All Things 2023-2024 Minnesota Twins Off-Season Thread

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forever a gopher said:
The guy has played 100 games ONCE in his 9 year career, and you're going to roll the dice that after his least productive fielding year, he's magically going to come back and play 100 games in CF? Whatever you're currently on must be really good and really illegal.
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As has been noted multiple times before by SON, the Twins have payroll restrictions they are under this season and that starting pitching as proven last year, is more of a priority as evidenced in the first half of the last season, when said starting pitching kept us in it. We also had Eight starters make 5 starts last season.

Funny, how you only bolded the first part of my premise - whoopsie bro - the second part if my initial premise is bolded below.

If Buck plays 100 games in center and isn’t calamitous at the plate and/or Martin/Castro fill the at Tayloresque level , then I’m sure you’ll be the first to acknowledge it.

If neither of the above scenarios works, there always the trade deadline as well, sport😉, in addition to any deals which are percolating on the hot stove.

It amazes me how many times people look at a situation as being something which has binary options, ergo checkers, when situations generally offer a multiplicity of maneuvers, chess.

Three division titles in five seasons, with a young nucleus of promising talent and a farm system on the rise.

Additionally, the moves they made last season were MONEY and the lineup should be improved with a full season of Wallner, Julian and Lewis, and With Correra’s plantar fasciitis in the rearview - reports are he’s progressing well. So, worst case, if we might need to have someone catch the ⚾️ and not have Taylor’s offensive output, it probably won’t cause the ship to be sinking.

I’m an optimistic by nature and smell 👃 another central crown 👑 with 93-95wins and a trip to the ALCS - Ryan will take the next step in his maturation and Lewus if he plays 140 games, he’ll be in the top 5 MVP voting.

Don’t worry, be happy 😃
 
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forever a gopher said:
The guy has played 100 games ONCE in his 9 year career, and you're going to roll the dice that after his least productive fielding year, he's magically going to come back and play 100 games in CF? Whatever you're currently on must be really good and really illegal.
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Derek, Thad and Rocco are enjoying it too apparently.
 

with Buxton, people are operating under the principle that - if a player has been injured in the past, he will continue to be injured in the future.

in some cases, that may be accurate. but with Buxton, it has been a series of different injuries. getting hurt running into a wall has nothing to do with fouling a ball off your foot and breaking a toe. a concussion has nothing to do with a hamstring pull. tendinitis has nothing to do with getting hit by a pitch and breaking a bone in the hand. you can say the guy is fragile, but at the same time, he has had incredibly bad luck.

most of this is not Buxton's fault. until he retires, I will continue to hope that Buxton finds a way to stay healthy and productive.

BTW - back in the day, the Milwaukee Brewers had this infielder who was always getting hurt. went on the disabled list six times between 1980 and 1986. had tommy john surgery. fans complained that he was always getting injured. you may have heard of him. his name is Paul Molitor. he has a plaque in Cooperstown, NY. -----I am NOT saying Buxton will be a Hall of Fame player. I am saying that if he can find a way to stay healthy, he can still be a productive player.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
with Buxton, people are operating under the principle that - if a player has been injured in the past, he will continue to be injured in the future.

in some cases, that may be accurate. but with Buxton, it has been a series of different injuries. getting hurt running into a wall has nothing to do with fouling a ball off your foot and breaking a toe. a concussion has nothing to do with a hamstring pull. tendinitis has nothing to do with getting hit by a pitch and breaking a bone in the hand. you can say the guy is fragile, but at the same time, he has had incredibly bad luck.

most of this is not Buxton's fault. until he retires, I will continue to hope that Buxton finds a way to stay healthy and productive.

BTW - back in the day, the Milwaukee Brewers had this infielder who was always getting hurt. went on the disabled list six times between 1980 and 1986. had tommy john surgery. fans complained that he was always getting injured. you may have heard of him. his name is Paul Molitor. he has a plaque in Cooperstown, NY. -----I am NOT saying Buxton will be a Hall of Fame player. I am saying that if he can find a way to stay healthy, he can still be a productive player.
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Great post.

I still remember April of 2022 when he had 13 homers and was right with (Judge who had 15) IIRC, it was magical crushing thise into the second deck and beyond.

No one feels worse than him and I hope 🤞 the pendulum has swung the other way now and he has a healthy & productive full season , he deserves it.

Good vibes to you Buck!!
 

Dead 🐴 time -

Gleeman had a whole article in The Athletic as to how the Twins will replace two starters, to hopefully replicate ot produce a reasonable facsimile for this in 2024 to the stats below

Twins starters led the American League with a 3.82 ERA last season and also ranked fourth out of 30 big-league rotations with 895 innings pitched.

The latter stat is hilarious as people were still complaining about the starters not going long enough

Their targets may include -

Tyler Glasnow, Corbin Burnes, Dylan Cease, Shane Bieber and Logan Gilbert are among the frontline starters rumored to be available in trade, and there are countless other quality starters — like López last season — who will be available at the right price even if they aren’t widely known to be on the trade block.

Falvey also said, they will wait for the market to settle (leverage) and then teams will likely start looking at Twins pieces which can be included in a trade.

Gleeman also points out that this approach is used by many clubs and isn’t unique to the Twins.
 
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a lot of writers seem to think that the trade market will open up after a couple of the big names move like Ohtani and Soto.

as of right now, the betting for Ohtani is on the Dodgers, Blue Jays, Giants and maybe the Cubs. a lot of talk about Soto to the Yankees.
 

No Rule 5 action for the Twins - none of our players were selected and we didn’t select one either. Yanks lost three pitchers, which interestingly enough, was a major weakness of theirs last season -

The full list of the ten players selected:

  1. A’s: Mitch Spence, RHP, Yankees
  2. Royals: Matt Sauer, RHP, Yankees
  3. Rockies: Anthony Molina, RHP, Rays
  4. White Sox: Shane Drohan, LHP, Red Sox
  5. Nationals: Nasim Nuñez, SS, Marlins
  6. Cardinals: Ryan Fernandez, RHP, Red Sox
  7. Angels: Pass
  8. Mets: Justin Slaten, RHP, Rangers
  9. Pirates: Pass
  10. Guardians: Deyvison De Los Santos, 3B, Diamondbacks
  11. Tigers: Pass
  12. Red Sox: Pass
  13. Giants: Pass
  14. Reds: Pass
  15. Padres: Stephen Kolek, RHP, Mariners
  16. Yankees: Pass
  17. Cubs: Pass
  18. Marlins: Pass
  19. Diamondbacks: Pass
  20. Twins: Pass
  21. Mariners: Pass
  22. Blue Jays: Pass
  23. Rangers: Carson Coleman, RHP, Yankees
The remaining teams (Phillies, Astros, Brewers, Rays, Dodgers, Orioles and Braves) passed on their picks.
 
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short ornery norwegian said:
a lot of writers seem to think that the trade market will open up after a couple of the big names move like Ohtani and Soto.

as of right now, the betting for Ohtani is on the Dodgers, Blue Jays, Giants and maybe the Cubs. a lot of talk about Soto to the Yankees.
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Soto to the Yanks being finalized now, per a NYC media source -

The Yankees’ timid trend took a break on Wednesday as a maligned front office made the biggest splash of MLB’s Winter Meetings so far, as they’re finalizing a deal to acquire superstar outfielder Juan Soto from the San Diego Padres, as first reported by MLB Network’s Jon Morosi.

In return, New York is giving up a five-player package that includes pitchers Drew Thorpe, Michael King, Jhony Brito, and Randy Vasquez along with catcher Kyle Higashioka. Soto is only under team control for one more season before hitting free agency in the winter of 2024, but the Yankees’ willingness to part with several pieces ultimately suggests that they’re confident in securing him in the Bronx for the long haul.

The Yankees are also getting outfielder Trent Grisham, who is under team control for two more years, to use as a fourth outfielder.
 
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Gopher_In_NYC said:
Soto to the Yanks being finalized now, per a NYC media source -

The Yankees’ timid trend took a break on Wednesday as a maligned front office made the biggest splash of MLB’s Winter Meetings so far, as they’re finalizing a deal to acquire superstar outfielder Juan Soto from the San Diego Padres, as first reported by MLB Network’s Jon Morosi.

In return, New York is giving up a five-player package that includes pitchers Drew Thorpe, Michael King, Jhony Brito, and Randy Vasquez along with catcher Kyle Higashioka. Soto is only under team control for one more season before hitting free agency in the winter of 2024, but the Yankees’ willingness to part with several pieces ultimately suggests that they’re confident in securing him in the Bronx for the long haul.

The Yankees are also getting outfielder Trent Grisham, who is under team control for two more years, to use as a fourth outfielder.
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It saves the Friars a likely $33M, which Soto is projected to get in arbitration.

SD, like Minnesota, is going through a local TV rights modification.
 



Ope3 said:
It saves the Friars a likely $33M, which Soto is projected to get in arbitration.

SD, like Minnesota, is going through a local TV rights modification.
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They also had to take out a bridge loan at the end of last season to meet payroll.

One of the reasons I love ❤️ baseball, is that it’s so hard to buy a championship as they and the Mets demonstrated last season.

Rocco has his shortcomings, like we all do, but everything I’ve read says guys love playing for him - thst goes a long way over the 6-7 months season, where they spend more time with each other than their families.
 
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Eduardo Rodriguez to the Diamondbacks. Would have made lots of sense for the Twins.
 


Gopher_In_NYC said:
Soto to the Yanks being finalized now, per a NYC media source -

The Yankees’ timid trend took a break on Wednesday as a maligned front office made the biggest splash of MLB’s Winter Meetings so far, as they’re finalizing a deal to acquire superstar outfielder Juan Soto from the San Diego Padres, as first reported by MLB Network’s Jon Morosi.

In return, New York is giving up a five-player package that includes pitchers Drew Thorpe, Michael King, Jhony Brito, and Randy Vasquez along with catcher Kyle Higashioka. Soto is only under team control for one more season before hitting free agency in the winter of 2024, but the Yankees’ willingness to part with several pieces ultimately suggests that they’re confident in securing him in the Bronx for the long haul.

The Yankees are also getting outfielder Trent Grisham, who is under team control for two more years, to use as a fourth outfielder.
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darn. I just read a yankees blog asking for the yankees to trade for kepler
 




Breakin' The Plane said:
20 million for a solid 2/3 seems pretty reasonable, especially when they pissed away 11 million for Joey Gallo last year.
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As noted previously in this thread, there are payroll restrictions due to the issues with the broadcasting rights and the Twins favor trades to acquire starting pitchers, not available at the .99 cent store, via trades-

Kenta 2020
Gray 2022
Pablo 2023

Those worked out well and it’s hard to argue with their overall success rate and this approach
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
As noted previously in this thread, there are payroll restrictions due to the issues with the broadcasting rights and the Twins favor trades to acquire starting pitchers, not available at the .99 cent store, via trades-

Kenta 2020
Gray 2022
Pablo 2023

Those worked out well and it’s hard to argue with their overall success rate and this approach
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There are self-imposed payroll restrictions. They could lose 250 million a year for the next 10 years and the Pohlad family would still be worth a billion dollars.
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
There are self-imposed payroll restrictions.
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Exactly and as the ones who foot the bill, they have the right to set the budget; just as you and/or your better half do for Christmas.
Breakin' The Plane said:
They could lose 250 million a year for the next 10 years and the Pohlad family would still be worth a billion dollars.
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Love when “fans” make these comments as they’re always said with such aplomb as it’s not their money.

Agree to disagree; have a great weekend😀
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
20 million for a solid 2/3 seems pretty reasonable, especially when they pissed away 11 million for Joey Gallo last year.
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If he stays healthy, it's a solid deal for Arizona. Rodriguez will be 34 when the contract expires so the last year or two might be iffy.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
Exactly and as the ones who foot the bill, they have the right to set the budget; just as you and/or your better half do for Christmas.

Love when “fans” make these comments as they’re always said with such aplomb as it’s not their money.

Agree to disagree; have a great weekend😀
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True...it's not our money, but with that said, is it so wrong to wish we had an Ownership group that treated the team like a passionate hobby rather than a lemonade stand just trying to cover the cost of the lemons?

Nothing gets a fanbase and season ticketholders more excited about the upcoming season than complaints from billionaires about needing to cut payroll. They didn't think much about the fans when they considered taking a huge check to contract the team, either.

Just my opinion.
 

Slim Tubby said:
True...it's not our money, but with that said, is it so wrong to wish we had an Ownership group that treated the team like a passionate hobby rather than a lemonade stand just trying to cover the cost of the lemons?

Nothing gets a fanbase and season ticketholders more excited about the upcoming season than complaints from billionaires about needing to cut payroll. They didn't think much about the fans when they considered taking a huge check to contract the team, either.

Just my opinion.
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You and ✈️ both have valid points, but that’s not our reality, per the parties that but the checks, and since the recent past includes the Buck, Correra and Pablo signings, I’m satisfied as to their commitment. If others aren’t so be it, I guess there choice is to grin and 🐻 it or not watch - no one’s forcing fandom on anyone.

Additionally, they took the risk in buying the Twins and I’m sure there are numerous teams in our lane who would welcome our successes under the Pohlad’s ownership.

No one on here has any clue to the Pohlad’s net worth and how that’s structured either or their long-term plans for it.

I’m not upset by their comments and I highly doubt I’m the only 1️⃣. I’ll always look at the 🥃 as half full and be grateful for another season of baseball.

Things in baseball or any endeavor are never perfect and can always use improvement, in my experience; one of my favorite book’s premise is life really comes down to how you perceive the things going on around. Everyone is free to their own version of said reality.
 

from what I can tell, Forbes magazine in a 2023 listing of billionaires listed the net worth of the Pohlad family at $3.8-Billion. but as I read it, that figure covers the entire family and all of its holdings.

a 2023 Yahoo Sports story listed the Pohlad family as the 4th wealthiest ownership group in MLB with an estimate of $3.6-Billion. a different listing by statista.com shows the Pohlads ranked in 8th place. they must be using different criteria to reach their figures.

of course, that does not mean they have the money sitting in a bank vault like Scrooge McDuck. their wealth includes various companies and holdings, and is divided among multiple family members.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
You and ✈️ both have valid points, but that’s not our reality, per the parties that but the checks, and since the recent past includes the Buck, Correra and Pablo signings, I’m satisfied as to their commitment. If others aren’t so be it, I guess there choice is to grin and 🐻 it or not watch - no one’s forcing fandom on anyone.

Additionally, they took the risk in buying the Twins and I’m sure there are numerous teams in our lane who would welcome our successes under the Pohlad’s ownership.

No one on here has any clue to the Pohlad’s net worth and how that’s structured either or their long-term plans for it.

I’m not upset by their comments and I highly doubt I’m the only 1️⃣. I’ll always look at the 🥃 as half full and be grateful for another season of baseball.

Things in baseball or any endeavor are never perfect and can always use improvement, in my experience; one of my favorite book’s premise is life really comes down to how you perceive the things going on around. Everyone is free to their own version of said reality.
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Always two (2) sides to every discussion. 👍
 

short ornery norwegian said:
from what I can tell, Forbes magazine in a 2023 listing of billionaires listed the net worth of the Pohlad family at $3.8-Billion. but as I read it, that figure covers the entire family and all of its holdings.

a 2023 Yahoo Sports story listed the Pohlad family as the 4th wealthiest ownership group in MLB with an estimate of $3.6-Billion. a different listing by statista.com shows the Pohlads ranked in 8th place. they must be using different criteria to reach their figures.

of course, that does not mean they have the money sitting in a bank vault like Scrooge McDuck. their wealth includes various companies and holdings, and is divided among multiple family members.
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Thanks for posting this and a couple of salient points which were driving my broaching this topic-

Lots of this data is self-reported; as has been shown by a member of that demographic recently, thus can include accounting parlor tricks- overvaluation of assets. Men from when we’re little boys till we reach the grave, invariably participate in pissing contests, in one form or another. I’m not saying this applies to the Pohlad’s, but does to a plurality in me experience with those with seven figure incomes+. If you live in NYC and are in business and making your bones, you’ll invariably run shoulders with them at some juncture, due to proximity in either business or social setting, certainly not because I was in their league financially.

I worked in marketing research when I was active in business conducting health economic outcome research on behalf of pharma companies (yes, they are mostly &@$?@), so this involved data to produce said research - so I have insight into how data moves through the marketplace that other people don’t.

When my dad passed in 2017, I inherited some $ and as part if the process I had discussions with his financial advisor, as there was paperwork to fill out, which included a section asking about my net worth and income. When I asked him about it, he said it was some BS regulation from Sarbanes-Oxley Act. This was financial reporting legislation passed after the mortgage lending fiasco in the late 90/early 00. He said put what you want to, as there’s no way it can be verified, so input $5K net worth and a $15K salary.

Those exact numbers appeared in My Life, an online infographic site - so Pinnacle, the financial services company, sold that info to date brokers, who sold it to My Life.

Ergo, I look at any net worth numbers online with askance; my favorite site is celebrity net worth, as they seemingly don’t factor in taxes or agents/manager commissions for people in the entertainment industry.
 


Slim Tubby said:
True...it's not our money, but with that said, is it so wrong to wish we had an Ownership group that treated the team like a passionate hobby rather than a lemonade stand just trying to cover the cost of the lemons?

Nothing gets a fanbase and season ticketholders more excited about the upcoming season than complaints from billionaires about needing to cut payroll. They didn't think much about the fans when they considered taking a huge check to contract the team, either.

Just my opinion.
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"Passionate hobby" Ownership groups can fail just as easily as those that are budget conscious, such as the 2023 Angles, Padres & Mets.
 

I don't have any problem with the Pohlads running their business......like a business. Most wealthy people I know (not super wealthy, but certainly well-off) do not throw money around. the reason they became wealthy is that they run a profitable business, spend money wisely, and invest in projects where they believe they can have a positive return on investment. If you suggested that they should deliberately run a business at a loss, they would think you were nuts.

I know a guy who bought two Midwest race tracks (dirt-track operations) in the last few years. He certainly tries to put on good shows for the fans, but he has no intention of losing money on the investment.
 

Ope3 said:
"Passionate hobby" Ownership groups can fail just as easily as those that are budget conscious, such as the 2023 Angles, Padres & Mets.
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That's true...but Free Agency is a lot more fun! 🙂
 

Ope3 said:
"Passionate hobby" Ownership groups can fail just as easily as those that are budget conscious, such as the 2023 Angles, Padres & Mets.
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Where the Twins missed the boat was back when they had two of the top position players in baseball (Mauer, Morneau), top starting pitcher (Santana), and top closer (Nathan). That team was destined for greatness. That's the time to go all out for a year or two. But they didn't.

I think some people have an expectation like they should just spend, spend, spend every year. They need to pick their spots and that was a time to really go for it. Hopefully that's different in the future.
 

Ope3 said:
"Passionate hobby" Ownership groups can fail just as easily as those that are budget conscious, such as the 2023 Angles, Padres & Mets.
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The Mets are now going to try and build an organization - it ain’t sexy, but it ain’t built on sand.

So Cohen’s (Mets owner) prediction of the Mets winning the WS in five years has been adjusted🥴, as 2024 is year 4.

They cleaned house with a new GM and manager.
 

GophersInIowa said:
Where the Twins missed the boat was back when they had two of the top position players in baseball (Mauer, Morneau), top starting pitcher (Santana), and top closer (Nathan). That team was destined for greatness. That's the time to go all out for a year or two. But they didn't.

I think some people have an expectation like they should just spend, spend, spend every year. They need to pick their spots and that was a time to really go for it. Hopefully that's different in the future.
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I'm much more frustrated with their reluctant approach to most trading deadlines than I am with offseason spending. And to that point, I have more questions about how they spend money as opposed to how much they spend.
 

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