HS Football Update - sort of

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Gophers_4life said:
To some degree, this is all hand-waiving BS, anyway.

At the end of the day, the true question is: how many trophies are you handing out in USBS at the end of the season, to make that many teams feel really good about themselves?

What's the correct number? 4, 5, 6, 7, 8? What?

Why shouldn't it be smaller? Why shouldn't it be bigger? Why not 10? Why not 2?
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Not everything is a debate.
To me this thread is about getting information more than anything. And telling people what I know is happening.
 

The info was given out. If mods want to therefore lock the thread, be my guest. You can DM them

A thread can morph to be whatever posters want it to talk about.
 

Gophers_4life said:
This is not at all the discussion.

Nor was I proposing that OSD should say something like "we are voluntarily deciding that the current boundary of PCHS should be split off into its own district".
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So what is it? Just your stream of consciousness rambling? It might be important to remember that at one time, the PC attendance area was pretty wealthy, and they were a major athletic powerhouse. That area encompassed the Edinburgh neighborhood when people like Kirby Puckett and Jesse Ventura lived there.
 

Gophers_4life said:
Right.

It makes no possible sense to force those bolded schools to be in 6A, just because their (poverty adjusted) enrollments are higher than some arbitrary threshold.

It doesn't matter if a high school has 5000 students, if it only has 30 total kids out for football.


Those should be put into 5A, and replaced with the four highest-performing 5A programs.
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Basically promotion and relegation? That makes sense. Question - do you run this throughout the entire high school league like the English Football Pyramid, where, in theory, even a small club team could make their way to the Premiership? Some class 1A team has a ten year run that ends up with them in 6A?
 



Well that's not correct, if you actually didn't care you wouldn't post anything in response.
 

disco said:
So what is it? Just your stream of consciousness rambling?
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Any GH post by any poster that isn't sharing factual information, links, Tweets, etc. is exactly what you say here. That's the point of GH.

disco said:
It might be important to remember that at one time, the PC attendance area was pretty wealthy, and they were a major athletic powerhouse. That area encompassed the Edinburgh neighborhood when people like Kirby Puckett and Jesse Ventura lived there.
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Did they send their kids to PC? Rhetorical question, besides the point.

PC has a great basketball program, actually. Right? I'm pretty sure that's true. So does Cooper.

Much easier in basketball, than in football, for whatever reasons.
 

disco said:
Basically promotion and relegation? That makes sense. Question - do you run this throughout the entire high school league like the English Football Pyramid, where, in theory, even a small club team could make their way to the Premiership? Some class 1A team has a ten year run that ends up with them in 6A?
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Great questions and I have no idea.

I just know that it makes absolutely no sense for those four high schools to be in that upper division, in football.

Football is special. Well obviously it is, no other sport in the state has near as many divisions.



No other sport is so entrenched at the intersection of "this matters, deeply, to the identity of the school and community" and "this sport is really difficult to be good at, even just a one-off year, so many things have to be done right to even have a chance".

Basketball, I don't know, you can probably just pickup the right 2-3 kids, and suddenly you're a contender.

Hockey, even more special than football in how difficult it is to do well. Kids play club, play year round. There are few schools in the state just already known as "hockey schools". You go there if you want to be serious about high school hockey. And it does matter, in this state, but it's like "niche special". When MPS only has a single team for the whole district, you know it's niche.

Every other sport, on the boys side at least, drops off dramatically in the "importance" department. Baseball, soccer, lacrosse, at matter dramatically less.
 
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Seems like they settled on a pretty logical 6a model

Will be curious what they do with 9 man through 5a
 



Gophers_4life said:
Any GH post by any poster that isn't sharing factual information, links, Tweets, etc. is exactly what you say here. That's the point of GH.


Did they send their kids to PC? Rhetorical question, besides the point.

PC has a great basketball program, actually. Right? I'm pretty sure that's true. So does Cooper.

Much easier in basketball, than in football, for whatever reasons.
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Back in the day, yeah, I think most of those kids that grew up in Brooklyn Park around the time Edinburgh was new did go to PC. I know a few people around my age that did. I used to play softball with a guy who grew up south of 85th and just west of 252 in the late 80's-early 90's.
He said it was a great area to grow up in and a good school. Pretty much average suburban middle class. It didn't get sketchier until later.

It's MUCH easier to have a great basketball program when literally only about 12-15 kids make the team and even then, often times only 8 play.

I've mentioned before, there's a tiny, tiny, TINY school in N. Wisconsin near my cabin. Graduating classes of ~15 or so. They've produced two of the top women's basketball players in Big Ten history. It only takes a few to be good to great.
 











Would love someone to put together the list of 6a games per week as they are confirmed. Maybe I should. Should be 16 games per week:

Week 1
Moundsview vs farmington
Woodbury vs Roseville
Prior lake vs forest lake
Eden prairie vs Buffalo
Rosemount vs Eastview
Lakeville north vs Stillwater
Lakeville south vs wayzata
 

MaxyJR1 said:
Looks like schedules for 6A are out. Farmington posted their schedule.

farmingtontigers.com

2023 Football Schedule Released; Homecoming Date Set - Farmington High School

The Farmington Tigers 2023 football schedule has been released and is final pending MSHSL board approval on June 6, 2023.
farmingtontigers.com farmingtontigers.com
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They did it really logical
6 teams opted down.
2 from 3 sections
0 from northern section.

Northern section will play 7 vs section + 1 crossover week 8
West, east, south will play 6 vs section.
1 vs 1 of the 2 opt down teams
2 random match
5 vs section that didn’t opt down


Opt down teams play the 5 other opt down teams plus 3 section opponents


Opt down teams:
Buffalo and Hopkins - west
Roseville and park - east
Burnsville and Eastview - south

Basically the opt down teams traded 2 section games and 2 random crossover games for 4 crossover games vs other opt down teams. They also locked one of their in section games as the other opt down team.
 

Some guy said:
They did it really logical
6 teams opted down.
2 from 3 sections
0 from northern section.

Northern section will play 7 vs section + 1 crossover week 8
West, east, south will play 6 vs section.
1 vs 1 of the 2 opt down teams
2 random match
5 vs section that didn’t opt down


Opt down teams play the 5 other opt down teams plus 3 section opponents


Opt down teams:
Buffalo and Hopkins - west
Roseville and park - east
Burnsville and Eastview - south

Basically the opt down teams traded 2 section games and 2 random crossover games for 4 crossover games vs other opt down teams. They also locked one of their in section games as the other opt down team.
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Thanks for update on how it worked. Coon Rapids did not opt down. I heard if you opted down you are locked into a 7-8 seed for playoffs. Is that true?
 

MaxyJR1 said:
Thanks for update on how it worked. Coon Rapids did not opt down. I heard if you opted down you are locked into a 7-8 seed for playoffs. Is that true?
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I believe that is true. But then again if one of those opt down team goes 5-0 against the other opt down teams and then 1-2 against the three section opponents I wonder if they will reconsider come seeding meetings.

This model stems from gold coaches being pissed at the maroon/gold split last year. Because the bottom of the gold group really got screwed the last two years.
 

Blaine and Shakopee are a MEA Wednesday cross over game.
 

Some guy said:
They did it really logical
6 teams opted down.
2 from 3 sections
0 from northern section.

Northern section will play 7 vs section + 1 crossover week 8
West, east, south will play 6 vs section.
1 vs 1 of the 2 opt down teams
2 random match
5 vs section that didn’t opt down


Opt down teams play the 5 other opt down teams plus 3 section opponents


Opt down teams:
Buffalo and Hopkins - west
Roseville and park - east
Burnsville and Eastview - south

Basically the opt down teams traded 2 section games and 2 random crossover games for 4 crossover games vs other opt down teams. They also locked one of their in section games as the other opt down team.
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Thanks for posting this. So, do the opt down teams essentially form a group that plays each other during the season? Does anyone opt up?
 

Teams aren’t opting down. They’re getting relief which means they are just playing other 6A schools that are asking for an easier schedule. I don’t think anyone is playing up in the state.
 

disco said:
Thanks for posting this. So, do the opt down teams essentially form a group that plays each other during the season? Does anyone opt up?
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It’s a regular season opt for “relief”
Playoffs will remain as usual
 

Supposed to be a preliminary update out on 9-man through AAAAA districts next Friday. Those are a lot more difficult to do since they can't just use sections since there is no class that has full sections of 8 teams like AAAAAA does.
 

Gopherwatcher said:
Supposed to be a preliminary update out on 9-man through AAAAA districts next Friday. Those are a lot more difficult to do since they can't just use sections since there is no class that has full sections of 8 teams like AAAAAA does.
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I personally would love it if the whole state went 6 team sections.
Top 4 from each section made playoff and 5 and 6 played another 5-6 for the 9th game.

Would eliminate the fri, wed, tues, sat game (4 games in 15 days)
 


First 5A schedule I've seen. Lots of good programs on this schedule.
 

Andover's schedule is up and has them opening with St. Thomas Academy. So much of what the MSHSL does gets criticized (and rightly so in so many cases . . . ) that fairness compels me to note that some people are doing something right with scheduling. It seems they found a way to get St. Thomas playing the schools they should be playing more often, if they're starting with Waconia and Andover.
 

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