Focusing in on Kill's B1G recruiting style

[GoAUpher]

Even by your standards this is some fine rambling with plenty of statements of fact that lack the fact part. Throw in some grand false dichotomies, a heap of impatience and freak out, add a pinch of delusion of grandeur (comparing us to Michigan? Really?) and serve with a side of hot air. Bon apatite.

Coach Kill always intended to recruit highly ranked players as is evidenced by the offer sheet we already know about.

Agree, and this is an obvious detail that some are missing.

We are losing out for one reason and one reason alone -- salesmanship.

First off, how is this waiting to do a post mortum after the season? You're doing it right now and unless you have some interview info that no one else has you're doing it with pure conjecture. You also ignore a host of other factors that come into play. Like, previous relationships with the player. Many of the guys Kill is recruiting are guys he never interacted with before. And he's going against teams that have been showing interest for a lot longer/interacting for a lot longer. Could that be playing a factor? Or is the ONLY possible explanation "salesmanship"?

They did not have to sell at SIU because they could develop the players into something that would win at that level.

This seems like a good point, but it isn't clear that it's relevant to his current situation.

We will NEVER enter the top tier without top talent. 4 years is an insufficient time frame to develop top talent for a run at a championship -- any championship that Minnesota competes for.

This is clearly false, even within the B1G (1990's Northwestern would like to talk to you). Having the top level talent makes it much more likely, but it is not a required element. You don't have to have OSU's roster to win the B1G.

If you take lower level talent and really get it to a championship caliber in 4 years you have two disastrous realities to overcome.

Are you kidding me? Did you just posit that it is impossible to win without top talent and then go on to say "if you take lower level talent and really get it to a championship caliber in 4 years you have two disastrous realities to overcome." Wha??? You just said it couldn't be done! Why are you talking about it then?

One, half of the team will always be in development at any given year.

Assuming this is true (where you get the 50% number I have no idea) could you be bothered to explain why this is a bad thing? In the scenario you note this development style would have just gottent the team to a B1G title game.

Two, academic training will get sacrificed for the time sacrifice of athletics. It is very difficult to be a champion at two things simultaneously without major sacrifices. These are undeniable truths.

Then you go on to claim that academic training will get sacrificed. Do you have anything, anything at all to back this up? And how would this not be true of a team with top tier athletes? Last time I checked many schools with star football players had problems with their team academics.

Kill is losing the war for 4 star athletes now and other schools are already loading up on them. Relationship selling is great if you have 10 years to do it and build a rapport with hundreds of high schools. But, we don't have the recruiting time or manpower to sustain those.

What does time or manpower have to do with this? We have the same amount of recruiting time as every other team and have the same amount of manpower (at least when it comes to assistant coaches who do the bulk of the recruitment).

25 years in the business suggests to me major turnover of staffing at high schools and new relationships to build and by God every college coach of the DI level has established similar relationships, and sometimes with the same coaches as Jerry Kill. These relationships are only good for information and not closing the sale. The only benefit of relationship management is information, which will most likely get shared with any interested coach, and not just those with the best relationships. A good coaching relationship is good to have but not a necessary component of good recruiting.

So this is why all schools do a great job of recruiting in all 50 states right? I mean, if any coach can walk into a state/region and all they need is information wouldn't this be true? Or could it be that a familiarity with a region is a help in recruiting there? And wouldn't have a relationship with coaches/leaders in an area mean you are a known quantity and thus not a complete enigma to the new HS coaches when they come in?

The other approach, cold calling, is in general the opening of relationship management and that can land you just as many prospects and signees as not having an existing relationship. In that light, any 4 or 5 star athlete should almost automatically get targeted and the battle joined for their heart and soul. Jerry Kill and staff need to overcome objections by targeted athletes like any solid salesman knows how to do. This takes substantial preparation and must be executed flawlessly by the recruiter. Right now, there is zero evidence that there is this preparation to recruit because we are landing a disproportionately minor share of these athletes. Offers have been made and no movement has occurred.

Right now there is zero evidence that salesmanship is the reason they haven't signed these guys. But feel free to state it like its a fact.

I would be happier to learn that the coaching staff went to a short course at the Wharton School for sales development than another round of chit chatting it up with Patterson or Peterson.

First, great false dichotomy. Second, if Kill going to Wharton would make you happier then you are an idiot.

We are losing recruits because Jerry's natural style does not work with 75% of athletes. It fits the 1/4 that share his style. Jerry needs to understand who that student is within 30 seconds of the first conversation or the battle is lost.

This is a great made up number. I think you are 97% full of BS. See, I can do it too! Also, we're back to you making factual claims with nothing to back them up. Your opinion is that he can't relate.

From what I have heard of Jerry Kill, he is unwilling to actually change his style to meet his audience. By speaking the same message to every single audience the same message with the same lines, suggests a lack of ground work and preparation. Red Wing has a different culture than does Owatonna than does Minneapolis.

Ok, now you are just getting asinine. First, consistent message is a good thing. Changing the message doesn't suggests you don't believe in it and are telling people what they want to hear. It's possible you're trying to say that he should be tailoring his message to his audience (i.e. delivering the same message in different ways)/ If so, I'd agree...to a point. Tailoring a message to RW, Owatonna, Faribault, DL, Duluth, Minneapolis, etc is taking it a bit far. If you think coaches across the country are tailoring their "rah rah" speeches community by community on a regular basis then I think you need your head examined.

Kill needs an assistant who understands selling and marketing and the psychology of good selling. His guy from NIU may be a great guy, but he has targeted the same pony with the same problems as at NIU.

Do you have proof that he doesn't? Can you show examples of a successful school that has exactly what you are talking about? Or are you just painting opinion as fact for the 100th time?

We are a different U with greater selling points than NIU and the message isn't generating any more interest than the "great recruiter" who didn't out recruit anybody.

What the hell did any of this mean? Word salads are tasty.

We can already see that many recruits enjoyed talking with him, but never connected to committing to the U.

Because you get such a large sample size in just a few months. Also, I'm glad to know national signing day was yesterday and we missed out on all of our targets for this year already.

Successful sales people get most of their sales on the first visit and not later visits, unless the client is risk averse and needs greater time to make up their mind. The first thing to identify in the first 30 seconds is the student athlete the decision maker. What style of decision making does he prefer? Am I mirroring his style? What is his real need in this decision? There are statements and questions that can get this information quickly and easily.

Some of what you put here is very true of sales (I recall several of these points from my own time in sales). So good for you on telling the world about selling stuff. Now can you show me the coaches who are getting recruits to verbal after their first visit with them the majority of the time? Because I seem to recall most high level players taking time to weigh their options.

The current benchmark is this years Michigan team recruiting. 3 and 4 stars across the board and a superior number to ours.

When did we become the equal with Michigan? Do we have some B1G titles in the last 40 years that have been hidden from me?

4 years from now, Michigan will have a stronger team than Minnesota.

Probably and likely based on history. Impossible to tell based on a nowhere near complete recruiting class.

The indicators of our failure are there right now.

Possible reasons for concern are out there right now. Failure requires actually failing. Which we haven't done yet.

February we might look better, but then so will all the other also rans in the B1G.

More word salad. Can you please pass the dressing?

 

[highwayman]

Holy carp! All this oneoldgopher in one place puts things into perspective: He's nuts. Thanks for the indepth analysis on something that has no depth--like smoke, or intestinal gas.

 

[GoAUpher]

Holy carp! All this oneoldgopher in one place puts things into perspective: He's nuts. Thanks for the indepth analysis on something that has no depth--like smoke, or intestinal gas.

Sometimes you come across something so stupid that you have no choice but to go line by line and point out just how ridiculous it is. My favorite parts to rebut were the "can't win without talent no matter what/if you win without talent you're still screwed" and "Minnesota and Michigan are exactly the same other than the coaches" portions of his argument.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

Oneoldgopher wrote: "I would be happier to learn that the coaching staff went to a short course at the Wharton School for sales development than another round of chit chatting it up with Patterson or Peterson."

Really?

Could it be that Coach Kill is following the Patterson/Peterson model? Me thinks so. And that isn't necessarily a bad thing.

According to Rivals during the period of 06-10 TCU averaged 2.59 stars and Boise State 2.30. Yet they both had very high winning percentages and excellent against highly rated BCS schools. During that time BSU never has recruited a 4 star and TCU is just starting to add a few. Compare that to the UM average of 2.70 and twelve 4 stars. And also to the annual high rankings of lets say, Notre Dame.

The reality is that Coach Kill can win without a glut of 4 stars just like his buddies.

Winning is mostly about getting enough of the best players you can to fit into your system, develop them, stick with the system and coach them. Coach Kill has been pretty darn good at that.

 

[gophmeister]

Let me translate for oneoldgopher. I don't like Jerry Kill and I think he will fail.

 

[nsmike]

I have no problem with the way Coach Kill is recruiting so far he has 8 commitments for 17 tenders available. We are on the consideration list of many better players who will not make decisions until later. I think that virtually all of the commits will end up as 3 star players, by the time all the evaluations are done, considering that we are coming off a 3-8 season I'll take it. I expect that we will pick up a couple of other commits before the season with the some of the better recruits waiting to see the product on the field.

 

[Flatfoot]

We can already see that many recruits enjoyed talking with him, but never connected to committing to the U. Successful sales people get most of their sales on the first visit and not later visits, unless the client is risk averse and needs greater time to make up their mind. The first thing to identify in the first 30 seconds is the student athlete the decision maker. What style of decision making does he prefer? Am I mirroring his style? What is his real need in this decision? There are statements and questions that can get this information quickly and easily.

There must be quite a few risk averse guys out there then or a lot of crap sales guys?! I am surprised there are any 3, 4 or even 5 star players left to recruit at all.

If my son was this good, I would tell him to wait and see what Kill and his staff do during the first year in the B1G. It could be that Kill and his staff have sold a number of kids, but they are waiting to see if what they were sold is the same product they will get or see on the field.

We don't know what kind of success Kill will have here, but why not let him coach a few games to get a preview before we string him up?

 

[Killjoy]

Thanks!

Kill's already said he hopes to recruit like Patterson at TCU.
Check out the progression of TCU's recruiting classes from 06(RSSr's last year, Srs 2 years ago)to now
06
8 3 stars 2 5.7s highest rank
8 2 stars
2 JUCOs
Best competing offer Kansas, KSU, ISU, alot of UTEP/TCU only(UTEP vs Western Michigan)

07
1 4 star
11 3 stars 1 5.7, 1 5.6
11 2 stars

08
8 3 stars all 5.6 or lower
10 2 stars

09
4 4 stars
12 3 stars
3 2 stars
1 unranked

10
2 4 stars
16 3 stars

11(After BCS game)
2 4 stars
23 3 stars

12(after Rose Bowl W) so far
4 4 stars
7 3 stars
3 unranked so far
Outrecruiting Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Oklahoma St for kids in Texas

Patterson won with under recruited types including a Rose Bowl W against wisky.
Alot of speed/developmental types/position switching, he fit them into his systems.
BUT he built on Fanchione's program and started a winning reputation, if Kill can win, the recruits will come.

It's always nice to read comments that are more than just somebody’s opinion and is based on solid information and analysis. Hopefully this will calm the people who are saying that the sky is falling but I doubt it. But anyway, well done Ole.

 

[Killjoy]

GoAUpher

Thanks for a very interesting post refuting OldGoph’s comments. When I first saw it I thought this guy is trying to outdo wren in the length of his post. Therefore I almost skipped it but thankfully I didn't.

 

[4four4]

Successful sales people get most of their sales on the first visit and not later visits, unless the client is risk averse and needs greater time to make up their mind. The first thing to identify in the first 30 seconds is the student athlete the decision maker. What style of decision making does he prefer? Am I mirroring his style? What is his real need in this decision? There are statements and questions that can get this information quickly and easily.

Have you ever sold before? You are living on fantasy island if you believe the most successful sales people get their sales on the first visit. On average it takes at least 5 visits before the sale and sometimes 10. The best sales people are the people who will not give up. Bank on it.

 

[Unregistered User]

GH Pull the plug on my [sic] now!!!

Please mods, acquiesce to his previous request.

 

[NewEngland_Gold]

No question salesmanship is a key factor in the recruiting business...

I am going to do a post mortem after this season as to why we failed to deliver a top 50 recruiting class.

....

We can already see that many recruits enjoyed talking with him, but never connected to committing to the U. Successful sales people get most of their sales on the first visit and not later visits, unless the client is risk averse and needs greater time to make up their mind. The first thing to identify in the first 30 seconds is the student athlete the decision maker. What style of decision making does he prefer? Am I mirroring his style? What is his real need in this decision?

but selling a scholarship from a B1G university to 17 yo 4-5 star D1-level athletes (there is a very limited supply of these individuals) is an extremely specialized area of sales much different than an everyday call on selling a life insurance product, financial service idea, major applicance or new car etc.

From my experience in sales, I would place the process of high-level 4-5 star recruiting sales in the same area of difficulty as trying to sell a high-end luxury home to a very wealthy client. Unless the home meets all of their many requirements, the agent will spend a great deal of time trying to find the right prospect and then a considerable amount of time trying to close the deal.

For Kill, finding the right upper-tier propects and offering them based on his program's needs doesn't seem to be any problem with his deep contact list, staff expertise and input from the recruiting services.

Kill's challenge re closing in the 4-5 star arena seems to be overcoming resistance to what he is selling apparently because of several factors: some distance from home for the "speed" prospects; his strong emphasis upon character/academic issues; intense competition for these elite athletes from institutions with more successful programs, and the unknowns of rebuilding a program with plently of historical tradition, but a staff new to the institution.

On the plus side, Kill does have a great deal more to sell a recruit than he has ever had in his long MAC-plus career and presented effectively, a very attractive total package encouraging the recruit to take a hard and serious look: participation in an elite football plus conference; education at one of the premier public research universities in the country; location in a dynamic/growing metro area home to many Fortune 500 companies; a tradition-rich program now with top-tier facilties ready to launch into a new era; a new coaching staff with a history of woking together for many years and producing consistent winning results, and very importantly, a national TV platform via the Big Ten Network, ESPN and ABC for essentially the entire fb schedule.

Also, Kill seems to have the full support of the administration and AD in getting this message out through road trips, recruiting trips and clinics, new media (webisodes etc) and facilities upgrades where needed.

Perhaps the greatest salesman of sizzle to walk Gopher sidelines was Lou Holtz. After a short recruiting phase, he was able to field a team capable of nearly upsetting #2 Oklahoma. Quite remarkable in retrospect. When he left for ND, the instituition provided the winning tradition he needed in his sales package and he went on to considerable success.

Overall, Kill seems to have more to sell recruits than perhaps any Minnesota head coach in the past forty years or so. When one weighs all the factors, maybe in the history of the program.

For the elite 4-5 athletes, some will connect and seriously consider his recruiting message. For those that want the helmet schools, Kill has a difficult selling job, but that doesn't mean he should give up trying to sell that sector because he does have a very attractive scholarship package for the right student athlete who wants to be at Minnesota.

As other have pointed out, until Kill actually starts generating consistent wins, his current strategy of woking hard to identify talent early in the process and securing early commitments from athletes generally overlooked by his competition (and developing them aggressively) may be the most effective approach at this early stage of his Gopher tenure.

Given Kill's driven work ethic, I expect that he will keep selling his program aggressively to student athletes that fit his program's need profile and I applaud him for that continuous effort.

 

[Geezo Beezo]

This is the Jerry Kill recruiting approach in a nutshell:

Trust your own evaluations
Don’t make promises you cannot keep
Don't pump sunshine up a recruits arse
Let everything from facilities, academics, staff record at past stops, etc. sell themselves

It is supposed to get commitments from guys who want to help build the program from the ground up and will take many years to implement, just like BA, KF, etc. The staff has had similar success at prior stops and I do not see them changing their style one bit. I do not have a problem with any of this.

What is difficult to swallow is that it seems like we are constantly being out-recruited as time goes by. You read about a recruit that is liking what he hears from Minnesota and will put them in his early top 5, top 3, top 2 or even the early favorite. But as time goes by you get the sense that the shine comes off the Minnesota apple and we fall down the list. I know that is going to be a product of Kill’s recruiting approach but it is disheartening nonetheless.

Many of Kill’s current commits lack AQ offers and high rating from recruiting services. This is not to say that these are terrible recruits as Kill knows what he wants and has been around long enough to recognize it when he sees it. But great players want to play with other great players, which is why year after year the same schools sit atop the recruit ranking charts. When we bring in players that lack offers and rankings, it gives the surface appearance that we are not bringing in quality players and we will continue to be “Minnesota” under Jerry Kill in the eyes of recruits. This can change with continuous on-field success. That kind of patience is hard to come by, especially when you have nothing but blind faith to base this on.

 

[4four4]

The top recruits most likely will wait until after Minnesota starts the season before they make any decisions. It is early in the recruiting process so lets start the season already.

 

[Mustang Mountain Man]

Mr Fixit

Coach Kill was born with a wrench in his hand. I am sure he can fix the team. This guys recruiting is down right ugly. He has the least stars. He gets by with 93 offers and 8 accepting.
As for recruiting efficiency lets break it down.

NWU 23%
OSU 20%
UM 16%
PSU 16%
WI 16%
IN 9%
UofM 9%
MSU 8%
IA 6%
UN 6%
IL 3%
PUR 1%

As for potential return on the recruiting investment, lets look at the stars.

Michigan
Ohio State
Nebraska
Penn St
Michigan State
Illinois
Purdue
Wisc
Iowa
NWU
Indiana
Minnesota

Minnesota ranks dead last in horsepower. Halfway through the recruiting cycle and Minnie takes last. What will this guy do to hasten development!

 

[ShushPush]

Thanks Brother MMM

Minnesota currently ranks 73rd in the recruiting war. Apparently, Kill is setting us up to be about a .500 team in 4 years. Doubtful he can catch a break here since most of the qualified 3 stars are already snatched up. Guess the character thing is a bunch of BS. Besides, who appointed Kill the judge of good character anyway! What makes him particularly qualified to what a man is supposed to be like now and in the future! This guy likes to fix football players. He doesn't have a program to allow good football players to be themselves. His all out effort to get the chance guys is admirable if you are bucking for sainthood. TCF stadium is not the place to showcase that talent.

Gopher Nation is so suckered into believing that beaters are the next most desirable outcome to real football players and talent. Why wait for January to post the result. I'll let you know now. I project the Goph's will have a top 90 team in 4 years. Woo hoo.

Good bye and good riddance.

 

[matt]

Minnesota currently ranks 73rd in the recruiting war. Apparently, Kill is setting us up to be about a .500 team in 4 years. Doubtful he can catch a break here since most of the qualified 3 stars are already snatched up. Guess the character thing is a bunch of BS. Besides, who appointed Kill the judge of good character anyway! What makes him particularly qualified to what a man is supposed to be like now and in the future! This guy likes to fix football players. He doesn't have a program to allow good football players to be themselves. His all out effort to get the chance guys is admirable if you are bucking for sainthood. TCF stadium is not the place to showcase that talent.

Gopher Nation is so suckered into believing that beaters are the next most desirable outcome to real football players and talent. Why wait for January to post the result. I'll let you know now. I project the Goph's will have a top 90 team in 4 years. Woo hoo.

Good bye and good riddance.

Ok then, who should the Gophers have hired that would have filled this class up with only 3 and 4 star recruits? Maybe you forgot that this team had the 2nd worst BT record, the worst overall record in the BT, and was one of the worst BCS teams last year.

 

[dpodoll68]

Man, I really wish that people who clearly have no idea what they're talking about when it comes to recruiting would go ahead and stop making posts about recruiting.

 

[NewEngland_Gold]

Re "Recruiting Efficiency"

Coach Kill was born with a wrench in his hand. I am sure he can fix the team. This guys recruiting is down right ugly. He has the least stars. He gets by with 93 offers and 8 accepting.
As for recruiting efficiency lets break it down.

NWU 23%
OSU 20%
UM 16%
PSU 16%
WI 16%
IN 9%
UofM 9%
MSU 8%
IA 6%
UN 6%
IL 3%
PUR 1%

As for potential return on the recruiting investment, lets look at the stars.

Michigan
Ohio State
Nebraska
Penn St
Michigan State
Illinois
Purdue
Wisc
Iowa
NWU
Indiana
Minnesota
pp
Minnesota ranks dead last in horsepower. Halfway through the recruiting cycle and Minnie takes last. What will this guy do to hasten development!

Thanks for the current stats...more food for thought, discussion and debate.

Here in June, interesting that Kill is converting his 2012 offers to verbals at a rate tied for 4th place in the B1G according to these efficiency numbers. Not bad, all things considered. Assuming that Kill's trying hard to fill his program's needs/system with athletes he's confident in based on 25 plus years in the business, I assume he and his staff are very confident that they are attracting B1G-quality players they believe will contribute to in a winning program. Why else would they offer them a very valuable 4-year scholarship at a nationally-recognized B1G university?

If Kill's conversion efficiency was near or dead last, that would be quite concerning because it would mean he was not attracting the type of athlete he truly believes he needs to build a successful, winning program within his system. Based on his wins over B1G opponents while at NIU, Kill obviously knows what type of athlete he has to offer/attract and sign in order to build a team that is competitive in the Big Ten. This in not his first rodeo.

But why last in stars?

Kill has said for the record many times that he and his staff do their own evaluations and don't rely on the recruiting services to identify/offer talent to fit their TCU/Boise-like approach to team-building which stresses being physical and playing fast.

Since Kill does offer "stars", he obviously wants some of them that meet his criteria, but he's not relying on the star system to rebuild the program. Neither did IA or WI in rebuilding to upper-tier B1G competitiveness and national prominance.

Yes, stars do matter a great deal in some programs, but for Kill at this state of his regime, his own evalutions based on years of experience seem to carry the most weight in this phase of his rebuilding process.

My take on these early 2012 recruiting stats is that Kill's getting the athletes he wants to fit his "fast" system at a clip that's reasonably competitive (in terms of efficiency) with B1G opponents, he knows based on years of experience what these type of athletes can produce on the field with proper development, and importantly, these kids really like the coaching staff, academic opportunities/post-graduate opportunities at Minnesota and want to be part of rebuilding a winning Gopher/B1G football tradition.

 

[RodentRampage]

Player ratings are neither worthless nor are they absolute. Coaches still have to evaluate talent for themselves. If he's getting players that are good fits for the system that he runs, that's what's important. Teams that win 3 games don't tend to land the big recruits, no matter what the sales pitch. Win, and the recruiting will improve.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

Maybe Oneoldgopher can explain how programs such as TCU (2.59), Boise State (2.30) and Navy (1.46) can even compete with their putrid star rankings the past five years. And compare that to the likes of Michigan (3.50) and Notre Dame (3.59).

Strange how this works. Based on his assumptions, Navy should have no business beating a star studded Notre Dame team 3 of the past 5 games. This should not happen in Oneoldgophers world. Plus how can Boise State beat Oklahoma and Oregon teams ladden with 4 and 5 star players and compete very well against highly ranked BCS programs such as Virginia Tech?

CFB is not cut and dried and there is not set formula for success. Coach Kill has demonstrated an ability to produce winning programs at each of his stops. Maybe, just maybe his system, molded in the likes of a TCU and Boise State, could work here as well.

As any informed person that follows CFB knows, recruiting is not an exact science and the star system lacks substance and is not a realiable basis for predicting success.

 

[kingvega]

Kill is out there trying to sell an Acer with a broken keyboard. Hoke is selling a MacBook Pro that had a couple bad startups

 

[oleboy41]

Coach Kill was born with a wrench in his hand. I am sure he can fix the team. This guys recruiting is down right ugly. He has the least stars. He gets by with 93 offers and 8 accepting.
As for recruiting efficiency lets break it down.

NWU 23%
OSU 20%
UM 16%
PSU 16%
WI 16%
IN 9%
UofM 9%
MSU 8%
IA 6%
UN 6%
IL 3%
PUR 1%

As for potential return on the recruiting investment, lets look at the stars.

Michigan
Ohio State
Nebraska
Penn St
Michigan State
Illinois
Purdue
Wisc
Iowa
NWU
Indiana
Minnesota

Minnesota ranks dead last in horsepower. Halfway through the recruiting cycle and Minnie takes last. What will this guy do to hasten development!

Those numbers aren't accurate at all. The services only report offers they know about and its up to the writers of those sites to update offer lists. There are kids with 10+offers that only show 5 or 6 on Rivals. There are dozens of other kids we've offered that haven't been reported because no writer has contacted them. I don't know if it would mean anything even if they were accurate especially for a team like us. The helmet schools offer fewer players because they can afford to. The rest of us will toss out tons of them and so who's biting.


As far as Kill's recruiting style, its going to be a slow burn. I won't pretend that I'm excited about our recruits because I'm not. Some appear to have some talent but when we're getting commits from kids from talent heavy states that still don't have many or any BCS conference offers, I'm not going to delude myself into thinking that Kill and staff are simply smarter or better evaluators than everyone. I do know that there are a lot of kids that can play and succeed at this level if they are properly coached and develop well. The trouble is that the margain for error is much smaller the less talented a kid is. A kid that comes out of HS at 6'3" 225 and runs a 4.65 certainly has a better shot at turning into a player than the 6'1" 210 kid that runs a 4.7. It appears to me that Kill would rather not get into recruiting battles at this point and I don't know how I feel about that. We're offering and taking the kids we're not having to fight for and that means getting kids of lesser talent at the moment. I really hope he knows what he's doing and doesn't put too much faith into his own evaluation and coaching abilities. Yes TCU and others have won with fewer 'stars' but they also don't play a B10 schedule. Its one thing to go up against the big boys once or twice a year and another thing to have to bang with B10 lines week to week. Will we have the size and depth to compete for 12 weeks? Will we have the talent to overcome a few injuries? Will we be able to consistently stop people once teams get used to this staff's tendencies? I don't know.

 

[imthewalrus]

I will base my opinion on Prexy K based upon his ability to...

stabalize the finances of the University of Minnesoat AND based upon what he does with the athletic director position. The lame duck prexy b. is gone! We have a new Prexy coming in. The old ad will be GONE, eventually. We HAVE our new Football Coach. It is a new era.

I have seen enough of Coach Kill's philosophy to understand that he IS a Coach. He has an incredibly difficult job to do here at the University of Minnesota. It is more difficult than many here even begin to realize. The odds are really very bad that Coach Kill will bring a Conference Championship to the University of Minnesota. He is NOT a magician. He is NOT a miracle worker. He is taking on a program that has been in the bottom 1/4 of the Big Ten for decades and decades.

Glen Mason managed to make some noise here despite incompetents such as prexy b, badger joel macturi and that brewster character. I was ANGRY about what happened and I meant it. I told the mobbers and the bashers to go to hell and I meant it. No apologies are in order...from anyone involved on these message boards...but, I have always stood my ground and stood up for what I believe to be true. Right or wrong or anywhere in between, I say what I think. ; 0 ) The last 4 years was a disaster in spite of opening our beautiful new stadium. The administration and an incompetent coach totally minimized the positive impact of the new stadium.

But here is the deal: Coach Kill IS a real no nonsesne coach...a REAL coach. He has a staff that has been with him for a LONG time. They know what they want to do and have experience and know what does work and what does not work for them and their style.

I'm an old guy...64 years old. I think that THIS rebuilding job in the Football Program is the LAST rebuilding job that I have left in me as a fan. Coach Kill is just going to have to be the one to start improving this program...making it competetive...and hopefully to start making some noise in the Big Ten Conference.

I realize that what I think, say and do has NO impact on what will happen. But, as I stated: I am an old guy who probably doesn't have either the stomach for or the constitution for another rebuilding job after this one. We HAVE the stadium. We HAVE a real Coach. He has his staff. The time to start this slow rebuilding process is NOW. For me: I have the feeling it is THIS TIME or never. (If you are young, the odds are you could probably try to "fire your way" to success way off into the future. But, I got started in this Gopher Fan business too early for that. For me: this is IT!

So, Coach Kill and Staff: give 'em hell and NEVER let the ba$tards get you down. You KNOW how to build a program. You are going to HAVE to do it by recruiting good, solid football players who will grow into solid citizens and who want to be students, want to work hard, want to listen to you and your staff and will bring much HEART and MENTAL TOUGHNESS along with them when they report to this program. You can Coach them with the rest of the skills and basics that they will need to succeed.

In my own little way, I've got your back, Coach Kill! IF mobbers and bashers start making their ugly presence felt around here, I'm going to ask them point blank what the heck they think they are doing? I need you to make this program competetive in Big Ten Play, Coach Kill. So do any potential mobbers and bashers...but...they MAY not know it yet. ; 0 ) You are the coach I've got representing my hopes for this program. You are the one who will help this University of Minnesota Football Program to compete with all the rest of the Big Ten Football Programs. You are the one who will help these student athletes to represent their Universtiy with pride all across the Big Ten Conference...to enter all Big Ten stadiums with their heads held high...KNOWING that they are going to leave it all on the field...win or lose and KNOWING that they will NOT be outworked.

You will not be able to recruit as many fantasy star ranked high school recruits to Minnesota as they do some other places in the Big Ten. But you CAN and WILL coach these kids and will give them the chance to compete. That is going to give you and your team a chance to really compete! That is ALL I will EVER ask. I will not EXPECT anything, but will be thankful and greatly appreciate EVERY Big Ten WIN that you and your team are able to achieve.

So, Coach...Good luck and best wishes. I look forward to the season. The honest, quiet, time-tested approach you have to building a football program gives me faith, hope and belief that we will have progress. This revitilizes this old guy's outlook about Golden Gopher Football. I may have a decade or two or more left in me...or maybe a lot less than that. But, I LIKE your style Coach Kill! And, in my own way, I am one old loyal Gopher Fan. You and your team are going to do JUST fine in TCF BANK STADIUM and in Big Ten Stadiums across the Conference! Just keep being you Coach Kill. I know you will!

I am too old and have watched Big Ten Football for too long to think this is going to be anything but the most difficult football program to turn around that you could possibly experience. We haven't been too much here for entirley too long. I DID cheer for the Gophers when they won a National Championship...I did watch Bobby Bell play. Good things...wonderful things ARE possible, but the odds are very long that it's going to be anything but a long, hard pull. That's ok. The process and the journey to improvement are the important things. Not just some final result...the fun is in the journey. It is building, improving and doing the RIGHT things that matter. Just give us your very best Coach Kill. I KNOW you will. And may you, your staff and your student athlete players and I NEVER let the ba$tards get us down. Battle on Gophers!. Work hard. And...give 'em hell! Go Gophers!

 

[RodentRampage]

There's no reason to think that it would require magic or a miracle to win a conference championship at Minnesota. The other teams have done it without requiring miracles. There's no particular disadvantage that Minnesota faces that makes a conference championship miraculous. Iowa and Wisconsin used to be in pretty much the same boat as Minnesota was. They turned it around, but it didn't require miracles, just hiring the right coach.

Two 5-win Big Ten seasons in 10 years isn't "making noise".

 

[imthewalrus]

There's no reason to think that it would require magic or a miracle to win a conference championship at Minnesota. The other teams have done it without requiring miracles. There's no particular disadvantage that Minnesota faces that makes a conference championship miraculous. Iowa and Wisconsin used to be in pretty much the same boat as Minnesota was. They turned it around, but it didn't require miracles, just hiring the right coach.

Two 5-win Big Ten seasons in 10 years isn't "making noise".

Believe what you want to believe, rodent. And, just remember this: two six win Big Ten seasons would have freaking been as noisy as hell and would have been an incredible miracle. I've been watching for over half a century rodent...and I'm telling you that it is going to be a real long shot if you think JUST hiring the right coach EVER gets the freaking thing done. In iowa's case ferentz replaced Hayden Fry who got a LOT of support from the administration at the university of iowa...just as ferentz gets a hell of a lot of support from the administration at the U of iowa. The same thing at wisky. Donna S. (Chancellor) and Pat Richter (AD) were the ones to hire AND support alvarez. alvarez did NOT do it all by himself. You are out to lunch if you think he did.

And IF you expect a coach to do it all...you are going to be waiting FOREVER.

Get real rodent...

; 0 )

 

[exiledinduluth]

Minnesota currently ranks 73rd in the recruiting war. Apparently, Kill is setting us up to be about a .500 team in 4 years. Doubtful he can catch a break here since most of the qualified 3 stars are already snatched up. Guess the character thing is a bunch of BS. Besides, who appointed Kill the judge of good character anyway! What makes him particularly qualified to what a man is supposed to be like now and in the future! This guy likes to fix football players. He doesn't have a program to allow good football players to be themselves. His all out effort to get the chance guys is admirable if you are bucking for sainthood. TCF stadium is not the place to showcase that talent.

Gopher Nation is so suckered into believing that beaters are the next most desirable outcome to real football players and talent. Why wait for January to post the result. I'll let you know now. I project the Goph's will have a top 90 team in 4 years. Woo hoo.

Good bye and good riddance.

Glad to say goodbye to you and be rid of you.

 

[GoAUpher]

I see Oneoldgopher has decided to continue his MO of throwing up crap, getting called on it, and then moving on to new crap without addressing being called out. Also, the sky is blue.

 

[Unregistered User]

This is as far as I could get:

Glen Mason managed to make some noise here despite incompetents such as prexy b, badger joel macturi and that brewster character.

Mase succeeded despite Brew? I've been trying to figure out that one since this was posted, and I just can't get my head around this one.

 

[imthewalrus]

The idiotic failed brewball experiment WAS the end...

of the Mason era. I blame prexy b and bjm...BUT...the 0-8 Big Ten record that happened at the end of the Mason era inflicted upon the program by brewball was immediate indication that brewster clown would be a TOTAL failure compared to the Mason era. So, you can NEVER mention Mason, prexy b, bjm OR brewster without the immediate result of having the the total failure of the program in 2007 to prove what total idiots prexy b and bjm were at the end of 2006. Ending the Mason era with the replacement by brewster was total and complete insanity demonstrated by prexy b and bjm. brewster was incompetent and the administration was derelect in their responsibilities for hiring brewster.

And there you have it user.

; 0 )