Andy Katz: Flip DECLINES Gophers job offer

[calminnfan]

Saul wasn't hired on Teague's watch.

I don't blame NT for not wanting to put up with nepotism in the workplace, it's always complicates how things are handled.

And truthfully you are dead wrong saying any potential problems with a Flip staff would be handled the same way as Tubby's was for two reasons.
1. Teague owed Tubby nothing, while he would own the Flip hire.
2. Flip is an alum and there are significant portions of the fanbase with a deep attachment to him for this reason. Any decisions made would be magnified because of this, which as I said earlier is unnecessary complication.

Agree...Nepotism is at best problematic. Though I have no doubt Ryan S. is an upright guy, it is better for NT and the U to have a policy on this and stick with it, esp. after Tubby/Saul. Unfortunate it came to this, but...

 

[Parski1]

If Flip's your guy, you let him hire his staff period. I recall this being an issue with Jim Harrick at UGa because state law prohibited it. But we allowed Tubby and Clem to do it. And unlike their sons, Ryan actually seems to have potential.

You nailed it....sure hope that was not the real reason.

 

[howieramone]

Disagree, I think we can make the tournament next year. If you were to say "This team is screwed without [insert graduating senior here]," I think Trevor Mbakwe is the only one that statement would be true for. I was hoping for more from Rodney this year. The biggest beef with this season seems to be that we didn't do very well and that we had the potential to do so much more. We still have both Hollins returning and Elliot improved throughout this season. I really think Trevor is the only huge loss this season, other than some of the non-conference games in which Rodney was spectacular, so I think some of the 5-13 Big Ten regular season record predictions are a little dramatic.

Also I would have been totally cool with keeping the coach who just got us our first tournament win in over 20 years for at least one more year.

+1

 

[calminnfan]

I usually enjoy both Bob and bga's posts and I find myself somewhere in the middle of both arguments. First of all, I am not sure I believe much of what has been reported about the Gopher search, it all seems too "simple". The idea that Flip (allegedly) turned the job down because he couldn't have Ryan on his staff falls in to that same "simple" line of thinking. I think most of us knew that Ryan would be on Flip's staff and that it would not necessarily be a popular move. When looking for a reason why Flip is not going to coach the Gophers, that would be the first place to go with speculation.

That said, to play along with the theory that Flip was offered the job and then turned it down because Ryan would not have been allowed on staff, I think blame should be placed on both Flip and Norwood. If Flip really wants to be the "U" coach, he should be willing to put together the best possible staff and I don't think you can argue that Ryan would be one of the 3 bench assistants under that scenario. If Norwood really wanted Flip then he should have known that Ryan was likely part of the package and found a way to work with Flip on a compromise of some sort.

Can two walk together unless they agree a little Bible verse there (Amos 3:3). I am not certain blame is a great word for what happened, just could not agree.

 

[calminnfan]

You nailed it....sure hope that was not the real reason.

New AD, New rules...

 

[Ron Johnson Super Fan]

Don't believe that Flip loves his school more than his son.

Didn't say that he did. But I do believe that he is an ethical enough person and loves his alma mater enough that he wouldn't hire his son for a position he is unqualified for.

I hope that the coach they eventually hire doesn't have any relationships with the assistants that he brings on. Wouldn't want those prior relationships to help someone get a job.

 

[GopherGod]

Agree...Nepotism is at best problematic. Though I have no doubt Ryan S. is an upright guy, it is better for NT and the U to have a policy on this and stick with it, esp. after Tubby/Saul. Unfortunate it came to this, but...

If a policy against Nepotism is the reason, then why didn't Teague fire Saul after his DUI. That was a perfect time to get rid of him if you have a policy against it to begin with, yet he didn't. Seems like an excuse to not hire a coach who would have more power and popularity with the fans and more importantly the AD's than Teague.

 

[calminnfan]

If a policy against Nepotism is the reason, then why didn't Teague fire Saul after his DUI. That was a perfect time to get rid of him if you have a policy against it to begin with, yet he didn't.

Valid point, though Teague was not the one who made the hire in the first place and Saul's issues are probably a lot of the reason they are making the policy.

Hey, I wanted Flip and believe Ryan would be competent for what Flip had intended. If they are making the policy though, I definitely respect the policy because to often it becomes a major issue and better to not have to deal with it.

 

[Dr.Don]

This whole board takes the word of "anonymous sources" and turns it into a neighborhood gossip festival. I am still sticking with Sgt. Schultz..."I know nuttink!" Lots of other people should too.

 

[westcoastgopher11]

Didn't say that he did. But I do believe that he is an ethical enough person and loves his alma mater enough that he wouldn't hire his son for a position he is unqualified for.

I hope that the coach they eventually hire doesn't have any relationships with the assistants that he brings on. Wouldn't want those prior relationships to help someone get a job.

You think he wants his son to waste away coaching with the Wizards?

Flip should be hiring the best assistants he can for the job, if he does anything less than that he's shortchanging the university.

Relationships =/= family.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

If a policy against Nepotism is the reason, then why didn't Teague fire Saul after his DUI. That was a perfect time to get rid of him if you have a policy against it to begin with, yet he didn't. Seems like an excuse to not hire a coach who would have more power and popularity with the fans and more importantly the AD's than Teague.

It's probably because at the time he was stuck with Tubby and didn't want to have to deal with that giant mess going into the biggest season in years for the team.

 

[GopherGod]

Valid point, though Teague was not the one who made the hire in the first place and Saul's issues are probably a lot of the reason they are making the policy.

Hey, I wanted Flip and believe Ryan would be competent for what Flip had intended. If they are making the policy though, I definitely respect the policy because to often it becomes a major issue and better to not have to deal with it.

Yet Teague had a slam dunk easy opportunity to implement his policy on Saul after his arrest, yet he gave him a slap on the wrist. That leads me to believe he never had this policy to begin with and is now using it as a smokescreen when convenient for him.

 

[bga1]

You think he wants his son to waste away coaching with the Wizards?

Flip should be hiring the best assistants he can for the job, if he does anything less than that he's shortchanging the university.

Relationships =/= family.

What if Ryan is the best assistant for Flip? Maybe Ryan has the exact skill set Flip is looking for. Making this stipulation up right now is garbage.

 

[GophersInIowa]

This kid is an assistant coach in the NBA who is supposedly working his a$$ off there and we are going to lose his father because of the ego of the new AD.

He had better get a knockout head coach or he is going to lose the backing of the big donor supporters before he even starts to campaign for the basketball building.

If the report is true (which it probably isn't), why does the blame only get put on one side? If you think it's ridiculous that an AD won't hire a coach because of this, isn't is just as ridiculous for a coach to turn down a supposed dream job because of this as well?

 

[calminnfan]

This whole board takes the word of "anonymous sources" and turns it into a neighborhood gossip festival. I am still sticking with Sgt. Schultz..."I know nuttink!" Lots of other people should too.

Fair enough...let me say IF this is what happened...

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

You think he wants his son to waste away coaching with the Wizards?

Flip should be hiring the best assistants he can for the job, if he does anything less than that he's shortchanging the university.
Relationships =/= family.

+1000000

It's baffling that some people are upset with Teague for insisting on qualified assistants.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

If the report is true (which it probably isn't), why does the blame only get put on one side? If you think it's ridiculous that an AD won't hire a coach because of this, isn't is just as ridiculous for a coach to turn down a supposed dream job because of this as well?

IF the report is true, every single bit of blame should be placed on Flip.

An AD that insists on qualified assistants is 100% in the right. Flip didn't owe the University anything, he didn't have to take the job so I'm not even mad at him. But you need to find some blame, it has to go to Flip.

 

[GopherGod]

It's probably because at the time he was stuck with Tubby and didn't want to have to deal with that giant mess going into the biggest season in years for the team.

Saul was a joke and a laughing stock from the get go. There would have been no PR mess or the like for firing or at a minimum suspending for the year a coach who got arrested. No one is going to feel pity for a guy who is supposed to be an example to young men, getting fired or suspended for being arrested.

 

[calminnfan]

Yet Teague had a slam dunk easy opportunity to implement his policy on Saul after his arrest, yet he gave him a slap on the wrist. That leads me to believe he never had this policy to begin with and is now using it as a smokescreen when convenient for him.

Possible, though maybe just took the path of least resistance with Saul's arrest at the time and decided with new coach time to implement new policy. No idea, and no idea if this is the real issue. May or May not be.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Saul was a joke and a laughing stock from the get go. There would have been no PR mess or the like for firing or at a minimum suspending for the year a coach who got arrested. No one is going to feel pity for a guy who is supposed to be an example to young men, getting fired or suspended for being arrested.

No, no PR mess but it might have been a distraction for Tubby (the coach of said team). I would have been 100% cool with him being canned. I am just saying that firing the son of your current coach right before a big game is a different scenario than not hiring the son of a future coach. You want to avoid the nonsense with the second scenario.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

What if Ryan is the best assistant for Flip? Maybe Ryan has the exact skill set Flip is looking for. Making this stipulation up right now is garbage.

So now your argument is that Ryan Saunders is a qualified assistant? Did you like Saul on the Tubby staff? Saul was quite a bit more qualifed than Ryan Saunders.

 

[Blackhammer]

Saul= Ryan ? What a bunch of pointless babble. In the instant information age nobody especially the media can stand not having any information. Noticed Rayno in the Trib said panic time Flip turns down job. Everything is bad speculation we can do on the Gopherhole, without the Andy Katzes of the world making plausible tweets.

 

[calminnfan]

No, no PR mess but it might have been a distraction for Tubby (the coach of said team). I would have been 100% cool with him being canned. I am just saying that firing the son of your current coach right before a big game is a different scenario than not hiring the son of a future coach. You want to avoid the nonsense with the second scenario.

oh, oh Bob, were in agreement on this...

 

[Golden22]

Saul= Ryan ? What a bunch of pointless babble. In the instant information age nobody especially the media can stand not having any information. Noticed Rayno in the Trib said panic time Flip turns down job. Everything is bad speculation we can do on the Gopherhole, without the Andy Katzes of the world making plausible tweets.

Im with y ou Blackhammer..Saul and Ryan arguments, I am going to the bar and let everyone hash out those two for the next 5 pages...sheesh....

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Do you want to explain why Ryan Saunders is not qualified to be on a college staff?

I believe that you are showing your ignorance, as most college coaching staffs have as their bottom assistant, one who is breaking into the college game with little to no college coaching experience.

Sure.

Ryan Saunders has almost no experience. He is way less experienced than Saul Smith was when Tubby hired Saul. The guy doesn't have the resume to be a Big 10 college basketball coach. He has had 1 job in coaching and it was from his dad. He has never recruited a player, he has had NO input into player development, he simply does advanced scouting with the Wizards. If his name wasn't Ryan Saunders, his resume would be chucked in the garbage RIGHT away.

He might end up being a good coach. I would be totally cool with him being on the staff if he had any experience in player development or recruiting. He has none, his resume is worthless as an assistant coach in the Big 10. It's really not complicated.

 

[minny01]

IF the report is true, every single bit of blame should be placed on Flip.

An AD that insists on qualified assistants is 100% in the right. Flip didn't owe the University anything, he didn't have to take the job so I'm not even mad at him. But you need to find some blame, it has to go to Flip.

Now you're not even being serious.

You're right, Flip owes the U nothing and it is the responsibility of the head coach to name his staff, period. If you want Flip to be your head coach, he names his staff. This falls on the AD, plain and simple. If he didn't want Flip, he chose a good way out. Let me say this again, if Norwood does not bring a top notch coach, and not some assistant coach, he will have lost the funding for a new basketball building from the boosters. If so, Norwood's days could be numbered and he's just stating. This is starting to sound like Maturi all over again.

 

[bga1]

So now your argument is that Ryan Saunders is a qualified assistant? Did you like Saul on the Tubby staff? Saul was quite a bit more qualifed than Ryan Saunders.

We fired Saul. See how that works?

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I agree. It sounds like Ryan is a good young coach with a lot of potential, not to mention there would be 3 or 4 other assistants on staff.

What about Ryan Saunders makes you think he's a good young coach? You've enjoyed his advanced scouting for the Wizards?


Oh, by the way, Saul was WAY more experienced when he was hired by Tubby. So if Ryan Saunders has a lot of potential, Saul Smith must be on a fast track.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

We fired Saul. See how that works?

Huh? We didn't fire Saul, he was on the staff until Tubby was canned.

Saul should have been fired earlier. I was against the nepotism then and I am against it now. You're against for everyone but Flip.

 

[Rouser]

I usually enjoy both Bob and bga's posts and I find myself somewhere in the middle of both arguments. First of all, I am not sure I believe much of what has been reported about the Gopher search, it all seems too "simple". The idea that Flip (allegedly) turned the job down because he couldn't have Ryan on his staff falls in to that same "simple" line of thinking. I think most of us knew that Ryan would be on Flip's staff and that it would not necessarily be a popular move. When looking for a reason why Flip is not going to coach the Gophers, that would be the first place to go with speculation.

That said, to play along with the theory that Flip was offered the job and then turned it down because Ryan would not have been allowed on staff, I think blame should be placed on both Flip and Norwood. If Flip really wants to be the "U" coach, he should be willing to put together the best possible staff and I don't think you can argue that Ryan would be one of the 3 bench assistants under that scenario. If Norwood really wanted Flip then he should have known that Ryan was likely part of the package and found a way to work with Flip on a compromise of some sort.

I agree with everything you said (yep, I'm scared). To think that Ryan Saunders is qualified to be on a BIG staff is laughable.. I hear he has a great future and is a hard worker. You can say the same about an intern at Wells Fargo. Bottom line, no way he should be on a staff yet.. THAT SAID, if we really wanted Flip.. a compromise should have been reached (who knows, maybe it still will) and let Ryan be on staff but then have Flip let Teague recommend at least one staff member?