Myron chat: Former, current players agree Tubby is not the easiest coach to play for

[GoGoGophers]

Who is this rage directed at?

But I agree about the DJ's lack of D...as I posted earlier in the thread. He got less minutes because of his bad D and that's probably why he didn't get the PT he thought he deserved. But dang his offense can look really good sometimes.

Edited my post to include Mrs. Joseph's, er, I mean gg's most recent BS related to the quitter.

 

[jmag21]

I appreciate that Myron stopped by to defend his column, though I still don't like it. Look, it could very well have been a failed drug test that did him in, but I don't know that and haven't heard it except on here, so I'm not going to say that. However, there's no disputing one thing. Devoe is a quitter. Tubby may have been hard on him, and not given him the minutes he wanted. Devoe may have even faced a suspension. Who knows. But the simple fact is that Devoe did not have to quit in the middle of the year, and he did. I still am holding out hope that this team rallies against all the skeptics and doubters and accomplishes something special this year.

 

[drnkmn]

"What did you think of the twitter exchange between Damian Johnson and Cobbs?
Thursday January 6, 2011 1:03 mambo"

Saw this on Myron's chat. Anyone see this....what was said?

 

[Myron P. Medcalf]

Look, I don't have any problem with Myron and his work. He can be a tad petulant at times, but seems like a straight-shooter.

Anyway, no one really knows for sure (including our reporters) all the circumstances behind Devoe's departure. But I did find it strange that Devoe couldn't attract Corey to play with him at Minnesota. Fortunately, Big Mo was recruited and hopefully he stays here despite the departure.

Insofar as sibling rivalry, younger brother Corey is starting and doing well down in Texas. Now I don't know Barnes' coaching style very well but do suspect he is like Tubby and is pretty much by the book.

With Devoe having done so well during the Big Ten Tournament only to come off the bench, it would seem that Corey's success may be in part a factor in Devoe's frustration.

Tubby being "old school" versus (I suppose) new school seems a point in Myron's contention. Yet many successful D-1 coaches are "old school" and many more have had problem recruits. The issue for me is how else do you run a major basketball program without being by the book? You're taking a dozen or more young men where physical maturity far exceeds mental maturity. You can't be duplicitous and have a different set of rules for certain players and not for others. Minnesota has experienced the NCAA sanctions that accompanied that practice. I'd rather lose a recruit or two and not risk the potential for NCAA sanctions.

Myron interviews the mother and gets the "insiders" scoop of the matter but he can't share it. So why bring it up to begin with? And even if Myron could, does anyone seriously believe that mom is going to turn on her son to a beat writer?

Many parents, like myself, like a coach who sets standards of behavior. I suspect guys like Ralph Sampson wanted his son to play for Tubby for that reason. If it means losing Devoe and Royce, so be it. But you don't throw the baby out with the bath water (sorry but true)

Yes, Mom has her version of things. And I'm sure the team/Tubby have a version.

I brought up "the scoop" because of the emails, comments on my blog, more emails and message board takes that suggest Devoe just decided to quit Friday because of this reason and/or that reason. He'd been thinking about it for some time.

And yes, Mom is biased. What she told me may not line up with what the team says about the matter. But I brought up the convo I had with his mom because Devoe and his family believe that he made the right decision and that he had valid reasons to make it.

And I know why he was suspended for the first six games. I'm not ignorant on this guy's situation over the last few months.

And I'm not trying to say this is on Tubby. And I'm not trying to defend Devoe. Just reporting what I know.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

If I was a Mom I would send my son to play for Tubby. I am a Dad and would do the same.

Quit your damn whining and do what is required to earn your scholarship!

 

[brucekaupa]

And I know why he was suspended for the first six games....Just reporting what I know.

Actually, you AREN'T reporting what you know.

 

[anonymous]

Sec105,

Moe Hargrow left in the middle of the season, one day after a game at Purdue.

Limar Wilson did as well.

 

[underground629]

Joseph isn't a better play than Nolen just because you say so. Yes, Devoe is a better scorer than Nolen, but he's not that great of a scorer either. He's a volume shooter and a poor decision maker. So Joseph is better because he could score a few more ppg while giving up waaaay more points than Nolen does? Tell me what else Devoe is better at?

You act as if the run at the end of the year was all Joseph. Obviously he played very well for a stretch, but Iverson was a huuuuge part of that, Damian stepped up, and Westbrook started to play defense and pass the ball.

Only Nolen was suspended for something other something Tubby didn't like? You just said we don't know why he was suspended, so how does that work?

Never a good situation for a player when he sits and watches an inferior player--who missed half a season for academic reasons, which Joseph never did--get his playing time. Joseph is a better player than Nolen, and this team would've been better had the coach admitted that.

I don't know why Joseph was suspended earlier. It doesn't appear anyone on this board does. But I do know why Nolen was suspended, and I do know the team was better last year when Tubby couldn't give Nolen too much court time. I also know that only one of those two players was suspended for reasons other than 'something Tubby didn't like.'

 

[underground629]

I'm confused... aren't those Myron's words? What exactly did Joseph's mom say that you think she should shut up? Whoever originally made the statement, it should be NOT every player. Right now it says that nobody responds to that style and that's not true.

"Former and current players agree that Tubby is not the easiest coach to play for. He's old school. And every player doesn't respond to that style."

And we're supposed to believe the players weren't aware of this when they signed on with Tubby?

Do us a favor Mommy Joseph & shut up.

 

[underground629]

Hahaha, I thought that was hilarious as well. Thank you for that Myron. How many d1 players with egos who are riding the bench consider transferring?

"Others have considered it. Trust me."

Imagine that. Basketball players at a major university have considered transferring from their original school because they're not happy with the coach? That just never happens. More "shocking", edge-of-your-seat information from one of the local beat writers. "Journalism" is becoming more & more amateurish every day.

 

[underground629]

I know you somewhat acknowledged this... but can't you say that for tons and tons of coaches? I would guess most players who ride the bench find the coach tough to play for, that the coaching style doesn't work for them, and that it's the coaches way or no way at all.

But many say he's tough to play for. As most on this board know, it's Tubby's way, or no way at all.

But his coaching style hasn't worked for some of the guys he's recruited.

 

[underground629]

I thought that Devoe should've played more in the Wisconsin game WITH Nolen in there. I think those stats are a little bit misleading though. When Devoe was guarding Taylor, Taylor literally either scored himself or drove and dished each possession. Taylor really struggled with Nolen guarding him.

20 Minutes a game is not enough for a kid that started the previous year and did very well because another kid (now starting ahead of him) couldn't cut it in class. Think about how Devoe felt when he contributed 14 pts, 7 assists, with just one turnover in 21 minutes while Nolen goes 0-6, scores 0 points and adds 2 assists in 22 in the Wisconsin game. We lose the WI game and playing Devoe more could have made the difference. Then we play MSU and Nolen plays 30 mins and scores 4 pts with 4 TO's and 3 assists. Devoe plays 21 minutes and scores 5 pts with 2 TO's and 1 assist. We lose another close game.

Don't you think it is a possiblity that Devoe, after starting the previous year and doing very well, felt that Tubby was holding whatever he did earlier against him and that he wasn't getting a fair shake so he transferred? I am not saying that this is the right move for Devoe, but to say it is grades or pettiness on his part is speculation. We have no idea. Nolen let the team down in 2009, Devoe did this year, but it seemed Al was given the starting job back without any grudge by Tubby. Again, we have no idea. Let's stop the grades and drug stuff. There are other reasons kids leave.

 

[underground629]

I agree with most of the bball points in there. Those stats are a little misleading though. We played much much weaker competition w/o Devoe. Whether or not he played against MSU or Wisc likely wouldn't have mattered because we would've lost either way.

would someone please give me one name of a coach that is easy to play for. i'm tired of everyone making excuses for unhappy kids. lets face it, he didn't like the time he was being played and something was going on behind the scenes, and he pouted like a little kid. when he didn't get his way he quit. thats how our society is today. if your unhappy with your job you quit. if your wife makes you mad because she doesn't want you at the bar all night you quit. its easier than facing up to reality. the kid quit and myron wants to make and all the insider bloggers want to coddle the kid. face up to it he's a quitter. now lets move on and i'm loven the guys who didn't quit. apparently tubby is so hard on those kids. he's only tough on a few of them, like cobbs and joseph. we're 7-0 without the kid and 5-3 with him. does that mean we're going undefeated? obviously no, but chemistry is more important than 10 pts./game.

 

[underground629]

Haha I loved this post. I'm glad someone else saw that and sees what he brought to the team. We really could've used him to backup Nolen, play with Nolen, and play a lot next year, but people who think we're better off with him at pg over Nolen don't know what they're talking about. Also, I'd say he sucks at more than 50% if you break down parts on offense. A lot of people seem to think he's some great offensive player. He really struggles in a lot of areas on offense. Obviously we have a lot of players like that, but just pointing out that he wasn't some offensive stud.

I absolutely love how the Devoe worshippers gloss over the fact that Jordan Taylor was absolutely raping him when he was on the floor. Nolen goes out with his second foul and Taylor, who was scoreless at the time, proceeds to go off on Superstar Devoe for the remainder of the half. He scored 9 straight points during one 4 minute stretch, for Christ's sake. What were you watching when this was happening? Taylor would have scored 40 if Devoe got more minutes, and the final margin would have been twice as bad.

Why don't you guys get this? Devoe is/was an awful defensive player. During the game you keep referencing, it was proved for the 50th time. THAT is why he couldn't ever stay on the floor, he absolutely sucks at 50% of the game. Devoe is/was much more concerned about his upcoming forced three pointer than manning up on the player if front of him (who was normally already by him and into the lane).

Everyone except you, Devoe's mom, Myron Pee, Air Force guy, and Devoe understand this.

 

[underground629]

Actually, your recollection is wrong. When Nolen guarded him in the 1st half, Taylor was shooting left and right and missing nearly every shot. When Nolen went out, Taylor drove on Devoe over and over. If Devoe didn't foul him, he frequently either scored or drove and dished the ball to someone. Yeah, Nolen was in the game when he scored at the end. That's because Ralph was guarding him.

Let me explain how MN went to the championship game of the BT tourney. Yes, Joseph played very well. So did Iverson, DJ, and Westbrook to name a few. The team played well, not just Joseph. Also, it helps when Purdue didn't have Hummel and just played awful. It also helped that we had a lot more to play for. Just because we didn't lose those games doesn't mean that Devoe's defense wasn't bad. You're right, we aren't better off without Devoe. I think you've made it pretty clear that you think he's better than Nolen though, and that's just not true.

Your recollection on the WI game is wrong. Dead wrong. Check the stats of Taylors scoring. Nolen was in the game when he went off. Nolen was guarding him. Tell me how did MN go to thew championship game of the Big Ten tourney and beat Pudue and a final four team, MSU, with Devoe playing 30 minutes of defense?

If you think MN is better off without Joseph, you are in for the biggest surprise of your life the next month or so.

 

[USAFChief]

I absolutely love how the Devoe worshippers gloss over the fact that Jordan Taylor was absolutely raping him when he was on the floor. Nolen goes out with his second foul and Taylor, who was scoreless at the time, proceeds to go off on Superstar Devoe for the remainder of the half. He scored 9 straight points during one 4 minute stretch, for Christ's sake. What were you watching when this was happening? Taylor would have scored 40 if Devoe got more minutes, and the final margin would have been twice as bad.

Why don't you guys get this? Devoe is/was an awful defensive player. During the game you keep referencing, it was proved for the 50th time. THAT is why he couldn't ever stay on the floor, he absolutely sucks at 50% of the game. Devoe is/was much more concerned about his upcoming forced three pointer than manning up on the player if front of him (who was normally already by him and into the lane).

Everyone except you, Devoe's mom, Myron Pee, Air Force guy, and Devoe understand this.

Three things, 2 specific and 1 general:

1. Specific: It's not 'Air Force guy.' There are no 'guys' in the Air Force. You can call me asshole, you can call me wrong, you can call me pretty much anything. But ff you're going to reference my service, get my *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#ing rank right. It's 'Chief.' As in Chief Master Sergeant. I spent 22 years earning that rank, and 4 proudly wearing it. I'm not about to let some dickhead disrespect it.

2. Specific: Your recollection of the Wisconsin game fits your meme, but contains zero facts and lots of errors. To wit:

- (Taylor)...Went off on him when Nolen was on the bench with 2 fouls for the last 9 minutes of the half (from your other 'post.')
Nolen didn't go out with 9 minutes left, he went out after his second foul with 6:58 left. Taylor wasn't scoreless at that point, he had 5 pts.

- Nolen goes out with his second foul and Taylor, who was scoreless at the time, proceeds to go off on Superstar Devoe for the remainder of the half. See above. Taylor wasn't scoreless at the point Nolen left the game. He had 5 pts, having just drained a 3 pointer and a jump shot, both off Nolen. From the time Nolen left the game a short time after his 2nd foul, Taylor scored 5 pts, all on free throws. He didn't score in the last 3:56 of the first half, and had no assists from the time Nolen left the game until halftime. If that constitutes 'going off' then you have a point. But since it doesn't, you don't.

- He scored 9 straight points during one 4 minute stretch, for Christ's sake. No, he didn't. He did score 7 straight for Wisconsin over a 4 minute stretch late in the second half, though, during which time the game was decided, and during which time Nolen was in the game. BTW, during that decisive stretch, Nolen was 0 for 3 on the offensive end, clanking three consecutive shots that helped him finish the night 0-6.

All this information comes from ESPN's play-by-play. Facts are such inconvenient things sometimes.

3. General: Why don't you guys get this? Devoe is/was an awful defensive player. During the game you keep referencing, it was proved for the 50th time. You're certainly entitled to your opinion on this. I would even agree that Nolen>Joseph defensively (but you forget that Joseph>>>Nolen offensively). Where I do not agree is with this poorly thought out meme that somehow Nolen is to defense what Kobe Bryant is to offense, or that Devoe Joseph is the worst defender in the history of basketball. Neither of those is true. Nolen, for example, is quick, but he's a gambler on defense, and for every pass he steals by jumping a passing lane, he misses one or two, resulting in his being out of position and an open look or easy pass for an opponant. He's also one of the reasons this team gives up so many open 3 pt looks, as in addition to leaving his man to gamble on a steal often, he is one of the Gophers who leaves his man to help whenever an opposing team makes an entry pass to a post player (and I understand that may be by design, but still). That's where he gets a good portion of the steals you guys love so much.

But you've staked your position on this board, so now you have to defend your position. I get that. Plz do try to stick to the facts about specific games though, tough as that may be.

 

[GoAUpher]

Seems to me Nolen quit on his teammates last year when he didn't go to class.

No, he let them down. He then proceeded to get his s**t together and is back in his role as a starter. Joseph should have been taking notes instead of packing his bags.

The speculation is what bothers me about Devoe. Obviously, Devoe had thought about transferring for quite a while per Myron. Obviously, Tubby has a long history of success with players. What we do NOT know is this:

1) Why Devoe left
2) Why Devoe only played 20 minutes against MSU after a good game vs WI.

All true. None of it changes the fact that he quit on his team.

Rather than speculate on drugs or placing blame on one or the other party, let's try waiting and seeing if something comes out. Smearing a kid as a quitter or a drug user or whatever is just wrong without facts. Just as wrong as blaming Tubby for being too tough on players.

I agree. No need to speculate. He left for a reason. The only thing that matters is that he left. And yes, this is quitting on his team.

Don't you think it is a possiblity that Devoe, after starting the previous year and doing very well, felt that Tubby was holding whatever he did earlier against him and that he wasn't getting a fair shake so he transferred? I am not saying that this is the right move for Devoe, but to say it is grades or pettiness on his part is speculation. We have no idea. Nolen let the team down in 2009, Devoe did this year, but it seemed Al was given the starting job back without any grudge by Tubby. Again, we have no idea. Let's stop the grades and drug stuff. There are other reasons kids leave.

Again, even if this is true it doesn't change the fact that he quit. Having what he, you, or even most people consider a good reason to quit doesn't excuse the fact that he quit. As for Nolen, you are making assumptions of your own about how easy or hard it was for Nolen to get his spot back. At the end of the day we know this. Both guys made mistakes. One guy took his punishment and earned his way back on the floor. The other guy took his punishment and quit soon after.

I had 2 of my college basketball teammates quit midseason my sophomore year. Both were good guys that I remained friendly with. They quit because they were not happy for a variety of reasons. Both were post players and they left our bench pretty short in the 4 and 5 slot. I understood why they left, but the fact is that they still quit on our team and it affected us negatively.

I'm with you on defending Devoe from smears. But you can't say he didn't quit. If leaving is the best thing for him then I wish him luck and respect that he felt he had to do this. But that doesn't mean we should ignore the mess he may have left behind when he decided to just up and leave his team.

 

[GoGoGophers]

Three things, 2 specific and 1 general:

1. Specific: It's not 'Air Force guy.' There are no 'guys' in the Air Force. You can call me asshole, you can call me wrong, you can call me pretty much anything. But ff you're going to reference my service, get my *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#ing rank right. It's 'Chief.' As in Chief Master Sergeant. I spent 22 years earning that rank, and 4 proudly wearing it. I'm not about to let some dickhead disrespect it.

2. Specific: Your recollection of the Wisconsin game fits your meme, but contains zero facts and lots of errors. To wit:
.
.
.
.
Nolen, for example, is quick, but he's a gambler on defense, and for every pass he steals by jumping a passing lane, he misses one or two, resulting in his being out of position and an open look or easy pass for an opponant. He's also one of the reasons this team gives up so many open 3 pt looks, as in addition to leaving his man to gamble on a steal often, he is one of the Gophers who leaves his man to help whenever an opposing team makes an entry pass to a post player (and I understand that may be by design, but still). That's where he gets a good portion of the steals you guys love so much.

But you've staked your position on this board, so now you have to defend your position. I get that. Plz do try to stick to the facts about specific games though, tough as that may be.

Take a look at that box score again. Obvioulsy I didn't recall it correctly and Taylor had 5 points when Nolen went to the bench, but Nolen held him scoreless for the first 12:05 of the half. He was not able to penetrate on Al and was settling for bombing from the perimter. I know for all The Quitter fans that doesn't mean much as it's not related to inefficiently scoring 11 ppg, but to the rest of us (and most importantly our HOF head coach) it was a vital part of the Gophs being in the game from the get go.

Taylor ended with 12 in the half. He hit a jumper on The Quitter and 5-6 from the stripe, and wore a path into the lane as he blew by the Quitter at will. BTW, there are no assists given when the dish leads to a foul and two free throws. I know that none of this matters to The Quitter backers, as he made a layup and a jumper during this stretch of getting beaten like a mule. YAY!!! 4 points for him, but a net negative to the Team as they were losing their lead and the battle. Again, never a concern for The Quitter or his great fans.

My apologies for the insult to your service and rank. As a Navy brat, I know better.

 

[minngg]

Unreal. Re-write the past all you want, Devoe got pi$$ed on by Taylor all game. Went off on him when Nolen was on the bench with 2 fouls for the last 9 minutes of the half, and did the same in the second half. Devoe sucks on the defensive end. Always has, always will.

Bringing up the B10 tourney run doesn't change that fact. He was not the reason they won those games. He was a contributor, sure, but not the sole reason. Was he the sole reason they got swept by Michigan? Beat down by NU and IU? That team STRUGGLED down the stretch last year and made a great, but unanticipated, run in 3 days that saved their season. To pretend that the team played well down the stretch last year without Nolen is a fallacy that people like you, Devoe, his mom, and Air Force guy have created.

I have never stated, or even thought, that they are better off without him, but your hero worship is asinine.

Tomorrow I'll post the play by play of the game and you will see your lies in print. Taylor scored most of his points with Nolen in the game. He scored when they screened for him and Tubby had our defense switch. Once Taylor got Sampson or Trevor on him, he drove to the hoop. Taylor also scored 8 FT's with more fouls on Nolen than Devoe.

One more thing. Your name calling and child like posts don't help your argument. Go ahead and demean the poster rather than intelligently challenging the post. If that is your style. However, it weakens your argument and makes you look immature. SO , go ahead, call me Devoe's mom and call USAF Air Force guy, whatever makes you feel like a man. Call Devoe a quitter too. If that whats makes you feel like a man. Especially when you have no idea why he left. None.

 

[USAFChief]

My apologies for the insult to your service and rank. As a Navy brat, I know better.

Accepted, and returned. Perhaps I overreacted...

...it was a vital part of the Gophs being in the game from the get go.

As were the last 5 minutes, during which Nolen was one of the reasons the Gophers lost a game they were in 'from the get go.'

 

[minngg]

No, he let them down. He then proceeded to get his s**t together and is back in his role as a starter. Joseph should have been taking notes instead of packing his bags.

All true. None of it changes the fact that he quit on his team.

I agree. No need to speculate. He left for a reason. The only thing that matters is that he left. And yes, this is quitting on his team.

Again, even if this is true it doesn't change the fact that he quit. Having what he, you, or even most people consider a good reason to quit doesn't excuse the fact that he quit. As for Nolen, you are making assumptions of your own about how easy or hard it was for Nolen to get his spot back. At the end of the day we know this. Both guys made mistakes. One guy took his punishment and earned his way back on the floor. The other guy took his punishment and quit soon after.

I had 2 of my college basketball teammates quit midseason my sophomore year. Both were good guys that I remained friendly with. They quit because they were not happy for a variety of reasons. Both were post players and they left our bench pretty short in the 4 and 5 slot. I understood why they left, but the fact is that they still quit on our team and it affected us negatively.

I'm with you on defending Devoe from smears. But you can't say he didn't quit. If leaving is the best thing for him then I wish him luck and respect that he felt he had to do this. But that doesn't mean we should ignore the mess he may have left behind when he decided to just up and leave his team.

Where have I defended Devoe for leaving? I gave reasons why he might have left that do not include grades or drugs. That is all. I have also given reasons why he should have played more from a performance perspective only. I do not know if he deserved to play based on his behavior. I just get mad at idiots that say things like, "we are better off without him" or "we played fine in Puerto Rico without him" or " addition by subtraction". Anyone that honestly believes this team is better off without Devoe is just saying that because he left. Like when we get a decommitt and everyone says "well he wasn't that good anyway". It is childish.

 

[GoAUpher]

Where have I defended Devoe for leaving? I gave reasons why he might have left that do not include grades or drugs. That is all. I have also given reasons why he should have played more from a performance perspective only. I do not know if he deserved to play based on his behavior. I just get mad at idiots that say things like, "we are better off without him" or "we played fine in Puerto Rico without him" or " addition by subtraction". Anyone that honestly believes this team is better off without Devoe is just saying that because he left. Like when we get a decommitt and everyone says "well he wasn't that good anyway". It is childish.

Part of my stressing the he did quit thing was that you used the phrase "smear him as a quitter" which seems to imply you don't think he quit. Apologies if I read too much into that.

I can't stress enough that I agree with you on not smearing the kid or jumping to conclusions. If there is one thing I learned from having 2 guys I knew and liked quit is that the reasons behind that sort of move can be complex.

I also don't believe in addition by subtraction. If he had a terrible attitude all the time I might feel otherwise. But that didn't seem to be the case. I don't think he was a cancer on the team or anything. I don't know why you single out the "we played fine in Puerto Rico" line though. We did in fact play well in Puerto Rico without him. That's just a fact. It doesn't mean we'll be great without him moving forward though and I'm guessing that line of thinking is what you were referring to.

I'm of the mind that the team is better off in one regard...IMO its better when all the members of a team want to be there and are working towards the same goal. This is also due to personal experience. My frosh year we had an extremely talented senior captain. He was head and shoulders above everyone else on our team or on our opponents. But as the season wore on you could tell he just stopped caring. Don't know why he wasn't happy, but he definitely wasn't. And despite his talent, his unhappiness hindered his ability to lead the team and it began to contribute to losses. That said, even an unhappy Joseph would bring an offensive presence to the team that will seemingly be hard to replace. And in that regard the team is likely not better off.

 

[underground629]

I agree with that. I thought Devoe should've received more playing time alongside Nolen. Nolen is clearly the better pg but it would've been nice to see that 3 guard lineup a little more with Devoe in there.

Where have I defended Devoe for leaving? I gave reasons why he might have left that do not include grades or drugs. That is all. I have also given reasons why he should have played more from a performance perspective only. I do not know if he deserved to play based on his behavior. I just get mad at idiots that say things like, "we are better off without him" or "we played fine in Puerto Rico without him" or " addition by subtraction". Anyone that honestly believes this team is better off without Devoe is just saying that because he left. Like when we get a decommitt and everyone says "well he wasn't that good anyway". It is childish.

 

[jovs]

The point that hasn't been presented is basically that Nolen quit on the team last year by failing school. Joseph stepped in and basically pulled the team to the NCAA tournament. As a coach how would you ever put Nolen ahead of Joseph at the start of the next season. That is beyond me. Some coaches I played for never would have let Nolen see the court the next year or limited at best. Whatever happened to you earn your playing time, if Joseph didn't earn it at that point in his career he never would at Minnesota.

I agree with Joseph, I would be gone in that situation. Basically what you are saying is there is nothing he could do to get more playing time.

 

[underground629]

That point has been brought up. Tubby said that Devoe was the leader of the team at the end of last year and in the summer he said that Nolen would have to earn his spot back. Obviously Devoe did stuff to drop below Nolen. It wasn't like Tubby just decided that for no reason. Joseph has always gotten decent playing time. Do you really think that next year he wouldn't log huge minutes? So Tubby would play Mav and Hollins ahead of him? There was stuff he could've done to get more playing time. He could've fixed whatever his off the court stuff was and played better.

The point that hasn't been presented is basically that Nolen quit on the team last year by failing school. Joseph stepped in and basically pulled the team to the NCAA tournament. As a coach how would you ever put Nolen ahead of Joseph at the start of the next season. That is beyond me. Some coaches I played for never would have let Nolen see the court the next year or limited at best. Whatever happened to you earn your playing time, if Joseph didn't earn it at that point in his career he never would at Minnesota.

I agree with Joseph, I would be gone in that situation. Basically what you are saying is there is nothing he could do to get more playing time.

 

[GopherJake]

Joseph stepped in and basically pulled the team to the NCAA tournament. As a coach how would you ever put Nolen ahead of Joseph at the start of the next season. That is beyond me.

The following is beyond you?

2010-2011 Minnesota Gopher Men's Basketball Regular Season Schedule

Game 1: Wofford - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)
Game 2: Siena - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)
Game 3: W. Kentucky - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)
Game 4: N. Carolina - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)
Game 5: W. Virginia - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)
Game 6: N. Dakota St. - D. Joseph - DNP (team suspension)

 

[Brew_recruit]

The best coaches are hard to play for.

 

[USAFChief]

That point has been brought up. Tubby said that Devoe was the leader of the team at the end of last year and in the summer he said that Nolen would have to earn his spot back. Obviously Devoe did stuff to drop below Nolen. It wasn't like Tubby just decided that for no reason. Joseph has always gotten decent playing time. Do you really think that next year he wouldn't log huge minutes? So Tubby would play Mav and Hollins ahead of him? There was stuff he could've done to get more playing time. He could've fixed whatever his off the court stuff was and played better.

We have no way of knowing if Joseph felt he'd log 'huge minutes' next season. Perhaps he felt like "If I can't play ahead of an inferior player (who suspended himself for half the season last year) now, what will change next year?"

Whether or not Joseph really is a superior player to Nolen (and I for one think he is, although I know I'm probably in the minority), I have little doubt that Joseph himself believes that. Most players think they're better than the competition.

 

[josh087]

Who cares how many points Jordan Taylor scored against whom and when? The point that was trying to be made is that Al is a better defender than Devoe. Nobody can dispute this fact, so arguing about the box score is missing the point.

 

[GoGoGophers]

Joseph stepped in and basically pulled the team to the NCAA tournament.

Again...this is just plain wrong. The Quitter was the starting point guard, but LW, Damian, RS3, PC, and Colt each had as much, if not more, to do with that than The Quitter.

As a coach how would you ever put Nolen ahead of Joseph at the start of the next season. That is beyond me.

Do you think that this may have had something to do with The Quitter being suspended for the first 6 games of the year? During the 6 months between the end of the season and the start of this year, The Quitter lost his starting job and was suspended for 20% of the season. He did that, Tubby did not. Then he quit.

The End.