Souhan tweets that Kill is a liar

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50PoundHead said:
I'm not defending Souhan here (although I really find it hilarious that he riles this place up to the extent that he does), but that's the state of the modern sports media. We have entire websites (including this one) dedicated to athletic enterprises and with the advent of twitter and the like, constant attention is paid to the minuscule machinations of sports teams and sports personalities. In that respect, Souhan is simply a cog in a machine that provides a perspective to fans who constantly what more, more, more. I readily participate as a fairly active poster here and at other sports-related sites, so I'm the "pot calling the kettle black" to a great extent, but Souhan is employed on a newspaper sports page and a sports-related radio station to generate business and if the reaction to his tweet is any reaction, he's succeeding at what he is being paid to do.

When things like this happen, just think of the entire world as the World Wrestling Federation and it all makes a lot more sense.
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The entire world isn't WWF. This isn't made up stuff. Real people. Souhan is getting much more attention because of his attack on JK than he could with his writing ability. I'm not sure I agree that he is generating business for his employer, and would probably guess in the long run the opposite is more true.
 

killme said:
The entire world isn't WWF. This isn't made up stuff. Real people. Souhan is getting much more attention because of his attack on JK than he could with his writing ability. I'm not sure I agree that he is generating business for his employer, and would probably guess in the long run the opposite is more true.
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Perhaps I should have said the entire world of public perception and I didn't say the world was the WWE, I just said think of it in that way. I'll agree that sounds cynical--and perhaps is truly thus--but Souhan is paid to do what he does. I'm not saying I agree with him, but he has a right to say it. Libel? I'll let the courts determine that. But in a modest defense of the current state of sports journalsim, if Kill did a Bo Pelini impression and told the press and the fans that none of this is anyone's business and they could do what he supposedly told Souhan to do, how would they react and would they be justified in their reaction?

The day the StarTrib and KSTP feel Souhan is a liability, they'll bounce his butt.

I like Kill and think he's a good coach and don't believe his epilepsy, at least at this point, is putting the program in any type of precarious situation. But let's say his health doesn't get better, we lose a bunch of recruits, and he still contends that everything is A-OK. The street has to run both ways.
 

killme said:
The entire world isn't WWF. This isn't made up stuff. Real people. Souhan is getting much more attention because of his attack on JK than he could with his writing ability. I'm not sure I agree that he is generating business for his employer, and would probably guess in the long run the opposite is more true.
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View attachment 2418
 

No, it's not what the modern sports media is. Don't confuse posts on a message board with a sports opinion columns. What other paper would be publishing Souhan's crap? Would you see it on ESPN or BTN? He'd be gone in any other market but this one. If the reaction to his tweet is any indication, he's NOT doing his job - this doesn't help sell newspapers. The best thing the Star Tribune could do would be to fire him immediately. His replacement would certainly do more to offer something readers want than Souhan offers.
 


RodentRampage said:
No, it's not what the modern sports media is. Don't confuse posts on a message board with a sports opinion columns. What other paper would be publishing Souhan's crap? Would you see it on ESPN or BTN? He'd be gone in any other market but this one. If the reaction to his tweet is any indication, he's NOT doing his job - this doesn't help sell newspapers. The best thing the Star Tribune could do would be to fire him immediately. His replacement would certainly do more to offer something readers want than Souhan offers.
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Have you ever read the NY papers or listened to sports talk radio out there? The Twin Cities market is unbelievably tame. We're duckies and bunnies compared to the T-Rex's that roam most markets. In a different market, the media would have incited the public to burn down Target Center instead of experiencing yet another year of Kevin McHale's inept handling of the Timberwolves, but he stayed on interminably and ran the franchise into the ground. Not exactly a pertinent case to this discussion, but example of the softball nature of the sports media in this market.

I don't want to start a fight, but how do you know this does or doesn't sell newspapers? Again, the StarTrib is a major market newspaper that likely runs all kinds of focus groups and conducts market research. Same with KSTP. If Souhan were truly a liability, he'd be gone in no time. Maybe this does him in. But if the StarTrib or KSTP fires Souhan, is it going to change your reading/listening habits?

I'm not confusing message boards with the mainstream media, but a ton of talk on all sports-related boards is reaction to what is reported in the mainstream media.
 

50PoundHead said:
Have you ever read the NY papers or listened to sports talk radio out there? The Twin Cities market is unbelievably tame. We're duckies and bunnies compared to the T-Rex's that roam most markets. In a different market, the media would have incited the public to burn down Target Center instead of experiencing yet another year of Kevin McHale's inept handling of the Timberwolves, but he stayed on interminably and ran the franchise into the ground. Not exactly a pertinent case to this discussion, but example of the softball nature of the sports media in this market.
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Souhan's epilepsy rants alone were enough to get him fired in many markets, but your analogy with the Timberwolves is a peculiar. The Timberwolves have been terrible for years, it's understandable that people would write negative things about them. But the Gophers aren't terrible, they are of to their best start in 8 years, yet Souhan continues to go all-in. In what market does that happen?

I don't want to start a fight, but how do you know this does or doesn't sell newspapers? Again, the StarTrib is a major market newspaper that likely runs all kinds of focus groups and conducts market research. Same with KSTP. If Souhan were truly a liability, he'd be gone in no time. Maybe this does him in. But if the StarTrib or KSTP fires Souhan, is it going to change your reading/listening habits?
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How do you know this sells newspapers? You assume that because they haven't fired him that he must not be a liability, but businesses do make mistakes. Just what is Souhan's market? Panth*Hawk can't buy that many papers.
 

50PoundHead said:
market.

I don't want to start a fight, but how do you know this does or doesn't sell newspapers? Again, the StarTrib is a major market newspaper that likely runs all kinds of focus groups and conducts market research. Same with KSTP. If Souhan were truly a liability, he'd be gone in no time. Maybe this does him in. But if the StarTrib or KSTP fires Souhan, is it going to change your reading/listening habits?
.
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I would love to sit in on a focus group where Souhan's ****ty work is received positively if only to meet the type of people that approve that type of garbage.
 

50PoundHead said:
the media would have incited the public to burn down Target Center instead of experiencing yet another year of Kevin McHale's inept handling of the Timberwolves, but he stayed on interminably and ran the franchise into the ground. Not exactly a pertinent case to this discussion, but example of the softball nature of the sports media in this market.
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The Detroit media wasnt in Matt Millen's corner...he lasted eight years? Isiah Thomas lasted as gm and/or coach of the Knicks for six years. The Chicago media didn't cause Bears fans to riot as they went from qb to qb to qb to qb to qb for the better part of 20 years.
 



No conspiracy.
My bet is that Souhan is actually an ahole and a terrible human being so miserable he cannot help himself shooting holes in a wonderful story like Kill and the gophers have been.
But.
He must be so secure in his position through knowledge of his editors and producers that he doesn't feel the least bit concerned of being removed, or is so miserable he doesn't care if they do.
The guy just exudes "I'm a middle aged ahole cynic who hates pretty much everything good in the world"
but he is fit.

Can we please bump that match.com profile again? That was hilarious.
 

That fans weren't lined up to burn down Target Center was mainly due to the manner in which many Minnesotans, even after 25 years, haven't totally warmed up to them. As for the Timberwolves diehards, as one of them, I can promise you that this fan segment was in open revolt by the end of the McHale era and for some time afterwards. The mood at the 2006 (Roy for Foye) and 2008 (picking Love over Mayo, a smart move assumed to be incorrect due to all the past errors) draft parties was downright ugly and in 2010 (Wes Johnson) it also got uncomfortable for team brass due to angry fans.

Although they were pretty chummy circa 2003 when times were good, it must also be said that Dan Barreiro, who talks more hoops than any local radio host, blasted McHale so badly and regularly that by the end they weren't on speaking terms and it became hard for his show to get players and coaches on. Barreiro was only the most vocal critic. Writers and the sports anchors gave them heat too. Say what you will about local media handling of Gopher football, but the late era McHale teams didn't get any kind of softball treatment.
 

I'm just saying if you listen to the ranting in other markets, it's much harsher than it is here.

If Souhan were affecting the bottom line at either of his employers, he'd be gone. If he were viewed as a mistake, he'd be out of a job.

I'm not defending what Souhan wrote and I like Kill, but I just laugh when this place goes hog wild over anything Souhan does.
 

Another potential veiled Souhan/Zulgad reference:

On his radio show on KFAN, coach Kill was asked about publicity and stories about him/them and he went on to discuss how they've done things in the past, and always reached out in the community. Then said:

"This one's been a bit different."

Clearly my opinion, but I believe it was in reference to our illustrious local media.
 



I think SueHand is manic-depressive, with no meds. He went from attack dog, to casper-milk-toast, now back to attack dog. He is diseased. He hates Kill for not resigning, then loves Kill for sticking it out, then hates Kill because ... who knows? That's my story and I'm sticking with it. Got at least one part right: SueHand is diseased.
 

Casa de Autos said:
Who plays Souhan in the Hollywood adaptation?
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I love your screen name.

And to answer your question, I would say John Malkovich. I know he's up there in age, though. But he would still do soooo good as the snarky bad guy. Spacey would be my next choice.
 

Souhan made a mistake and Kill is making a mistake in making any public acknowledgement of Souhan's mistake.
 

Kuato Lives! said:
I would love to sit in on a focus group where Souhan's ****ty work is received positively if only to meet the type of people that approve that type of garbage.
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YES! This is a great thought, and now that it's been brought up, I would love to sit beside you.
 


50PoundHead said:
Have you ever read the NY papers or listened to sports talk radio out there? The Twin Cities market is unbelievably tame. We're duckies and bunnies compared to the T-Rex's that roam most markets. Not exactly a pertinent case to this discussion, but example of the softball nature of the sports media in this market.

...the StarTrib likely runs all kinds of focus groups and conducts market research. Same with KSTP.
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I ask you to read the stuff I've bolded for you. NYC is a unique place. So are the Twin Cities. I would argue there are more cities like this than like NYC. The Twin Cities is not a community where Souhan's style seems to fit, at least from my very limited perception.

50PoundHead said:
if Kill did a Bo Pelini impression and told the press and the fans that none of this is anyone's business and they could do what he supposedly told Souhan to do, how would they react and would they be justified in their reaction?

To my knowledge Kill did not tell this fan base what he said to the despicable Souhan. This is rather ridiculous. A person is entitled to a certain amount of personal privacy and he has been more forthcoming on his epilepsy and cancer to the public than he really should be required to. He did it to advance awareness. Jerry Kill is a human. I'm positive. I'm not sure, however, whether you consider yourself to be one.

I like Kill and think he's a good coach and don't believe his epilepsy, at least at this point, is putting the program in any type of precarious situation. But let's say his health doesn't get better, we lose a bunch of recruits, and he still contends that everything is A-OK. The street has to run both ways.
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When the program starts looking precarious, let me know. Much of what you're arguing on this issue sounds like it would be better received in the Souhan camp.

g1976b said:
Another potential veiled Souhan/Zulgad reference:

On his radio show on KFAN, coach Kill was asked about publicity and stories about him/them and he went on to discuss how they've done things in the past, and always reached out in the community. Then said:

"This one's been a bit different."

Clearly my opinion, but I believe it was in reference to our illustrious local media.
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I heard it and thought the same thing. He certainly didn't elaborate, and I'm probably a bit overly sensitive to the way a certain segment of this community has reacted to him, but from an outsider's perspective the reputation of the Twin Cities is the opposite of what Souhan's crusade against Kill reflects. I guess that's what surprises me, and probably Jerry, that this community has allowed Souhan to continue to exist here.
 

I'm fine with Kill and everything he's done. I just get a chortle how Souhan can rile everyone up. As I said earlier, if he was viewed as a problem by either of his employers, he'd be looking for work. I'm not defending the guy. I'm just stating what looks like a reality.

And if you go to Chicago, Los Angeles, New York, Boston, or Philadelphia, I can assure you that the sports journalism is much more rabid in those towns than Barreiro on his wildest rant.
 

Souhan is a miserable human being plain and simple. He never writes anything that puts a smile on someone's face. He's always negative. I find him grating when he's on the radio. I do not doubt for a second that he is unable to get along with anyone. It sounds like he's been divorced, so his wife likely couldn't even stand him.

He's taking things way too far with Kill, for no good reason. He's not talented enough to get a radio gig, and he's not telegenic enough to get a tv gig. He certainly doesn't have the profile to get a tv gig. The Star Tribune should reprimand this guy.
 

Formo said:
I love your screen name.

And to answer your question, I would say John Malkovich. I know he's up there in age, though. But he would still do soooo good as the snarky bad guy. Spacey would be my next choice.
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Malkovich would have to play it like his crazy guy from the Red films.
 

50PoundHead said:
I'm just saying if you listen to the ranting in other markets, it's much harsher than it is here.

If Souhan were affecting the bottom line at either of his employers, he'd be gone. If he were viewed as a mistake, he'd be out of a job.

I'm not defending what Souhan wrote and I like Kill, but I just laugh when this place goes hog wild over anything Souhan does.
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They are harsher in other markets, but whatever this is goes well outside the scope of normal media/sports team relations. To me, this feels personal. Going back to the original firestorm, there is nothing wrong with the intent of the column. It was a fair question to ask. However, the manner in which Souhan did it was puzzling, offensive and just plain wrong. That didn't feel like a columnist trying to generate debate. Mocking someone with epilepsy? How that was allowed in this politically correct day and age still baffles me. One can argue that he wasn't mocking, but trying to equate the number of seizures someone suffered with Big Ten wins is making a mockery of the man's condition. Everything that is fair game is fine. Souhan went way over the line, never apologized sincerely and now it's clearly evident that he didn't like someone standing up to him, so he continues to push his agenda.
 


50PoundHead said:
I just get a chortle how Souhan can rile everyone up. As I said earlier, if he was viewed as a problem by either of his employers, he'd be looking for work. I'm not defending the guy. I'm just stating what looks like a reality.

And if you go to Chicago, Los Angeles, New York, Boston, or Philadelphia, I can assure you that the sports journalism is much more rabid in those towns than Barreiro on his wildest rant.
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Maybe some people choose not to live in those cities because of the environment you claim exists. Just because a culture exists does not make it a model to be imitated. Maybe it's a good thing to resist the demise of morals, ethics, and values. And, maybe rallying behind a cause is a good thing. IMHO this community would be better off without Souhan.

JerryKillFan said:
I'm JerryKillFan. :cool:
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You seem to be multiplying.
 

killme said:
Maybe some people choose not to live in those cities because of the environment you claim exists.
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That's some f'ed up priorities if someone chooses not to live somewhere due to the sports journalism environment.
 

killme said:
Maybe some people choose not to live in those cities because of the environment you claim exists. Just because a culture exists does not make it a model to be imitated. Maybe it's a good thing to resist the demise of morals, ethics, and values. And, maybe rallying behind a cause is a good thing. IMHO this community would be better off without Souhan.


You seem to be multiplying.
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I doubt many people choose where to live based on the sports climate. People live where they work and in an increasingly mobile society, they often end up living where they weren't raised or where their original sports loyalties were formed. With the plethora of national media and the reach of the internet, that's not as big a deal. I'm just saying that the sports media in this town is relatively tame when compared to other markets. New York/New Jersey used to have a guy who billed himself as "the coach killer." More schtick than anything else, but every coach in the burg got clobbered all the time.

Ironic thing here is that I've always found Souhan to be incredibly softball on both the Twins and the Vikings, especially the Twins. Breakin' the Plane, I agree there appears to be more than meets the eye here and I don't know how that happened. A journalist shouldn't allow that to happen. If that's the case, Souhan needs to get some perspective and change his tone.

Hey, I know this is an internet board and people spout for the sake of spouting. But if anyone here thinks that the folks at the StarTrib or KSTP are going to make a decision regarding Souhan based on what is posted here, they are likely kidding themselves.
 


If there was any doubt that the Strib will continue to fully support Souhan and his crap.
The editor has a live chat now and basically gave Souhan a pass saying he needs to write "strong opinions"
What a load of trash.
 

Ole said:
If there was any doubt that the Strib will continue to fully support Souhan and his crap.
The editor has a live chat now and basically gave Souhan a pass saying he needs to write "strong opinions"
What a load of trash.
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What's the Strib? Is that a dinosaur?
 

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