Gutless Playcalling

[gopherdudepart2]

Here we go again. I started reading this thread...but couldn't continue. As usual, everyone blames the coaching/playcalling.

The issue is talent, period.

The coaches recruit and identify the talent.

 

[Some guy]

Against a team like OSU, yeah. Against Purdue or Northwestern, they’re plenty athletic enough.

i don’t think they lost to Purdue and northwestern because they were conservative.
They lost because they didn’t execute

 

[Seany]

Then why play your starters at all? The starting offense was on the field down 34 late in the 4th quarter. That's really stupid if your only goal is to avoid injuries to key players.

Or why play the game at all? Why not just concede beforehand and save everyone the trouble?

If that's what Fleck's goal was, to run the clock/get out of there as quickly as possible while trying to avoid injury, in my opinion that's even worse. Where's the pride? I will tell you, I cannot STAND that defeatist way of thinking, accepting a loss as being a foregone conclusion and thus not even trying to really compete, much less doing your best to try and pull off the upset and actually win the game

"Gutless" is exactly right when describing that type of mindset, as that is selling everyone short, his players most of all. That's just another way of telling them without telling them, "I don't believe in you".

 

[Live in the now]

In 2023 and beyond, our NIL pockets.

Sadly that is so true.

 

[Mulligan]

Or if the more talented team plays well in the 2nd half.

The hope is that at 13-0 at halftime...the undefeated National-Championship-or-bust home-team tenses up. 1 mistake...and they're midway through the 3rd quarter within 1 score of losing.

But Ohio State came out after halftime and played very well.

I really doubt Ohio State would have tensed up if we were within one score of them at any point in a game. There have been games to be pissed about PJ being too conservative and the defense just collapsing, but the Ohio State game isn't worth all the bitching. We could play them 10 times and I'd put a lot of money on them being 10-0 against us with the players the Gophers had on the field against them. Just beat the frick'n Badgers.

 

[Pompous Elitist]

i don’t think they lost to Purdue and northwestern because they were conservative.
They lost because they didn’t execute

Right, I was talking about the defense, not the offense, although neither executed well.

 

[60's Guy]

Imagine your HC not believing in his team. Fireable offense?

But as the coach he knows better than anyone what the team can and cannot do.

 

[60's Guy]

I’m not sure 9’wins is the ceiling.

Let’s look at next years schedule.

Losses in people’s minds:
Michigan
USC (7-5)
Penn state (9-2)

Every other team on the schedule if the team doesn’t win it will be the end of the world.

So like, yeah 9-3 is the “ceiling”
Unless you beat penn state like 2019
Or unless you beat a 7-5 USC team

I can’t predict much more than 6 next year without seeing the roster.
The bigger issue for this program’s ceiling isn’t the schedule. The bigger issue is the roster.

Schedule 2024 I don't think anybody but you sees these games as gimmees
North Carolina opening game
UCLA at the Rose Bowl
Iowa at home
Illinois at Burt's place
Wisconsin at their place
Rutgers at their place

 

[OddStack]

You're missing one thing. When you do move the ball to midfield and beyond, you need to take your shots and actually try to score TD's, not play the field position game and punt it away every time. It was 13 - 0 at the half, but it felt like 31 - 0 with the way we called plays all half.

I didn't include that as I'm not sure you get a free kick if there are zeros on the clock. He could've used two TOs to ensure time for a play after a punt, but then the risks that PJ worries about are more likely. Therefore, I didn't even include him using both TOs only 1.

I agree. With a mediocre to poor punt, the Serbian Hammer definitely has a shot at 3! I would have gone for broke right there as they need to get a bounce or two!

 

[Some guy]

Schedule 2024 I don't think anybody but you sees these games as gimmees
North Carolina opening game
UCLA at the Rose Bowl
Iowa at home
Illinois at Burt's place
Wisconsin at their place
Rutgers at their place

That wasn’t my point.
I wasn’t saying they were gimme’s

I’m saying if they lose any of those games it will be the end of the world on gooherhole

 

[StormWatch08]

I understand injuries. The issue I have is that although inexperienced, AK showed late last year that he can play at an above-average level. I’m just frustrated that the coaches haven’t put the players in a position to succeed, in terms of strategic X and O’s and also in terms of having an aggressive attacking offense. We have above average WRs and supposedly an all-conference TE and I would say an average to above average OL. I’m not saying we should air-raid, but we shouldn’t be last in Div 1 passing stats.

 

[noamfromm]

i don’t think they lost to Purdue and northwestern because they were conservative.
They lost because they didn’t execute

I didn't watch Purdue, but against NW we punted twice from their 39 and 37 on 4th & 3

 

[Some guy]

I didn't watch Purdue, but against NW we punted twice from their 39 and 37 on 4th & 3

Yeah. And that’s not why the team lost. The team lost because it gave up like 250 yards in the 4th quarter

 

[noamfromm]

Yeah. And that’s not why the team lost. The team lost because it gave up like 250 yards in the 4th quarter

Yeah. And had they converted that last 4th down the game would have likely been over.

 

[Some guy]

Yeah. And had they converted that last 4th down the game would have likely been over.

Maybe.
But it’s still not why they lost

If they had not gotten the 4th down conversions they may have lost in regulation instead of overtime.

 

[60's Guy]

That wasn’t my point.
I wasn’t saying they were gimme’s

I’m saying if they lose any of those games it will be the end of the world on gooherhole

Maybe, but I think the reason there is a meltdown on Gopherhole is the way we lose.
Also, compared to the 6 games I listed I'd say the meltdown comments have been about games we coulda/shouda won.

 

[Some guy]

Maybe, but I think the reason there is a meltdown on Gopherhole is the way we lose.
Also, compared to the 6 games I listed I'd say the meltdown comments have been about games we coulda/shouda won.

There are meltdowns whether the team loses 9-6
34-3
Or 42-41

And there are meltdowns if the gophers play bowling green, Illinois, or Ohio state

 

[short ornery norwegian]

it's more than just playcalling - it's an overall approach to the game.

Fleck believes he has a system that works. and it has worked at times when the offense and defense are able to compliment each other.

but when the offense or defense - or both of them - struggle, then the system doesn't work - and Fleck shows no willingness to change, adjust or adapt.

that's the real issue - a coach who either can't or won't change when things don't go the way he would prefer. Sure, more talent would help. but even with more talent, you have the same coach with the same inflexible philosophy.

 

[Dakota2]

I'm not sure this has been brought up, but gutless PJ proof can be found right before half. Fleck had TOs and didn't use them with OSU having a 4th and 12 from their own 19. Use the TOs and force them to punt! Possible outcomes:
1. Block punt for TD--GOOD
2. Block punt for safety--GOOD
3. Return punt for TD--GOOD
4. Muff punt (can be recovered but not returned)--end of half--ZERO RISK Neutral
5. Unreturnable--Neutral
6. Return and fumble--end of half ; ZERO RISK Neutral
7. Return and fumble recovery goes for TD--BAD
8. Rough punter--automatic first down; 1 more untimed play 64 yards from end zone--BAD but high probability of Neutral.

Plenty of upside (albeit rare); very limited downside...even more rare! To beat the #2 team in the country, you need a bounce or two. Fleck is too scared to even try to use a TO to get a bounce and thinks worst case scenario. LOSER MENTALITY!

He seems to have lost any ability to weigh risk and reward. He sees only risk. If he runs your list through his head, he sees only No. 7.

 

[MNVCGUY]

that's the real issue - a coach who either can't or won't change when things don't go the way he would prefer. Sure, more talent would help. but even with more talent, you have the same coach with the same inflexible philosophy.

I think we need to see what happens this off season before assuming he can't/won't change. He was coming off back to back 9 win seasons in 21 and 22, so it is understandable that he would have felt they were doing things right given the success the team was having.

He won't be able to lean on that after this season. Whether or not Fleck changes at all remains to be seen but there is only so much you can do during the course of a college season where you are stuck with the roster you have and you can't go out and add players like you can in the NFL.