Which QB do the Vikes draft in 2024?

[Ope3]

Thanks for the clarification.

You just hit one of my pet peeves, the game manager’s sobriquet.

I don't consider "game manager" to be pejorative.

Also naturally, a young QB that proves to be a solid game manager can certainly progress to something more elite as experience is gained.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

I don't consider "game manager" to be pejorative.

Also naturally, a young QB that proves to be a solid game manager can certainly progress to something more elite as experience is gained.

Agreed

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Exactly. For the Vikings, a game manager that protects the ball with the weapons around him should be all that is required. That's presuming the defense is solid.

The defense part of the equation is easier to obtain with less cap devoted to the QB.

In all fairness, every QB in the NFL is a game manager and really, every QB in the NFL is a "system QB", two terms which are so horrendously tossed around it's ridiculous.

At the end of the day, it's about the QB executing the game plan.

A QB that is efficient at executing the game plan and works within the structure of the offense looks to some like a "system QB" or a "game manager" simply because they don't HAVE to improvise and make plays off-script.

 

[GopherJake]

In all fairness, every QB in the NFL is a game manager and really, every QB in the NFL is a "system QB", two terms which are so horrendously tossed around it's ridiculous.

At the end of the day, it's about the QB executing the game plan.

A QB that is efficient at executing the game plan and works within the structure of the offense looks to some like a "system QB" or a "game manager" simply because they don't HAVE to improvise and make plays off-script.

???? Don’t apply for a football coaching, scouting or front office job. Stick to coin toss bets.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Has anyone changed their opinion?

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Interesting discussion from FO folk, who discuss the various options regarding Sam’s future, which have been covered in this thread, more or less -

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6011697/2024/12/23/sam-darnold-contract-future-vikings-nfc-north/?source=user_shared_article

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Has anyone changed their opinion?

I have to admit, I probably have, at least a little bit. And I was one before the season started that thought Darnold could have some real success this year.

You could make a strong case that the Vikings have no choice but to keep him at this point. There's at least 20 teams in the NFL right now that would kill to have Darnold playing at this level in their building next season.

I've seen the argument, what if this is as good as it gets for Darnold and he regresses dramatically next year? What about the flip side to that argument; what if Darnold is better next year, in his second year in this offense, and his second year with this offensive personnel and weapons?

I don't know what the right answer is, it's a tough one.

With Shad Sanders and Cam Ward the only QBs even remotely worthy of going in the top 20-30 picks in this year's draft and so many QB-needy teams, if someone offered a top 4-7 pick (where you could draft the #1 CB or the #1 DT) and maybe some later picks for JJ McCarthy, how do you turn that down, if your goal is REALLY to win a SB Champ?

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

It's going to be interesting. They have a chance to be even better next year. Do you want to go with the guy like Darnold that you know what you're getting or take a chance with the unproven guy?

If they don't spend the money to bring back Darnold, then use that for strengthening the interior OL. And maybe bring back a guy like Daniel Jones to backup JJM if he's willing.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

I have to admit, I probably have, at least a little bit. And I was one before the season started that thought Darnold could have some real success this year.

To your credit, you were on him from the beginning and saw his promise when I and others didn’t.

You could make a strong case that the Vikings have no choice but to keep him at this point.

Yup.

There's at least 20 teams in the NFL right now that would kill to have Darnold playing at this level in their building next season.

Scheffler said today he can think of seven teams off the top of his head who need a QB and there’s not that many decent ones available.

I've seen the argument, what if this is as good as it gets for Darnold and he regresses dramatically next year?

The Cinderella argument; I don’t know why he would regress at this point

What about the flip side to that argument; what if Darnold is better next year, in his second year in this offense, and his second year with this offensive personnel and weapons?

Yup.

I don't know what the right answer is, it's a tough one.

With Shad Sanders and Cam Ward the only QBs even remotely worthy of going in the top 20-30 picks in this year's draft

Read in an article in the Athletic, that some FOS don’t believe either Sanders or Ward in front of any of the six first rounders from last year.

and so many QB-needy teams, if someone offered a top 4-7 pick (where you could draft the #1 CB or the #1 DT) and maybe some later picks for JJ McCarthy, how do you turn that down,

You don’t.

Based on the scarcity, they might get a haul for JJ.

if your goal is REALLY to win a SB Champ?

You’re drafting JJ to your SB QB, but if Darnold continues to show out, you figure out how to sign him and pivot from there.

 

[golf]

NFL.com does an mvp watch every week. This week's version just came out:
1. Josh Allen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Saquon Barkley
4. Jared Goff
5. Sam Darnold

4th best QB. 2nd best in nfc. Ahead of Herbert, Burrow, Mahomes, Love, Dak, Stroud, Stafford, Hurts, etc.
Who'd have thought there would ever be such a list.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

To your credit, you were on him from the beginning and saw his promise when I and others didn’t.

Scheffler said today he can think of seven teams off the top of his head who need a QB and there’s not that many decent ones available.

Read in an article in the Athletic, that some FOS don’t believe either Sanders or Ward in front of any of the six first rounders from last year.

Based on the scarcity, they might get a haul for JJ.

You’re drafting JJ to your SB QB, but if Darnold continues to show out, you figure out how to sign him and pivot from there.

I'm not even advocating that this is what they should do, just playing devil's advocate;

Right now, Darnold is leading the Vikings to what in any other given year would be a Division title and the #1 overall seed heading into the playoffs. He's basically doing what any team in the NFL wants their QB to do; lead the team, deliver in the clutch, mostly protect the football, put up points.

Grit has mentioned the dead money for Cousins, how that disappearing could offset an increased contract number for Darnold next year, but there's a lot more than that. Between just Cousins, D. Hunter, Davenport, D. Cook, Cine, and a few others, the Vikings had $60M+ in Dead Cap this season. Next year that goes to about $2M.

And yes, he may not take $7-$10M/yr less to stay with the Vikings, but I absolutely think Darnold would take less money to stay in Minny. It will be part of the equation, but I really don't think the money will be the driving force in the decision on what they do next offseason. It will be their belief in Darnold, and/or their belief in JJM.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

There are too many teams that need a QB next season. Darnold isn't going to turn down 50 million to stay with the Vikings and the Vikings aren't going to pay him 50 million per season.

 

[golf]

Former player and current player agent Jeremiah Sirles says Darnold's agent will ask for $60 million a year.

Locked on Vikings podcaster Luke Braun says Darnold will get $40 -$50 million a year.

Vikings podcaster Alec Lewis wonders if Vikes could get Darnold at a discount - $40 million a year

Interesting that none of these folks come out and say what Vikings should or shouldn't do. The correct path with this is not cut and dried anymore.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Former player and current player agent Jeremiah Sirles says Darnold's agent will ask for $60 million a year.

Locked on Vikings podcaster Luke Braun says Darnold will get $40 -$50 million a year.

Vikings podcaster Alec Lewis wonders if Vikes could get Darnold at a discount - $40 million a year

Interesting that none of these folks come out and say what Vikings should or shouldn't do. The correct path with this is not cut and dried anymore.

What a difference a year makes, wow.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

There are too many teams that need a QB next season. Darnold isn't going to turn down 50 million to stay with the Vikings and the Vikings aren't going to pay him 50 million per season.

The market may not be that robust, on both sides. If I'm Darnold, right off the top, the Jets, Giants and maybe even Cleveland (and maybe the Raiders?) are a hard NO from pure franchise dysfunction. Going from the Vikings to a purely dysfunctional franchise would be career suicide, and just collecting a check.

Teams like Tennessee, the Giants, Raiders, and maybe Cleveland if they're looking, will be drafting in the top handful of picks in the draft and may be in love with one of those QBs.

The Saints and the Browns happen to be the #1 and #2 most salary cap f*cked teams in the league; no way they can pay for Darnold.

The 49ers would be a team to watch, depending on how much they love Purdy. I think Purdy is pretty damn good but how different will their contracts be? That could be the Vikings biggest competition for Darnold's services, crazy as that sounds.

I don't see Darnold getting $50M+; I just don't think he can get that big of a number. It might be $40M, low-$40's.

 

[Ope3]

The market may not be that robust, on both sides. If I'm Darnold, right off the top, the Jets, Giants and maybe even Cleveland (and maybe the Raiders?) are a hard NO from pure franchise dysfunction. Going from the Vikings to a purely dysfunctional franchise would be career suicide, and just collecting a check.

Teams like Tennessee, the Giants, Raiders, and maybe Cleveland if they're looking, will be drafting in the top handful of picks in the draft and may be in love with one of those QBs.

The Saints and the Browns happen to be the #1 and #2 most salary cap f*cked teams in the league; no way they can pay for Darnold.

The 49ers would be a team to watch, depending on how much they love Purdy. I think Purdy is pretty damn good but how different will their contracts be? That could be the Vikings biggest competition for Darnold's services, crazy as that sounds.

I don't see Darnold getting $50M+; I just don't think he can get that big of a number. It might be $40M, low-$40's.

Rams if Stafford retires?

Based on ability, I don't think Stafford should hang it up, but his age, health issues and already with a Super Bowl ring, I could see it.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Rams if Stafford retires?

Based on ability, I don't think Stafford should hang it up, but his age, health issues and already with a Super Bowl ring, I could see it.

I can't believe the level Stafford is playing at. Holy shit. I was one that thought he should have quit 2 years ago. An elite player, no doubt.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

The market may not be that robust, on both sides. If I'm Darnold, right off the top, the Jets, Giants and maybe even Cleveland (and maybe the Raiders?) are a hard NO from pure franchise dysfunction. Going from the Vikings to a purely dysfunctional franchise would be career suicide, and just collecting a check.

Teams like Tennessee, the Giants, Raiders, and maybe Cleveland if they're looking, will be drafting in the top handful of picks in the draft and may be in love with one of those QBs.

The Saints and the Browns happen to be the #1 and #2 most salary cap f*cked teams in the league; no way they can pay for Darnold.

The 49ers would be a team to watch, depending on how much they love Purdy. I think Purdy is pretty damn good but how different will their contracts be? That could be the Vikings biggest competition for Darnold's services, crazy as that sounds.

I don't see Darnold getting $50M+; I just don't think he can get that big of a number. It might be $40M, low-$40's.

Most interesting scenario for me regarding the QB carousel would be Kirko Chainz to the Raiders, per a writer in The Athletic. That would be the Raiders staying on brand.

I realize he may have some decent ball left in him, but I would like to see them land a QB with less ???, taking a less risky route.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Rams if Stafford retires?

Thst was floated in a l Athletic article; if Sam leaves, best to stay with the McVay coaching tree, as their offenses are a good fit for his skills.

Based on ability, I don't think Stafford should hang it up, but his age, health issues and already with a Super Bowl ring, I could see it.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Most interesting scenario for me regarding the QB carousel would be Kirko Chainz to the Raiders, per a writer in The Athletic. That would be the Raiders staying on brand.

I realize he may have some decent ball left in him, but I would like to see them land a QB with less ???, taking a less risky route.

I can't think of a single NFL franchise, at this point in time, that is further away from being relevant than the Las Vegas Raiders. I've been saying it for weeks, I would hate, HATE to see them spend any reasonable draft/cap capital at all on the QB position. They might have been saved from themselves by winning last week and dropping in the draft, likely too far for one of the QBs.

Antonio Pierce is the dumbest SOB I've ever seen coaching an NFL team since maybe Tomsula with the 49ers, like THAT bad. Mark Davis listens to the players way, way too much; it was Maxx Crosby and Davante Adams that went crying to Davis because Josh McDaniels was making the players work too hard and be accountable. McDaniels had issues, but nowhere near the shitshow in LV right now.

All that said, if Kirk took a workable number (because he would still be getting so much from ATL), the Raiders nabbing him for a year or two wouldn't be the dumbest thing. But that roster is terrible, and the coaching staff is terrible across the board, although the Scott/Norv Turner duo has at least improved the offense.

 

[Ope3]

Thst was floated in a l Athletic article; if Sam leaves, best to stay with the McVay coaching tree, as their offenses are a good fit for his skills.

Probably where I stole the idea from.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

I can't think of a single NFL franchise, at this point in time, that is further away from being relevant than the Las Vegas Raiders. I've been saying it for weeks, I would hate, HATE to see them spend any reasonable draft/cap capital at all on the QB position. They might have been saved from themselves by winning last week and dropping in the draft, likely too far for one of the QBs.

Antonio Pierce is the dumbest SOB I've ever seen coaching an NFL team since maybe Tomsula with the 49ers, like THAT bad. Mark Davis listens to the players way, way too much; it was Maxx Crosby and Davante Adams that went crying to Davis because Josh McDaniels was making the players work too hard and be accountable. McDaniels had issues, but nowhere near the shitshow in LV right now.

All that said, if Kirk took a workable number (because he would still be getting so much from ATL), the Raiders nabbing him for a year or two wouldn't be the dumbest thing. But that roster is terrible, and the coaching staff is terrible across the board, although the Scott/Norv Turner duo has at least improved the offense.

The Raiders are like Nebby in football.
Think they’re relevant and so far from it.

You think Pierce is gone?

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Locked on Vikings podcaster Luke Braun says Darnold will get $40 -$50 million a year.

Vikings podcaster Alec Lewis wonders if Vikes could get Darnold at a discount - $40 million a year

I'm a touch biased, and I haven't tried everyone, but if you only consumed Braun and Alec Lewis, you'd be in pretty damn good shape for being in touch with all things Minnesota Vikings.

Braun can get a little deep in the weeds sometimes with defensive schemes and looks but he takes his gig seriously and is incredibly well-educated on the game for a really really young guy (kid looks like he's 17). And he has a great understanding of the salary cap and how the roster is put together. And Alec Lewis is a great writer for The Athletic, just puts out great content on a weekly basis

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

The Raiders are like Nebby in football.
Think they’re relevant and so far from it.

You think Pierce is gone?

For any other franchise, no doubt about it. But the Raiders are SOOOO far away, I would almost consider letting Pierce flounder and flail another year while they add pieces to the roster and get closer to being a product that could attract a HC that could make a real difference.

Allegedly, new part owners Tom Brady and Richard Seymour WILL have some influence on decision-making so that would give cause for some hope; those guys at least know what competence looks like and what a winning culture looks like. I have to believe that if Brady ever walked through the building in Henderson he would have just shook his head and thought to himself "WTF....."

 

[Ope3]

I have to believe that if Brady ever walked through the building in Henderson he would have just shook his head and thought to himself "WTF....."

I drove by the Raiders facility 2 weeks ago after golfing at Revere (Lexington). Really nice edifice, from the outside at least.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

I drove by the Raiders facility 2 weeks ago after golfing at Revere (Lexington). Really nice edifice, from the outside at least.

That's the sad thing; facilities are 100% first rate. There were stories a couple years ago about Belichick's comments when the Patriots were here about how incredible they are. I toured it a year or so ago, it's pretty impressive, inside and out. They nailed the facilities, the players rank it like #1 or #2 in the NFL last I saw, and yet the franchise is seriously dysfunctional. This town would be so much more fun if the Raiders were good.

 

[Wally]

There's at least 20 teams in the NFL right now that would kill to have Darnold playing at this level in their building next season.

The question is how much of his success is Justin Jefferson, Jordan Addison, KOC and a decent o line. He has maybe the best receiver duo and a top 5 offensive play caller.

If Darnold leaves I would bet big he flops at his next destination.

 

[Ope3]

The question is how much of his success is Justin Jefferson, Jordan Addison, KOC and a decent o line. He has maybe the best receiver duo and a top 5 offensive play caller.

If Darnold leaves I would bet big he flops at his next destination.

The Rams have pretty much the same things as the Vikings do on your list, except KOCs mentor instead.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

The market may not be that robust, on both sides. If I'm Darnold, right off the top, the Jets, Giants and maybe even Cleveland (and maybe the Raiders?) are a hard NO from pure franchise dysfunction. Going from the Vikings to a purely dysfunctional franchise would be career suicide, and just collecting a check.

Teams like Tennessee, the Giants, Raiders, and maybe Cleveland if they're looking, will be drafting in the top handful of picks in the draft and may be in love with one of those QBs.

The Saints and the Browns happen to be the #1 and #2 most salary cap f*cked teams in the league; no way they can pay for Darnold.

The 49ers would be a team to watch, depending on how much they love Purdy. I think Purdy is pretty damn good but how different will their contracts be? That could be the Vikings biggest competition for Darnold's services, crazy as that sounds.

I don't see Darnold getting $50M+; I just don't think he can get that big of a number. It might be $40M, low-$40's.

You've hit on most of them, but I think there are 7 teams who will need a new QB next season. There are likely only 2 worth drafting and starting right away out of next year's draft. Last year was the draft to take a QB and that's why the Vikings took JJ. That leaves 5 teams for a bidding war.

The Steelers are already discussing giving a 36 year old Russell Wilson a 3 year $100 million extension. I would be surprised if Darnold got anything lower than 45 million per year.

If JJ's not ready, they can make Daniel Jones the next Darnold next season. There's just no reason for the Vikings to spend that amount of money on a QB when they already spent a high draft pick in what's already proving to be a very good QB draft, and have Jones in waiting. That money can go a long ways to finding more help at RB, OL, and DBs.

Darnold has been shockingly better than I expected. I'm enjoying this ride but will have no problem when he walks in the offseason for more money. It's a win for everyone.