Shortell's future

Donate To GopherHole
GophersInIowa said:
It's no secret Shortell is a weak runner and more of a "pure" passer. Since he is a very little threat in the running game, he has to be accurate for us to be successful. I'm not saying he is the only reason, but he certainly wasn't very accurate at times today. He did have some very nice throws to the sidelines though.

I think he's got a shot to be a very good QB. I just think Gray has to be the guy when he's healthy again. As others have said, our OL is extremely young and inexperienced. A running QB neutralizes that a little bit in my opinion.
Click to expand...
I don't know. He seemed to set the world on fire when they ran him repeatedly at the end of the game. If someone could explain to me exactly what that was, I'd love to hear it. I know there's a bye week coming, but for all intents and purposes that guy's the only legit/healthy QB on the roster right now and you're running him at the end of a blowout. If they were trying to get some tape out to NW that he's a legit runner, I don't think the Wildcats are going to buy it.
 

My opinion of Max didn't change after today. He is a talented kid. I don't think he's talented enough as a true SO to play poorly and still be effective. He'll have a good career at MN and it will be really tough for Nelson to overtake Shortell next season.

As far as running the read option, I think Shortell can run it decent. It won't be as effective as Gray, but it will certainly be good enough to keep teams honest. You don't need to be that fleet of foot for the system to still be effective. Prior to Persa, NWestern had a couple slow QBs who were still effective ( Bassinez? and some other guy who shall remain nameless). He'll be fine. We have a young OL and we were missing 3 of our top 7 players (did Tommy play at all? Bjorklund and Mottla). When the run game cames, things will open up for Shortell.
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
I don't know. He seemed to set the world on fire when they ran him repeatedly at the end of the game. If someone could explain to me exactly what that was, I'd love to hear it. I know there's a bye week coming, but for all intents and purposes that guy's the only legit/healthy QB on the roster right now and you're running him at the end of a blowout. If they were trying to get some tape out to NW that he's a legit runner, I don't think the Wildcats are going to buy it.
Click to expand...

I was actually fine with the playcalling all day but that was a big head scratcher.
 

Kafka? Today Bob, you bring up the name KAFKA? Don't you think we suffered enough today already. :(
 




Count me among those who think Gray should start vs. NW provided he can run all the plays full speed.

There is a part of me however who wonders if the best approach would be to tell Max someone else is going to start all week and then tell him he's the guy 5 minutes before kickoff.
 

I've been watching a lot of Big 10 football today, and Neb. Wisc, Ohio St, Mich St NW,Purdue, all have QB's that can throw. Shortell had a hard time today, but Gray's throwing still concens me, because teams can all stop the run, especially teams like ours that has such a young line. Gray better be a better passer than we have seen so far or we are in big trouble.
 

station19 said:
That's a fact many people here are incapable of grasping.

Way too high and way too low.

Praise or shoot the QB....of course that would be the officials if it were a closer game.
Click to expand...

What about, I don't know, last week? Or the week before? Or the games he played in last year? Its not just one game
 



One offensive line put on a clinic today. The other one started a bunch of underclass men

This loss was a total team effort if there ever was one. It's tough to win on the road. I don't think people really realize that.
 

Max is the same QB he's been in the last two games. He's average.

Today's loss is the result of an average QB behind and average O-line with average running backs and average receivers. I hate to say but it's the truth. It's come a long way, but we have a ways to go if we want to be a top team in our conference. And right now, we don't have that talent....
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
I don't know. He seemed to set the world on fire when they ran him repeatedly at the end of the game. If someone could explain to me exactly what that was, I'd love to hear it. I know there's a bye week coming, but for all intents and purposes that guy's the only legit/healthy QB on the roster right now and you're running him at the end of a blowout. If they were trying to get some tape out to NW that he's a legit runner, I don't think the Wildcats are going to buy it.
Click to expand...

I agree. Not sure why that was the plan at the end?
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
One offensive line put on a clinic today. The other one started a bunch of underclass men

This loss was a total team effort if there ever was one. It's tough to win on the road. I don't think people really realize that.
Click to expand...

Totally agree winning on the road is tough. That being said Central Michigan and Iowa State seemed to manage it ok against this same Iowa squad. I am not shocked we lost, I am shocked we didn't at least put up a fight. Coaching, play calling, injuries, execution, whatever, that was a very disappointing performance against a team we should at least be in the ballpark with talent wise.
 



MNVCGUY said:
Totally agree winning on the road is tough. That being said Central Michigan and Iowa State seemed to manage it ok against this same Iowa squad. I am not shocked we lost, I am shocked we didn't at least put up a fight. Coaching, play calling, injuries, execution, whatever, that was a very disappointing performance against a team we should at least be in the ballpark with talent wise.
Click to expand...

I don't know about you, but I sure thought we fought pretty hard in the 2nd half. Iowa's only score was on a forced interception on a 4th down when Shortell had to try and make something happen. Unfortunately the deficit from the 2nd quarter was too hard to overcome. Teams of the past few years would have probably quit and it would have ended up like Purdue or Michigan last year.
 

Lose one Big Ten game on the road and the world comes crashing down on Gopherhole.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Totally agree winning on the road is tough. That being said Central Michigan and Iowa State seemed to manage it ok against this same Iowa squad. I am not shocked we lost, I am shocked we didn't at least put up a fight. Coaching, play calling, injuries, execution, whatever, that was a very disappointing performance against a team we should at least be in the ballpark with talent wise.
Click to expand...

I thought they quit in the second quarter, but I agree with Gopher in Iowa, I thought they fought in the second half.
 

Shortell is not the problem. He's a 2nd year player who has now played in 6 games. Hard to expect someone so inexperienced to set the world on fire when you don't have better talent all around.

My opinion is that our major weakness is the offensive line. They are young and undersized and have a lot of difficulty opening up holes for the running game and keeping the QB clean on passing plays. When the QB is worried about where the pass rush is coming from, they get gun shy, wait too long to make decisions and throw late. I think this might have been the case on a few of the under throws yesterday. The reason Gray can be effective running, is he can take the snap and run to an opening. Running QBs can mask poor o-line play.

Another telling stat is that other than Gray's 75yd TD, I believe Shortell has several of the longest runs from scrimmage. Why have none of the RBs broken anything yet? how about a few 10yd runs? Designed runs don't seem to work. Until we get better on the line, our offense is going to struggle.

I would like to see the play calling mix it up and help the line more. It seems all our pass plays are set to go 10-15 yds down the field (or longer), which requires the line to hold blocks. Why not run a few more quick-hit slant plays to take pressure off the line? Will be helpful to who-ever is the QB.
 

Parski1 said:
Lose one Big Ten game on the road and the world comes crashing down on Gopherhole.
Click to expand...

Football is very much a mental game. The reality is that there is going to be a lot of ups and downs during a game and the season. The good coaches realize this and therefore are always teaching their players how to control their emotions. This is a young team who just experienced a very hostile environment and ran into difficulties. Coach Kill used this as a teaching moment and was able to get them pointed back in the right direction in the second half. Unfortunately some of the experts on the GopherHole haven't learned yet how to control their emotions but I am seeing improvement.:)
 


littlebigboy said:
I've been watching a lot of Big 10 football today, and Neb. Wisc, Ohio St, Mich St NW,Purdue, all have QB's that can throw. Shortell had a hard time today, but Gray's throwing still concens me, because teams can all stop the run, especially teams like ours that has such a young line. Gray better be a better passer than we have seen so far or we are in big trouble.
Click to expand...

How about the Michigan Wolverines? Are they in big trouble? Their poor throwing QB beat the Gophers 58-0 last year.
 

The 12th Man said:
Ok, I'll bite.

In the past, you have said that you were upset with Kill for saying that the team lacked the talent necessary to win consistently in the Big Ten. Now, you say good coaches never say they lack the talent to win and that they adjust to the people they have. At the same time, you say Kill is a great coach.

My man: Which is it?
Click to expand...

Which is it? My man, I never said half of what you are crediting me with, so there is no "which is it?"

I never said "good coaches never say they lack the talent to win." I said something like good coaches can successfully coach to a system and great coaches can fit a system to the players.

However; because you correctly remember some of the criticisms of Kill I have made in the past I will have to admit I can see how you reasonable assumed (not my intent) that I was criticizing Kill.

If you were to ask how can I criticize Kill and complement him? Easy, none of us (including me) are perfect.
 

GophersInIowa said:
I don't know about you, but I sure thought we fought pretty hard in the 2nd half. Iowa's only score was on a forced interception on a 4th down when Shortell had to try and make something happen. Unfortunately the deficit from the 2nd quarter was too hard to overcome. Teams of the past few years would have probably quit and it would have ended up like Purdue or Michigan last year.
Click to expand...
I think you're right about that - the team came back in the second half, which was encouraging compared to past years.
 

FreakyDeke said:
What is your beef with Kill if not coaching? He seems like a solid dude. You had no problem sending your son to play for Brew so I'm curious why you would have a problem with Kill, who appears to be a much more likable personality.
Click to expand...


My Beef with Kill? Dude's whole act is just that...a self serving act. Case in point. Kill and his entire coaching staff with the exception of 1 (somebody had to unlock the doors) didn't bother to do what ever other head coach in college football does for their senior class...show up at pro day. The man had nothing to do with the seniors (GT included) after they played their last game. Yet hours after GT tragically died he managed to turn that into a let's win for GT.....self serving....IMO.

In regards to my son...let's just leave it at he was totally and completely f...ked over. I'm not trying to be coy and I certainly don't give a damn who I may offend at the U, but I do care about the folks who love gopher football (is this the appropriate venue?)

Brew? Criticize his coaching all you want, the man legitimately cared about his players and was authentic. To this day he still calls and checks up on Kim and to ask what can he do.
 

Great Plains Gopher said:
I think you're right about that - the team came back in the second half, which was encouraging compared to past years.
Click to expand...

I agree; Kill is creating a never say die attitude with this team. Folks forget this is a young team and Kinnick Stadium is tough place to play. There is no shame to losing that game.

The defensive line has saw much improvement. The secondary has improved because of the return of Troy, Carter finally getting on the field and the upgrading of the 2nd safety position with Vereen and 27. D.Wells is a young exciting play maker.

We have some young exciting receivers, the o-line is young and you would think they will improve. I never thought this team would be were they are now.
 

Max and the coaches have to figure out what he's good at and not good at. Then they can find a groove, at least in terms of routes and playcalling.

He throws the ball aggressively and I like that.

A running game would help.
 

I think this has been alluded to earlier, but my gut reaction is that Shortell is (in baseball terms), a relief pitcher, not a starter. Shortell's best performances seem to happen when he comes in off the bench on short notice, and just starts chuckin' - USC last year, and Western Michigan this year. When he know he's going to start and has all week to prepare, he doesn't seem to throw as free and easy as he does when he comes off the bench.

Maybe, for the rest of this year, the best option is to start Gray, and use Shortell as a change-of-pace QB - bring him in for a series or two, and put him in a situation where he doesn't have to think so much - just go in and throw.

I will add that, IMHO, the biggest play of the Iowa game was the under-thrown ball to Barker that turned into an INT when the DB (admittedly) made a good, aggressive play to pull the ball away. If Shortell leads Barker, he has a good chance to go in for a TD and turn the momentum around. The INT seemed to energize Iowa after the Gopher Defense had held them to a FG on the earlier possession.
 

This is a bit of a tortured comparison but apt in the sense offered. Shortell reminds me of Brett Favre's approach in that he trusts his arm too much and tries to wedge throws in that have a very low chance of being completed. Further, the late throws often give the defense the opportunity to break up the play, intercept the pass, or simply crush the receiver. For as great as Favre was (and he was great), he hung a lot of receivers out to dry during his career and Max is doing the same thing.

He can get better. He does have a great arm.
 

Studwell55 said:
Max and the coaches have to figure out what he's good at and not good at. Then they can find a groove, at least in terms of routes and playcalling.

He throws the ball aggressively and I like that.

A running game would help.
Click to expand...

The problem is the top two QB's have radically different skill sets. One can run and can't pass (slight exageration), the other can pass but can't run (no exageration). The offense has been built for Gray; they are trying to patch an offense together for Shortel.

I don't believe anyone should be alarmed that our offense and defense is still a work in progress. This should be expected going into a coaches 2nd full year of recruiting. I would rather see a patchwork offense than burn Nelson's redshirt.

Also, as someone else correctly pointed out; Max only has a handfull of starts and playing time; the jury/verdict is far from in on him.
 

Shortell may still turn out to be a good QB. It was one game, he is just a Soph so lets not relgate him to bench warming just yet.
 

The backup quarterback is always the fans' favorite player on the team. As of this week, that backup (kinda) QB is Marquis. Its convenient to think we would have won the game with Q, but we'll never know.

I do have faith in this coaching staff. After spending last year, this spring and this summer with all the QBs, they decided that Q gives them the best chances at success and I have no reason to second guess that.

I like Max Shortell as a player (and I'm presuming he's a good all around human being), but based on his three starts to date I hope that Marquis can return soon and that Parish is groomed to be the eventual starter.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom