Do the Goph's have 8 wins without DeAndre Mathieu

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dpodoll68 said:
Interesting how "Dre's not a PG" when he was 3rd Team All-Big Ten as a PG and the starting PG on the first Minnesota team to win a Tournament game in 23 years.
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Is it possible he would have gotten any better as an upperclassman?
 


dpodoll68 said:
No, upperclassmen never get better. They're as good as they'll ever be the moment they step on campus.
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this would explain what happened under Tubby much better then....


I'm just kidding. it was just set up far too perfectly for me to resist. :cool02:
 

underground629 said:
You were expecting him to easily be the BT scoring leader?

It's absolutely laughable that you're claiming this is Malik's team in any way and pretending like he's ahead of Andre. That's true in a grand total of zero ways. The only games he started were when Andre was hurt. Andre has the longest leash of anyone on the team. He's a captain, he's leading the team in scoring and shots taken, and he's leading in minutes even though he played like 20 seconds in one game and has been hurt for other games. Malik has played 23 minutes the last two games, but yet it's still his team. Wow.
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B1G scoring leader? Sure, why not? He was averaging 21ppg down the stretch last year. It wasn't a fluke. I certainly expected him to progress and be better than last year.

Dissect all the stats you want, Malik is Pitino's boy. He's his leading scorer from last year, he asked him to transfer up to Minnesota with him, that's how much he likes him. He seemingly has a green light that never turns red. He can shoot us right out of games & never get benched for it. On a normal team, the leader would have a talk with a gunner like that who's hurting the team and tell him to knock it the hell off. It doesn't feel like we have that type of dynamic on this team though. If Tubby was still here (which I'm not advocating) I think this would unquestionably be "Dre's team". He's the star, end of discussion. Would that be better than the present dynamic? Not saying that at all. Just saying it doesn't feel like Dre's the star of this team or that it's unquestionably "Dre's team" anymore.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
B1G scoring leader? Sure, why not? He was averaging 21ppg down the stretch last year. It wasn't a fluke. I certainly expected him to progress and be better than last year. Dissect all the stats you want, Malik is Pitino's boy. He's his leading scorer from last year, he asked him to transfer up to Minnesota with him, that's how much he likes him. He seemingly has a green light that never turns red. He can shoot us right out of games & never get benched for it. On a normal team, the leader would have a talk with a gunner like that who's hurting the team and tell him to knock it the hell off. It doesn't feel like we have that type of dynamic on this team though. If Tubby was still here (which I'm not advocating) I think this would unquestionably be "Dre's team". He's the star, end of discussion. Would that be better than the present dynamic? Not saying that at all. Just saying it doesn't feel like Dre's the star of this team or that it's unquestionably "Dre's team" anymore.
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Your opinion of how Malik is treated is so far off-base, I can't even begin to understand how you came to believe it.
 


dpodoll68 said:
Interesting how "Dre's not a PG" when he was 3rd Team All-Big Ten as a PG and the starting PG on the first Minnesota team to win a Tournament game in 23 years.
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The All-Big Ten team doesn't recognize players as a PG or SG.
 

MadtownGopher said:
The All-Big Ten team doesn't recognize players as a PG or SG.
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What position did he play most of the time last year (I am assuming it was his performance at said position that earned him honors)?
 

mnsports1 said:
What position did he play most of the time last year (I am assuming it was his performance at said position that earned him honors)?
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It wasn't because of his point guard skills. It was because of his scoring and defense.
 




GopherJake said:
It wasn't because of his point guard skills. It was because of his scoring and defense.
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What position did he defend? Did he score while running the team as point guard?

I like him off the ball this year, and it is possible to enjoy the change without discrediting what he accomplished last year as PG.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
The future is bright. The team is fun to watch. Dre Mathieu is fun to watch. Exciting times. As to the question posed of how bad we would be this year without Mathieu? I don't think we would be significantly worse in terms of W's & L's if Tubby was still here using his system. I expect Pitino to step it up next year and the year after as he brings in his guys, but right now this is about what I expected from Tubby's squad in terms of W' & L's.
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I think we will take a step forward next year, a step back in year three and than a couple steps forward in years four and five. We will be awfully young in year three. Look at Indiana, most of there freshman and sophomores are blue chippers and there in the seller. It's tough to win in the big ten with youth and the only Tubby recruit that could still be here in 2015-16 is Buggs
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
B1G scoring leader? Sure, why not? He was averaging 21ppg down the stretch last year. It wasn't a fluke. I certainly expected him to progress and be better than last year.

Dissect all the stats you want, Malik is Pitino's boy. He's his leading scorer from last year, he asked him to transfer up to Minnesota with him, that's how much he likes him. He seemingly has a green light that never turns red. He can shoot us right out of games & never get benched for it. On a normal team, the leader would have a talk with a gunner like that who's hurting the team and tell him to knock it the hell off. It doesn't feel like we have that type of dynamic on this team though. If Tubby was still here (which I'm not advocating) I think this would unquestionably be "Dre's team". He's the star, end of discussion. Would that be better than the present dynamic? Not saying that at all. Just saying it doesn't feel like Dre's the star of this team or that it's unquestionably "Dre's team" anymore.
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Lol why did Malik "the team leader" Smith only play seven minutes last game and get one point? This is rich
 

mnsports1 said:
What position did he defend? Did he score while running the team as point guard?

I like him off the ball this year, and it is possible to enjoy the change without discrediting what he accomplished last year as PG.
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It's funny how these guys all crucify Tubby and decry how he's "old" and "tired" and "out of touch" and yet they're rehashing old (OLD) stereotypes about how PGs have to be pass-first and must have great handles. In other words, because Hollins isn't the best passer and ball-handler, he can't play PG. And yet, playing the majority of his time as a PG last year (as a sophomore, nonetheless), he was deemed to be worthy of a 3rd team All-Big Ten selection.
 



dpodoll68 said:
It's funny how these guys all crucify Tubby and decry how he's "old" and "tired" and "out of touch" and yet they're rehashing old (OLD) stereotypes about how PGs have to be pass-first and must have great handles. In other words, because Hollins isn't the best passer and ball-handler, he can't play PG. And yet, playing the majority of his time as a PG last year (as a sophomore, nonetheless), he was deemed to be worthy of a 3rd team All-Big Ten selection.
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I don't think anyone is saying he can't play PG. The general consensus is he's better off the ball but can certainly provide minutes at PG as well. The main reason he made 3rd team all big ten is his scoring, he easily could've made it playing more SG. Last year's team would've been better with Mathieu at PG, Dre off the ball and Joe Coleman playing less. Having a guy who can break down his defender and finish in the lane or create for others is huge. That isn't Dre H.'s game and we were lacking in that ability last year. It's the main reason our offense broke down so often last year and our TO % was so poor.
 

dpodoll68 said:
It's funny how these guys all crucify Tubby and decry how he's "old" and "tired" and "out of touch" and yet they're rehashing old (OLD) stereotypes about how PGs have to be pass-first and must have great handles. In other words, because Hollins isn't the best passer and ball-handler, he can't play PG. And yet, playing the majority of his time as a PG last year (as a sophomore, nonetheless), he was deemed to be worthy of a 3rd team All-Big Ten selection.
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He CAN play PG. He IS NOT our best PG. That is Mathieu. He was an All-Big Ten player because of his scoring.
 


dpodoll68 said:
Thank you for admitting that you were wrong in your earlier post.



Where did anyone say that he is?



...while playing PG.
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When did I say he can't play PG? He is our back up PG. He is a better SG however. Unless you think Pitino is an idiot. Even Tubby would have started Mathieu at the 1 and Dre at the 2.
 

MadtownGopher said:
When did I say he can't play PG?
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When you said "he is not a PG". Newsflash - players can "be" more than one position.

MadtownGopher said:
He is our back up PG. He is a better SG however. Unless you think Pitino is an idiot. Even Tubby would have started Mathieu at the 1 and Dre at the 2.
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No one has said any of these things. Are you arguing with yourself?
 


It sounds like what is missing in order for you to call this Dre's team is that Dre simply needs to play better. He gets to shoot as much as he wants. I really just don't understand your logic though, especially as it relates to Malik.

Costa Rican Gopher said:
B1G scoring leader? Sure, why not? He was averaging 21ppg down the stretch last year. It wasn't a fluke. I certainly expected him to progress and be better than last year.

Dissect all the stats you want, Malik is Pitino's boy. He's his leading scorer from last year, he asked him to transfer up to Minnesota with him, that's how much he likes him. He seemingly has a green light that never turns red. He can shoot us right out of games & never get benched for it. On a normal team, the leader would have a talk with a gunner like that who's hurting the team and tell him to knock it the hell off. It doesn't feel like we have that type of dynamic on this team though. If Tubby was still here (which I'm not advocating) I think this would unquestionably be "Dre's team". He's the star, end of discussion. Would that be better than the present dynamic? Not saying that at all. Just saying it doesn't feel like Dre's the star of this team or that it's unquestionably "Dre's team" anymore.
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