All Things 2023 Minnesota Vikings Off-Season Thread

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Hmmmm.

Did you actually play football (past middle school)?

How many NFL coordinators are fired and new ones hired every year (the exact situation that you’re lamenting as the end of the world🤣)? Each has their own system or version of it - learning a new system as in changing from a 3-4 to a 4-3 B is not a Herculean request.

NFL players have an elongated off-season which allows plenty of study time as well as ample practice time with mini- camps etc…many may also be familiar with the system or some type of version of it that the coordinator wants to run as the may have played it in college or the pros previously. There is not a infinite universes of schemes, bro.

This is their profession for Pete’s Sake.

Quite possibly, you’re not the NFL expert you claim to be?
I was an Hon Mention All-Am as a Junior and a pre-season AA as a senior in college but that really doesn't have much to do with any of your mindless incessant rantings you laid out here. It's clear to most of the board that you have some serious insecurity issues, among a litany of others.

I'm not doing much other than repeat a lot of the things that I've heard on a few different Vikings podcasts so it's not really my opinion at all, I just happen to think that line of thinking isn't that far off.

Feel free to offer your own assessment for us all to ponder?
 

kg21

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You're missing the point. Sure, I think they would be well-served to go away from Donatell's system.

I'm saying, if you think that changing schemes again, after one year, is not going to come with some serious growing pains from a group of guys who spent the last year learning something different, you're foolish and naive.
Well of course there are going to be growing pains. This defense is old, slow, and non-physical.

But why the hell would you keep last years system? I mean seriously.

go back to the a 4-3
 


kg21

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Damn, how depressing to watch the Eagles dismantle New York. Jones has 57 yards and 1 pick at the half.

JJ may be the only player who would start on the Eagles. I suppose Hockenson maybe.
 

JimmyJamesMD

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Vikes seem to be compliling a solid list of DC interview requests.

Makea me wonder what they were thinking last offseason hiring donashell
 


GopherWeatherGuy

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The Giants were the worst team in the playoffs until the Vikings proved they were the worst team in the playoffs.
 

short ornery norwegian

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on the defensive scheme.

O'Connell hires Donatell to switch to a 3-4. that forced some positional shuffling.

If you go back to a 4-3, that scheme might fit some of the current players, but the guys who were brought in to play a 3-4 might not be good fits. it's not as simple as just learning a new system. some people are just better suited for one system or the other because of their physical ability, size, speed, experience, etc.

And - with salary cap questions and only 4 picks in the draft, it's not like the Vikes can just bring in a whole new set of defensive players.

I don't think the problem is the 3-4 per se - I think the problem is the way Donatell had them trying to play the 3-4.

if you have good athletes, you can be a good defensive team in a 3-4 or a 4-3. if you don't have good athletes, no scheme is going to look great.
 

howeda7

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If Buffalo fans have their way, Sean McDermott might be available as a DC. Certainly Les Frazier might.
 




Ogee Ogilthorpe

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that loss is going to hurt. I was rooting for them.

I would have been good with either team winning, but I put a fairly decent futures bet with good odds about 2 months ago for Cincy to win the AFC Champ. One more game!! Go Broadway Joe!!

I still think Zac Taylor is pretty clueless as an NFL HC. Burrow deserves better, but they're making it work for now. Taylor should have a shrine to Burrow in his basement that he kneels and prays to every night before bed.
 

forever a gopher

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I would have been good with either team winning, but I put a fairly decent futures bet with good odds about 2 months ago for Cincy to win the AFC Champ. One more game!! Go Broadway Joe!!

I still think Zac Taylor is pretty clueless as an NFL HC. Burrow deserves better, but they're making it work for now. Taylor should have a shrine to Burrow in his basement that he kneels and prays to every night before bed.
I laughed when they were saying how the Bengals were 100% behind his “vision” and how even though they sucked his first two years as a coach, they stuck by him. Then, these past two years have been the payoff for sticking with him, as now they’ve been excellent. Of course they failed to mention the turnaround completely coincided with a healthy Burrow. But yeah, it’s because of the coaching…
 

kg21

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I'm just enjoying watching these playoffs for the hitting on defense, the swarming, and at times seeing two guys on a receiver step for step.

It's like I'd forgotten what defense was.
 

kg21

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Bye, Bye Jerry Jones......don't cry buddy.

Another week of Brock Purdy love. Oh, great!
 



Ope3

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I laughed when they were saying how the Bengals were 100% behind his “vision” and how even though they sucked his first two years as a coach, they stuck by him. Then, these past two years have been the payoff for sticking with him, as now they’ve been excellent. Of course they failed to mention the turnaround completely coincided with a healthy Burrow. But yeah, it’s because of the coaching…
Yeah, Burrow is the #1 reason they are a Super Bowl contender in back-to-back seasons but their Defense should not be downplayed. They have been outstanding since last years playoff run.

How much Taylor has to do with that other than input with choosing the Coordinator, I have no idea.
 

howeda7

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Vikes seem to be compliling a solid list of DC interview requests.

Makea me wonder what they were thinking last offseason hiring donashell
KOC was hired pretty late due to the Super Bowl. I think Ed just checked a boxes of "I want to run a 3-4", "get a veteran to run the defense" and was available.
 

howeda7

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on the defensive scheme.

O'Connell hires Donatell to switch to a 3-4. that forced some positional shuffling.

If you go back to a 4-3, that scheme might fit some of the current players, but the guys who were brought in to play a 3-4 might not be good fits. it's not as simple as just learning a new system. some people are just better suited for one system or the other because of their physical ability, size, speed, experience, etc.

And - with salary cap questions and only 4 picks in the draft, it's not like the Vikes can just bring in a whole new set of defensive players.

I don't think the problem is the 3-4 per se - I think the problem is the way Donatell had them trying to play the 3-4.

if you have good athletes, you can be a good defensive team in a 3-4 or a 4-3. if you don't have good athletes, no scheme is going to look great.
The only players they really brought in specifically for the 3-4 are Zadarius Smith and Jordan Hicks. I expect them both to be gone. So they can easily switch back to a 4-3 without having mismatched personnel. From the draft, I suppose Assamoah is better in the 3-4 but I don't see why he can't play either and he's not someone you build around anyway.

Hunter is clearly better in the 4-3 and he's your best defensive player. That alone is reason to switch back IMO.
 

Gopher_In_NYC

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I was an Hon Mention All-Am as a Junior and a pre-season AA as a senior in college but that really doesn't have much to do with any of your mindless incessant rantings you laid out here. It's clear to most of the board that you have some serious insecurity issues, among a litany of others.

I'm not doing much other than repeat a lot of the things that I've heard on a few different Vikings podcasts so it's not really my opinion at all, I just happen to think that line of thinking isn't that far off.

Feel free to offer your own assessment for us all to ponder?
 

JimmyJamesMD

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The only players they really brought in specifically for the 3-4 are Zadarius Smith and Jordan Hicks. I expect them both to be gone. So they can easily switch back to a 4-3 without having mismatched personnel. From the draft, I suppose Assamoah is better in the 3-4 but I don't see why he can't play either and he's not someone you build around anyway.

Hunter is clearly better in the 4-3 and he's your best defensive player. That alone is reason to switch back IMO.
and if youre going to be a 3 - 4, I'd make him a DE. No more linebacking for him.

I still prefer a 4-3.
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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and if youre going to be a 3 - 4, I'd make him a DE. No more linebacking for him.

I still prefer a 4-3.

From the people I've heard linked to the Vikings, I would most prefer Sean Desai from Seattle; he's supposed to be a DB teaching guru, and I like his track record so far. It would be a change from Donatell, but not a complete overhaul.
 

march madness

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The defense finished just as terrible as the year before where we ran a 4-3.
Best players on defense, not named Hunter looked old and slow as the year went on. safety Cine was burried om depth chart then lost for the season. 2nd rd cb didn't help then got hurt too. I have no confidence in Vikings ability to evaluate corners: Hughes, Gladney. Want the to draft another in the first? Team need help everywhere on defense and has been weak on interior off line for over a decade. Also rumors of a first rrd wr in the draft. To me there are many more areas of weakness especially on defense!
 

short ornery norwegian

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shoot - just saw an online headline of "Vikings cut ties with QB."

clicked on it.

the QB they were talking about was Josh Rosen. who was on the Vikings practice squad. the Vikes had picked him up on waivers.

clickbait wins again.
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Ryan Nielsen gets hired as the new Atlanta Falcons DC, coming from coaching DL at the Saints.

Nielsen was one of the guys the Vikings have been looking at really hard for DC, along with Brian Flores and Sean Desai. Nielsen was the one that I was the least interested in; Flores or Desai would be pretty good but Flores is I think still being considered for a few HC spots.

Wilks is now in play for DC after the Carolina Panthers switched gears and hired Frank Reich for HC instead of Wilks. Wilks would probably be a decent choice as well
 

Ope3

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Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Future AFC & NFC Conference Championship Games at neutral sites?

This idea sucks.


But usually, money wins.

I get both sides of the equation, but I kind of like it really. I think back to the San Diego Chargers - Cincinnati Bengals AFC Champ game when the Chargers were flying high with Air Coryell and Dan Fouts, having to go into Cincy and that stupid arctic game. Cincy goes to the Super Bowl and gets embarrassed, nobody wanted to see that shit.

But sure, there should be something to earning the #1 seed. The thing is, the way the playoffs are set up now, there IS something to earning the #1 seed; you get that first week Bye.

The way the NFL is going, more and more offense, more points, fans seem to want that... this wouldn't surprise me if they go this way. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but some will love it, some will hate it.
 

kg21

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I get both sides of the equation, but I kind of like it really. I think back to the San Diego Chargers - Cincinnati Bengals AFC Champ game when the Chargers were flying high with Air Coryell and Dan Fouts, having to go into Cincy and that stupid arctic game. Cincy goes to the Super Bowl and gets embarrassed, nobody wanted to see that shit.

But sure, there should be something to earning the #1 seed. The thing is, the way the playoffs are set up now, there IS something to earning the #1 seed; you get that first week Bye.

The way the NFL is going, more and more offense, more points, fans seem to want that... this wouldn't surprise me if they go this way. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but some will love it, some will hate it.
All done for $$$$$$, not the betterment of the game or the fans who support their team.

Gross, but predictable.
 


Gophers_4life

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Win 13 regular season games, win the division ... all for nothing in 2022. And just sunk 2023 down lower, with a lower draft pick and harder opponents.
 

Gophers_4life

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Perfect example of why the Vikings defensive scheme and strategy/playcalling was just as big an issue for the defense as having old/bad players.

From The Athletic yesterday (emphasis added by me):


All season, Minnesota leaned heavily into what is commonly referred to as Cover 6. In layman’s terms, that means the defense has two players occupying a quarter of the field in coverage on one side and one player occupying half the field on the other side.

No NFL team ran this coverage more than the Vikings (25.6 percent of their defensive snaps) in 2022. The only team that allowed more yards per play in this coverage than the Vikings was the Raiders.

Digging a bit deeper, the Vikings were vulnerable in all areas of the field in this coverage. They allowed 10.53 yards per play when teams threw the ball to the middle of the field against their Cover 6. And they allowed 10.78 yards per play when teams threw the ball outside of the numbers against their Cover 6.

Compound those facts with the reality that the Vikings had a better success rate in each of their other coverages, and you arrive at a logical question: Why, then, would the Vikings continue to play Cover 6? It feels fair to further challenge Donatell’s decision-making.

His stated goal was to limit explosive plays by the opposition. By playing Cover 6, at least one cornerback tends to have help over the top. On the other hand, when playing coverages with only one safety in the middle of the field, such as Cover 3, cornerbacks are left more on their own island.

What’s jarring is how susceptible the Vikings were against deep passes in both types of coverages. Opponents completed 25 of 48 attempted passes of 15 yards or more in the air against the Vikings’ Cover 6. Meanwhile, when the Vikings played Cover 3, opponents completed 17 of 34 passes of 15 yards or more in the air.

Some of these defensive missteps were the result of confusion. Others occurred because of lackluster technique or mismatches in athleticism. On most of these plays, it’s difficult to separate whether the issue was coaches failing to teach or players struggling to apply those teachings.
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Win 13 regular season games, win the division ... all for nothing in 2022. And just sunk 2023 down lower, with a lower draft pick and harder opponents.
I'm going to go out on a limb and venture that there is NOBODY in the organization that thinks winning 13 games and winning the NFC North title in KOC and KAM's first season in Minnesota is "all for nothing".

This is some seriously f'd up mentality
 

GFBfan

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I get both sides of the equation, but I kind of like it really. I think back to the San Diego Chargers - Cincinnati Bengals AFC Champ game when the Chargers were flying high with Air Coryell and Dan Fouts, having to go into Cincy and that stupid arctic game. Cincy goes to the Super Bowl and gets embarrassed, nobody wanted to see that shit.

But sure, there should be something to earning the #1 seed. The thing is, the way the playoffs are set up now, there IS something to earning the #1 seed; you get that first week Bye.

The way the NFL is going, more and more offense, more points, fans seem to want that... this wouldn't surprise me if they go this way. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but some will love it, some will hate it.
I can't imagine the owners wanting this if their team is the higher seed. They get a larger % of the profit, where in a neutral site game, they are splitting the money or the league is going to take the profit.
The Bengals weren't embarrassed as they lost to the Niners 26 to 21. Having the better regular season record should mean something. Yes the #1 seed gets a bye, but if they get beat the #2 seed should get to have home field for the title game if they make it that far.
I would rather they seed the playoffs by record once it is determined who makes the playoffs than have them move the Championship game to a neutral site.
For the NFC this year that would have gone #1 Phila, #2 SF, #3 Vikings, #4 Dallas, #5 Giants, #6 Seattle and #7 Tampa. In the AFC, #1 KC, #2 Buffalo, #3 Cinci, #4 San Diego (better Conf. Record), #5 Baltimore, #6 Jacksonville then #7 Miami
 




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