Wisconsin has to be the luckiest team on the planet.

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bleedsmaroonandgold said:
I'd love to see us kill Wisconsin when we have them in the Barn. Its a win we pretty desperately need, and watching the Grinch storm of the court after losing would make my day.
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+1,000,000

Couldn't find the thread, but someone mentioned the NCAA get like the NBA and T coaches up. Just disgusting watching him on the sideline. Absolutely pathetic.
 

Back to the topic at hand, it is quite remarkable how the Badgers have won their last three home games. They get a lucky bounce 2-pt shot against Minnesota that may not have even gotten off before a shot clock violation that is the game-winner. They are down three against Iowa late and get a lucky bounce 3-pt shot from a 28% 3pt shooter to send it to OT and an eventual win. They are down three against Michigan with seconds left and get a 47-footer to go through to send it to OT and an eventual win.
 

tjgopher said:
Back to the topic at hand, it is quite remarkable how the Badgers have won their last three home games. They get a lucky bounce 2-pt shot against Minnesota that may not have even gotten off before a shot clock violation that is the game-winner. They are down three against Iowa late and get a lucky bounce 3-pt shot from a 28% 3pt shooter to send it to OT and an eventual win. They are down three against Michigan with seconds left and get a 47-footer to go through to send it to OT and an eventual win.
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Don't forget on Minnesota's game winning shot the guy who was fouled injured his already injured wrist.

Way the game works though, still counts as a W.
 

Grant said:
*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#. When will we finish above uw in basketball or football?
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We will finish higher than them when Bo Ryan retires. (And maybe get a better coach....ya know, one that isn't washed up.)

Also worth noting, Bo Ryan is 10-1 against Beilein.

The thing about Wisconsin is that, by typically not turning the ball over and allowing fast break points, they position themselves so that one lucky play can change a game.
 

GopherHole/Flip twitter back and forth:

GopherHole tweet: Wow, bet Michigan regrets not fouling and sending #Badgers to FT line there. UW hits buzzer beater from just inside half court to go to OT

@Flip_Saunders: @GopherHole michigan had foul to give on 3 pt heave for the tie. Amazed why college coaches don't foul at end of games.

Go Gophers!!
 



BleedGopher said:
GopherHole/Flip twitter back and forth:

GopherHole tweet: Wow, bet Michigan regrets not fouling and sending #Badgers to FT line there. UW hits buzzer beater from just inside half court to go to OT

@Flip_Saunders: @GopherHole michigan had foul to give on 3 pt heave for the tie. Amazed why college coaches don't foul at end of games.

Go Gophers!!
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Agree. Simply amazing. The other thing I always wonder is why oh why don't college coaches play for the '2-for-1' like NBA coaches do. It seems like Tubby has had a chance to do that a lot over the past few years, but just refuses to do it. Meanwhile, we continually have buzzer-beating shots get drained late in the half to send the other team into the locker room with momentum. Has happened at least twice this year that I can remember, maybe (probably) more.
 

GibsonSG said:
We will finish higher than them when Bo Ryan retires. (And maybe get a better coach....ya know, one that isn't washed up.)

Also worth noting, Bo Ryan is 10-1 against Beilein.

The thing about Wisconsin is that, by typically not turning the ball over and allowing fast break points, they position themselves so that one lucky play can change a game.
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Agreed on why Wisconsin wins on those lucky plays, they put themselves in position for that to happen.

Disagree on them going down when Bo leaves. Wisconsin was a good program long before Bo and will continue to be after he leaves IMO. Unless they really botch the new hire or have a scandal.
 

scher215 said:
To continue context, however, also look at the history of the two programs (last 20-30 years), the facilities, etc.

People can blame Tubby all they want, and he does deserve some blame, but Minnesota is behind every other schools in so so so many ways.
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Certainly it's not all Tubby's fault - not even close. Not finishing-ever- above 6th is unacceptable. This program is a tough climb but there are advantages -especially versus Wisky:

1. Only high major is the state - Wisky has to compete with Marquette and a number of decent mid-majors in Wisconsin
2. Much better place to live- the Twin Cities has something to sell
3. Musselman, Dutcher and Haskins all won here

We used to battle the scandal stigma but that is gone and Tubby has a solid name. He is respected as a person. He has collected some good talent. He just is not that good of a coach. He's a lousy communicator. Will anyone argue that Bo with our same roster would not do better? I doubt it. I am all for Tubby staying. He needs a new staff of assistants to cover for his shortfalls. Keep the recruiter- dump the rest of them.
 



tjgopher said:
Agree. Simply amazing. The other thing I always wonder is why oh why don't college coaches play for the '2-for-1' like NBA coaches do. It seems like Tubby has had a chance to do that a lot over the past few years, but just refuses to do it. Meanwhile, we continually have buzzer-beating shots get drained late in the half to send the other team into the locker room with momentum. Has happened at least twice this year that I can remember, maybe (probably) more.
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My biggest issue was McGary standing under the hoop to prevent a two pointer when up 3. Huh????

IMO, I like Tubby's decision to put his center in the ball in those cases. However, McGary should have been on the other side of the court playing D or at least not inside the 3 point line.

Want to say Michigan actually had two guys on the wrong side of half court.
 

the harder they work the luckier they are.

as for the talent difference--Bo's players generally get better as their career progresses. Evans is the latest example. Not a world-beater now but as a freshman, Maverick was better than Evans was as a freshman. And I don't think Tubby got beat out on any of those players on the Badgers roster. I would guess the Gophers never even considered any of the current Badgers.(Dekker being the exception but everyone knew he was going to the Badgers all along). Next years Badgers recruits at least had the Gophers talking to them at one time so maybe we are making progress.
 


Tubby won a freaking a title. Bo Ryan hasn't sniffed the Final Four in his life. It's ludicrous to say that Bo Ryan is a better coach than Tubby Smith. He's had the better of Tubby in the Big Ten, but overall career wise, it's not even comparable.
 



Johnnyboy18 said:
Name someone who the Gophers could land if they fire someone who made the tournament three times in six years? This isn't Kentucky.
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They could land literally hundreds of coaches. There are people sitting in the stands that could teach an athletic group of college kids to beat a 1-3-1 zone.
 

KyGopherfan said:
Tubby won a freaking a title. Bo Ryan hasn't sniffed the Final Four in his life. It's ludicrous to say that Bo Ryan is a better coach than Tubby Smith. He's had the better of Tubby in the Big Ten, but overall career wise, it's not even comparable.
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But tubby only won ONE title at UK. Anyone could do that. It's why John Calipari has so many ... Wait, is UK even ranked right now?

All kidding aside, people think UK is easy to win at, but UK isn't competing with Iowa State and Wisconsin for recruits. They compete with Duke, UNC, Kansas, etc. for recruits. Still tough competition am expectation are much much higher.
 

afurry91 said:
They could land literally hundreds of coaches. There are people sitting in the stands that could teach an athletic group of college kids to beat a 1-3-1 zone.
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Man if its that easy to beat a 1-3-1 why do a ton of teams struggle against it? Keep sideline coaching bud.
 

KyGopherfan said:
Tubby won a freaking a title. Bo Ryan hasn't sniffed the Final Four in his life. It's ludicrous to say that Bo Ryan is a better coach than Tubby Smith. He's had the better of Tubby in the Big Ten, but overall career wise, it's not even comparable.
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Tubby winning a title at KY helps us right now how?

Bo is easily the better coach right now...you know, when it matters.
 


scher215 said:
Agreed on why Wisconsin wins on those lucky plays, they put themselves in position for that to happen.

Disagree on them going down when Bo leaves. Wisconsin was a good program long before Bo and will continue to be after he leaves IMO. Unless they really botch the new hire or have a scandal.
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That's not true. Wisconsin had a couple of good years under Dick Bennett who was essentially an older version of Bo. Prior to that the program was a mess for a long time.
 

bga1 said:
2. Much better place to live- the Twin Cities has something to sell
3. Musselman, Dutcher and Haskins all won here
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You live in a vacuum if you truly believe that the Twin Cities has some sort of "draw" for 18-year old kids that Madison doesn't. Madison is an unreal college town and for many college kids, that's what counts. Just because you choose to think the Twin Cities is great doesn't mean everyone else does. To some kid who grew up in Chicago or Cleveland or Terre Haute, why would the Twin Cities beat out Madison? For some it might, but to claim that's some major recruiting advantage is silly.

About Clem, we all love him, but boy does absence make the heart grow fonder. Like Tubby, he was under .500 for his career at Minnesota in Big Ten games. In his 13 years here, he made 6 NCAA tourneys, including only twice in his last four years, and finished above 4th in the Big Ten exactly once (which was vacated). He finished 6th or worse more than he finished 5th or better.

As for Dutch, he coached here ten full seasons. He finished 4th or better only three times. He finished 5th or worse seven times. In TEN SEASONS, Dutch made it to ONE NCAA tourney.

We have a lot of people who don't fully understand who we are. There is ONE old guard Big Ten basketball program that has fewer NCAA tourney appearances than us - Northwestern. EVERYONE else has more. We are not some juggernaut, never have been.
 


Johnnyboy18 said:
Man if its that easy to beat a 1-3-1 why do a ton of teams struggle against it? Keep sideline coaching bud.
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If the 1-3-1 is so tough to beat why doesn't Northwestern use it wire to wire? It's a gimmick, that's why. Even NW only uses it for stretches of the game to rattle the opponent. If it works (like it does every time against us) they stick with it longer.
 

I love the Gophers, but in some way, I hope Tubby goes to USC so Teague can hire some middling assistant coach at Cleveland State to come here and put the Gophers back to the 2 win BT seasons. I guess then, and only then, will some fans be happy.
 

KyGopherfan said:
Tubby won a freaking a title. Bo Ryan hasn't sniffed the Final Four in his life. It's ludicrous to say that Bo Ryan is a better coach than Tubby Smith. He's had the better of Tubby in the Big Ten, but overall career wise, it's not even comparable.
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I wasn't going to chime in on this thread, because I understand the frustration of being a Gophers hoops fan, but that is the most absurd thing I have read on this board in a long time.

I don't think there is a Gophers fan alive that would not make that trade in one second, even if they had to win ugly and boring basketball. :cool:
 

afurry91 said:
Exactly. There is absolutely no reason we should be worse than Wisconsin this year. It is all coaching.
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Please stop. It's hardly ever all coaching or all on the players. How do we know that Tubby hasn't tried coaching them to do certain things against the 1-3-1? Maybe it is Tubby's fault, but unless you're at practice, you have no idea.

I'm just getting sick of some people thinking your attitude/opinion has to be on one far end or the other. Just because someone thinks Tubby is doing a terrible job doesn't always mean they think he should be fired. And, at the same time, anyone who thinks it's not all Tubby's fault doesn't mean they think he's doing a great job.
 

scher215 said:
Disagree on them going down when Bo leaves. Wisconsin was a good program long before Bo and will continue to be after he leaves IMO. Unless they really botch the new hire or have a scandal.
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I wasn't implying that they would become terrible after Bo. But given their history before Bo, it is a safe bet to assume their streak of always finishing in the top four will end. And that would give the Gophers a chance to pass them some years.

Wisconsin was extremely mediocre (to say the least) before Bo Ryan. And before Dick Bennett, they only made the NCAA tournament once in 12 years. And in Bennett's 5 years, they only finished above .500 in conference twice. His third year they were 3-13 in conference.
 

tjgopher said:
Back to the topic at hand, it is quite remarkable how the Badgers have won their last three home games. They get a lucky bounce 2-pt shot against Minnesota that may not have even gotten off before a shot clock violation that is the game-winner. They are down three against Iowa late and get a lucky bounce 3-pt shot from a 28% 3pt shooter to send it to OT and an eventual win. They are down three against Michigan with seconds left and get a 47-footer to go through to send it to OT and an eventual win.
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Crazy isn't it. The Badges have nothing to apologize for (other than being from wisconsin), it's just amazing how the ball has been bouncing their way.
 

tjgopher said:
You live in a vacuum if you truly believe that the Twin Cities has some sort of "draw" for 18-year old kids that Madison doesn't. Madison is an unreal college town and for many college kids, that's what counts. Just because you choose to think the Twin Cities is great doesn't mean everyone else does. To some kid who grew up in Chicago or Cleveland or Terre Haute, why would the Twin Cities beat out Madison? For some it might, but to claim that's some major recruiting advantage is silly.

About Clem, we all love him, but boy does absence make the heart grow fonder. Like Tubby, he was under .500 for his career at Minnesota in Big Ten games. In his 13 years here, he made 6 NCAA tourneys, including only twice in his last four years, and finished above 4th in the Big Ten exactly once (which was vacated). He finished 6th or worse more than he finished 5th or better.

As for Dutch, he coached here ten full seasons. He finished 4th or better only three times. He finished 5th or worse seven times. In TEN SEASONS, Dutch made it to ONE NCAA tourney.

We have a lot of people who don't fully understand who we are. There is ONE old guard Big Ten basketball program that has fewer NCAA tourney appearances than us - Northwestern. EVERYONE else has more. We are not some juggernaut, never have been.
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I find it amazing as well the distorted view Gophers fans have of the program. When we (at that time it was a we) won the Big 10 in 82, it was the first one in ten years and it took a crazy recruiting class to do it. I loved that team and the Barn rocked that year, but it is far from the norm.

The Gophers have had some amazing individual talent over the years, but as for team success? Nothing like what people believe.
 

Anyone else see that Hardaway had 5fouls and was still on the court!!! College basketball refs are brutal!!!
 

tjgopher said:
You live in a vacuum if you truly believe that the Twin Cities has some sort of "draw" for 18-year old kids that Madison doesn't. Madison is an unreal college town and for many college kids, that's what counts. Just because you choose to think the Twin Cities is great doesn't mean everyone else does. To some kid who grew up in Chicago or Cleveland or Terre Haute, why would the Twin Cities beat out Madison? For some it might, but to claim that's some major recruiting advantage is silly.

About Clem, we all love him, but boy does absence make the heart grow fonder. Like Tubby, he was under .500 for his career at Minnesota in Big Ten games. In his 13 years here, he made 6 NCAA tourneys, including only twice in his last four years, and finished above 4th in the Big Ten exactly once (which was vacated). He finished 6th or worse more than he finished 5th or better.

As for Dutch, he coached here ten full seasons. He finished 4th or better only three times. He finished 5th or worse seven times. In TEN SEASONS, Dutch made it to ONE NCAA tourney.

We have a lot of people who don't fully understand who we are. There is ONE old guard Big Ten basketball program that has fewer NCAA tourney appearances than us - Northwestern. EVERYONE else has more. We are not some juggernaut, never have been.
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this^^^

I don't get where people get this idea that we are a destination all these coaches and recruits want to come to, this whole thing reminds me of the glen mason situation, we all weren't happy with just making bowl games so we all wanted him out thinking we can do much better without him, now we all praise kill for getting us to ONE bowl game (only made it by scheduling the worst D1 programs), because we haven't made one in so long, when glen mason would always get to the bowl game. Everyone wishing for tubby gone, be careful what you are wishing for because you might regret it. Tubby and his national recognition is the only reason recruits out of state consider Minnesota, its not because of the barn or because Minnesota is a prestige basketball program, because it is not, unlike what a lot of you may think.
 

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