Ten Gophers football players indefinately suspended

Can't see the logic for getting behind the players on this one. WTF are these guys out partying in the presence of alcohol after a game? WTF didnt they get the hell out of there when they saw what was going down with an inebriated cheerleader? How many F'ing times were these kids warned by coaches, administrators, etc to avoid exactly these types of situations? WTF didn't these guys pay attention to what happened with Dorsey last spring?

Playing football is a PRIVILEGE and the principals in this fiasco gave the university a black eye, not the EEOC or WTF its called.
Blaming this on "feminists" and "PC police" is total bull****. These guys deserved to be suspended. Hardin can join Dorsey wherever he ended up.

Memo to Claeys: next time recruit character.

Yeah, totally! I mean, what are these college kids thinking? Going out partying, drinking, and having sex? The U is totally out of control, I mean this can't happen on other campuses in America!
 

They are taking a very firm direction, it's just that many on this board don't like it. They aren't legally allowed to get into specifics, but the direction they are taking is that these players might have committed serious violations of the student code of conduct and won't be allowed to play until all of that is sorted out. Neither Coyle/Kaler can provide any finality on the process at this time because the process is still playing out and it would be inappropriate for them to make any declarations about what they think should happen. Knowing that they can't get into any specifics and that it would be wrong for them to influence the process in any way I don't know what more you want them to say.

I agree 100%
 

I wish our university would set the trend of finally standing up to groups like the EOAA. Unfortunately, I don't think it makes sense for them to draw a line in the sand for a case involving athletes because the public perception would be that they are just protecting the football team. I talked about these offices last night on this thread. This stuff is happening all across the country to athletes and non-athletes alike. They have attempted to re-define equality, harassment, and consent (and a slew of other words).

Their definition of equality is essentially equality of outcome (which is obviously absurd) rather than equality of opportunity.
Their definition of consent is essentially non-regret (but that really only applies to women during sex). For instance, if I went to casino and agreed to make a bet but later regretted it. . .I still consented.
Their definition of harassment can include telling third parties the truth (like literally, I have seen these offices describe harassment as a person telling a third party "I didn't assault her, she is lying").

Now, I am absolutely pro-equality, I think anyone who engages in non-consensual sex should be shot and if these guys actually harassed her, I hope they are kicked off the team. I just will use the actual definitions of these terms not the bastardization of the terms by groups like the EOAA.

But yeah, I understand your frustration, but keep in mind that this is an issue at every college campus in the country. It's bigger than just the U.

U r correct, it is bigger than just the U. I know Outside The Lines has done segments on this issue in the past. I hope they r camped out in Dinkytown and expose this whole situation.


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So the woman is a junior? She drinks 5 or 6 shots at her own apartment of her own volition with her friend before going out? She sees some guys out and decides to go to Djams apartment complex and to Djams apt (her friend decides not too)? She decides to go with Djam into his bedroom? She decides to engage in sex with Djam (video shows her consensual and playful). Other players start having sex with her? She decides not to try and get up and leave? She does not physically resist? There are no signs of forced sex or her trying to resist? Is this correct from what I have read?

Personally I find the players (after Djam) actions the epitome of shameful and retarded (and that is disparaging the word retarded in this case). I'm not trying to be self righteous here, I could care less what people do consensually in their sex lives, 10 on 1, who cares. I'm just basing my opinion off what I've read, as you'll see later.

Can we surmise the woman was telling them to stop and yelling to stop and they didn't?

As a father of a daughter I would like to think my daughter would behave much differently. Obviously the friend chose not to go to the apartment complex, the apartment, and the bedroom. Someone posted on here about being an adult and being able to make choices.

Ultimately if she was saying stop and no and these morons continued without respecting that, they should be expelled. The question is how do people know if that's the case? The fact she called her sister immediately after, went to a hospital, and filed a police report lends credence to her statement in the police report that she was telling them to stop (after Djam) and was in fear because they did not and there were so many of them and they were much larger and stronger than her.

Obviously it will all play out, and in the meantime there is not a damn thing any of us can do. Bottom line is these guys decided to jump in for 2nds and thirds, and fourths, etc and if the woman really wanted that she wouldn't have immediately gone to a hospital and filed a police report. It's the 2nd, 3rd, and 4ths imo that should be expelled. I don't see how the rest are involved, but maybe that comes out eventually. I say good riddance to the guys who didn't have the mental capacity to do the right thing from everything I've read. I could care less if they stay or go.


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I agree 100%

Actually, they've provided zero direction and zero leadership. This is a topic that has been deeply dissected for months. The EOAA ruling seems to have caught them completely off guard. And there is a severe lack of transparency regarding their position on the situation. What is shameful is not that some may disagree with their position, it's that's they don't seem to have one.
 


Not familiar with all the names but are all of these players black ?
Sounds like a purge to me . Message is consent or not you are not coming up here and doing this to our girls .


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http://www.startribune.com/sex-assa...ension-of-gophers-football-players/406564806/

After reading this update on the players I have come to this conclusion. It's the fault of the State Fair. This could have been all avoided had the U not agreed to having to play on Thursday of Labor Day weekend. This gave the players too much free time before their second game. I knew there were other reasons for not playing on Thursday night. I guess we learn the hard way.
 

Can't see the logic for getting behind the players on this one. WTF are these guys out partying in the presence of alcohol after a game? WTF didnt they get the hell out of there when they saw what was going down with an inebriated cheerleader? How many F'ing times were these kids warned by coaches, administrators, etc to avoid exactly these types of situations? WTF didn't these guys pay attention to what happened with Dorsey last spring?

Playing football is a PRIVILEGE and the principals in this fiasco gave the university a black eye, not the EEOC or WTF its called.
Blaming this on "feminists" and "PC police" is total bull****. These guys deserved to be suspended. Hardin can join Dorsey wherever he ended up.

Memo to Claeys: next time recruit character.

Did you attend college?
 

Can't see the logic for getting behind the players on this one. WTF are these guys out partying in the presence of alcohol after a game? WTF didnt they get the hell out of there when they saw what was going down with an inebriated cheerleader? How many F'ing times were these kids warned by coaches, administrators, etc to avoid exactly these types of situations? WTF didn't these guys pay attention to what happened with Dorsey last spring?

Playing football is a PRIVILEGE and the principals in this fiasco gave the university a black eye, not the EEOC or WTF its called.
Blaming this on "feminists" and "PC police" is total bull****. These guys deserved to be suspended. Hardin can join Dorsey wherever he ended up.

Memo to Claeys: next time recruit character.

I must say that I do agree with most of this post. I still believe, at least until we hear and know everything, that the players are getting a bum wrap. That is wrong regardless of the situation. Nevertheless, they put themselves in that situation. I firmly believe the old saying, "nothing good happens after midnight." If they r in their dorms sleeping, studying or watching tv, we r not having this conversation.


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Is there any room to operate between "I am really drunk and agreed to consensual sex" and "I am really drunk and now there is a group of friends participating and/or filming, I didn't agree to this"?
Can't both of those be the case?
Or is it still a marxist feminazi witch hunt?
 


I must say that I do agree with most of this post. I still believe, at least until we hear and know everything, that the players are getting a bum wrap. That is wrong regardless of the situation. Nevertheless, they put themselves in that situation. I firmly believe the old saying, "nothing good happens after midnight." If they r in their dorms sleeping, studying or watching tv, we r not having this conversation.


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I know I wasn't the best student in high school or college, but there was not more than 2-3 nights where I was studying on a weekend night around midnight. Out of those 2-3 nights, I can guarantee you none of them were at the beginning on the semester.
 



What proof does she have other than her word? As opposed to their words and 3 videos? Anyone could have lied, including the so called victim. If it really happened the way she felt it did, she wouldn't have reached a settlement without fighting. Let's face it, she did the restraining order in a way that she knew would hurt these players and the football team. And the moment their lawyer called bull****, she pretty much backed off. If someone wronged me, I would fight till my last breath. In comes the EOAA with perfect timing for maximum effect with nothing more than her words, and takes her word as truth. I'm sorry but she basically tried to say Djam's encounter wasn't consensual, and yet on the videos, she's playful. That already opens the door to her being dishonest.
 

The President, AD, and Claeys all have to respect the Title IX process publicly. Behind closed doors I am sure the coaches have a different opinion, but there are good reasons for having Title IX (protect women on college campuses would be the main reason I believe). Some schools forced this by not talking sexual assault investigations seriously enough and I believe that is where this came from. If the University does not comply, a large loss of funding and prestige is at stake. It could cripple the University which is bigger than the football program.

That being said, none of us were there that night. I don't think you have gone there PE, but many other posters have come out and said things that I find disturbing and unbecoming of our fan base. When football becomes more important than the health and safety of other students, then we are no better than Penn State or Baylor. Maybe sex with Djam was consensual, and then it became a revolving door of other participants and onlookers. No one deserves to have that and I don't care if she put herself into this situation by having a few drinks and entering their apartment.

Very well said. Agree with everything you said. I think you hit the nail on the head.


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At the end of the day, the sky isn't falling. It's %10... TEN percent of our team. And only about %5 of our critical players. We'll be fine.

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Uhm...no, no we won't. We are losing the future of the secondary. Completely wiping it out.
 

What proof does she have other than her word? As opposed to their words and 3 videos? Anyone could have lied, including the so called victim. If it really happened the way she felt it did, she wouldn't have reached a settlement without fighting. Let's face it, she did the restraining order in a way that she knew would hurt these players and the football team. And the moment their lawyer called bull****, she pretty much backed off. If someone wronged me, I would fight till my last breath. In comes the EOAA with perfect timing for maximum effect with nothing more than her words, and takes her word as truth. I'm sorry but she basically tried to say Djam's encounter wasn't consensual, and yet on the videos, she's playful. That already opens the door to her being dishonest.

Even if a drunk girl doesn't say no to the first five players through the door - she still has the right to say no to the last five. I certainly hope it is a violation of the student code of conduct to have group sex with a drunk coed in a U of M dormitory regardless of consent. The mere fact that the players took advantage of a girl who had too much to drink is enough for me to want the players who were involved kicked off the team. They have no legal right to play football and I don't want them representing the U in any way.
 

At the end of the day, the sky isn't falling. It's %10... TEN percent of our team. And only about %5 of our critical players. We'll be fine.

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If these 10 players are gone then it is pretty devastating. The team itself would take a step back next year and Stadium will be empty.
 

They are taking a very firm direction, it's just that many on this board don't like it. They aren't legally allowed to get into specifics, but the direction they are taking is that these players might have committed serious violations of the student code of conduct and won't be allowed to play until all of that is sorted out. Neither Coyle/Kaler can provide any finality on the process at this time because the process is still playing out and it would be inappropriate for them to make any declarations about what they think should happen. Knowing that they can't get into any specifics and that it would be wrong for them to influence the process in any way I don't know what more you want them to say.

This is not a new topic. It's been investigated, debated and dissected for months. For them not to have a position on this (whatever that might be) and express it in an elegant way is a complete lack of leadership. Frankly, I don't look at it as -- who's side are you on? That's irrelevant. However, I do expect our very highly paid public officials provide direction and a perspective on complex situations. From what I've seen in their public statements, they are basically in duck-and-cover mode. We deserve better than that.
 

Uhm...no, no we won't. We are losing the future of the secondary. Completely wiping it out.

Not to mention 2 most likely candidates for starting QB next year.


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I certainly hope it is a violation of the student code of conduct to have group sex with a drunk coed in a U of M dormitory.

A violation for the man or the woman?
 

I know I wasn't the best student in high school or college, but there was not more than 2-3 nights where I was studying on a weekend night around midnight. Out of those 2-3 nights, I can guarantee you none of them were at the beginning on the semester.

I know what u mean and I wasn't exactly and angel in high school or college either, but my point is, I tried to be. Everyday you, I, these players and the girl involved have decisions to make. There were plenty of times of I could have made the wrong decision but was smart enough not too. These players put themselves in a situation where it was off the chart on the potential danger scale. Any of them could have walked away and they chose not to. Now, that doesn't give them the right to be screwed by the EOAA, but I'm not gonna cry a river for them either.

Put this in football terms, Harbaugh and Michigan can complain all they want about what they think was a screw job by the refs with that crucial spot against Ohio State. But Michigan put themselves in a situation where they could be screwed by throwing a pick six and turning the ball over in the red zone.

So again, if these players r in their own dorms, or almost anywhere else for that matter, they r not accused like this. Make better choices.

Hopefully they and others learn a lesson from this, but I doubt it.

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This much we know:
Alleged victim made claims. At least one player produced evidence that refuted at least a portion of her claims. The county was unable to pursue any charges as a result.

Basically the alleged victim was proved to have misremembered what happened, exaggerated, or lied. It was at least one of the three.

That, coupled with the timing (clearly timed for maximum impact) and the increased scope (now 10, and all football players) is enough for me to know with certainty that there is a RAT here.

If there is a RAT, it MAY have been triggered by REGRET.
Going back to my college days, if regret could have been used as a punishment tool, I'd still be in prison.
 


Actually, they've provided zero direction and zero leadership. This is a topic that has been deeply dissected for months. The EOAA ruling seems to have caught them completely off guard. And there is a severe lack of transparency regarding their position on the situation. What is shameful is not that some may disagree with their position, it's that's they don't seem to have one.

I see your point with the coach and AD possibly trying to walk the fence on this. I think the only way they could have acted more swiftly would have been to kick the players involved off of the team immediately after this took place. They decided to let other parties decide the players fate and that is why they are now being called out.

I don't know if there is anything Claeys or Coyle can do now besides letting the results of this current appeal play out.
 

Sex is only acceptable between a married man and woman who are both over 25, in a bedroom behind a locked door when no one else is in the house, for purposes of procreation only.
There. Now we'll never have problems like this again.
 

According to the police person investigating that night, the phone tape had the girl cooperating, smiling, and even joking. I wonder what a jury would think of this evidence? Then Coach Sawvel, "one of the accused wasn't even in the building". Again no support from Kahler, MC, and even TC. Although TC probably had his hands tied. I am sure we will have plenty of scholarships available. Though why would a student-athlete would want to come to the U where the EOAA is more important, more powerful than any administrator. Sad
 

Sex is only acceptable between a married man and woman who are both over 25, in a bedroom behind a locked door when no one else is in the house, for purposes of procreation only.
There. Now we'll never have problems like this again.

With one foot on the floor at all times?
 

Sex is only acceptable between a married man and woman who are both over 25, in a bedroom behind a locked door when no one else is in the house, for purposes of procreation only.
There. Now we'll never have problems like this again.

That sounds funny- but you just solved about 20 trillion societal problems, were that advice heeded going forward... It's a very good life plan, although I'd say that age 21 is an acceptable target as the male brain is almost fully formed by then.
 

This is not a new topic. It's been investigated, debated and dissected for months. For them not to have a position on this (whatever that might be) and express it in an elegant way is a complete lack of leadership. Frankly, I don't look at it as -- who's side are you on? That's irrelevant. However, I do expect our very highly paid public officials provide direction and a perspective on complex situations. From what I've seen in their public statements, they are basically in duck-and-cover mode. We deserve better than that.
Good point. I also worry about the double indemnity consequences, especially for the players who were dragged back in to this issue.

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