USA Today: Michigan coach Jim Harbaugh discusses coronavirus in interview, shifts conversation to abortion

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Dean S said:
Will you still pay if I already had it done? Had my vasectomy done in 2006.
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Well I think it would depend on how many kids you already had. Full amount paid if you never have kids. Step-down amounts if you have already had kids. But yeah, I think it would make sense for the gov to pay even you if you choose to sterilize yourself.

I’m curious as to whether WriterGopher and GoldTeam would agree to a federal program that pays people who choose to sterilize themselves. Would seem to appeal to the right and left.
 

Replacement Gopher said:
Well I think it would depend on how many kids you already had. Full amount paid if you never have kids. Step-down amounts if you have already had kids. But yeah, I think it would make sense for the gov to pay even you if you choose to sterilize yourself.

I’m curious as to whether WriterGopher and GoldTeam would agree to a federal program that pays people who choose to sterilize themselves. Would seem to appeal to the right and left.
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How many people would seriously do that? I say very few.
 

WriterGoph said:
yes, freedom of choice is the beauty of America. Is that so hard for you to understand? No one group or person's beliefs should dictate what another person is allowed to choose to do with their body. How does that even make sense? Because a person read a fiction written thousands of years ago and interpreted it the way they wanted to that should dictate laws for others? Ridiculous. Church and state are separated here. Maybe move to Uganda if you want otherwise.
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But a women can dictate to kill the unborn baby who has a body??? Like I said-don't reproduce!
 

WriterGoph said:
You have a small world view.

Actually yes, men or women can choose to be a prostitute anywhere they want. Some places have legal repercussions for it, some don't.

Doing drugs is also legal in plenty of places. I've been doing them for years in public - lots of fun, btw - and I've yet to be arrested. Many drugs are less dangerous than drinking, but the government hasn't figured out a way to profit off them, so they tell us not to do them.

And yes, there are also places where a woman can be topless without issue.

I do not care whether you like Pitino or not. I just know you're a coward because the only time you show up is to boast about "look how right I am about Pitino" during losses. I also know you're a coward because you're on a football message board trying to scare people into seeing a personal decision the way you do.
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Explains a lot!
 

Goldteam said:
How many people would seriously do that? I say very few.
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You are right. Only about 1 in a 1000 men ever get it done globally. This procedure is not painful. It takes about 15 minutes. And, recovery is swift. It only takes a while to evacuate the last spermatozoa before 100% effectiveness at contraception is achieved. And, it is a relatively cheap operation.

I got it done because our 2nd child came at 27 weeks and was a premie. Not knowing the exact cause of this early delivery, my wife and I decided that it was too risky to have more kids. So, I bit the bullet. Never regretted it. Very easy to do with many post procedure benefits and I mean benefits.
 


manny77 said:
But a women can dictate to kill the unborn baby who has a body??? Like I said-don't reproduce!
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You're totally insane. Yes, that's a woman's choice. I cant believe you actually think someone else should be able to decide that. Good thing we are not going backwards in this country though. In November - GOD willing ;) - this shitshow will be over.
 

WriterGoph said:
You're totally insane. Yes, that's a woman's choice. I cant believe you actually think someone else should be able to decide that. Good thing we are not going backwards in this country though. In November - GOD willing ;) - this shitshow will be over.
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Manny, it's a woman's choice in case you didn't know.

And what's the shitshow?
 
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Political opposition to abortion is a passive aggressive way to oppose adultery and fornication, habits which are endemic to paganism and the birth control age and which produce proven damage to women, men and children -- all for passing thrills.
 



GoldenRodents said:
Political opposition to abortion is a passive aggressive way to oppose adultery and fornication, habits which are endemic to paganism and the birth control age and which produce proven damage to women, men and children -- all for passing thrills.
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Wtf

Of all the things to be concerned about....
 

Goldteam said:
Manny, it's a woman's choice in case you didn't know.

And what's the shitshow?
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Right now, yes it is legally a women's choice. Hope someday the babies will have rights to live. Not sure what the shitshow is either.
 

Dean S said:
You are right. Only about 1 in a 1000 men ever get it done globally. This procedure is not painful. It takes about 15 minutes. And, recovery is swift. It only takes a while to evacuate the last spermatozoa before 100% effectiveness at contraception is achieved. And, it is a relatively cheap operation.

I got it done because our 2nd child came at 27 weeks and was a premie. Not knowing the exact cause of this early delivery, my wife and I decided that it was too risky to have more kids. So, I bit the bullet. Never regretted it. Very easy to do with many post procedure benefits and I mean benefits.
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It's a bit unnerving when you smell your own flesh being cauterized, however. "Ah, doc, what's that I smell. Smells like chicken on the grill..." ?

True story. A buddy of mine is a wonderful singer and got the lead in the town play/musical. After a show he was greeting the patrons and this lady walks up. He looks at her and says "I know you from somewhere. Where have I seen you?"
She responds, "I was your nurse for your vasectomy." ???
 

manny77 said:
Right now, yes it is legally a women's choice. Hope someday the babies will have rights to live. Not sure what the shitshow is either.
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The country is not devolving to that kind of spot. As much as the last 3.5 years may have gotten your hopes up, our President's handling (or lack thereof) of the COVID crisis, will likely be enough for the folks in the middle to want to start a new chapter.

To your chagrin, gays will continue to marry, more and more drugs will continue to be legalized, decriminalized and utilized for medical research, minorities in prison for petty drug offenses will be released (as they should have years ago) and women will retain the rights they fought for decades for.
 



WriterGoph said:
The country is not devolving to that kind of spot. As much as the last 3.5 years may have gotten your hopes up, our President's handling (or lack thereof) of the COVID crisis, will likely be enough for the folks in the middle to want to start a new chapter.

To your chagrin, gays will continue to marry, more and more drugs will continue to be legalized, decriminalized and utilized for medical research, minorities in prison for petty drug offenses will be released (as they should have years ago) and women will retain the rights they fought for decades for.
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When did I say anything about gays? When did I say I was against women's rights? More drugs legalized-yep maybe doesn't mean it's smart. Boy you really are messed up.
 

manny77 said:
When did I say anything about gays? When did I say I was against women's rights? More drugs legalized-yep maybe doesn't mean it's smart. Boy you really are messed up.
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You're right, I'm assuming since you're so clearly pro-life that you also believe marriage is only between a man and a woman. Am I wrong?

I'm also assuming you don't know much about "drugs" or the positive benefits of many of them. I'd guess you put everything in the same bucket with crack, heroin and meth. Am I wrong?
 



MplsGopher said:
All babies do have the right to live.

If it's in a womb, it's not a baby.
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It is, however, a human.
How do we arbitrarily decide when a human has no say in whether they live or die?
It is a fine line between no rights in the womb and no rights if you're a burden to society because your disability costs too much, or your poor health is a social weight we shouldn't bear.
When we rationalize eliminating a human because they are a burden to our happiness, we open our selves to approving genocide for the good of society.
 

MennoSota said:
It is, however, a human.
How do we arbitrarily decide when a human has no say in whether they live or die?
It is a fine line between no rights in the womb and no rights if you're a burden to society because your disability costs too much, or your poor health is a social weight we shouldn't bear.
When we rationalize eliminating a human because they are a burden to our happiness, we open our selves to approving genocide for the good of society.
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what about a human self-eliminating when they are not happy and don't want to be around anymore? In the Netherlands, euthanasia is legal and it does not require a terminal illness.

Do you believe each human being should have a right to choose their end-of-life in a humane way?

Also, abortion is not about usually about a "burden to our happiness". Many people are not fit or prepared to provide for a child. Would you rather we have more kids living in poverty?
 

WriterGoph said:
The country is not devolving to that kind of spot. As much as the last 3.5 years may have gotten your hopes up, our President's handling (or lack thereof) of the COVID crisis, will likely be enough for the folks in the middle to want to start a new chapter.

To your chagrin, gays will continue to marry, more and more drugs will continue to be legalized, decriminalized and utilized for medical research, minorities in prison for petty drug offenses will be released (as they should have years ago) and women will retain the rights they fought for decades for.
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History says that the general population will choose some belief system and route out the evil doers. I put my money on Islam.
 

WriterGoph said:
what about a human self-eliminating when they are not happy and don't want to be around anymore? In the Netherlands, euthanasia is legal and it does not require a terminal illness.

Do you believe each human being should have a right to choose their end-of-life in a humane way?

Also, abortion is not about usually about a "burden to our happiness". Many people are not fit or prepared to provide for a child. Would you rather we have more kids living in poverty?
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You are moving the goal post to a person who is struggling with mental illness and wondering if they should be given our blessing to end their life rather than provide assistance.
I believe we should care them back to health.
Abortion is often about relieving the economic and social burden of caring for a child. It is rarely about the physical survival of the mother.
You make a judgment statement on others when you say "many people are not fit or prepared to provide for a child." What gives you the right to make that judgment of others? Second, you equate that many people have children and poverty creates a horrific life. I grew up in rural poverty. I rarely traveled outside a 50 mile radius of my home because my parents had very little money. Yet, I was deeply loved and blessed by the small community. I worked hard from age 12 on up and took 10 years to graduate undergrad because I had to survive. I have spent years helping others in my career. By your judgment, it would have been better if my mom aborted me. I find your judgment extremely arrogant and prideful. Yet, I accept you may simply be ignorant of the pride you have exhibited. To that end I forgive you what you don't know.
I would have more children deeply loved by their parents in poverty than fewer children neglected by their parents as they serve money. Money doesn't buy happiness. Love grows happiness.
 

WriterGoph said:
You're right, I'm assuming since you're so clearly pro-life that you also believe marriage is only between a man and a woman. Am I wrong?

I'm also assuming you don't know much about "drugs" or the positive benefits of many of them. I'd guess you put everything in the same bucket with crack, heroin and meth. Am I wrong?
[/
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WriterGoph said:
You're right, I'm assuming since you're so clearly pro-life that you also believe marriage is only between a man and a woman. Am I wrong?

I'm also assuming you don't know much about "drugs" or the positive benefits of many of them. I'd guess you put everything in the same bucket with crack, heroin and meth. Am I wrong?
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Are you in the medical field? Part of my time is spent there. Some drugs are useful and some not. So yes you are wrong. Also, I didn't vote for Trump-but I also more than likely didn't vote for your candidate.
 

I had no idea there were so many bigots on this board. Anti-choice, anti-women`s health beliefs almost always stem from religous convictions. You have the right to believe whatever you want, but you can't force your belief on anyone else and laws that do are unconstitutional on their face. Denying women health is an extension of male dominated rape culture, deny an abortion and you are condoning rape, or are you going tell women when they have been raped or not as well?. Every person has a fundamental right of agency over their own body. I might believe that prostate cancer is sentient, cancer is my god made flesh. Are you going to tell me I can't believe it, how about when I picket outside your doctor and throw pigs blood on you for killing my god? Leave your religion at home and stay out of other peoples lives!
 

MplsGopher said:
All babies do have the right to live.

If it's in a womb, it's not a baby.
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If it is in the womb it's not a baby?

You seriously can't be that stupid! You seriously can't be!

What is it? A dog, a bird, a caterpillar? What is it?
 

vaporboy said:
I had no idea there were so many bigots on this board. Anti-choice, anti-women`s health beliefs almost always stem from religous convictions. You have the right to believe whatever you want, but you can't force your belief on anyone else and laws that do are unconstitutional on their face. Denying women health is an extension of male dominated rape culture, deny an abortion and you are condoning rape, or are you going tell women when they have been raped or not as well?. Every person has a fundamental right of agency over their own body. I might believe that prostate cancer is sentient, cancer is my god made flesh. Are you going to tell me I can't believe it, how about when I picket outside your doctor and throw pigs blood on you for killing my god? Leave your religion at home and stay out of other peoples lives!
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I didn't know we had this many baby killers!

And killing a baby ties in somehow with prostrate cancer I guess.
 

MennoSota said:
How do we arbitrarily decide when a human has no say in whether they live or die?
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The SC decided this decades ago and it’s not at all arbitrary.

If the fetus is capable of surviving on its own outside the womb, then the mother no longer has the legal choice to abort the pregnancy. Medical circumstances of course can alter that.

MennoSota said:
It is a fine line between no rights in the womb and no rights if you're a burden to society because your disability costs too much, or your poor health is a social weight we shouldn't bear.
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That’s not a fine line, in the slightest.

That’s just an illogical, specious argument.
 

MennoSota said:
You are moving the goal post to a person who is struggling with mental illness and wondering if they should be given our blessing to end their life rather than provide assistance.
I believe we should care them back to health.
Abortion is often about relieving the economic and social burden of caring for a child. It is rarely about the physical survival of the mother.
You make a judgment statement on others when you say "many people are not fit or prepared to provide for a child." What gives you the right to make that judgment of others? Second, you equate that many people have children and poverty creates a horrific life. I grew up in rural poverty. I rarely traveled outside a 50 mile radius of my home because my parents had very little money. Yet, I was deeply loved and blessed by the small community. I worked hard from age 12 on up and took 10 years to graduate undergrad because I had to survive. I have spent years helping others in my career. By your judgment, it would have been better if my mom aborted me. I find your judgment extremely arrogant and prideful. Yet, I accept you may simply be ignorant of the pride you have exhibited. To that end I forgive you what you don't know.
I would have more children deeply loved by their parents in poverty than fewer children neglected by their parents as they serve money. Money doesn't buy happiness. Love grows happiness.
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Randy Moss was born in prison for those who don't know. He should have been aborted.
 

MplsGopher said:
The SC decided this decades ago and it’s not at all arbitrary.

If the fetus is capable of surviving on its own outside the womb, then the mother no longer has the legal right to voluntarily abort the pregnancy. Medical circumstances of course can alter that.


That’s not a fine line, in the slightest.

That’s just an illogical, specious argument.
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If the fetus is capable of surviving on its own outside the womb

What the bleep...............at one week outside the womb it's just as dependent on mom as it was a 5 weeks ago in the womb. Maybe it could get up and walk to the refrigerator and make a sandwich!

Seriously, buddy...................
 

Goldteam said:
How many people would seriously do that? I say very few.
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Yeah, cause everyone wants a kid.
I am guessing the same people who would sterilize themselves - for money - are the same ones having abortions.

“How many people would seriously do that?” Prob more than have abortions. I mean....
 

MennoSota said:
You are moving the goal post to a person who is struggling with mental illness and wondering if they should be given our blessing to end their life rather than provide assistance.
I believe we should care them back to health.
Abortion is often about relieving the economic and social burden of caring for a child. It is rarely about the physical survival of the mother.
You make a judgment statement on others when you say "many people are not fit or prepared to provide for a child." What gives you the right to make that judgment of others? Second, you equate that many people have children and poverty creates a horrific life. I grew up in rural poverty. I rarely traveled outside a 50 mile radius of my home because my parents had very little money. Yet, I was deeply loved and blessed by the small community. I worked hard from age 12 on up and took 10 years to graduate undergrad because I had to survive. I have spent years helping others in my career. By your judgment, it would have been better if my mom aborted me. I find your judgment extremely arrogant and prideful. Yet, I accept you may simply be ignorant of the pride you have exhibited. To that end I forgive you what you don't know.
I would have more children deeply loved by their parents in poverty than fewer children neglected by their parents as they serve money. Money doesn't buy happiness. Love grows happiness.
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Stop putting words in my mouth. Of course I or someone else isn't making the judgement whether someone should have a kid. That is that woman/couple's choice. That is the whole point here. Thanks to the law, people now have a choice if they are fit to be parents. Just because it worked out for you and your parents doesn't have any relevance to someone else's ability to make a PERSONAL choice. Its insane that you or a church or group or whatever are making an argument to make that decision for SOMEONE ELSE because of your own beliefs.

I really can't believe you tried to change my words to saying that I was the judge of another person's fitness to raise a child. Not even close to what I suggested. Super weak on your part.
 

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