All Things Gopher Players Appeals Process

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PMWinSTP said:
Thanks. Lots of bad stuff going on with a highly talented player in a relatively small city for his troubles not to be a pretty well known thing. The article makes it sound like it was widely known. His lawyer was even shocked that he was put back on the team.
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Agreed, but there's also evidence of his coach and possibly high school administrators going out of their way to protect him, because they needed him on the field scoring touchdowns. I can imagine them not being forthright with recruiters about his character.


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Ewert86PC said:
This is one of the most ridiculous comments that I have read. The whole issue, regardless of gender, is not being shamed when coming forward. You have just proven it is less shameful for a woman to make accusations because of a "who ever hears of that" mentality for men. Forty years ago who ever heard of a wife bringing sexual assault charges against her husband because the mentality was they are married and that is their business.

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Exactly. The very comment shows the bias. By the definition of 'affirmative consent', I personally have been sexually assaulted by MANY women, and I ain't exactly Cassanova. Furthermore, anyone who's sat next to a bachelorette party or a wives happy hour at a bar knows that crude sexual behavior don't just happen amongst men.

Take one of the progressive causes du jour: 'body-shaming'. You make a comment about a women's body, and Katie bar the door. Meanwhile, 'size' jokes are totally OK. Just look at all the references to Donald Trump's 'tiny hands'.
 

UpnorthGo4 said:
Fleck may not want any of the players back on the team. Unlike Claeys, he is not the kind of coach who waits for the results of administrative hearings or criminal trials to decide what to do with players who are not "elite".
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DBs like you make it hard to support our new coach. Let's see how many BigTen all Freshmen come out of his MAC level recruits.
 


UpnorthGo4 said:
Fleck may not want any of the players back on the team. Unlike Claeys, he is not the kind of coach who waits for the results of administrative hearings or criminal trials to decide what to do with players who are not "elite". Last August he kicked two WMU players off his team long before they received their "due process" in the criminal court system or in WMU code of conduct hearings. How long do you think it would have taken Fleck to kick the Gopher players off the team who supplied alcohol to the under-age high school recruit and then got him involved in the gang bang?

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Two former WMU football players to face judge over robbery

KALAMAZOO, Mich. (NEWSCHANNEL 3) – Monday, a judge was scheduled to decide if there's enough evidence to send two former WMU football players to trial, but their court date was changed.

Freshmen Ronald George and Bryson White are charged with holding up a woman with a gun and knife.

Prosecutors will lay out some of the evidence against them on October 28th.

Both players have been dismissed from the football team as a result of the incident.

Read more at: http://wwmt.com/news/local/two-former-wmu-football-players-to-face-judge-over-robbery
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You are so biased in this whole situation, characterizing each of the suspended players the same. How is a player never even in the apartment building not "elite"? How is a player who comes and gets a recruit out of the apartment not "elite"? Is it just ok with you to assume they are all guilty and should have their futures thrown away, despite possibly having done nothing wrong?


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Ozzy&Ray said:
You are so biased in this whole situation, characterizing each of the suspended players the same. How is a player never even in the apartment building not "elite"? How is a player who comes and gets a recruit out of the apartment not "elite"? Is it just ok with you to assume they are all guilty and should have their futures thrown away, despite possibly having done nothing wrong?


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The sad thing is many have sided so hard with the EOAA on this that I swear they would rather it be true and players get booted than to have the opposite occur.


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tato2001 said:
Take one of the progressive causes du jour: 'body-shaming'. You make a comment about a women's body, and Katie bar the door. Meanwhile, 'size' jokes are totally OK. Just look at all the references to Donald Trump's 'tiny hands'.
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Holy smokes! Those aren't tiny, they're hipster small.

Atrophy from lack of use?
 

UpnorthGo4 said:
How is the treatment different for women and men? How many men to you know (or even heard of) who have been a victim of sexual assault or harassment by a woman?
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None, but there is a high profile Amherst case you can read about which is this very thing, passed out man, girl performs oral, 2 years later she goes to the eoaa, dude is expelled. He wasn't allowed to file a complaint because it might traumatized her. Totally slanted process toward women. By design.


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Tlsbhansen said:
Hmmm...if I were one of his players (suspended or not) I'd want him to say the most important thing is that the players receive a fair process and we will wait for the outcome. Not "basically I don't care about that, I've got replacements for them!" #thumbsup #RTB
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This post makes no sense. So Fleck is supposed to talk about a fair process when he has 0 input and the process is already over??? What?

I'm glad rather than wasting time on lip service he decided to be proactive and cover his arse. I can't fathom why any fan would want it any other way.
 



Tlsbhansen said:
Hmmm...if I were one of his players (suspended or not) I'd want him to say the most important thing is that the players receive a fair process and we will wait for the outcome. Not "basically I don't care about that, I've got replacements for them!" #thumbsup #RTB
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Nope. None of this occurred under his watch. He should say as little about it as possible, accept the outcome and move on.


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Tlsbhansen said:
Hmmm...if I were one of his players (suspended or not) I'd want him to say the most important thing is that the players receive a fair process and we will wait for the outcome. Not "basically I don't care about that, I've got replacements for them!" #thumbsup #RTB
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Furthermore, I can only imagine the reaction on NSD if Fleck steps up to the mic and says, "we lost beck, Harris and Robinson at the last minute. I thought the best use of time was to analyze the hearing that were already concluded. Sorry those other coaches kept recruiting. At least we have handy-holly if we lose all the other guys in the EOAA appeal."

There are certainly things that aren't perfect and rub people the wrong way. But trying to pick apart everything he does makes the Fleck criticism seem pretty silly.
 

dpodoll68 said:
That didn't happen.
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Prove it.

I only say that because that's what the players are up against. Trying to prove innocence instead of the EOAA, or whatever that sh*tty acronym stands for, proving guilt.

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Will we find out the outcome to the Appeals process today?
 



pregameatblarneys said:
Prove it.

I only say that because that's what the players are up against. Trying to prove innocence instead of the EOAA, or whatever that sh*tty acronym stands for, proving guilt.

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Stupid. You can't prove a negative.
 

Stuff said:
Will we find out the outcome to the Appeals process today?
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We will probably find out today - but only if the attorneys for the players decide it is the right time to tell us. And we are only going to get 1/2 of the story from them. The U, of course, will be saying very little about what happened during the hearing. They will tell us absolutely nothing about the rationale for the rulings for each of the players.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Stupid. You can't prove a negative.
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You don't get my point I see. That was my point. Of course you can't, but the players are being forced to as the committee believes the girl and they are forced to prove their innocence rather than the committee proving their guilt

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Spoofin said:
The sad thing is many have sided so hard with the EOAA on this that I swear they would rather it be true and players get booted than to have the opposite occur.
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A lot of good old thinly veiled Minnesota racism.
 

pregameatblarneys said:
You don't get my point I see. That was my point. Of course you can't, but the players are being forced to as the committee believes the girl and they are forced to prove their innocence rather than the committee proving their guilt

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How do you know the "committee believes the girl"? Unless you have inside info you don't even know who is on the "committee". It appears you may be biased against the girl and in favor of the players.
 

UpnorthGo4 said:
How do you know the "committee believes the girl"? Unless you have inside info you don't even know who is on the "committee". It appears you may be biased against the girl and in favor of the players.
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The girl has allegedly now admitted consensual sex with numerous players. If true, should those players still be expelled?


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Ozzy&Ray said:
The girl has allegedly now admitted consensual sex with numerous players. If true, should those players still be expelled?


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Was that before or after the appeal hearings?


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Supposedly at the hearings, according to a few people. Don't know for sure if true or not. However, my question to UpNorth, who seems to want to hang all ten, is if this is true would he be willing to recognize it or would he still believe they should be expelled.


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Ozzy&Ray said:
Supposedly at the hearings, according to a few people. Don't know for sure if true or not. However, my question to UpNorth, who seems to want to hang all ten, is if this is true would he be willing to recognize it or would he still believe they should be expelled.


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If she admitted to having consensual sex with several of the players, after previously changing her story numerous times, all ten should be exonerated. Period.


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PitinoFan said:
If she admitted to having consensual sex with several of the players, after previously changing her story numerous times, all ten should be exonerated. Period.


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There's several other flips as well, in the podcast Hutton said she admitted she was not drunk at the hearing. The investigator also misunderstood Shenault's answer on where he was that night. If you have not done so, go listen to the podcast.
 

PMWinSTP said:
There's several other flips as well, in the podcast Hutton said she admitted she was not drunk at the hearing. The investigator also misunderstood Shenault's answer on where he was that night. If you have not done so, go listen to the podcast.
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I'll check it out later. Thanks.


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All the disciplinary threads trend from raising some issues and questions to more and more straight up bonkers or made ups stuff as they go....
 

PMWinSTP said:
in the podcast Hutton said she admitted she was not drunk at the hearing.
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There were assumptions she was drunk at the hearing? Why would anyone attend a hearing under the influence of alcohol?
 



Schnauzer said:
There were assumptions she was drunk at the hearing? Why would anyone attend a hearing under the influence of alcohol?
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Moderately funny, clunky on my part. Admitted at the hearing that she was not drunk the night of the alleged assault.
 


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