All Things 2024 Minnesota Vikings Off-Season Thread

Donate To GopherHole
Ogee Ogilthorpe said:
I wouldn't hate this either, as I actually think KOC and McCown could do some things with a guy like Sam Darnold; no, maybe not the long term franchise solution but I think if things fell right with the draft and the rest of FA, they could contend for the playoffs.

The thing I'm worried about is, if you're trading to 4th, and you have a guy you really love and it's McCarthy (as some are saying), what happens if the board changes and the first 3 are Williams, Maye and McCarthy? Not saying Daniels would be a horrible consolation prize but what if the Vikings happen to NOT be very high on whoever is left at #4?

It's risky. I think you can only trade up into #4 early (like way before the draft) if you happen to LOVE all four of those QB's. Such different players, is that possible?
Click to expand...

You don't trade up unless you know who you're getting with that pick. The Vikings know who they want and where they need to be to get him.
 

MplsGopher said:
Correct

But KAM's job is 100% on the line, with how dogs__t he and his "analytics" have drafted.

It's go big now or get fired, for him.


If I were the Wilfs, I would decree that draft picks are off limit. So if #4 is the best they can do for #11 and #23, so be it. That all but guarantees Maye is out of reach.
Click to expand...
This isn't really a defense of KAM but the Vikings have drafted poorly for some time before KAM. They've gotten very little production out of the draft this decade.

I think the only way a trade for #4 makes sense now is if you are sold on any of Maye, Daniels and McCarthy. But that kind of drafting is done under the guise of "I need a QB" rather than "I need this QB" and leads to a busted pick.

I think the more likely scenario here is that if a trade up is made, it is on draft night, immediately before the pick, because the guy they really wanted all along is available. At least that is how I hope this would go down.

I think grabbing the #23 pick was a good move. It does give the Vikings an asset to help move up if their guy is available. If their guy is not available or the price is too high, take the best player available at #11 and then use #23 on Penix/Nix, or even trade back down if you think one of these guys are available in Rd 2. Not overpaying for KC and subsequent draft positioning has been KAM's best moment as GM. How he executes after will likely define his tenure.
 

WilliamsArenaGuy said:
I mean I understand you're comparing the total package of individuals, but you think the Chargers did better than the team who won two Super Bowls with the guy they got?? Not only that, that guy beat the unbeatable Patriots both times, whom Rivers and the Chargers could never get past themselves.

I think the Giants clearly won, and it isn't even debatable.
Click to expand...
The media's obsession with evaluating QBs by Super Bowl titles is stupid.

More than 40 players play snaps per team, every single game. It's the ultimate team game.

Switch Rivers with Manning, and the Giants probably win those Super Bowls. It was their defense that carried the team, and one tough catch.

Dilfer isn't a better QB than Cousins. Neither is Brad Johnson. Both won Super Bowls because of their defense.

National talk media has ruined any honest conversation about QBs, and to a large extent, NBA basketball players.
 


swede2 said:
This isn't really a defense of KAM but the Vikings have drafted poorly for some time before KAM. They've gotten very little production out of the draft this decade.

I think the only way a trade for #4 makes sense now is if you are sold on any of Maye, Daniels and McCarthy. But that kind of drafting is done under the guise of "I need a QB" rather than "I need this QB" and leads to a busted pick.

I think the more likely scenario here is that if a trade up is made, it is on draft night, immediately before the pick, because the guy they really wanted all along is available. At least that is how I hope this would go down.

I think grabbing the #23 pick was a good move. It does give the Vikings an asset to help move up if their guy is available. If their guy is not available or the price is too high, take the best player available at #11 and then use #23 on Penix/Nix, or even trade back down if you think one of these guys are available in Rd 2. Not overpaying for KC and subsequent draft positioning has been KAM's best moment as GM. How he executes after will likely define his tenure.
Click to expand...
♟️moves
 


TruthSeeker said:
The media's obsession with evaluating QBs by Super Bowl titles is stupid.

More than 40 players play snaps per team, every single game. It's the ultimate team game.

Switch Rivers with Manning, and the Giants probably win those Super Bowls. It was their defense that carried the team, and one tough catch.

Dilfer isn't a better QB than Cousins. Neither is Brad Johnson. Both won Super Bowls because of their defense.

National talk media has ruined any honest conversation about QBs, and to a large extent, NBA basketball players.
Click to expand...
Then why didn't Rivers make a SB with that loaded Chargers team?

I think the Giants are pretty happy with the results of that trade. The goal is to win it all, is it not?

I agree you don't only judge a QB by SBs, but that isn't really the point here.

Tennessee won a National Championship the year after Peyton Manning left. Is Tee Martin a better QB? Of course not. Would most people trade four years of Manning where they didn't win anything for that one year of Tee Martin? I think so.
 

TruthSeeker said:
Exactly. The trade up will occur during the draft.
Click to expand...
And if they dont, I'm happy they have 2 first rounders. I like lower amount of picks but high picks. Ivan pace a good example you can get decent players without 4th thru 7th rd picks. Thr best players are usually first 3 rounds

Only concern is if kwesi is doing the selecting
 


football may be a sport, but the NFL is a business - a big business. as of last fall, the MN Vikings franchise had an estimated value of $4.65-billion.

from that perspective - you are the General Manager of a billon-dollar business. you are about to make a decision that will shape the future direction of that business. unless you are certifiably crazy, you are not making that decision on a whim. you have a plan.

ergo, the Vikes did not add a 2nd pick in the 1st round on a whim. IMHO they added that pick as part of a plan - because they believed they needed it to attain a goal.

in other words, the Vikes have a very good reason to believe that one of the teams at the top of the draft is willing to trade down, and they have an understanding of what the cost will be to move up.

unless there is a last-minute change of plans, I think the Vikes are taking a QB with the 4th or 5th pick in the 1st round. (and by change of plans, I don't mean the Vikings - I mean that another team has a late change of heart)
 



jamiche said:
I spent 20-25 minutes of my life that I can’t get back on YouTube reviews of the various quarterbacks. My conclusion is that everybody is an expert and nobody knows anything. My conclusion after that waste of time is the same as before. The Vikings should use the two 1st rd picks on two players. As to which players, no clue.
Click to expand...
100% correct

Heard Dan B say on Friday that Kurt Warner doesn't think very highly of Maye. Says he misses a lot of "layup" type passes.

Ay caramba. Especially if we give up future picks plus #11 and #23 to get into 3rd pick, take him, and he's the next Mac Jones.

J Fing C
 

WilliamsArenaGuy said:
I mean I understand you're comparing the total package of individuals, but you think the Chargers did better than the team who won two Super Bowls with the guy they got??
Click to expand...
The Giants would've won those same two Super Bowl's with Rivers.

Eli ain't Peyton
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
You don't trade up unless you know who you're getting with that pick. The Vikings know who they want and where they need to be to get him.
Click to expand...

That would be so F'ing hilarious, and so F'ing Minnesota sports/Minnesota Vikings: move up to #4 before draft night, and the top three are Williams, Maye, and JJM.

I would piss my pants laughing
 

swede2 said:
This isn't really a defense of KAM but the Vikings have drafted poorly for some time before KAM. They've gotten very little production out of the draft this decade.

I think the only way a trade for #4 makes sense now is if you are sold on any of Maye, Daniels and McCarthy. But that kind of drafting is done under the guise of "I need a QB" rather than "I need this QB" and leads to a busted pick.

I think the more likely scenario here is that if a trade up is made, it is on draft night, immediately before the pick, because the guy they really wanted all along is available. At least that is how I hope this would go down.

I think grabbing the #23 pick was a good move. It does give the Vikings an asset to help move up if their guy is available. If their guy is not available or the price is too high, take the best player available at #11 and then use #23 on Penix/Nix, or even trade back down if you think one of these guys are available in Rd 2. Not overpaying for KC and subsequent draft positioning has been KAM's best moment as GM. How he executes after will likely define his tenure.
Click to expand...
Nothing to disagree with here, solid post.

Bolded: I pray they're that smart, at least.

Have a plan for if the guy (or the two guys) you want are available, and have another plan for taking guys at 11 and 23.
 




MplsGopher said:
100% correct

Heard Dan B say on Friday that Kurt Warner doesn't think very highly of Maye. Says he misses a lot of "layup" type passes.

Ay caramba. Especially if we give up future picks plus #11 and #23 to get into 3rd pick, take him, and he's the next Mac Jones.

J Fing C
Click to expand...
Hoe do you know he going to be the next Mac Jones. You don't know that. So shut the hell up dude.
 

TruthSeeker said:
National talk media has ruined any honest conversation about QBs
Click to expand...
100% correct.

Local too. Dan B trying to a fake take of forcing that it had to be Kirk or else it has to be a high first round pick this year. Souhan basically saying the same in STrib today.

These a__holes only say these things because they want to make sure they have the most to talk about. That's all that matters to them
 



short ornery norwegian said:
ergo, the Vikes did not add a 2nd pick in the 1st round on a whim. IMHO they added that pick as part of a plan - because they believed they needed it to attain a goal.

in other words, the Vikes have a very good reason to believe that one of the teams at the top of the draft is willing to trade down, and they have an understanding of what the cost will be to move up.
Click to expand...
This is sheer fantasy.

As well laid out by swede2, it really does make a lot of sense to add the 23 on nothing more than it gives options. Nothing had to be set in stone before acquiring that.
 

atsgopher said:
The guy they traded for him was #4 pick Phillip Rivers. The Chargers used that future first round pick to draft Shawne Merriam. They Chargers also got K Nate Kaeding, that made multiple pro bowls.

I’d say the Chargers did far better.

How ironic that both QBs actually did turn out to be good. When do two in the same draft turn out as well as those two, other than 1983?
Click to expand...
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 hilarious
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
You don't trade up unless you know who you're getting with that pick. The Vikings know who they want and where they need to be to get him.
Click to expand...
In the 2019 NBA draft Gerson Rosas traded up to get Darius Garland and got stuck with Jarret Culver. Too many dependent variables.
 

jamiche said:
In the 2019 NBA draft Gerson Rosas traded up to get Darius Garland and got stuck with Jarret Culver. Too many dependent variables.
Click to expand...

That was incompetence by Rosas. The Vikings aren't that stupid, and neither are most GMs.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
That was incompetence by Rosas. The Vikings aren't that stupid, and neither are most GMs.
Click to expand...
It was a miscalculation, not incompetence. Rosas was a pretty competent POBO. His personal judgement was lacking.

Kwesi has yet to demonstrate drafting chops. The franchise has few draft picks over the next two years. It doesn't have the luxury of offering two 1sts for anybody unproven.
 

jamiche said:
It was a miscalculation, not incompetence. Rosas was a pretty competent POBO. His personal judgement was lacking.

Kwesi has yet to demonstrate drafting chops. The franchise has few draft picks over the next two years. It doesn't have the luxury of offering two 1sts for anybody unproven.
Click to expand...

Trading up to 6, when there was a pretty clear cut top 5 in that draft hoping Garland would slip is incompetence no matter how you try to spin it.

If Kwesi did something similar in this draft, he would trade to 5 ahead of time hoping the QB he likes the best would slip to him in a 4 QB draft.

I'm pretty sure they have a plan to get to 3 or 4 in the draft.
 


MplsGopher said:
100% correct

Heard Dan B say on Friday that Kurt Warner doesn't think very highly of Maye. Says he misses a lot of "layup" type passes.

Ay caramba. Especially if we give up future picks plus #11 and #23 to get into 3rd pick, take him, and he's the next Mac Jones.

J Fing C
Click to expand...
Kurt Warners top two were Kenny Pickett and Malik Willis. Will has yet to throw a td, and Pickett has already been traded.

J Fing C

 

kg21 said:
Kurt Warners top two were Kenny Pickett and Malik Willis. Will has yet to throw a td, and Pickett has already been traded.

J Fing C

Click to expand...
Even if they're all bad, there's always going to be a Top 2.
 



GopherWeatherGuy said:
Trading up to 6, when there was a pretty clear cut top 5 in that draft hoping Garland would slip is incompetence no matter how you try to spin it.

If Kwesi did something similar in this draft, he would trade to 5 ahead of time hoping the QB he likes the best would slip to him in a 4 QB draft.

I'm pretty sure they have a plan to get to 3 or 4 in the draft.
Click to expand...
Incompetence references a body of work. David Kahn was incompetent. Billy Smith was incompetent. Gerson Rosas miscalculated. He made a mistake. He was far from incompetent.

Kwesi is off to a bad start in terms of competency. He shouldn't do a twofer for an unproven when he has so few picks. His talent judging skills have been lacking so far. Maybe he takes the two 1sts and drafts the next Mahomes. History and his own body of work say that's unlikely.

Don't fall in love with the shiny object. The current Vikings front office haven't shown they are smarter than Rosas was. Not close.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom