Brohm leaving?

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Gophers_4life said:
I was talking about the drive that they stole the TD away from, and he responded that a PI call kept that drive alive ... and there was a PI call on that drive early, but it was on a 1st and 10.

So you can see my confusion.

Thanks for the clarification.
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Yep, I was off a bit on the details. I apologize. Don't blame you for being confused .
 



btowngopher said:
Who cares about that game? Why are we acting like the gophers weren’t a play away from winning this year and taking away any possible argument anyone could make for Brohm accomplishing more during Fleck?
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Well in fact my original response to Spoofin was that (in spite of his assertion that Brohm has been a better coach than Fleck) that Fleck has gotten the better of him. Which is technically true.

Interestingly, Fleck's current 4-2 against Brohm could easily be 3-3 (if Purdue doesn't have that 2020 TD taken away) or 5-1 (if we take care of business this year, as we should have).

The only year Fleck really had no shot against Purdue was the first year 2017, and I think even that game "got away from them" IIRC. That was the game right after we got "Bortenschlager'ed".
 

btowngopher said:
Fleck has won 7 more games. 🤷‍♂️
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Have they played the same schedule? Did they start at the same place?
To me.... wins vs Eastern Illinois, etc. don't really register. 8-4 seasons where you have not beaten a single team with a winning record are not very impressive.

Again, you don't have to agree, but Brohm took over a program that is a harder to recruit to and that was in a worse spot than the one PJ took over. IMO, Brohm has accomplished more (same # of Top 5 wins as PJ has Top 25 wins, More wins vs Top 25, B1G West Championship, etc.) with less.
 



Spoofin said:
And crushed an otherwise undefeated tOSU team that ended up 13-1 and #3!
See how that works 🤷‍♂️
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And they lost to? Or do the bad teams the Gophers lost to only matter?
 

Maybe it’s as simple as the Purdue offensive approach is (was) higher risk but higher reward, while MN is lower risk, lower ceiling. Shorten the game, and so on versus aerial circus.
 

Dave H said:
And they lost to? Or do the bad teams the Gophers lost to only matter?
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They all matter. @Word already provided the list. MN has lost to bad teams too.
My post was a direct response to someone downplaying the Top 5 Iowa win. I thought it was relevant.

You will note I have not harped on MN bad loses - only mentioned Bowling Green when someone pointed out that Purdue had bad losses. I have been concentrating on Purdue's accomplishments, not Minnesota's failures. I also have been complimenting Brohm, not ripping on PJ.
 





Gophers_4life said:
The only year Fleck really had no shot against Purdue was the first year 2017, and I think even that game "got away from them" IIRC.
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At Purdue in 2017, the Gophers went on a 17-play, 62-yard drive that resulted in the go-ahead FG from Emmit Carpenter with 2:26 remaining in the game. The defense then let Purdue march down the field to retake the lead 24-17 with 1:17. The Gophers responded by driving 48 yards to the Purdue 27 yard line before Connor Rhoda threw a pick-6 to make 31-17.

The Gopher led in that game with under 90 seconds left and lost by 14.
 

Spoofin said:
And crushed an otherwise undefeated tOSU team that ended up 13-1 and #3!
See how that works 🤷‍♂️
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Yes, that was a very impressive win. Brohm has had a few of those, for which he is given credit. If the criteria for evaluating Brohm vs PJ is as simple as who had the single most impressive win, then Brohm gets the nod. Personally I'm a proponent of looking at the whole body of work.
 



Gophers1992 said:
Yes, that was a very impressive win. Brohm has had a few of those, for which he is given credit. If the criteria for evaluating Brohm vs PJ is as simple as who had the single most impressive win, then Brohm gets the nod. Personally I'm a proponent of looking at the whole body of work.
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The whole body of work could favor Brohm as well if you take into account the shape of the program. In the 4 years preceeding Brohm, Hazell went 9–33. He took a terrible team and made them decent/good. I think it's reasonable to believe that Brohm could have out performed Fleck at Minnesota if he got the job.
 

noamfromm said:
The whole body of work could favor Brohm as well if you take into account the shape of the program. In the 4 years preceeding Brohm, Hazell went 9–33. He took a terrible team and made them decent/good. I think it's reasonable to believe that Brohm could have out performed Fleck at Minnesota if he got the job.
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It certainly could. My issue isn't with anyone concluding Brohm has a better resume than PJ - there is a reasonable argument to be made. My issue is one poster trying to claim it's an open and shut case and that most of us gopher fans simply can't accept how much better Brohm's accomplishments are.
 

I'm finally going to address the elephant in the room. How does Brohm leaving affect North Dakota and Duluth's chances of joining Big Ten hockey?
 


Gophers1992 said:
It certainly could. My issue isn't with anyone concluding Brohm has a better resume than PJ - there is a reasonable argument to be made. My issue is one poster trying to claim it's an open and shut case and that most of us gopher fans simply can't accept how much better Brohm's accomplishments are.
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Oh please. I’ve stated my opinion. I’ve presented why I believe it. I’ve challenged counter arguments. I believe the answer is clear, but have acknowledged more than once that others may have other opinions. We are talking about football, and not something that is actually important, right?
We all know what has folks so bothered by my opinion and it has nothing to do with the guy I said has outperformed and has everything to do with the guy I dare to say has underperformed.
 

Spoofin said:
Have they played the same schedule? Did they start at the same place?
To me.... wins vs Eastern Illinois, etc. don't really register. 8-4 seasons where you have not beaten a single team with a winning record are not very impressive.

Again, you don't have to agree, but Brohm took over a program that is a harder to recruit to and that was in a worse spot than the one PJ took over. IMO, Brohm has accomplished more (same # of Top 5 wins as PJ has Top 25 wins, More wins vs Top 25, B1G West Championship, etc.) with less.
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To me beating OSU doesn’t register when you only win 6 games and end the year with a 63-14 brutalization at the hands of a 7-5 Auburn team.

I think Minnesota is a tougher location to recruit to personally.

And again I don’t think Brohm has accomplished more with less. I think it’s pretty clear he has accomplished less. If you want to argue he started with less so he should receive more credit for what he has accomplished then I would say you have a debatable argument. But to say he has accomplished more is just factually wrong when the ultimate accomplishment is finishing #1 and Fleck has come way closer to that than Brohm ever has.
 

btowngopher said:
To me beating OSU doesn’t register when you only win 6 games and end the year with a 63-14 brutalization at the hands of a 7-5 Auburn team.

I think Minnesota is a tougher location to recruit to personally.

And again I don’t think Brohm has accomplished more with less. I think it’s pretty clear he has accomplished less. If you want to argue he started with less so he should receive more credit for what he has accomplished then I would say you have a debatable argument. But to say he has accomplished more is just factually wrong when the ultimate accomplishment is finishing #1 and Fleck has come way closer to that than Brohm ever has.
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OK
 

Genuine question to everyone: Would you trade our 2019 season for Purdue's 2022 season? I ask this not to argue one way or another but this thread kind of made me think about it.
 


Gophers_4life said:
Well in fact my original response to Spoofin was that (in spite of his assertion that Brohm has been a better coach than Fleck) that Fleck has gotten the better of him. Which is technically true.

Interestingly, Fleck's current 4-2 against Brohm could easily be 3-3 (if Purdue doesn't have that 2020 TD taken away) or 5-1 (if we take care of business this year, as we should have).

The only year Fleck really had no shot against Purdue was the first year 2017, and I think even that game "got away from them" IIRC. That was the game right after we got "Bortenschlager'ed".
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TBH every Fleck vs Brohm game has been a little weird. 2018 was a clear ass kicking. We controlled the 2019 game, they rallied late but we won that one. 2017, 2020-2022 could have all gone either way, be it a flucky call, an unlucky drop. 2017 and 2021 were crazy whether games
 

Gophers1992 said:
Genuine question to everyone: Would you trade our 2019 season for Purdue's 2022 season? I ask this not to argue one way or another but this thread kind of made me think about it.
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no chance. maybe for their 2000 season
 

Gophers1992 said:
Genuine question to everyone: Would you trade our 2019 season for Purdue's 2022 season? I ask this not to argue one way or another but this thread kind of made me think about it.
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No
 

Gophers1992 said:
Genuine question to everyone: Would you trade our 2019 season for Purdue's 2022 season? I ask this not to argue one way or another but this thread kind of made me think about it.
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Not even close. Purdue isn't ranked (MN finished #10), has five losses, and probably gets ass-kicked by LSU for the 6th loss.
 

Dupreefor3 said:
TBH every Fleck vs Brohm game has been a little weird. 2018 was a clear ass kicking. We controlled the 2019 game, they rallied late but we won that one. 2017, 2020-2022 could have all gone either way, be it a flucky call, an unlucky drop. 2017 and 2021 were crazy whether games
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True, but you could say the same thing about almost every Iowa game since PJ has been here......
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
True, but you could say the same thing about almost every Iowa game since PJ has been here......
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Most of them. They whooped us in 2018 and 2020, 2017 was close, but we were never much of a threat. I do believe we were better in 2019, 2021 and 2022, out played them in all three and yet found away to piss all three away. Then again you can argue Nebraska pissed their games away against us in 2020-2022, but ultimately that's why you're what you're
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yet PJ's floor and ceiling have both been higher at Minnesota than Brohm's has been at Purdue.
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Depends on POV and metric. These arguments can make eyes glaze over but it’s seemingly unarguable one team was crowned West champion this year and it was from Indiana.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Depends on POV and metric. These arguments can make eyes glaze over but it’s seemingly unarguable one team was crowned West champion this year and it was from Indiana.
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That raises the question I asked above about whether Purdue's 2022 was better than our 2019.
 

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