Agreed... Also, you cant think it was going to be cleared up today if you werent planning on pleading guilty to something. They just werent going to drop the case all together, that is not the way our justice system works.
Royce White Leaving the U per Myron
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Agreed... Also, you cant think it was going to be cleared up today if you werent planning on pleading guilty to something. They just werent going to drop the case all together, that is not the way our justice system works.
That's exactly what I'm saying. Royce complains all year long that he wasn't getting to play/practice. The University said things had to be cleared up in the legal sense. Tubby finally let him back on the team to practice (and likely play at some point) and Royce's response to that is to skip practice not even a week into being welcomed back and then to have his people communicate to Tubby that he wasn't going to practcie until it is all cleared up, knowing that was the U's position all along?? Does that make any sense??
the 3.4 has ripped apart the sterotype the senior GHer ( and Bruce ) were trying to wrap Royce into..
ya'll must be dancin' in the aisles knowing he is leaving.. <<< more evidence i am from Kentucky.
but the truth about him must hurt.. he can ball AND has a brain... rocked.
ya'll must be dancin' in the aisles knowing he is leaving.. <<< more evidence i am from Kentucky.
but the truth about him must hurt.. he can ball AND has a brain... rocked.
He is smart. There's no doubt about that. The problem is that he has the maturity level of a grade school student. Until his mind grows up, trouble will continue to follow him. As I said at the very start of this, I hope he gets the help he needs from a mental health standpoint.
SelectionSunday
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Rhodes Scholar?
Pretty soon Royce is going to be a Rhodes Scholar.
First it was: he's eligible.
Then it became: he had one of the better GPAs on the team.
Third (now) it's become: has a 3.4 GPA.
Next thing I expect to hear from Royce's jock-sniffers is that he's a 4.0 student headed for a Rhodes Scholar, ala Florida State's Myron Rolle.
Pretty soon Royce is going to be a Rhodes Scholar.
First it was: he's eligible.
Then it became: he had one of the better GPAs on the team.
Third (now) it's become: has a 3.4 GPA.
Next thing I expect to hear from Royce's jock-sniffers is that he's a 4.0 student headed for a Rhodes Scholar, ala Florida State's Myron Rolle.
JohnnyGopher said he was originally kicked out of the dorm for playing his music too loud. This thread is amazing at bringing out people's true colors.
I really think this wouldn't be such a huge issue if Tubby and Royce were on the same page with their communication. I'm getting a little sick of everything being held in-house. The public is forming very damaging opinions about Tubby, Royce, UMPD and the U itself. it seems like it could be partially avoided if we knew what was really going on. Losing by 20 to OSU isn't helping either.
I would guess our Cory Joseph chances are dwindling with this news as well. If Royce and Cory are out, it looks like its back to square one. Who is going to score for us next year?
quite a waste of post #5944 if i do say so myself. your last great post was #3211.
SelectionSunday
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Thank you. That means a lot to me coming from you.
Yet he consistently behaves stupidly.
I hope to God you are not comparing Boone to White.
The blame goes around
First of all, I think we need to realize what we are upset about. Are we upset that a young man is "throwing his life away" and "can't stay out of trouble", or are we upset that our basketball team is missing a piece that could help us get a few more wins? For most of us, I think it is the latter. Therefore, I think a lot of the anti-Royce remarks made by posters are spoken out of some sort of selfishness in wanting to see our team do well. I do admit, at some times, that I fall in this group as well.
However, I feel the blame for this entire situation is plentiful for all involved parties. And, unfortunately (at least to me), it sullies the reputation of each of these parties.
Royce White
I think we all have a very good idea of the mistakes that Royce has made.
Joel Maturi/Tubby Smith
99% of us have no idea what is said behind closed doors, but the wait-and-see message given to the public by our AD and HC has caused as much of the anger out there, regarding the suspensions, as anything else. Was he at practice? Is he practicing now? Why wasn't he attending the game? Will he play against OSU? There was a ton of ambiguity and no real answers from the people in charge.
In today's Star Trib article, Tubby "said Monday that he never expected White to play this season, even after allowing him to resume practicing." Perhaps this message should have been conveyed to the public rather than the rigmarole being spewed by those at the top. And, more importantly, to Royce, as he seemed unaware that this was the case.
UMPD
I have a ton of respect for those that risk their lives every day for our protection. BUT, the UMPD definitely dropped the ball on this one. First of all, they acknowledge that Royce White was a suspect. Why? What happened to due process? Immediately, everyone assumed Royce was guilty.
Secondly, they took several months to investigate a relatively minor case. Unable to make a strong enough case for a felony charge (I could be wrong, but I believe that a theft of $500 or more calls for a felony), they charged Royce, and only Royce, with 3 counts of trespassing?
Due to the length of time it took for this investigation, I am going to imagine that there were a few hundred man-hours spent on the case--all for a stolen laptop. What a waste.
Media
In the age we live in, I guess it can be expected. However, the local media reporting on every one of Royce's tweets, Facebook statuses, and YouTube videos was borderline at best. Imagine if everything you thought and said at 18 was reported on in the news. I would imagine that 1. most people's egos would be inflated and 2. you might say or do something that you might regret later.
I also have a very tough time stomaching the fact that Royce's potential involvement in the laptop case was reported. If he's charged, go ahead and write a story. Don't find him guilty in the press.
Paul Shirley's writings about the Haiti tragedy opened my eyes once again to the lack of empathy that some people have towards other's situations. Please do your best not to judge Royce, no matter the outcome. Watching the team interact in warm-ups before the MSU game, it is clear his teammates have not.
First of all, I think we need to realize what we are upset about. Are we upset that a young man is "throwing his life away" and "can't stay out of trouble", or are we upset that our basketball team is missing a piece that could help us get a few more wins? For most of us, I think it is the latter. Therefore, I think a lot of the anti-Royce remarks made by posters are spoken out of some sort of selfishness in wanting to see our team do well. I do admit, at some times, that I fall in this group as well.
However, I feel the blame for this entire situation is plentiful for all involved parties. And, unfortunately (at least to me), it sullies the reputation of each of these parties.
Royce White
I think we all have a very good idea of the mistakes that Royce has made.
Joel Maturi/Tubby Smith
99% of us have no idea what is said behind closed doors, but the wait-and-see message given to the public by our AD and HC has caused as much of the anger out there, regarding the suspensions, as anything else. Was he at practice? Is he practicing now? Why wasn't he attending the game? Will he play against OSU? There was a ton of ambiguity and no real answers from the people in charge.
In today's Star Trib article, Tubby "said Monday that he never expected White to play this season, even after allowing him to resume practicing." Perhaps this message should have been conveyed to the public rather than the rigmarole being spewed by those at the top. And, more importantly, to Royce, as he seemed unaware that this was the case.
UMPD
I have a ton of respect for those that risk their lives every day for our protection. BUT, the UMPD definitely dropped the ball on this one. First of all, they acknowledge that Royce White was a suspect. Why? What happened to due process? Immediately, everyone assumed Royce was guilty.
Secondly, they took several months to investigate a relatively minor case. Unable to make a strong enough case for a felony charge (I could be wrong, but I believe that a theft of $500 or more calls for a felony), they charged Royce, and only Royce, with 3 counts of trespassing?
Due to the length of time it took for this investigation, I am going to imagine that there were a few hundred man-hours spent on the case--all for a stolen laptop. What a waste.
Media
In the age we live in, I guess it can be expected. However, the local media reporting on every one of Royce's tweets, Facebook statuses, and YouTube videos was borderline at best. Imagine if everything you thought and said at 18 was reported on in the news. I would imagine that 1. most people's egos would be inflated and 2. you might say or do something that you might regret later.
I also have a very tough time stomaching the fact that Royce's potential involvement in the laptop case was reported. If he's charged, go ahead and write a story. Don't find him guilty in the press.
Paul Shirley's writings about the Haiti tragedy opened my eyes once again to the lack of empathy that some people have towards other's situations. Please do your best not to judge Royce, no matter the outcome. Watching the team interact in warm-ups before the MSU game, it is clear his teammates have not.
Duthasmon Smith
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Snide comments from everyone aside. This is exactly what is wrong with RW and the whole situation. We've spent an entire year lamenting what would have been instead of dealing with what we do have. We have great posters on this site being drug into the mud by some troll and we even have ladygopher feeling the need to defend RW.
I can come up with a few people in the past ten years who have been so devise for the gophers:
Rick Rickert
Kris Humphrey
RW
At the end of the day, they all left and we moved on. Wish RW would at least have the decency to do the same thing.
I can come up with a few people in the past ten years who have been so devise for the gophers:
Rick Rickert
Kris Humphrey
RW
At the end of the day, they all left and we moved on. Wish RW would at least have the decency to do the same thing.
MilesTarver
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that is not completely correct. yes, he was making too much noise, but that wasn't the issue. it was his pompous attitude and the 'do you know who I am" above the law talk that did it. kids get in trouble for being too loud every night, and they apologize and quiet down. not royce, he refused multiple times, to the point where the r.a. had to call the UMPD. i've heard multiple times.
think about it - do you really get kicked out of a dorm for playing your music too loud???
Gold Vision
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Excellent post. There seems to be a huge lack of communication in this entire ordeal between all of the parties. The cryptic quotes about team and legal status lead to some crazy speculation. It's an extremely frustrating end to this soap opera.
Check the behavioral markers from this list. It leaves little doubt what the U is dealng with in Royce White and calls into question why there haven't been much earlier interventions in getting this kid the help he so desperately needs:
<b><u>Profile of the Sociopath</u></b>
This website summarizes some of the common features of descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.
1) <b>Glibness and Superficial Charm</b>
2)<b> Manipulative and Conning</b>
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.
3) <b>Grandiose Sense of Self</b>
Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."
4) <b>Pathological Lying</b>
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.
5) <b>Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt </b>
A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
6) <b>Shallow Emotions</b>
When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
7) <b>Incapacity for Love</b>
8)<b> Need for Stimulation</b>
Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.
9) <b>Callousness/Lack of Empathy</b>
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.
10) <b>Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature </b>
Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.
11) <b>Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency</b>
Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
12) <b>Irresponsibility/Unreliability</b>
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.
13) <b>Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle</b>
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.
14) <b>Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility </b>
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.
<b><u>Profile of the Sociopath</u></b>
This website summarizes some of the common features of descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.
1) <b>Glibness and Superficial Charm</b>
2)<b> Manipulative and Conning</b>
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.
3) <b>Grandiose Sense of Self</b>
Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."
4) <b>Pathological Lying</b>
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.
5) <b>Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt </b>
A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
6) <b>Shallow Emotions</b>
When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
7) <b>Incapacity for Love</b>
8)<b> Need for Stimulation</b>
Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.
9) <b>Callousness/Lack of Empathy</b>
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.
10) <b>Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature </b>
Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.
11) <b>Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency</b>
Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
12) <b>Irresponsibility/Unreliability</b>
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.
13) <b>Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle</b>
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.
14) <b>Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility </b>
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.
goldengophers
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Pretty apparent that White is using the media in an attempt to be activated to play. Like the previous YouTube video I don't think he is planning to withdrawl and this is likely an empty threat considering he doesn't have a plan to go anywhere else or leave for the NBA.
we 'moved on'?
to what?
we were losing then, we are losing now.
maybe some of you need to 'move on'... back to Lake Wobegon where all the children are above average.. no RW, no John Wall... ( who called out his coach in the national press today). Guns in Knoxville, etc, etc... how about the fall of Tucker in Iowa?... who is a 'safe' recruit?
sure these guys get cocky... flown all over the country in AAU ball starting about age 12.. Rivals, etc putting up 'top 100' lists of 8th graders... If you want to just dismiss them all, go ahead..
beowulftom
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Well said.
WilliamsArenaGuy
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+1
Just like you don't expelled from a school for cheating on a test. There is obviously a lot more to this, and the only person who is at fault is Royce White.
Tubby needs to take a stand now and quit putting up with this *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#. He needs to officially say we are done with him. What a joke of a season.
Missed-layup
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- If your diagnosis of him being a sociopath is correct, why don't you also list the successful ways to treat sociopaths? - I'm not sure sociopaths can be treated, thus you likely would not want him on the team.
- I'm not sure your checklist is a good way for any non-professional (non-psychologist) to make a diagnosis, without actually doing a psychological interview with him.
- You walk on dangerous territory casting around such accusations. What could we label you, using these same checklists?
I can't believe I'm saying this, but I agree with you for once.
Duthasmon Smith
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Does Rivals actually have a top 100 list for 8th graders? That's funny if true. At least Tucker and Wall were actually PLAYING!!!!! Wall just went up IMO for ripping Calipari. Tucker made his own mistakes as well but I don't think anyone thinks he was the model student/athlete coming out of Minnetonka and coach hedstr......oops.
Royce or not, Tubby needs to take some accountablity for a disappointing season too. He has basically the same players as last year. There have been games where we just don't look ready to go.
Tub of all people is the one who needs to block out the distractions and get the team prepared. Blaming Royce for the way we have looked is just not very prudent.
I cast no accusations. I ask you to look at the behavioral markers and note if any fit the public personality of Royce White. I then ask you to support the U in continuing to work on convincing Royce in getting the help he needs to make the most of his talents and not going down the path he's currently headed- in throwing his whole life away. At this point, there is denial from both sides on dealing with the reality of this situation.
Good points. There is a lot of blame to go around, but Tubby and Maturi's apparent failure to communicate Royce's future with RW is a big part of it.
Exactly what in Royce White's past leads you to take his word about what Tubby/Maturi/anyone did or did not communicate to him?
I have my share of concerns with Tubby, but I certainly wouldn't side with a wildcard like Royce White in an integrity contest with Orlando Smith.
brucekaupa
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Name the classes and let the world decide how hard he's had to work.
And saying your a "marketing major" in your freshman year means jack. You don't get accepted to Carlson as an undergrad until your junior year. Everything before that is prep work.
So, he COULD have "Calc I", "Cost Accounting" and "MacroEcon"...or he could have "Art of Disney", "Theater 1001" and "Badminton".