CONGRATS ALABAMA ON YOUR 8 CUTS!

[GopherinPhilly]

It is exactly this kind of crap that emboldens guys like Kane Colter to think they have a leg to stand on in court against the schools and NCAA. If it isn't a business and kids aren't compensated then how can they be fired? Yet, these kids didn't do anything wrong and have worked their butts off but just aren't good enough. If they wanted to quit and transfer they lose a year and when they get kicked off the team they will lose a year but somehow this is OK and the kids should have no rights and way of controlling their own destiny or at least be compensated for what they lose when they are forced to find a new program.

Where is the student in this scenario? Sounds like athletes paid in scholarship, room & board getting fired for underperforming. If you are compensated and can get fired you should have rights. End of rant.

 

[stocker08]

Does each school have their own scholarship document? If so, what stops them from putting in language that renews a scholarship on an annual basis rather than a 4 or 5 year period of time. Thus, there would be a mutual agreement between the athlete and the university when the players signs the LOI and be understood by both parties.

Players can choose to transfer at any time as well which could leave the school in a bind so it couid work both ways.

The overall effect of a transfer is larger on an individual than it is on an 85 player team. There are plenty of different reasons why a player chooses to transfer to a different school. The Tide have one reason........make room for somebody else. "Thanks for picking us out of high school.....but we changed our minds. Good luck landing somewhere else. Say bye to your friends and teammates."

Of course I've felt slighted. But I think it's true that an individual is responsible for what promises they choose to believe. Let the buyer beware. I think that type of personal responsibility has gone missing in our society.

I've lost several thousands of dollars in raises and bonuses that were "promised" (not in any sort of contractual or legally binding way) but not delivered. I'm just saying this is part of life. Sometimes people aren't even trying to screw you over, situations change. Maybe you didn't perform as well as they'd hoped. Maybe there's an economic downturn. I think sheltering these college kids from all that could possibly set them up for a bigger and harsher dose of reality later on. And these aren't employees IMO - they are students getting free tuition, board, tutors, etc to play a game.

That's just my opinion and nothing I can prove. And I'm willing to concede that I could be wrong.

Who said anything about Alabama intentionally screwing these kids over? If these players are putting in the effort expected and following the coaches requests, should they be dropped? I guess it comes down to how much value you put into loyalty. I personally wouldn't kick somebody who's down in order to make ten bucks.

The reason we "pretend" to care about these poor souls being shown the door in Tuscaloosa is because they chose that school over ours and we wish we were the ones legally clearing house for our next class full of five-star recruits.

Alabama isn't going to be dropping players that we were fighting them for......most likely. If anything, most people would say things like "serves you right". A spiteful way to look at things.

 

[Jeshurun]

The overall effect of a transfer is larger on an individual than it is on an 85 player team. There are plenty of different reasons why a player chooses to transfer to a different school. The Tide have one reason........make room for somebody else. "Thanks for picking us out of high school.....but we changed our minds. Good luck landing somewhere else. Say bye to your friends and teammates."



Who said anything about Alabama intentionally screwing these kids over? If these players are putting in the effort expected and following the coaches requests, should they be dropped? I guess it comes down to how much value you put into loyalty. I personally wouldn't kick somebody who's down in order to make ten bucks.



Alabama isn't going to be dropping players that we were fighting them for......most likely. If anything, most people would say things like "serves you right". A spiteful way to look at things.

Whoops. Was not intending to imply that Alabama is intentionally screwing people over.

I guess my thinking at the start of this discussion was "it's not like the kids got nothing out of the deal - they still got part of an education paid for", but I can see where you're coming from and I think I can agree that coaches need to honor commitments or, if they're going to do this, should be more upfront in saying "if someone better comes along you're getting replaced."


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CrocShots]

J Tadpole is a ******nozzle

 

[mcal24]

Not to mention the student's life outside of football. They are basically forcing the kids to leave their friends, pursuit of a degree, and most likely a place they love to live in. Pretty disgraceful by the coaches.

 

[Deleted_User]

The reason we "pretend" to care about these poor souls being shown the door in Tuscaloosa is because they chose that school over ours and we wish we were the ones legally cleaning house for our next class full of five-star recruits.

Speaking on your own behalf...

 

[stocker08]

Whoops. Was not intending to imply that Alabama is intentionally screwing people over.

I guess my thinking at the start of this discussion was "it's not like the kids got nothing out of the deal - they still got part of an education paid for", but I can see where you're coming from and I think I can agree that coaches need to honor commitments or, if they're going to do this, should be more upfront in saying "if someone better comes along you're getting replaced."


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's fair. But what about grabbing the education out from underneath them as well? Credits don't easily transfer from school to school.

Not to mention the student's life outside of football. They are basically forcing the kids to leave their friends, pursuit of a degree, and most likely a place they love to live in. Pretty disgraceful by the coaches.

Well said. A football team isn't the only thing these players lose.

 

[Maximus]

Not to mention the student's life outside of football. They are basically forcing the kids to leave their friends, pursuit of a degree, and most likely a place they love to live in. Pretty disgraceful by the coaches.

In this case that's very true, but we learned late last week if any of these are Minnesota kids that turned down the Gophers to play elsewhere, then they would have deserved to be cut. Ya know, seeing as how they didn't select their school because of friends or a degree or a place they would love to live.

 

[Jeshurun]

That's fair. But what about grabbing the education out from underneath them as well? Credits don't easily transfer from school to school.



Well said. A football team isn't the only thing these players lose.

Very good point. Especially if they were trying to transfer those credits to a non-SEC school...

That being said, they could drop football altogether and get a job to pay for the rest of the credits to earn their degree at that school. Maybe that's not a likely possibility, but it is a possibility.

I was never going to be a D1 athlete, so my perspective is skewed by that and by paying back student loans, but if I was on a 4 year scholarship that got rescinded partway through I'd finish my degree and be thankful I at least got some of my education paid for. I do understand though that a lot of kids who wind up at Alabama have NFL dreams and education is secondary to that. And I think that bugs me. It takes the college out of college athletics.

But that's really not the point of this discussion. You've made a lot of good points and it is kind of scummy that coaches can do this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[stocker08]

In this case that's very true, but we learned late last week if any of these are Minnesota kids that turned down the Gophers to play elsewhere, then they would have deserved to be cut. Ya know, seeing as how they didn't select their school because of friends or a degree or a place they would love to live.

So the opinion of a few reflect the views of an entire fanbase?

 

[stocker08]

Very good point. Especially if they were trying to transfer those credits to a non-SEC school...

That being said, they could drop football altogether and get a job to pay for the rest of the credits to earn their degree at that school. Maybe that's not a likely possibility, but it is a possibility.

I was never going to be a D1 athlete, so my perspective is skewed by that and by paying back student loans, but if I was on a 4 year scholarship that got rescinded partway through I'd finish my degree and be thankful I at least got some of my education paid for. I do understand though that a lot of kids who wind up at Alabama have NFL dreams and education is secondary to that. And I think that bugs me. It takes the college out of college athletics.

But that's really not the point of this discussion. You've made a lot of good points and it is kind of scummy that coaches can do this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I hear yah. I was never on track to be a D1 athlete either. I am trying to put myself in the place of one of these guys that are on the cutting block. Maybe they weren't good enough. Maybe the Tide found someone better. I don't think that's a good reason to throw out a player who made a commitment to your team.

 

[Gopherguy0723]

And some people think these kids aren't employees and their coach isn't their boss.

Maybe Minnesota players should sign union cards like Northwestern.

 

[John Galt]

Scholarships aren't promised for 4-5 years, but that's the unwritten rule.

Alabama has been doing this for a while. Note to recruits: with all the options you have, is that who you want to play for? Buyer beware.

 

[Unregistered User]

Maybe Minnesota players should sign union cards like Northwestern.

Then if I'm the coach, I cut him and fill that scholly with a kid from Bama.

It's not as if these kids who get cut just get to walk into any school, get a scholly and simply move on with their lives, especially this late in the recruiting game. I think they would be lucky to find a spot at a school With an available scholarship that they thought equalled their talent coming out of high school.

 

[Gopherguy0723]

Then if I'm the coach, I cut him and fill that scholly with a kid from Bama.

It's not as if these kids who get cut just get to walk into any school, get a scholly and simply move on with their lives, especially this late in the recruiting game. I think they would be lucky to find a spot at a school With an available scholarship that they thought equalled their talent coming out of high school.

I don't think you understood what I was saying, but that is probably my fault.

All players should be represented by a union.

 

[Costa Rican Gopher]

When a kid commits to a school, he commits for 4 or 5 years, not 1 year. The school should not be able to only commit to a recruit for 1 year when he is unable to do the same to the school (without limitations).

+1

 

[Unregistered User]

I don't think you understood what I was saying, but that is probably my fault.

All players should be represented by a union.

Nope, I understood what you wrote, I don't like the thought of players being unionized. I don't want to get into it in this thread, there is already one about unions.

 

[vagopher]

I would be less concerned about players who were forced out of a program, if they were able to transfer without having to sit out a year.

 

[Rescooter]

I would be less concerned about players who were forced out of a program, if they were able to transfer without having to sit out a year.

I am in total agreement here. As an employer who has hired and fired many, I say let Saban yield the fruits of his labor. If I were a coach recruiting against him; I'd use it as Exhibit A as to why the recruit should not go to Alabama. I'd sit down with the recruit and family and say; we'll take care of your son. This Saban guy, seems like a decent person on the outside, but this is what he does to those that don't perform to his standards or he doesn't have room for. Do you really want to play for a guy with this attitude and lack of compassion or would you rather sign with us? After all, we will patiently mentor your son into a man who not only will be the best possible athlete, but a person that has an education, and a future. Cold Minnesota is far warmer than the Alabama coaching staff who view student/athletes as disposeable things

 

[WarriorGopher]

It's also real life. Someone who doesn't perform to management's standards is replaced. Someone who escalates their salary by staying with a company for period of years is replaced by someone who can maybe do the job almost as well but much cheaper.

Each case is individual but in the Alabama instances it's likely "disgusting" because of the blind greed to win.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I think of a scholarship offer like an employment contract where both sides have the right to move on if they so choose. That said, this reflects poorly on Alabama and I suspect over time, it's going to hurt them with some top end recruits. I know if I were recruiting against them, I'd use this to plant a seed of doubt in the family/players mind.

I do think the NCAA should bring some common sense into this. If a school decides to force a scholarship athlete out, the player ought to be able to transfer without sitting a year. Using another employment analogy, it's like the kid is forced to sign a non-compete while getting zero contractual protections on the other end. Shady at best.

 

[BamBam]

I think the NCAA needs to step in on this one. I think once you promise a kid a scholarship it is his unless he does something like breaking the law.

If the kid has to sit out a year to transfer, then the open scholarship should not be used for a year as we'll. what is only the kid being penalized for being forced out.

 

[EG#9]

I am surprised by the number of kids this may affect, but kids have been "forced out" all over the nation in revenue sports for decades. This certainly isn't a new phenomenon, but Alabama seems to be taking it to extreme degrees. I don't disagree with those that say it shouldn't go on, but if you want to compete (especially in basketball) it's tough to keep non-contributors on scholarship for 4-5 years. Even if the NCAA made scholarships guaranteed for four years (provided sufficient academic progress and no criminal act), you'd still have coaches call kids in to their office and "suggest" a transfer. That "suggestion" can come with a very strong indication that you won't be competing for playing time.

I am not sure what the answer is, but the bad publicity Saban/whoever gets for forcing kids out will be wiped away as long as the wins keep coming. If parents will send their kids to Iowa after what happened with their strength and conditioning sessions, they sure as hell will still send their kids to Alabama to play on the big stage.

 

[corcoran1]

The reason we "pretend" to care about these poor souls being shown the door in Tuscaloosa is because they chose that school over ours and we wish we were the ones legally cleaning house for our next class full of five-star recruits.

I don't believe B1G schools o this very much. There are a bunch of kids on our team that would not be there if we did it.

 

[16FeetUnder]

How does this affect their APR?

 

[Fuzzy Rumpton]

I don't believe B1G schools o this very much. There are a bunch of kids on our team that would not be there if we did it.

The B1G only allows you to over-sign by 3 players. That's why it isn't as extreme in our conference.

 

[CentralGopher]

When a kid commits to a school, he commits for 4 or 5 years, not 1 year. The school should not be able to only commit to a recruit for 1 year when he is unable to do the same to the school (without limitations).

+1 This is exactly why the NCAA needs to do something. Either step in and force schools to quit oversigning or abolish the rule that forces transfers to sit out a year. Schools need to make the same commitment to the kids that the kids make to the schools.

 

[Unregistered User]

How does this affect their APR?

The coaches and AD's respond:

 

[Deleted_User]

+1 This is exactly why the NCAA needs to do something. Either step in and force schools to quit oversigning or abolish the rule that forces transfers to sit out a year. Schools need to make the same commitment to the kids that the kids make to the schools.

Could Northwestern recruit these kids since the Northwestern players understand the issues better?

 

[dpodoll68]

The B1G only allows you to over-sign by 3 players. That's why it isn't as extreme in our conference.

I think this has been adopted pretty much everywhere now - including in the SEC.

 

[Unregistered User]

From something called www.shutnick.com - compliments of www.reddit.com/r/cfb:

"TUSCALOOSA, AL—On the eve of National Signing Day, the University of Alabama has suddenly misplaced six scholarship football players. After conducting a thorough search of the locker room, his pockets and Layla Kiffin’s underwear drawer, Head Coach Nick Saban announced that the missing student athletes may lose their place on the team if they don’t turn up by National Signing Day, which is tomorrow.

“I’m drawing a blank right now,” said Saban, as he directed equipment managers to clean out the missing players’ lockers. “I already re-traced my steps, which was tough because I’ve been on so many recruiting trips lately. I know I didn't leave them on the field…we’ll have to scramble to replace these guys if they don’t turn up within the next couple hours. Hopefully Lane can scrounge up some four-star recruits to replace the missing guys, none of whom had a chance to play next season.”

Meanwhile, Athletic Director Bill Battle was unable to name the missing players, because all records of their enrollment have, coincidentally, been erased due to a technical malfunction. Said Battle, “We aren't too worried about this quite yet. Sometimes a player will go missing for a couple weeks and then turn up in a doctor’s office or at the University of North Alabama.”"