All Things 2024-25 Vikings Regular Season Thread

[Slim Tubby]

KOC on PA today said no other receiver in the league gets played by defenses like Jefferson. He often has 3 of the 5 DBs covering him or favoring him. He changes the game.

The LAC just triple-boxed JaMar Chase on Sunday night, too. It's what helped Tee Higgins have a monster game opposite of Chase.

Ironically, Chase still got plenty of his own despite the bracketing but he has a better QB than JJ.

 

[Ope3]

Vikings are currently 15th in yards per game.

13th in passing yards per game.

19th in rushing yards per game.

10th in points per game.

Meanwhile, Vikings defense is tied for first in takeaways.

It looks (on the surface, at least) like the Brian Flores defense is what's working best.

Defense was also able to add resources once Cousins was let go, freeing up some salary cap space.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Vikings are currently 15th in yards per game.

13th in passing yards per game.

19th in rushing yards per game.

10th in points per game.

Meanwhile, Vikings defense is tied for first in takeaways.

It looks (on the surface, at least) like the Brian Flores defense is what's working best.

We’re also tied third in sacks with 35

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

The LAC just triple-boxed JaMar Chase on Sunday night, too. It's what helped Tee Higgins have a monster game opposite of Chase.

Ironically, Chase still got plenty of his own despite the bracketing but he has a better QB than JJ.

And Cincy’s D blows

 

[RememberMurray]

Defense was also able to add resources once Cousins was let go, freeing up some salary cap space.

Yes, and I'm not arguing that the Vikings should have given Cousins a deal to compete with the one Atlanta gave him... not at all. In fact, I think it was time to move on from Cousins.

I'm questioning the wisdom of paying a monster contract to a wide receiver. This is not an "either the QB or the WR" question.

What the team did was:

1) Let Cousins walk

2) Draft McCarthy

3) Use the savings from the Cousins decision to sign free agents, including some great signings on defense, plus sign Sam Darnold

4) Give Jefferson a league-leading contract

I am 100% in favor of 1, 2 and 3. I only have reservations about #4, and it's not because I think Jefferson is overrated — he is not. It's because of the position he plays, that's all.

 

[kg21]

Yes, and I'm not arguing that the Vikings should have given Cousins a deal to compete with the one Atlanta gave him... not at all. In fact, I think it was time to move on from Cousins.

I'm questioning the wisdom of paying a monster contract to a wide receiver. This is not an "either the QB or the WR" question.

What the team did was:

1) Let Cousins walk

2) Draft McCarthy

3) Use the savings from the Cousins decision to sign free agents, including some great signings on defense, plus sign Sam Darnold

4) Give Jefferson a league-leading contract

I am 100% in favor of 1, 2 and 3. I only have reservations about #4, and it's not because I think Jefferson is overrated — he is not. It's because of the position he plays, that's all.

I'm thinking the Vikings are about 2-8 with Jefferson not on this roster.

We have won several one score games. He takes a good share of the defense away by just being there.

Without him, they double Addison. I just don't know how we score without Jefferson. We are not great at running the ball. Without JJ, that would be far worse.

3-7 at best!

 

[howeda7]

Yes, and I'm not arguing that the Vikings should have given Cousins a deal to compete with the one Atlanta gave him... not at all. In fact, I think it was time to move on from Cousins.

I'm questioning the wisdom of paying a monster contract to a wide receiver. This is not an "either the QB or the WR" question.

What the team did was:

1) Let Cousins walk

2) Draft McCarthy

3) Use the savings from the Cousins decision to sign free agents, including some great signings on defense, plus sign Sam Darnold

4) Give Jefferson a league-leading contract

I am 100% in favor of 1, 2 and 3. I only have reservations about #4, and it's not because I think Jefferson is overrated — he is not. It's because of the position he plays, that's all.

He's an elite player who was under contract and you could keep long term and you have plenty of cap space. What position did you want them to spend it on instead? RB? CB? Safety? Is it better to overpay for those positions?

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

I'm thinking the Vikings are about 2-8 with Jefferson not on this roster.

We have won several one score games. He takes a good share of the defense away by just being there.

Without him, they double Addison. I just don't know how we score without Jefferson. We are not great at running the ball. Without JJ, that would be far worse.

3-7 at best!

The Vikings had a winning record without JJ last season and a losing record without Cousins. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. If Jefferson missed a game, the Vegas line wouldn't move more than a point, if that.

 

[Spaulding!No!]

The Vikings had a winning record without JJ last season and a losing record without Cousins. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. If Jefferson missed a game, the Vegas line wouldn't move more than a point, if that.

Gink!

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Gink!

Fink

 

[kg21]

The Vikings had a winning record without JJ last season and a losing record without Cousins. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. If Jefferson missed a game, the Vegas line wouldn't move more than a point, if that.

What do you think our record is without Jefferson?

 

[RememberMurray]

What do you think our record is without Jefferson?

I have no idea, but I do know it's not just about this season.

In what ways would the roster look different? I'm assuming the Vikings would not have simply released Jefferson, with nothing in return. Future picks? Players? And the money that is now allocated for Jefferson could have and would have been applied elsewhere in the roster, but we can't say exactly where.

Going forward, are there other areas that need improvement? Offensive line, maybe? Cornerback?

Paying one single player a big chunk of your cap reduces your future flexibility. Sometimes that's unavoidable, such as when a young QB or left tackle you drafted has outplayed his rookie contract and is due to re-up.

But a wide receiver? As I've said, I have my reservations.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

What do you think our record is without Jefferson?

I mean, without Jefferson, you would presumably still have a WR that is making $20M+, and in that scenario, they are probably still 7-3, 6-4 at worst; possibly still 8-2. You can't assume they would have that #1 WR spot empty and they are rolling with just Addison and Nailor and Sherfield, that's just not realistic. There would have been SOMEBODY in that spot, just not as elite as Jefferson

The thing about the Jefferson extension, why it makes sense in this limited scenario, by the time his big money hits, the salary cap will be considerably higher. I would have been okay if they didn't give him the big money, I can live with the fact that they did.

At the end of the day, this Front Office to this point has shown me that they know what the f*ck they are doing and they have a plan; both short term and long term plans. They are not dumb, I love the work they've done so far in clearing the books, moving off Cousins at just the right time, setting themselves up for 2025 and beyond, etc

 

[RememberMurray]

At the end of the day, this Front Office to this point has shown me that they know what the f*ck they are doing and they have a plan; both short term and long term plans. They are not dumb, I love the work they've done so far in clearing the books, moving off Cousins at just the right time, setting themselves up for 2025 and beyond, etc

Yes.

The Cousins situation was handled beautifully, in my opinion. They would have been foolish to pay anywhere close to what Atlanta is paying him.

Now they need to make sure they have a QB to go with the best, highest-paid receiver in football, and an offensive line that can protect that QB so that he has time to throw to the best, highest-paid WR in football.

Hmmmm... now that I've typed those words, it sure makes it sound like the Vikings are building this team around a WR.

 

[short ornery norwegian]

it's a catch-22.

you can win without star players, but it's a lot easier to win with star players.

but star players want to be paid like star players.

I think most people would agree that the Vikings are not as talented without Jefferson.

so it becomes a question of - is the loss of talent with a lesser receiver worth the lower salary that receiver would command?

If the Vikes save $10 or $15 million by going from Jefferson to another WR, where does that $10- or $15-million go and does it make them a better team - or maybe a more balanced team?

AND ***** do the Vikings have a QB who can be effective with less talent at the WR position?

I do not want to watch Darnold try to pull that off.

 

[RememberMurray]

it's a catch-22.

you can win without star players, but it's a lot easier to win with star players.

but star players want to be paid like star players.

I think most people would agree that the Vikings are not as talented without Jefferson.

so it becomes a question of - is the loss of talent with a lesser receiver worth the lower salary that receiver would command?

If the Vikes save $10 or $15 million by going from Jefferson to another WR, where does that $10- or $15-million go and does it make them a better team - or maybe a more balanced team?

AND ***** do the Vikings have a QB who can be effective with less talent at the WR position?

I do not want to watch Darnold try to pull that off.

If Jefferson makes any QB better, why do you need a great QB?

 

[short ornery norwegian]

If Jefferson makes any QB better, why do you need a great QB?

that is the exact opposite of what I said in that post. If you don't have Jefferson, you do need a QB who can be effective with less-talented WR's. If you do have Jefferson, then you probably can get by with a QB who is good but not great. Heck, they're doing that with Sam Darnold.

 

[Ope3]

Yes.

The Cousins situation was handled beautifully, in my opinion. They would have been foolish to pay anywhere close to what Atlanta is paying him.

Now they need to make sure they have a QB to go with the best, highest-paid receiver in football, and an offensive line that can protect that QB so that he has time to throw to the best, highest-paid WR in football.

Hmmmm... now that I've typed those words, it sure makes it sound like the Vikings are building this team around a WR.

I agree that this regime handled the Cousins situation as well as possible.

An effective offensive line is necessary in any situation.

 

[RememberMurray]

I agree that this regime handled the Cousins situation as well as possible.

An effective offensive line is necessary in any situation.

Oh, yes. So true. If your goal is to win a championship or two, you certainly need a good to great offensive line.

And, truth be told, you probably need a good to great QB.

And a good to great defense as well.

Where do you start? What's your priority? Which position is your keystone?

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Yes.

The Cousins situation was handled beautifully, in my opinion. They would have been foolish to pay anywhere close to what Atlanta is paying him.

Now they need to make sure they have a QB to go with the best, highest-paid receiver in football, and an offensive line that can protect that QB so that he has time to throw to the best, highest-paid WR in football.

Hmmmm... now that I've typed those words, it sure makes it sound like the Vikings are building this team around a WR.

Why does this have to be binary (either/or)?

Personally, I have found that the more complex challenges in life, lend themselves to solutions which work on multiple levels, an and/both paradigm. I would posit that building an NFL level SB contending roster is in latter bucket.

 

[RememberMurray]

Why does this have to be binary (either/or)?

Personally, I have found that the more complex challenges in life, lend themselves to solutions which work on multiple levels, an and/both paradigm. I would posit that building an NFL level SB contending roster is in latter bucket.

I'm not sure I see the 'binary (either/or)' part. I'm not clear what you mean.

 

[RememberMurray]

that is the exact opposite of what I said in that post. If you don't have Jefferson, you do need a QB who can be effective with less-talented WR's. If you do have Jefferson, then you probably can get by with a QB who is good but not great. Heck, they're doing that with Sam Darnold.

So, the plan/goal is... to 'get by'?

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

I'm not sure I see the 'binary (either/or)' part. I'm not clear what you mean.

From your post -

it sure makes it sound like the Vikings are building this team around a WR.

That sounds like an either/or proposition to me .

Maybe you’re not be open to a different possible perspective, than from yours above?

 

[RememberMurray]

From your post -

it sure makes it sound like the Vikings are building this team around a WR.

That sounds like an either/or proposition to me

How so? Where's the either/or in my statement?

My statement seems (to you) to be: Either _________, or __________.
Please fill in the blanks, then I'll finally grasp it. (I think my brain called in sick today).

 

[Ope3]

Oh, yes. So true. If your goal is to win a championship or two, you certainly need a good to great offensive line.

And, truth be told, you probably need a good to great QB.

And a good to great defense as well.

Where do you start? What's your priority? Which position is your keystone?

Left Tackle.

 

[RememberMurray]

Left Tackle.

Yep.

And then, next in line... wide receiver, I guess?

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

How so? Where's the either/or in that statement?

Either _________, or __________. Please fill in the blanks, then I'll finally grasp it. (I think my brain called in sick today).

I’m tapping out bro.

Honestly, if you don’t understand the point I’m trying to make at this juncture, I doubt it’s going to become more salient moving forward. So we’ll agree to disagree

Good Night & Good Luck.

 

[RememberMurray]

I’m tapping out bro.

Honestly, if you don’t understand the point I’m trying to make at this juncture, I doubt it’s going to become more salient moving forward. So we’ll agree to disagree

Good Night & Good Luck.

You too, bro.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Left Tackle.

Which has already been accomplished with Darisaw.

 

[RememberMurray]

Let me try this a different way...

Teams have a finite amount of money to spend, because of the NFL cap.

The Vikings just gave a league-leading amount to a wide receiver.

How many league-leading contracts can they write and still build the remaining parts of the roster with decent players, while staying within the cap?

Two more league-leading contracts? Three more? I think we'd all agree, not too many more.

If so, that means you have just put a very, very, very high premium on one wide receiver.