All Things Dawson Garcia Recruitment Thread (Class of 2020): UPDATED: Gophers Offered

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Garcia would do fine at center, how many teams in the B1G have a big dominating center, last year Illinois, other that I can't think of one. Defense around it when you do, that's what Ben gets paid the big bucks for. If you have a Fox or Ihnen at the 4 and Battle at the 3 and you can't make do then you shouldn't be coaching in the Big Ten.
 


He and Battle would be our best players next season. He could guard most 5s except Kofi, Trevion, and Key from Osu
 


jovs said:
Garcia would do fine at center, how many teams in the B1G have a big dominating center, last year Illinois, other that I can't think of one. Defense around it when you do, that's what Ben gets paid the big bucks for. If you have a Fox or Ihnen at the 4 and Battle at the 3 and you can't make do then you shouldn't be coaching in the Big Ten.
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He absolutely would not be fine as a defensive 5.

As a stretch 5 on offense he would be good bring his guy out to the arc. But that would be where you have to make it worth it.
 


It's pure speculation...but it's also a possibility. Ben will continue to have opportunities to show himself as the ace recruiter that Coyle hired him to be.
 



USAF said:
Considering the options, he'd be FANTASTIC at 5. Jeez.
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OK, I think people are sleeping a bit on Payne at the 5 (He could play at the 4). I'm not saying he's going to be Rudy Gobert in there, but he's 6-9 and about 235 right now. He has a really strong lower body and room for more lbs of muscle in his upper body. He may come in at 250. He's strong, quick, athletic, and I believe he's going to be a decent post defender in his first year. So if Johnson can't bring any other playable bigs for next year, Payne can deliver some effective minutes for you. I've seen enough players to know that this kid is going to be really good. Maybe not a star next year, but soon.
 



Formerswish said:
OK, I think people are sleeping a bit on Payne at the 5 (He could play at the 4). I'm not saying he's going to be Rudy Gobert in there, but he's 6-9 and about 235 right now. He has a really strong lower body and room for more lbs of muscle in his upper body. He may come in at 250. He's strong, quick, athletic, and I believe he's going to be a decent post defender in his first year. So if Johnson can't bring any other playable bigs for next year, Payne can deliver some effective minutes for you. I've seen enough players to know that this kid is going to be really good. Maybe not a star next year, but soon.
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Any mobile and reasonably skilled guy at 6-9 250 is going to be a major upgrade in interior defense over the current squad.
 

USAF said:
Considering the options, he'd be FANTASTIC at 5. Jeez.
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So your solution to building a program, is to fix issues by having guys play out of position??

Garcia if they want to trust he will buy in would not be a bad add. Playing him mostly as a Big10 5 would be a terrible decisision without a really quality and strong 4 to help out down low.

Fantastic is just a mental comment.
 

MUgopher32 said:
So your solution to building a program, is to fix issues by having guys play out of position??

Garcia if they want to trust he will buy in would not be a bad add. Playing him mostly as a Big10 5 would be a terrible decisision without a really quality and strong 4 to help out down low.

Fantastic is just a mental comment.
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I think we just add as many good players as possible. If Dawson a great matchup for the best centers in the Big 10? No. Will he do as well as most guys we could land? Absolutely.
 

MUgopher32 said:
So your solution to building a program, is to fix issues by having guys play out of position??

Garcia if they want to trust he will buy in would not be a bad add. Playing him mostly as a Big10 5 would be a terrible decisision without a really quality and strong 4 to help out down low.

Fantastic is just a mental comment.
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The solution to building a program is to get better players. Players like Garcia.

I'd rather have a 20 year old Shaq transfer in, but again, given the options, I'd be absolutely thrilled to see Garcia suit up for the Gophers next year.

What would be a terrible decision is turning down Garcia because somebody doesn't think he matches their idea of what a "5" has to look like.
 




USAF said:
The solution to building a program is to get better players. Players like Garcia.

I'd rather have a 20 year old Shaq transfer in, but again, given the options, I'd be absolutely thrilled to see Garcia suit up for the Gophers next year.

What would be a terrible decision is turning down Garcia because somebody doesn't think he matches their idea of what a "5" has to look like.
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Again, no one said turn him down.

You said he would be fantastic. He wouldnt.

Hes a 4 and that is where he would be a really, really good addition. As a 5 hes far better than what we have this year(the lowest bar possible) and not someone you turn down. He would not be a fantastic 5.

You act like "its my idea of what a 5 would look like" I have literally watched him play college basketball in two different leagues. He isnt a 5. This isnt me making assumptions. Weve seen it. Hes had trouble at the rim in both the BE and ACC because he cannot elevate and gets his shot blocked at the rim, bigs eat him alive. Defensively it aint pretty.

If you would like to tell me where I said Garcia should not be on roster Id love to see it. But saying he is a fantastic 5 for the BIG is simply incompetent basketball intellect.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I think we just add as many good players as possible. If Dawson a great matchup for the best centers in the Big 10? No. Will he do as well as most guys we could land? Absolutely.
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Thats a bad indictment of the program then.

If you your only chance of improving is to play guys out of position.

Garcia at the 5 and Battle at the 4 would be a damn nightmare. My thought though is if Ben made the move, they would play A LOT of 3/4. Why? Because that is where they make the team better.
 

MUgopher32 said:
Thats a bad indictment of the program then.

If you your only chance of improving is tnightmare guys out of position.

Garcia at the 5 and Battle at the 4 would be a damn nightmare. My thought though is if Ben made the move, they would play A LOT of 3/4. Why? Because that is where they make the team better.
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A nightmare? Wow! That's absurd. Would Garcia shut down a Kofi or Edey, no, but who can? And any coach who is any good then uses that on the other end, put Garcia in 1/5 pick and roll and bring those big slow C out on the perimeter. A nightmare, good night what an absolutely stupid statement. This year we played Battle at the 4 all year, you think he gets worse? We played Curry and Daniel's at C, one can barely move and one is closer to a D2 player. A guy with nba potential isn't a "nightmare" for a team that just finished DFL in the conference.
 

leib0039 said:
A nightmare? Wow! That's absurd. Would Garcia shut down a Kofi or Edey, no, but who can? And any coach who is any good then uses that on the other end, put Garcia in 1/5 pick and roll and bring those big slow C out on the perimeter. A nightmare, good night what an absolutely stupid statement. This year we played Battle at the 4 all year, you think he gets worse? We played Curry and Daniel's at C, one can barely move and one is closer to a D2 player. A guy with nba potential isn't a "nightmare" for a team that just finished DFL in the conference.
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Huh? What are you even talking about?

We did play Battle at the 4 and we got 14th place. So yeah, keeping him at the 4 with an out of place 5 clearly would not be the optimal play.

Battle at the 3 and Garcia at the 4 stretching a D?? Now that would be good. They both would lack quickness guarding 3s and 4s but physicality wise much better fit.

As I said to the other poster, you do realize Garcia has burned through two teams already? Both of which have tried him at the 5 to very poor results and both of which who got better when he left.

When Garcia was at his best with UNC, Bacot was the 5 and Dawson stretched the floor. You act like there are not two years of evidence of this stuff
 

Garcia is pretty well rounded….not a back to the basket guy unless he’s got a mismatch. More nifty than strong, but I think he has a lot of intangibles, including character that would help this team.
 




MUgopher32 said:
Huh? What are you even talking about?

We did play Battle at the 4 and we got 14th place. So yeah, keeping him at the 4 with an out of place 5 clearly would not be the optimal play.

Battle at the 3 and Garcia at the 4 stretching a D?? Now that would be good. They both would lack quickness guarding 3s and 4s but physicality wise much better fit.

As I said to the other poster, you do realize Garcia has burned through two teams already? Both of which have tried him at the 5 to very poor results and both of which who got better when he left.

When Garcia was at his best with UNC, Bacot was the 5 and Dawson stretched the floor. You act like there are not two years of evidence of this stuff
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You went from calling Garcia at the 5 to a "nightmare" to calling it "not optimal".....those are almost complete opposites. Would it be "optimal"? No. Optimal would be Cockburn finding another year of eligibility and transferring here. Besides.....who cares if Garcia is a 5? He would add length, scoring and rebounding. Add in Fox, Ihnen and Payne and I'll take my chances with that frontcourt. Love the flexibility and matchup nightmares that those 4 might provide. Hell, we had Sean Sutherlin covering centers during the last couple of games. If Dawson wants to transfer here, I'd offer to pick him up at the airport......
 

fan of Ray Williams said:
Even if we add up all the extra years that covid gave the entire roster, still don't think it's enough to get Kerwin Fleming back.
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Is this guy related to the guy with the same name who played in the Monson era? I’m quite sure the original is out of eligibility. 😀
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
You went from calling Garcia at the 5 to a "nightmare" to calling it "not optimal".....those are almost complete opposites. Would it be "optimal"? No. Optimal would be Cockburn finding another year of eligibility and transferring here. Besides.....who cares if Garcia is a 5? He would add length, scoring and rebounding. Add in Fox, Ihnen and Payne and I'll take my chances with that frontcourt. Love the flexibility and matchup nightmares that those 4 might provide. Hell, we had Sean Sutherlin covering centers during the last couple of games. If Dawson wants to transfer here, I'd offer to pick him up at the airport......
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How is that complete opposites. There is optimal or not optimal. Hahaha/

Again he is NOT a FIVE. This isnt some situation where we both have opinions of an unknown. He has failed at TWO teams. One in the BE and one in the ACC when trying to play some five. Both teams were better off when he left since he didnt fit as a consistent four at either.

I think the issue here for you is an all around lack of intelligence. I start with

1. Watching other college basketball games

2. Learning to read. I said take Dawson, but as a 4. So not sure why you are once again saying we should get him. Im not agruging that. I am arguing position fit, which you trying to argue just makes you look like you havent watched hoops.

3. This is the most glaring concern. Pick him up at the airport?? Dawson is going to fly from what? Prior Lake to Minnepolis?

Please respond intelligently.
 

MUgopher32 said:
How is that complete opposites. There is optimal or not optimal. Hahaha/

Again he is NOT a FIVE. This isnt some situation where we both have opinions of an unknown. He has failed at TWO teams. One in the BE and one in the ACC when trying to play some five. Both teams were better off when he left since he didnt fit as a consistent four at either.

I think the issue here for you is an all around lack of intelligence. I start with

1. Watching other college basketball games

2. Learning to read. I said take Dawson, but as a 4. So not sure why you are once again saying we should get him. Im not agruging that. I am arguing position fit, which you trying to argue just makes you look like you havent watched hoops.

3. This is the most glaring concern. Pick him up at the airport?? Dawson is going to fly from what? Prior Lake to Minnepolis?

Please respond intelligently.
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By watching other college basketball games you should know that many highly successful teams don’t have a ‘5’.

People need to stop with the obsession of having a clear cut 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. This isn’t 20 years ago. Most players don’t just play and defend one position.
 
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GopherWeatherGuy said:
By watching other college basketball games you should know that many highly successful teams don’t have a ‘5’.

People need to stop with the obsession of having a clear cut 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. This isn’t 20 years ago. Most players don’t just play and defend one position.
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I don't disagree, but it's not bad to have one though.....I'd rather have that option than not. This year we don't have one. We saw that in action.
 

MUgopher32 said:
How is that complete opposites. There is optimal or not optimal. Hahaha/

Again he is NOT a FIVE. This isnt some situation where we both have opinions of an unknown. He has failed at TWO teams. One in the BE and one in the ACC when trying to play some five. Both teams were better off when he left since he didnt fit as a consistent four at either.

I think the issue here for you is an all around lack of intelligence. I start with

1. Watching other college basketball games

2. Learning to read. I said take Dawson, but as a 4. So not sure why you are once again saying we should get him. Im not agruging that. I am arguing position fit, which you trying to argue just makes you look like you havent watched hoops.

3. This is the most glaring concern. Pick him up at the airport?? Dawson is going to fly from what? Prior Lake to Minnepolis?

Please respond intelligently.
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Because someone doesn't agree with you they lack intelligence and cannot read? The point is, and I don't think you are arguing it, is Dawson Garcia would raise the talent level on this team whether he plays 4 or 5. Leave that to the coach to figure out. Garcia would give them another big body who would improve the team's ability to rebound or play inside in any meaningful way. If what you believe is correct and he would be better at the 4 then you use a combination of Payne, Fox, Thompson and Ihnen at the 5 with Battle at the 3. Next year's roster will have some size which should enable the team to be more competitive inside. To sum up, if Garcia wants to come here, you take him in .01 seconds.

Talking about speculation like this is fun and we can disagree about certain specifics. The name calling and vitriol is not fun and will lead to people ignoring the information you provide.
 

MUgopher32 said:
Thats a bad indictment of the program then.

If you your only chance of improving is to play guys out of position.

Garcia at the 5 and Battle at the 4 would be a damn nightmare. My thought though is if Ben made the move, they would play A LOT of 3/4. Why? Because that is where they make the team better.
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Yeah, we don't have a lot of talent right not. I guess that's an indictment on our current talent level. I'm not sure if there are many teams in the country that wouldn't have some interest in Garcia.

I'm cool with rolling with a front court of Battle, Ihnen, Garcia, Payne, Fox, and Thompson. I realize some of those minutes will come with Payne at the 5, some of them will come with Garcia at the 5, etc. While that frontcourt lacks a dominant/experienced 5, I think that would be a drastically improved unit.
 

If players avoided the U cuz the team is a cellar dweller than we shouldn’t expect anyone who said ‘no thanks’ to come back to the U.
 

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