not even touched and just dropped it running in with no one around him. I wouldn't hang your hat on this to justify Iowa State as a good opponent. Minnesota actually led the turnover margin versus Iowa State and still lost.
 

Doogie said:
mingg -- Oh, this would be subjective as well, but Mason left more talent than you believe ... Mason left 5 win talent and Brewster turned that into 1 win ... coaching was a reason in '07 why they lost a handful of games by 7 points or less.
Do you really believe that Bruininks, after seeing the brand new beautiful stadium constructed, will continue to tolerate at times unwatchable and losing football?
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Doogie:

a) Mason did not leave 5 win talent. How many Gophers were drafted in the NFl on the team that Brewster inhereted? More than Indiana? Less? More than Purdue? Less? Mason left junk for the most part.

b) I could care less if we won 5 games his first year. What is the point? I'd rather win 1 game trying to change things than continue to win 5 games without making big changes.

c) I have read national college football expert after expert say that changing coaches again is not the answer here. Some laugh at the notion that you could expect somone to change things here in 3 years. Mase was 32-48 in the Big Ten that is roughly 3-5 year after year after year. Brewster is already at that level and his recruited pplayers are just sophomore at the oldest. I trust the national experts more that the homers at KFAn that do not even follow college football. Including your buddy PA.

d) I have never said Brewster is the answer, but I know without an upgrade in talent, this program is going nowhere fast. Every recruiting analyst says Brewster is improving the talent pool here. For you to include the 07 recruiting year for Brewster when he was hired two weeks before the signing perios just shows how biased you are. I trust the analysts over you. Sorry.
 



Bob_Loblaw said:
Matt Spaeth graduated.
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That is correct and WVDS had minimal impact in 2007 as he was injured most of the season (1 sack). So you have Decker, Wheelwright, and Barber as your "stars". The key is not these three guys but the talent level of the other 18 guys around them.
 

My problem with ANYONE in the media (Souhan, Reusse, Doogie, PA) trying to break down the Gophers 2009 football season is the total lack of any sort of memory of the season. It seems everyone has forgotten what happend before the 4th quarter of the Illinois game.....then again I think everyone has forgotten what happened before Eric Decker got hurt.

Any meaningful discussion of the 2009 season needs to bring up Deckers injury (how well would have Wisconsin done this year without Clay?). It also needs to bring up the upgrade in the strength of schedule. Sagarin has the Gophers with the toughest schedule played in the Big Ten this season. We played 2 BCS bowl teams on the road, and played an 'almost' BCS bowl team Penn State on the road as well. How does this not get mentioned in any argument for or against Brew? And thirdly, I also believe its important to mention that the Gophers had some bad luck in the draw by not being able to play the worst two teams in the Big Ten in Indiana and Michigan.

These issues need to be covered whether you are pro Brew or Anti Brew.....at the end of the day you determine after discussing these issues Brew needs to go that is totally your opinion. At least you are informing and not shooting from the hip.
 

im curious to know what "gophernation" would think of brewster if we kept the same wins and losses, but we averaged 40 points a game all season. i really believe no one would talk as much trash because the games would be more "entertaining" to the masses. this is an nfl community and we love watching a ton of points. i am personally a 21-17 kind of a guy but im just curious if brew's perception would be different if we had a big time offense?
 

minngg said:
Doogie:

a) Mason did not leave 5 win talent. How many Gophers were drafted in the NFl on the team that Brewster inhereted? More than Indiana? Less? More than Purdue? Less? Mason left junk for the most part.

b) I could care less if we won 5 games his first year. What is the point? I'd rather win 1 game trying to change things than continue to win 5 games without making big changes.

c) I have read national college football expert after expert say that changing coaches again is not the answer here. Some laugh at the notion that you could expect somone to change things here in 3 years. Mase was 32-48 in the Big Ten that is roughly 3-5 year after year after year. Brewster is already at that level and his recruited pplayers are just sophomore at the oldest. I trust the national experts more that the homers at KFAn that do not even follow college football. Including your buddy PA.

d) I have never said Brewster is the answer, but I know without an upgrade in talent, this program is going nowhere fast. Every recruiting analyst says Brewster is improving the talent pool here. For you to include the 07 recruiting year for Brewster when he was hired two weeks before the signing perios just shows how biased you are. I trust the analysts over you. Sorry.
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Could you please submit the links to the statements of these numerous experts that have said this about our program as I have not found these and would be interested in reading them?
 



"Those items still have nothing to do with the fact that we put up a measly 13 points against Iowa State.[/QUOTE]

Very true and very frustrating. RaT, I exclude you from the following by the way.

I get the feeling that even if the Wideout hadn't fallen and instead caught the TD at the end of the First Half thus adding 7 points for the Gophers and taking away 7 from ISU, even a 20-7 victory wouldn't have changed any minds about Mr. Brewster and company.

The arguments about ending the season badly and the pathetic Offense would still be made. The "how could you lose to ISU" would be replaced by "beating ISU isn't a big deal".

The "he's GOT to GO!" crowd is buoyed by next year's schedule. The "give him time" crowd is disheartened by it.

It's going to be a long damn nine months!:horse:

Happy New Year RaT!:drink:
 

Kirk Herbstreit has earned the right to say whatever he wants about Minnesota or Indiana. He played, he beat those squads. That's where the national media differs so greatly from the local media. BTN, ESPN, et. al are peppered with guys who have played football at a high level and understand the game. I'm not saying you can't understand the game if you've never played it, but it sure makes it a lot easier. Why are 99% of coaches former players?

I'd love for someone to conduct a little survey of every member of the Twin Cities sports media and determine how many of them actually played football. I'm guessing the vast majority never played after jr. high. This would go a long way towards explaining why so many of these "experts" are so adept at pointing out problems, but more often than not, fail to provide a possible solution.
 

Wheelright and WVS were not drafted and are not playing in the NFL. They might be on taxi squads but they aren't playing. What was Brewsters record with a healthy Decker and without a healthy Decker? I know Doogie doesn't feel this is a factor in looking at the Gophers record. Does MN beat Iowa State with Decker? Who knows but let's get out the difference in MN's record with a healthy Decker and without.
 

PlayHosea said:
Kirk Herbstreit has earned the right to say whatever he wants about Minnesota or Indiana. He played, he beat those squads. That's where the national media differs so greatly from the local media. BTN, ESPN, et. al are peppered with guys who have played football at a high level and understand the game. I'm not saying you can't understand the game if you've never played it, but it sure makes it a lot easier. Why are 99% of coaches former players?

I'd love for someone to conduct a little survey of every member of the Twin Cities sports media and determine how many of them actually played football. I'm guessing the vast majority never played after jr. high. This would go a long way towards explaining why so many of these "experts" are so adept at pointing out problems, but more often than not, fail to provide a possible solution.
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Based on that logic then what does that say about Jedd Fisch?
 



You don't even have to go that far. Forget the "played football" angle. How many of them have even watched more then 5 or 6 Quarters of College Football on a weekly basis? Barrerio, Soucherey and PA in particular are famous for starting their spiel with either "now I didn't see ALL of the game" or "I didn't SEE the game, but I read about it".

Gees.:banghead::banghead::banghead:
 

Iceland12 said:
"Those items still have nothing to do with the fact that we put up a measly 13 points against Iowa State.
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Very true and very frustrating. RaT, I exclude you from the following by the way.

I get the feeling that even if the Wideout hadn't fallen and instead caught the TD at the end of the First Half thus adding 7 points for the Gophers and taking away 7 from ISU, even a 20-7 victory wouldn't have changed any minds about Mr. Brewster and company.

The arguments about ending the season badly and the pathetic Offense would still be made. The "how could you lose to ISU" would be replaced by "beating ISU isn't a big deal".

The "he's GOT to GO!" crowd is buoyed by next year's schedule. The "give him time" crowd is disheartened by it.

It's going to be a long damn nine months!:horse:

Happy New Year RaT!:drink:[/QUOTE]


That much is right.......it is going to be a long damn nine months. The floodgates were already starting to open about a month ago and the loss to Iowa State certainly opened them even more.

We all need a nice pick me up. The only thing that could lighten the mood is a Henderson or Corey Nelson commitment.

Winning cures all ills, and unfortunately we just haven't done enough of that to ward off the Brew haters.
 


minngg said:
What was Brewsters record with a healthy Decker and without a healthy Decker? I know Doogie doesn't feel this is a factor in looking at the Gophers record. Does MN beat Iowa State with Decker? Who knows but let's get out the difference in MN's record with a healthy Decker and without.
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We wouldn't have been playing Iowa State if Decker was healthy all year. Injuries are harsh but especially harsh when they happen to the only star player a team has. Too bad for us.
 

Wheelright and WVS were not drafted and are not playing in the NFL. They might be on taxi squads but they aren't playing. What was Brewsters record with a healthy Decker and without a healthy Decker? I know Doogie doesn't feel this is a factor in looking at the Gophers record. Does MN beat Iowa State with Decker? Who knows but let's get out the difference in MN's record with a healthy Decker and without.
 

tikited said:
We wouldn't have been playing Iowa State if Decker was healthy all year. Injuries are harsh but especially harsh when they happen to the only star player a team has. Too bad for us.
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But this kind of logic is meaningless to the anti-Brewster crowd. According to them, we aren't able to bring up Decker but they certainly will bring up that Iowa was without Ricky Stanzi.
 

Deckers injury is what it is. It sucked, but we can't use that as our excuse.

OK State lost arguably on the top 5 WR in the country in Dez Bryant and still finished the season ranked #19. Teams need to overcome injuries.
 

GopherGod said:
Could you please submit the links to the statements of these numerous experts that have said this about our program as I have not found these and would be interested in reading them?
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Thanks for picking out 1/4 of my argument. You must agree with the rest of it. Here is one link to to an SI guy that thinks changing coaches here is not the answer. There are more but I have better thiings to do that Google all day. Many announcers have said it as weel from Griese to Holtz to others.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/stewart_mandel/11/18/pac-10/1.html
 

RaT said:
Deckers injury is what it is. It sucked, but we can't use that as our excuse.

OK State lost arguably on the top 5 WR in the country in Dez Bryant and still finished the season ranked #19. Teams need to overcome injuries.
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No QB in the nation relied on one receiver as much as Weber did Decker. All I asked is that Doogie mention it since the record with Decker and without Decker healthy is very very different. Very few teams can counter the loss of their obvious best player. Okie State was nothing after Bryant went down.
 

I also want to point out the journalism that is being thrown the Vikings way by Souhan and PA....Both were totally for a Childress extension and neither ever brings up the fact that he's never won a playoff game (or any game when its really mattered).
Also, neither have brought up the fact that the Vikings have beat only 3 winning teams this year. Thank God for Detroit, Cleveland, and St. Louis.
Sorry, Go Vikes! But it is alarming at how they hate the Gophers.
 

minngg said:
Thanks for picking out 1/4 of my argument. You must agree with the rest of it. Here is one link to to an SI guy that thinks changing coaches here is not the answer. There are more but I have better thiings to do that Google all day. Many announcers have said it as weel from Griese to Holtz to others.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/stewart_mandel/11/18/pac-10/1.html
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Your link didn't work but please also include the links from Griese and Holtz if you are going to site that multiple experts have stated it. Thanks

EDIT: Got the link to work and after reading the statement it is not crystal clear if Mandel is referencing the firing of Brewster as being a bad idea or if he is mocking the posters pipe dream comments about getting Tony Dungy.
 

Take out the extra http// in the link and it will work, also trying doing some research for yourself too for a change.
 

It was a good article if you like reading repackaged GopherHole comments and no original analysis from a so-called "journalist".
 

Oklahoma State scored 7 points in their final 2 games and will not finish in the top 25 with their loss to Mississippi.
And I will add that they would have lost to Georgia in the first game of the season if Dez Bryant was not playing.

How did Cal finish up without Best? Better yet, would the Gophers beat Cal if Best wasn't playing? Of course it didn't happen, but think about it. 5 touchdowns!
 

Saskatchewan Gopher said:
Take out the extra http// in the link and it will work, also trying doing some research for yourself too for a change.
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I didn't make the statement so not my job to do his research to defend his statement. If I had made the statement that would be another thing.
 



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