University of Texas head men's basketball coach Chris Beard was arrested and charged with assault on a family member.

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GopherTheJugular said:
I vote "ill". If we start judging people on accusations instead of what's proven in court, we're headed for an awful slippery slope.

Right now, most people won't go making up accusations towards someone - but if we get to a point where accusations alone are enough to "have an effect" it could get out of control and become a huge mess. (Look at the former USSR, just accuse your neighbor of being against the gov't and whammo, they're gone from society. Let's keep a far distance from that.)
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Definitely in ill now. Arbitrary enforcement of laws, plenty of false allegations, lots of distortions in the legal system and plenty of people having their lives ruined by public assertions that are at best partially true. I’m with you, but it takes a pretty virtuous and patient person to not cast judgment before the case has been tried. Accusations themselves have the power to destroy and often do.
 

bc2211 said:
From a pure basketball perspective, of course we want him. If all controversy were to be resolved, however, I still think he’s a bad option. He’s too big of a fish, he’d come here, reform his image, and leave for a blue blood after success in year 2. And with our track record, we wouldn’t be able to replace him with a coach of equal caliber.
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Huh? So we are better off finishing 14th every year than having 2 good to great years then seeing him leave? That's some logic there ha
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy said:
When I posted I wanted him after the news broke in Nov I was laughed at by certain posters…now it seems the tide is turning. The guy is a stud coach. Even if he is only here 3 years, it may be the greatest 3 year run in our program. We’d get big time recruits and he’d get us to the top of the B10.

If we are also talking about big names who can reform their image with the U…calling Greg Marshall (winning cures a lot of things)
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The difference for me is Marshall was a DEEK to his players, Beard is not.
 


Gophers_4life said:
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-b...stic-violence-case-ex-texas-coach-chris-beard

DA drops domestic violence case against ex-Texas coach Chris Beard​

Travis County District Attorney Jose Garza said that after a review of the evidence, and considering the wishes of Randi Trew, Beard's fiancée, his office determined the charge of assault by strangulation/suffocation-family violence could not be proved beyond a reasonable doubt.

...

"Everyone knows that Coach Beard has maintained his absolute innocence since the moment he was arrested,'' said Perry Minton, Beard's attorney. "Additionally, this district attorney has a well-earned reputation for being very tough regarding domestic violence cases. The fact that Mr. Garza's review resulted in this determination so quickly says a lot. We are very pleased.''

...

Beard had five years left on a seven-year guaranteed contract that included a provision saying he could be fired for cause if he was charged with a felony or committed other behavior unbecoming of his position or that reflected poorly on the university.

The university's vice president of legal affairs, Jim Davis, wrote in a letter to Beard's attorney on the day the coach was fired that Beard engaged in "unacceptable behavior that makes him unfit to serve as head coach at our university." Whether Beard ultimately faced charges would not determine whether Beard engaged in conduct unbecoming of the school, Davis wrote.



He'll be getting every cent that he is rightfully owed. And moreover, I hope he sues them for wrongful termination. They'll push over small children to settle, quickly and quietly.
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No, they won't. That would be absolutely shocking.

The DA dropping charges doesn't change a thing.
 


GopherTheJugular said:
I vote "ill". If we start judging people on accusations instead of what's proven in court, we're headed for an awful slippery slope.

Right now, most people won't go making up accusations towards someone - but if we get to a point where accusations alone are enough to "have an effect" it could get out of control and become a huge mess. (Look at the former USSR, just accuse your neighbor of being against the gov't and whammo, they're gone from society. Let's keep a far distance from that.)
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While I understand what you're getting at, I think it's unrealistic to hold everyone to the same standards that are used in the court of law. People have always been judged independently to how the court of law might judge them - sometimes the general public is more lenient and sometimes we are more harsh. It isn't a slippery slope, it's the reality that we all live every day.

I'm not saying the people should be thrown in jail without due process, but I do think we as a society can and often should still judge them based on the facts that we know.

This isn't just true with obvious examples like OJ Simpson and Casey Anthony, but it's true with a guy like Chris Beard. I'm not saying we should run away from him but hiring him would require added due diligence that might not be there with hiring a Ben Johnson (clean background). That added due diligence is because we DO judge him for what happened. I certainly wouldn't want to hire Dave Bliss and he's never been convicted of anything.
 

Gophers_4life said:
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-b...stic-violence-case-ex-texas-coach-chris-beard

DA drops domestic violence case against ex-Texas coach Chris Beard​

Travis County District Attorney Jose Garza said that after a review of the evidence, and considering the wishes of Randi Trew, Beard's fiancée, his office determined the charge of assault by strangulation/suffocation-family violence could not be proved beyond a reasonable doubt.

...

"Everyone knows that Coach Beard has maintained his absolute innocence since the moment he was arrested,'' said Perry Minton, Beard's attorney. "Additionally, this district attorney has a well-earned reputation for being very tough regarding domestic violence cases. The fact that Mr. Garza's review resulted in this determination so quickly says a lot. We are very pleased.''

...

Beard had five years left on a seven-year guaranteed contract that included a provision saying he could be fired for cause if he was charged with a felony or committed other behavior unbecoming of his position or that reflected poorly on the university.

The university's vice president of legal affairs, Jim Davis, wrote in a letter to Beard's attorney on the day the coach was fired that Beard engaged in "unacceptable behavior that makes him unfit to serve as head coach at our university." Whether Beard ultimately faced charges would not determine whether Beard engaged in conduct unbecoming of the school, Davis wrote.



He'll be getting every cent that he is rightfully owed. And moreover, I hope he sues them for wrongful termination. They'll push over small children to settle, quickly and quietly.
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I bet he doesn't sue, and I'd be surprised if he goes after the $$$ from his contract. If there is a lawsuit, wife can be forced to testify. My reading of the article is that the charges were dropped because she refused to cooperate. That wouldn't be as easy to do in a civil matter.
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
I bet he doesn't sue, and I'd be surprised if he goes after the $$$ from his contract. If there is a lawsuit, wife can be forced to testify. My reading of the article is that the charges were dropped because she refused to cooperate. That wouldn't be as easy to do in a civil matter.
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No chance he doesn't get every cent of the guaranteed money in his contract.

There was no valid "cause" to fire him for cause. Let em try it ... sue their asses into oblivion. I'd like to think they aren't that stupid, I guess we'll see.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
While I understand what you're getting at, I think it's unrealistic to hold everyone to the same standards that are used in the court of law. People have always been judged independently to how the court of law might judge them - sometimes the general public is more lenient and sometimes we are more harsh. It isn't a slippery slope, it's the reality that we all live every day.

I'm not saying the people should be thrown in jail without due process, but I do think we as a society can and often should still judge them based on the facts that we know.

This isn't just true with obvious examples like OJ Simpson and Casey Anthony, but it's true with a guy like Chris Beard. I'm not saying we should run away from him but hiring him would require added due diligence that might not be there with hiring a Ben Johnson (clean background). That added due diligence is because we DO judge him for what happened. I certainly wouldn't want to hire Dave Bliss and he's never been convicted of anything.
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Why would we judge Beard? He didn't commit anything wrong, and his wifegirlfriend (I guess we'll see if they stay together after this!) is a psycho.

Prove me wrong
 
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Gophers_4life said:
No chance he doesn't get every cent of the guaranteed money in his contract.

There was no valid "cause" to fire him for cause. Let em try it ... sue their asses into oblivion. I'd like to think they aren't that stupid, I guess we'll see.
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The whole situation is “unbecoming”, per the verbiage in his contract. I would be surprised if he gets his money (if in fact he sues). I could see him just as easily going and finding a new job with a slightly reduced salary and it being not worth it to sue.

tOSU as a landing spot? Holtman probably won’t survive.
 

bc2211 said:
From a pure basketball perspective, of course we want him. If all controversy were to be resolved, however, I still think he’s a bad option. He’s too big of a fish, he’d come here, reform his image, and leave for a blue blood after success in year 2. And with our track record, we wouldn’t be able to replace him with a coach of equal caliber.
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Bullsh*t.

Clem took our rock-bottom program to the Sweet -16, Final 8 (robbed of the Final Four), and to the Final Four. And we didn't lose him to a blue blood.
 

EasyThere Pilgrim said:
Bullsh*t.

Clem took our rock-bottom program to the Sweet -16, Final 8 (robbed of the Final Four), and to the Final Four. And we didn't lose him to a blue blood.
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Because he was toxic with a scandal. The only flirting with another program I recall was Arizona State.
 

Gophers_4life said:
No chance he doesn't get every cent of the guaranteed money in his contract.

There was no valid "cause" to fire him for cause. Let em try it ... sue their asses into oblivion. I'd like to think they aren't that stupid, I guess we'll see.
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You don't think there would be a chance that Texas would say "we will give you X percentage money" (something less than every cent of guaranteed money) just to have this over and done with for all parties?

The alternative would be litigation that could take several years to play out along with lots of discovery that could be harmful/embarrassing to Beard and family.
 



Ope3 said:
You don't think there would be a chance that Texas would say "we will give you X percentage money" (something less than every cent of guaranteed money) just to have this over and done with for all parties?

The alternative would be litigation that could take several years to play out along with lots of discovery that could be harmful/embarrassing to Beard and family.
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Settlements are always a valid risk-abatement option. Each side giving up something in order to negate the possibility of losing everything.

Sure, exactly like you said it. Could see it.
 


Gophers_4life said:
Why would we judge Beard? He didn't commit anything wrong, and his wifegirlfriend (I guess we'll see if they stay together after this!) is a psycho.

Prove me wrong
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Because we judge everyone on everything. We don't have to clear our memories from what we know because the DA dropped charges.

We know cops got called to his house. We know that she said she was injured by Chris Beard and we also know that the police officer noted several injuries (bite marks, abrasions, scratches, scrapes, and blood on her). The fact that the victim recanted (which happens ALL THE TIME with domestic violence) does not change the affidavit. It does not erase what we know.

The DA, correctly, dropped charges because they couldn't prove the assault beyond a reasonable doubt. But we're not the court of law. We're not putting him in prison. We're the general public.

Texas will not have to pay him a dime and he won't even attempt to get money back. Any prayer he has of coaching again involves this thing going away silently and hoping some naive people believe the DA dropping charges means nothing happened. If he wants to sue them for $ back, UT won't be held to a BARD standard and they'll drag him back through the mud.

Again, I'm not saying where you should land on your judgement of him. You might think his story checks out and that there is nothing to be worried about. You might think he beat the sh!t out of his GF and she recanted for whatever reason. Either way, you're judging him from this incident.

When he gets another job, that university will put him through a thorough screening. That screening is judgement. Where the land on that screening - - reasonable people could disagree.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Because we judge everyone on everything. We don't have to clear our memories from what we know because the DA dropped charges.

We know cops got called to his house. We know that she said she was injured by Chris Beard and we also know that the police officer noted several injuries (bite marks, abrasions, scratches, scrapes, and blood on her). The fact that the victim recanted (which happens ALL THE TIME with domestic violence) does not change the affidavit. It does not erase what we know.

The DA, correctly, dropped charges because they couldn't prove the assault beyond a reasonable doubt. But we're not the court of law. We're not putting him in prison. We're the general public.

Texas will not have to pay him a dime and he won't even attempt to get money back. Any prayer he has of coaching again involves this thing going away silently and hoping some naive people believe the DA dropping charges means nothing happened. If he wants to sue them for $ back, UT won't be held to a BARD standard and they'll drag him back through the mud.

Again, I'm not saying where you should land on your judgement of him. You might think his story checks out and that there is nothing to be worried about. You might think he beat the sh!t out of his GF and she recanted for whatever reason. Either way, you're judging him from this incident.

When he gets another job, that university will put him through a thorough screening. That screening is judgement. Where the land on that screening - - reasonable people could disagree.
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Bite marks and abrasions on her back and shoulders…I love Beard the coach, but some sort of altercation went down that night and that isn’t really debatable. If his fiancé was willing to cooperate, he’d been charged. Chris Beard the coach is one of my favorites, this was depressing to read though on his off the court issues.
Spot on the rest of the stuff as far as screening and coaching again.
 

We are having this discussion because Ben’s results to date stink.
 


Appreciate the solid post Bob.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Because we judge everyone on everything. We don't have to clear our memories from what we know because the DA dropped charges.

We know cops got called to his house. We know that she said she was injured by Chris Beard and we also know that the police officer noted several injuries (bite marks, abrasions, scratches, scrapes, and blood on her). The fact that the victim recanted (which happens ALL THE TIME with domestic violence) does not change the affidavit. It does not erase what we know.

The DA, correctly, dropped charges because they couldn't prove the assault beyond a reasonable doubt. But we're not the court of law. We're not putting him in prison. We're the general public.
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All correct.

The posts prior that you were originally replying to, my sense of them was getting at the idea of judging him so as to be unworthy to even be considered for a job opening, at all.

That's quite a more impactful (outcome of a) judgement than just judging you don't like someone, which seems more to the point you're making.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Texas will not have to pay him a dime and he won't even attempt to get money back. Any prayer he has of coaching again involves this thing going away silently and hoping some naive people believe the DA dropping charges means nothing happened. If he wants to sue them for $ back, UT won't be held to a BARD standard
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I have no idea how his contract was legally worded, but I assume it didn't contain any language in the respect of firing for cause resulting in the loss of owed money (or however that is correctly worded) beyond what is standard in such contracts.

I would assume the suit would be civil, which we already know has a lower bar than BARD (criminal standard).

I don't know what UT would have to prove and to whom (I would guess not a jury in this case, and that just a judge would rule on it).

But I would assume that coaches have agents and lawyers and that such people wouldn't allow coaches to sign contracts such that the school can "get out it" on any little whim that they feel like. Indeed, they should have to prove significant "conduct unbecoming" (or whatever) actually did take place, and again shouldn't get to define such a term however they want.

Bob_Loblaw said:
and they'll drag him back through the mud.
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??? You mean more than has already happened?

I don't see how, unless there are a lot of skeletons in closets in Lubbock that got buried. Maybe there are.

Obviously we know the gf isn't going to testify against him to help UT out.

Bob_Loblaw said:
Again, I'm not saying where you should land on your judgement of him. You might think his story checks out and that there is nothing to be worried about. You might think he beat the sh!t out of his GF and she recanted for whatever reason. Either way, you're judging him from this incident.

When he gets another job, that university will put him through a thorough screening. That screening is judgement. Where the land on that screening - - reasonable people could disagree.
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All fine.

Again my main thing was to avoid what I believe is excessive, and quite absurd, level of judgement so as to preclude him even from consideration in the first place. That is just silly, given the facts and what has happened.


Sure, of course, he would need to be vetted, in order to be further considered for a U men's basketball opening. Just fine.


I also think you and others here are discounting the reputation, skill, and determination of the Austin prosecutor (or whatever the correct entity is, maybe the county).

Do you really think they give up so easily? "The girlfriend said she doesn't want to testify anymore. Well S__T, throw it all in the trash. All that other evidence. We give up!" I don't think so.
 

Gopherfan84 said:
If his fiancé was willing to cooperate, he’d been charged.
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1) They interviewed her, and found out pretty quickly that she's awful at lying.

2) Beard just turned 50 years old. 50. I get that there's a first time for everything, sure. But if you're a woman-beater .... you don't just up and start at 49. You've been doing it since probably your late teens or early 20's.


They put 1 and 2 together and pretty quickly saw that there was no case.

Prove me wrong.
 

Gophers_4life said:
1) They interviewed her, and found out pretty quickly that she's awful at lying.

2) Beard just turned 50 years old. 50. I get that there's a first time for everything, sure. But if you're a woman-beater .... you don't just up and start at 49. You've been doing it since probably your late teens or early 20's.


They put 1 and 2 together and pretty quickly saw that there was no case.

Prove me wrong.
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The hills some people will die on...🥱
 

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