Confernce Realignment Chaos is Here!!!!!! (maybe ... probabbly not) (Rumor Texas and OK reach out to SEC about joining)

TALON- I think some of the Universities that Goldmember chose on the west coast are just to far away to consider for your new conference. I also think those west coast teams will try and pull in closer teams to create their own super conferences. No offence to Goldmember that just my opinion!




Goldmember stated - "I think this is roughly the ordered list of how likely the Big Ten would be interested in expanding (irrespective of availability)"

**1. Notre Dame - good choice
2. Texas- Didn't the already sign with the SEC?

**3. North Carolina - good choice
**4. Virginia Tech- good choice

5. Georgia - don't see Georgia leaving the SEC
?6. Oklahoma ?
7. USC - I think the are to far west to join your new conference
8.UCLA - I think the are to far west to join your new conference
9. Tennessee - ! don't see them leaving the SEC
10. Texas A&M - a little to far away
11. Colorado ? a bit far away
**12. Virginia - good choice
13. Washington- to far away to make your new conference compact enough -much travel time
14. Oregon - to far away to make your new conference compact enough-much travel time

?15. Stanford
16. Cal - to far away to make your new conference compact enough- much travel time
*17. Missouri- OK

*18. Kansas -OK
?19. Georgia Tech -Maybe they would leave the ACC but don't think so.
*20. Utah- they would probably come.

?21. Iowa State - I read by some of you that you don't want Iowa State
?22. Oklahoma State - maybe
?23. Kansas State maybe
 

TALON

I was surprised that no gopher fans commented on Pat Forde's article from S.I. Or like me did you think his article was just to far out there?

In my post ( 382 above) from the S.I. writer Pat Forde in his article "Radical Conference Realignment" is way out their with his own personal wish list. If you didn't skip to his acritical about a third of way down to see the conferences that he designed, you should just glance at them. If the NCAA even contemplated this type of idea to the ADs of the schools to the Pat Forde mentioned their would be a massive uprising from the P5 schools.
How did he come up with those conferences?

The only way he could get his wish for those conferences to come about is if the NCAA realigned the conferences themselves. That won't happen. That would take away each conferences ability to choose the best teams that would fit their region, the conference needs, other sports needs beside football, and the fit academically for that conference! IT WOULD CAUSE A REVOLT!
 

Nah, Talon. I read through it.
Same general concept from the Cowboy Altitude blog from 2012ish or so.
But, rather than kicking some teams out, it was just a reshuffle of teams to make it easier for travel, etc. And it's eleven conferences, since the WAC was still a thing.

I do like the idea in theory, but b/c of money, it will never happen. And, as someone mentioned earlier, the Big Ten is a conference of colleges - it wasn't created (just?) for sports.

Also, I strongly object to the idea of taking Minnesota out of the Big Ten.

Pac 12

NORTH
SOUTH
San Jose State
UCLA
Stanford
USC
Cal
San Diego State
Nevada
UNLV
Fresno State
Arizona
Hawaii
Arizona State


WAC

Washington
Washington State
Oregon
Oregon State
Idaho
Boise State
Utah
BYU
Utah State


MWC

Wyoming
Texas Tech
Colorado State
New Mexico
Colorado
New Mexico State
Air Force
UTEP


Big 12

Oklahoma
Missouri
Oklahoma State
Nebraska
Tulsa
Iowa
Arkansas
Iowa State
Kansas
Minnesota
Kansas State


C-USA

Texas
LSU
Texas A&M
Houston
TCU
Southern Miss
Baylor
Louisiana Tech
SMU
Tulane
North Texas
LA - Lafayette
Rice
LA - Monroe


Big 10

Wisconsin
Michigan
Purdue
Michigan State
Illinois
Notre Dame
Northwestern
Western Michigan
Indiana
Eastern Michigan
Northern Illinois
Central Michigan
Ball State


SEC

Alabama
Auburn
Ole Miss
Tennessee
Mississippi State
Vanderbilt
UAB
Troy
Memphis
Middle Tennessee State
Arkansas State
Western Kentucky


Sun Belt
Georgia
Florida
Georgia Tech
Miami
South Carolina
USF
Clemson
UCF
Florida State
Florida Atlantic
Florida International

ACC
North Carolina
Virginia
Duke
Virginia Tech
NC State
Maryland
Wake Forest
Navy
East Carolina


Mighty Mac
Louisville
Ohio State
Kentucky
Toledo
Cincinnati
Akron
Miami (OH)
Kent State
Ohio
Bowling Green

The Big East is below
Apologies for formatting
Boston College
Penn State
Connecticut
West Virginia
Syracuse
Pitt
Army
Rutgers
Buffalo
Temple
 

I think this is roughly the ordered list of how likely the Big Ten would be interested in expanding (irrespective of availability):

1. Notre Dame
2. Texas
3. North Carolina
4. Virginia Tech
5. Georgia
6. Oklahoma
7. USC
8.UCLA
9. Tennessee
10. Texas A&M
11. Colorado
12. Virginia
13. Washington
14. Oregon
15. Stanford
16. Cal
17. Missouri
18. Kansas
19. Georgia Tech
20. Utah
21. Iowa State
22. Oklahoma State
23. Kansas State

No one below 10 is coming without one of the top 10 on that list (except maybe Colorado). How available some of these schools are is going to shift and change a lot over the next two years.

*edited because I “forgot” about TX and OK.
Make it an even 25 by adding Pitt and Syracuse. I think both would fall in the teens.
 




Look at that signature. Did he have a stroke?
 


Bob and little 8 is signaling how many digits they want from Micky, Tajas and OU. It is encrypted message. Or he was in a hurry as moving crew taking away the office desk.
 



Nah, Talon. I read through it.
Same general concept from the Cowboy Altitude blog from 2012ish or so.
But, rather than kicking some teams out, it was just a reshuffle of teams to make it easier for travel, etc. And it's eleven conferences, since the WAC was still a thing.

I do like the idea in theory, but b/c of money, it will never happen. And, as someone mentioned earlier, the Big Ten is a conference of colleges - it wasn't created (just?) for sports.

Also, I strongly object to the idea of taking Minnesota out of the Big Ten.

Pac 12

NORTH
SOUTH
San Jose State
UCLA
Stanford
USC
Cal
San Diego State
Nevada
UNLV
Fresno State
Arizona
Hawaii
Arizona State



WAC

Washington
Washington State
Oregon
Oregon State
Idaho
Boise State
Utah
BYU
Utah State



MWC

Wyoming
Texas Tech
Colorado State
New Mexico
Colorado
New Mexico State
Air Force
UTEP



Big 12

Oklahoma
Missouri
Oklahoma State
Nebraska
Tulsa
Iowa
Arkansas
Iowa State
Kansas
Minnesota
Kansas State



C-USA

Texas
LSU
Texas A&M
Houston
TCU
Southern Miss
Baylor
Louisiana Tech
SMU
Tulane
North Texas
LA - Lafayette
Rice
LA - Monroe



Big 10

Wisconsin
Michigan
Purdue
Michigan State
Illinois
Notre Dame
Northwestern
Western Michigan
Indiana
Eastern Michigan
Northern Illinois
Central Michigan
Ball State



SEC

Alabama
Auburn
Ole Miss
Tennessee
Mississippi State
Vanderbilt
UAB
Troy
Memphis
Middle Tennessee State
Arkansas State
Western Kentucky



Sun Belt
Georgia
Florida
Georgia Tech
Miami
South Carolina
USF
Clemson
UCF
Florida State
Florida Atlantic
Florida International


ACC
North Carolina
Virginia
Duke
Virginia Tech
NC State
Maryland
Wake Forest
Navy
East Carolina



Mighty Mac



Louisville
Ohio State
Kentucky
Toledo
Cincinnati
Akron
Miami (OH)
Kent State
Ohio
Bowling Green
The Big East is below
Apologies for formatting

Boston College
Penn State
Connecticut
West Virginia
Syracuse
Pitt
Army
Rutgers
Buffalo
Temple

I just don't see it. The Super Conferences advocates or wants at least 14 plus members. and that leaves about 3-4 of your conferences out. I don't see any of the SEC or ACC teams leaving their conferences because they are hoping to build a Super Conference except for Vandy from the SEC.

I think most of the UCF fans want to join the ACC, And although you have some G5 teams going to a Super Conference you don't have Georgia Southern or App. State. While Southern has been down the last 6 years we are not knocked out. The total rearrangement of conferences will take at least 2 years which allows Southern to rebound on offense. Southern has beaten every MAC team we have played in FBS. Does that mean that GSU or App. State deserves to move up- NO! Still we are better than many G5 you have moved up and what about Air Force and Army? They could slide into the spots that are open in tour personal realignment

I think these Super Conferences are a bad idea for the FBS G5 and the FCS P5 in general. Oh ya I think the FCS NDSU Bisson should be considered for a move up even though they are FCS. That is if they have the money to move. They have beaten 6 of 9 P5 schools that they have played while in the FCS and those P5 schools weren't all chumps.
 
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There will be at least a couple extremely bitter Big XII schools that won’t get picked up.

They’ll go scorched Earth, to the bitter 2025 end, for no other reason than to deny satisfaction Texas, OU, and ESPN for as long as possible.
 

There will be at least a couple extremely bitter Big XII schools that won’t get picked up.

They’ll go scorched Earth, to the bitter 2025 end, for no other reason than to deny satisfaction Texas, OU, and ESPN for as long as possible.

Would be awesome, but no chance that happens.

UT and OU are playing SEC football by 2023 at the latest.
 



Also...Bay area. Stanford.

If it weren't a logistical and travel mess, the Big Ten would love to ally with the Pac 12, particularly the 4 California schools (UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford) and Washington. They are very desirable from an academic, media market, revenue, and total athletic program standpoint.

The Big Ten likely won't make choices as nakedly about football as the SEC will.
 

If it weren't a logistical and travel mess, the Big Ten would love to ally with the Pac 12, particularly the 4 California schools (UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford) and Washington. They are very desirable from an academic, media market, revenue, and total athletic program standpoint.

The Big Ten likely won't make choices as nakedly about football as the SEC will.

Why is it a logistical and travel mess? It's 2021 and teams take chartered flights everywhere. Travel is only an issue for the fans.
 

There will be at least a couple extremely bitter Big XII schools that won’t get picked up.

They’ll go scorched Earth, to the bitter 2025 end, for no other reason than to deny satisfaction Texas, OU, and ESPN for as long as possible.
I wonder if even just 2 schools don't get picked up, could they "remain" in the Big 12 and collect OU and Texas media rights and just split it 50/50? That'd probably be pretty lucrative for a few years. Or is there a minimum number of schools required in order to have a conference?
 

You can see the wrestling experience in Bowlsby’s letter. Hard to imagine the B1G leader Warren writing such a letter. Apparently he has been on vacation all summer as the B1G office has been silent. Maybe he is moving his son from Mississippi State.
 

UT and OU are playing SEC football by 2023 at the latest.
I agree - but it will be because the Big XII and its remaining members (after whatever other exodus occurs) allowed that to happen, with a legal settlement.


ESPN will get what it wants in the end - only four Power conferences, with it owning the SEC and ACC and pumping up those properties with the best schools it can muster.

Next is the big squeeze to get Notre Dame fully loaded into the ACC. Not sure who they'll select for #16. West Virginia makes sense to me, but I guess there's still a lot of resentment towards that school from past bad attitudes of their fans and admin towards ACC schools and Big East schools.

Not sure who else would make sense for them, to be honest. Cincinnati? Houston? Memphis?
 


I wonder if even just 2 schools don't get picked up, could they "remain" in the Big 12 and collect OU and Texas media rights and just split it 50/50? That'd probably be pretty lucrative for a few years. Or is there a minimum number of schools required in order to have a conference?
There's nothing stopping them from adding 6-8 members of the American Athletic Conf.

Cincinnati, Houston, South Florida, Central Florida, Memphis, SMU, etc.


The American is trying to put it out there that they are going to add the leftover members of the Big XII, instead. But that just isn't reality, I think.

Even if it isn't a P conf anymore, the Big XII brand automatically vaults to the top of the G confs.
 

OK - so here you go. Big XII is claiming that ESPN is asking the American Athletic Conf to take the remaining eight Big XII members.

That way, the Big XII dissolves and all penalties to OU and Texas dissolve with it, and they're able to join the SEC immediately. And ESPN doesn't have to pay out the remaining three years left on its TV contract with the Big XII. Makes sense

That's why the C&D letter was sent.


https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...-members-with-texas-oklahoma-leaving-for-sec/

Big 12 believes American is attempting to grab eight remaining members with Texas, Oklahoma leaving for SEC

The Big 12 is concerned that the American Athletic Conference (AAC) is actively attempting to assume all eight remaining league members once Texas and Oklahoma are formally accepted into the SEC, league sources tell CBS Sports. This comes as Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby told CBS Sports that ESPN is leading an attempt to restructure college sports.

"I'm absolutely certain [ESPN was] involved in it with the [American] trying to poach our members," Bowlsby told CBS Sports.

AAC commissioner Mike Aresco did not respond to multiple requests for comment.



In fact, the Big 12's bylaws are written in such a way that -- if there is even one member remaining -- a program can individually sue any of the entities in this discussion -- the SEC, the AAC or even ESPN.

Leaning on the "disinterested directors" clause in its bylaws, the Big 12 intends to make the migration of Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC as difficult as possible.

After losing four teams in the last round of conference realignment a decade ago, those bylaws were drafted in 2012 to stand for a period of 99 years. Texas and Oklahoma were part of the group who, according to one source, wanted the longest agreement possible.

That last round of realignment led to the Big 12 registering itself as a corporation in the state of Delaware. That helps prevent the case from being heard in Texas where the University of Texas might have a legal advantage.

"Oklahoma and Texas are going to do everything they can to get out of the grant of rights and get out of the bylaw stipulations. It's going to be a long process," Bowlsby told CBS Sports.

Bowlsby recently told the eight remaining Big 12 schools that his strategy is to fight for survival as long as they stay together.

ESPN provided the following statement Wednesday night in reference to Bowlsby's letter: "The claims in the letter have no merit."

The Big 12 has clearly taken a fight-to-the-death stance as the two most powerful members of its league are mere steps from joining the nation's most powerful conference.

As long the Big 12 remains viable, ESPN and Fox cannot reduce the conference's rights fees under the current contract.

Big 12 schools each make approximately $37 million annually. Industry sources told CBS Sports that the Big 12's worth declined 50% to 75% with the defections of the Longhorns and Sooners.

"The eight remaining schools are dealing with a lot," Bowlsby told CBS Sports. "They're coming off a COVID year. They're coming off a rough year on ticket sales. … If we stay together, I think we'll have some options [in realignment]."
 

I can't see KU and K-State voluntarily joining a league with Wichita State, Oklahoma State voluntarily joining a league with Tulsa, or TCU and Baylor voluntarily joining a league with Houston and SMU. (last one is probably less of a deal)

And all to make less money, even in a depleted Big XII. They'd probably still make double what they'd make in the AAC, with just FOX picking up the new Big XII contract. (not sure on that though, that is obviously an important detail)


Maybe before they were only going to invite say Cinci and Memphis ..... now, I wonder if they'll take away the top 6-8 AAC properties just to spite this obvious plan by ESPN and the AAC.


Will be interesting to see which invitations go out. Big XII meeting tomorrow.
 

OK - so here you go. Big XII is claiming that ESPN is asking the American Athletic Conf to take the remaining eight Big XII members.

That way, the Big XII dissolves and all penalties to OU and Texas dissolve with it, and they're able to join the SEC immediately. And ESPN doesn't have to pay out the remaining three years left on its TV contract with the Big XII. Makes sense

That's why the C&D letter was sent.


https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...-members-with-texas-oklahoma-leaving-for-sec/

Big 12 believes American is attempting to grab eight remaining members with Texas, Oklahoma leaving for SEC

The Big 12 is concerned that the American Athletic Conference (AAC) is actively attempting to assume all eight remaining league members once Texas and Oklahoma are formally accepted into the SEC, league sources tell CBS Sports. This comes as Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby told CBS Sports that ESPN is leading an attempt to restructure college sports.

"I'm absolutely certain [ESPN was] involved in it with the [American] trying to poach our members," Bowlsby told CBS Sports.

AAC commissioner Mike Aresco did not respond to multiple requests for comment.



In fact, the Big 12's bylaws are written in such a way that -- if there is even one member remaining -- a program can individually sue any of the entities in this discussion -- the SEC, the AAC or even ESPN.

Leaning on the "disinterested directors" clause in its bylaws, the Big 12 intends to make the migration of Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC as difficult as possible.

After losing four teams in the last round of conference realignment a decade ago, those bylaws were drafted in 2012 to stand for a period of 99 years. Texas and Oklahoma were part of the group who, according to one source, wanted the longest agreement possible.

That last round of realignment led to the Big 12 registering itself as a corporation in the state of Delaware. That helps prevent the case from being heard in Texas where the University of Texas might have a legal advantage.

"Oklahoma and Texas are going to do everything they can to get out of the grant of rights and get out of the bylaw stipulations. It's going to be a long process," Bowlsby told CBS Sports.

Bowlsby recently told the eight remaining Big 12 schools that his strategy is to fight for survival as long as they stay together.

ESPN provided the following statement Wednesday night in reference to Bowlsby's letter: "The claims in the letter have no merit."

The Big 12 has clearly taken a fight-to-the-death stance as the two most powerful members of its league are mere steps from joining the nation's most powerful conference.

As long the Big 12 remains viable, ESPN and Fox cannot reduce the conference's rights fees under the current contract.

Big 12 schools each make approximately $37 million annually. Industry sources told CBS Sports that the Big 12's worth declined 50% to 75% with the defections of the Longhorns and Sooners.

"The eight remaining schools are dealing with a lot," Bowlsby told CBS Sports. "They're coming off a COVID year. They're coming off a rough year on ticket sales. … If we stay together, I think we'll have some options [in realignment]."
The fact that the Big 12 is going after ESPN so hard is a tell that they know their days are numbered. Even if the conference survives to 2025 they will need a new TV deal at that point. The two major TV routes for college football right now are FOX and ESPN. If ESPN isn't an option for the Big 12 then FOX is bidding against who? CBS and Amazon are the only others I can think of that have shown any interest in college football, and neither is a big player at this point. Amazon doesn't have anything right now, though I think they were in talks with the Pac 12 at some point. I guess NBC has Notre Dame football, but I haven't heard of them ever looking to expand their college FB inventory beyond that. And they are getting rid of NBCSN so I don't think they would have much appetite for the Big 12.

Seems to me that this action by the Big 12 is sort of a "cut off your nose to spite you face" move. And maybe the Big 12 doesn't care because they know they're done.
 

and, you add this to the fact that the television industry is in flux with more people cord-cutting and abandoning traditional cable t-v for streaming services.

One way or another, the ESPN's and FOX's of the world will still figure out a way to get paid, but it will be very interesting to see what happens with the negotiations for the next round of media-rights deals.

ESPN gets a ton of revenue from cable operators on a monthly fee per subscriber. I believe the rate on my local system is $8.38 a month. Fewer subscribers = less money for ESPN. As I said, they will replace a lot of that by making new deals with streaming services, but they may not be as lucrative as previous deals.
 

Big 12 believes American is attempting to grab eight remaining members with Texas, Oklahoma leaving for SEC

The Big 12 is concerned that the American Athletic Conference (AAC) is actively attempting to assume all eight remaining league members once Texas and Oklahoma are formally accepted into the SEC, league sources tell CBS Sports. This comes as Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby told CBS Sports that ESPN is leading an attempt to restructure college sports.

"I'm absolutely certain [ESPN was] involved in it with the [American] trying to poach our members," Bowlsby told CBS Sports.
The new combined AAC should be called the "Big 12". Merge and get all those dollars left by TX and OK. That'd be a great outcome for the current Big 12 schools and the AAC and it screws over TX, OK and ESPN. Kind of a win-win-win-win-win.
 

If it weren't a logistical and travel mess, the Big Ten would love to ally with the Pac 12, particularly the 4 California schools (UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford) and Washington. They are very desirable from an academic, media market, revenue, and total athletic program standpoint.

The Big Ten likely won't make choices as nakedly about football as the SEC will.

I agree that affiliating with those schools would be a boon for the B1G.

I don't think there's a workable solution to put these two conferences under the same roof, and I don't think they would be politically compatible even if they tried to do it. There are thousands of miles of prairie, mountains, and deserts between the two power centers of these conferences.

The priorities of the Pac 12 are not the same as the priorities of the B1G. People in San Francisco are not going to make decisions in the best interest of people in Minneapolis, much less people in Happy Valley. The power center would not stay in Chicago. Unless you want to watch Gopher games on Periscope, better off leaving the Pac 12 to do their own thing. They might be panicking, but the B1G doesn't _need_ to do anything to respond to this. They _should_ try to poach a few schools from the ACC.
 

The fact that the Big 12 is going after ESPN so hard is a tell that they know their days are numbered. Even if the conference survives to 2025 they will need a new TV deal at that point. The two major TV routes for college football right now are FOX and ESPN. If ESPN isn't an option for the Big 12 then FOX is bidding against who? CBS and Amazon are the only others I can think of that have shown any interest in college football, and neither is a big player at this point. Amazon doesn't have anything right now, though I think they were in talks with the Pac 12 at some point. I guess NBC has Notre Dame football, but I haven't heard of them ever looking to expand their college FB inventory beyond that. And they are getting rid of NBCSN so I don't think they would have much appetite for the Big 12.

Seems to me that this action by the Big 12 is sort of a "cut off your nose to spite you face" move. And maybe the Big 12 doesn't care because they know they're done.
I DO NOT LIKE THIS SUPER CONFERNCE DEAL WITH 5 OR EVEN 4 SUPER CONFERENCES made up of 16, 20 or maybe 25 teams. $$$$$$$$! I think this leaves the FBS- G5 teams no ware to move up to when they deserve it by proving it on the field!!! GSU use to be a super power in FCS or 1AA and we proved ourselves in FBS the first 2 years that HC Fritz was at GSU. Of course we now have to prove that ALL over again after HC Frits left after his 2nd year and went through 3 different HCs over the last 6 years. At this time GSU does not deserve to be in a FBS conference and surly not a Super Conference. The last 6 years is the longest time period that GSU has been mediocre in GSUs history and fans, upset, tired of it and not use to this! This SUPER CONFERENCE thing creates a huge SUPER ELEATISTS Conferences in the NCAA. I can even see GOOD P5s being let go by a conference to grab a team that has a bigger stadium and more TV appeal!



I think the far west coast teams and some teams west of the Mississippi will try to make 1 or 2 Super Conferences., get rid of the basement dwellers and add teams. Then again I think most conferences want a few bottom dwellers so they don't have to put an FCS team on their schedule. Like Vandy in the SEC. UGA or Georgia was supposed to play Georgia Southern every 4 years. They did so when GSU was FCS or 1AA. When we played Georgia in our 2ed year GSU moved up tp FCS-G5, took them into overtime in our 3nd year in FCS they have not scheduled us again. To bad for them because the last 6 years they could have beaten the $h!t out of after HC Fritz and some of his staff left with him.
 

The new combined AAC should be called the "Big 12". Merge and get all those dollars left by TX and OK. That'd be a great outcome for the current Big 12 schools and the AAC and it screws over TX, OK and ESPN. Kind of a win-win-win-win-win.
I think the Big XII remaining teams that can’t exit to other P confs will just stay put and invite AAC teams, rather than the other way around.

TX/OU stuck there til 25, unless they agree to a settlement payment, ESPN stuck with TV contract til 25.

After that … see what FOX/CBS will offer and go from there. Might be king of the G confs at that point going forward.
 

Regardless, this is why it was smart to set the new playoff up with simply the six highest rated conf champs, rather than set particular conf champs in stone.
 

Regardless, this is why it was smart to set the new playoff up with simply the six highest rated conf champs, rather than set particular conf champs in stone.
It should be the winners of the P5 conference winners and 3 open spots for the highest ranked teams that did not win their conference, You could have a 3rd or someone in the top 8 that didn't win their conference , but had a great winning season with great stats. In FCS or 1aa there were plenty of teams that were ranked #1or 2 & won their conference, but didn't complete the 16 team playoff system or win the FCS/1AA National Championship.
 




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