All Things 2023 Minnesota Vikings Off-Season Thread

GophersInIowa

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SO ANYWAY, back in our reality ....

not actual names, but: should KOC just try to bring in some other "Fangio DC", or should he switch back to a more tried-and-true 4-3 DC?
With the current players, 4-3 makes way more sense IMO. But if they're going to blow it up, I think 3-4 could be good.
 

JimmyJamesMD

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SO ANYWAY, back in our reality ....

not actual names, but: should KOC just try to bring in some other "Fangio DC", or should he switch back to a more tried-and-true 4-3 DC?
anyone that schemes to the strength of their team i will take. Need innovation, not a static system
 

JimmyJamesMD

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Cleveland is just fine. Ingram was literally a rookie.

Bradbury can walk if he thinks his career performance to date will earn him $$$ elsewhere. We played just as well with Schlottmann, and I'd be fine riding with him at Center next year.


Absolutely won't be wasting a high draft pick on an interior OL.

You can go ahead and put that L in pen for howeda7. Sorry!
I used to discount interior lineman. But OL and OL depth is becoming a problem in the league. If you tell me that i can guard an OG thats expected to be a pro bowler often, im taking him. So what if Ingram goes to the bench, then its depth
 

Gophers_4life

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I used to discount interior lineman. But OL and OL depth is becoming a problem in the league. If you tell me that i can guard an OG thats expected to be a pro bowler often, im taking him. So what if Ingram goes to the bench, then its depth
If you had a magic genie, then fine.

The obvious problem is: how do you tell??


Elflein :(
 

Bfan

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Priority #1 is switching back to a 4-3 defense.

Today the defensive coordinator was fired. I hope that kills for good the inferior 3-4.

Minnesota has a long history if good 4-3 defenses with some of the greatest pass rushing tackles in history.

The 4-3 is THE way.
 


From the Parkinglot

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What I love about the whole thing is KOC and Kwesi did their whole song and dance year end press conference yesterday afternoon. They knew full well that Donatell’s ass was gone at that time. They made no mention of it as to avoid any questions regarding it. Then at 5:30pm they release a statement on Twitter that they fired him. What a bunch of gutless people running sports teams are. Man up and say you are firing him before the press conference. Now you won’t see or hear from either of them until a week before the draft. Maybe when they hire a new DC, but that’s a not a guaranty to not just be a press release.

Your defense sucked and it sucked all year and it stopped you from moving on in the playoffs. Take some accountability for your actions on hiring this guy and then having to fire him after 1 season. I assume you still owe him a decent amount of money too.
 

Gopherguy0723

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The best thing the Vikings can do is draft the best player available. They have too many needs.

Namely they need the following:
WR
S
CB
ILB
Edge
DT
Interior OL
RB

You don't draft ILBs, RBs, or CBs in Round 1. So, among the remaining positions, they need to draft the best player available.
 

Ope3

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I know this would never, ever have been on the table, but still seems true:

- KOC takes over the team, is the soul of the team, dictates its culture, has a great relationship with Kirk, runs the offense .... and
- Zimmer is DC, with his same defensive staff, doing the same things they had always been doing, players know the system, he's not in charge of the team, stays away from Kirk and the offense, doesn't go on TV, just does his defensive guru thing

= who knows. Maybe Super Bowl this year.

DAMN
The Vikings defense under Zimmer was ranked 27th in 2020 and 30th in 2021 in terms of Yards Allowed. With the returnees all a year older in 2022, I can't say with any certainty at all that they would have been any better then they were under Donatell (31st).
 

GophersInIowa

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What I love about the whole thing is KOC and Kwesi did their whole song and dance year end press conference yesterday afternoon. They knew full well that Donatell’s ass was gone at that time. They made no mention of it as to avoid any questions regarding it. Then at 5:30pm they release a statement on Twitter that they fired him. What a bunch of gutless people running sports teams are. Man up and say you are firing him before the press conference. Now you won’t see or hear from either of them until a week before the draft. Maybe when they hire a new DC, but that’s a not a guaranty to not just be a press release.

Your defense sucked and it sucked all year and it stopped you from moving on in the playoffs. Take some accountability for your actions on hiring this guy and then having to fire him after 1 season. I assume you still owe him a decent amount of money too.
Would would you expect them to say about the firing? They're not going to go into details so it would just be the standard "we want to go in a different direction" statement.
 



short ornery norwegian

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look - the entire defense needs to get younger and faster.

complicating matters, you just don't know how good Cine and Booth might be until or unless they are healthy and can get back on the field. Evans showed some flashes before his concussion issues.

that's one of the problems - hard to make decisions when you have so much uncertainty over whether some of these guys can play and whether they can stay healthy.
 

Gophers_4life

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The Vikings defense under Zimmer was ranked 27th in 2020 and 30th in 2021 in terms of Yards Allowed. With the returnees all a year older in 2022, I can't say with any certainty at all that they would have been any better then they were under Donatell (31st).
They wouldn't do bizarre crap. Stuff where everyone is like "what the hell is that???"

They wouldn't leave huge swaths of field open in games (eg, against the Eagles) ..... and then just not fix it all season.

The rest of your post, I can't disagree with, who knows. Wish I could peer into that alternate universe!
 

Gophers_4life

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Priority #1 is switching back to a 4-3 defense.

Today the defensive coordinator was fired. I hope that kills for good the inferior 3-4.

Minnesota has a long history if good 4-3 defenses with some of the greatest pass rushing tackles in history.

The 4-3 is THE way.
They played a 40 front, most of the snaps this year. Whether you call it a 2-4-5 or a 4-2-5 is a bit of hand waiving.

Guys who played DE with their hand in the dirt their whole careers were told "no no no, stand up in a 2 point stance. See?!"
 

Gophers_4life

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The best thing the Vikings can do is draft the best player available. They have too many needs.

Namely they need the following:
WR
S
CB
ILB
Edge
DT
Interior OL
RB

You don't draft ILBs, RBs, or CBs in Round 1. So, among the remaining positions, they need to draft the best player available.
I'll take Safety, DL, OLB every day and twice on draft day over a WR or interior OL. Yeah I know, best guy and people have made fine comments for taking JSN if available.
 



Bob_Loblaw

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The best thing the Vikings can do is draft the best player available. They have too many needs.

Namely they need the following:
WR
S
CB

ILB
Edge
DT
Interior OL
RB

You don't draft ILBs, RBs, or CBs in Round 1. So, among the remaining positions, they need to draft the best player available.
I'm not disagreeing with you, but the fact that those are still three of our biggest draft needs after last season is a major condemnation on last year's draft.

We also need a C really bad.
 

From the Parkinglot

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Would would you expect them to say about the firing? They're not going to go into details so it would just be the standard "we want to go in a different direction" statement.
It’s just a poor look. Any statement from an actual person vs a Twitter account is a start.
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Priority #1 is switching back to a 4-3 defense.

Today the defensive coordinator was fired. I hope that kills for good the inferior 3-4.

Minnesota has a long history if good 4-3 defenses with some of the greatest pass rushing tackles in history.

The 4-3 is THE way.

So you're convinced that the current defensive roster, after spending the last 10-12 months learning Donatell's 3-4 defense, will magically be a strong and efficient defense by changing the entire defensive scheme AGAIN? Starting over with an entirely new defensive scheme again this year will suddenly translate into a great defense? How much do you think these guys are capable of digesting in the span of 2+ years?

They may go this route and it may work out but it's foolish to think that this group can just turn it off and on like a switch, easily flip-flopping entire defensive schemes at the drop of a hat. Dumb...
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Your defense sucked and it sucked all year and it stopped you from moving on in the playoffs. Take some accountability for your actions on hiring this guy and then having to fire him after 1 season. I assume you still owe him a decent amount of money too.

You can make a pretty strong argument that recognizing the mistake and making an immediate change after just one year is the very definition of taking accountability
 

kg21

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Clean house on defense.
So you're convinced that the current defensive roster, after spending the last 10-12 months learning Donatell's 3-4 defense, will magically be a strong and efficient defense by changing the entire defensive scheme AGAIN? Starting over with an entirely new defensive scheme again this year will suddenly translate into a great defense? How much do you think these guys are capable of digesting in the span of 2+ years?

They may go this route and it may work out but it's foolish to think that this group can just turn it off and on like a switch, easily flip-flopping entire defensive schemes at the drop of a hat. Dumb...
If they switch from something that sucks........well, I guess I'm not understanding the problem with the switch.
 

Ope3

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So you're convinced that the current defensive roster, after spending the last 10-12 months learning Donatell's 3-4 defense, will magically be a strong and efficient defense by changing the entire defensive scheme AGAIN? Starting over with an entirely new defensive scheme again this year will suddenly translate into a great defense? How much do you think these guys are capable of digesting in the span of 2+ years?

They may go this route and it may work out but it's foolish to think that this group can just turn it off and on like a switch, easily flip-flopping entire defensive schemes at the drop of a hat. Dumb...
I hope Minnesota defenders (the ones that remain with the new coordinator) unlearn the scheme quickly which allows a receiver on a crossing pattern to catch a ball without a Viking helmet anywhere on my TV screen.
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Clean house on defense.

If they switch from something that sucks........well, I guess I'm not understanding the problem with the switch.
You're missing the point. Sure, I think they would be well-served to go away from Donatell's system.

I'm saying, if you think that changing schemes again, after one year, is not going to come with some serious growing pains from a group of guys who spent the last year learning something different, you're foolish and naive.
 

From the Parkinglot

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You can make a pretty strong argument that recognizing the mistake and making an immediate change after just one year is the very definition of taking accountability
Disagree. Especially when you fire him 5 hours after your season ending press conference. Plus his defense was a huge reason why you lost. It’s a chicken shit move.
 


Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Disagree. Especially when you fire him 5 hours after your season ending press conference. Plus his defense was a huge reason why you lost. It’s a chicken shit move.

Meh... Such is life in the NFL. Same thing happened to dozens of guys this last week. Fair or unfair, they know the drill. Donatell was not shocked this happened, make no mistake.
 


Gopher_In_NYC

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So you're convinced that the current defensive roster, after spending the last 10-12 months learning Donatell's 3-4 defense, will magically be a strong and efficient defense by changing the entire defensive scheme AGAIN? Starting over with an entirely new defensive scheme again this year will suddenly translate into a great defense? How much do you think these guys are capable of digesting in the span of 2+ years?

They may go this route and it may work out but it's foolish to think that this group can just turn it off and on like a switch, easily flip-flopping entire defensive schemes at the drop of a hat. Dumb...
Hmmmm.

Did you actually play football (past middle school)?

How many NFL coordinators are fired and new ones hired every year (the exact situation that you’re lamenting as the end of the world🤣)? Each has their own system or version of it - learning a new system as in changing from a 3-4 to a 4-3 B is not a Herculean request.

NFL players have an elongated off-season which allows plenty of study time as well as ample practice time with mini- camps etc…many may also be familiar with the system or some type of version of it that the coordinator wants to run as the may have played it in college or the pros previously. There is not a infinite universes of schemes, bro.

This is their profession for Pete’s Sake.

Quite possibly, you’re not the NFL expert you claim to be?
 
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Ogee Ogilthorpe

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Lots of coach shuffling going on, it's often almost as fun to watch as the player/FA offseason shuffle.

One thing interesting... just how dumb does Byron Leftwich look right now? He turns down the Jax Jag HC gig last year because he didn't want to work with the GM (Baalke, who I guess can be a turd but has made a lot of good moves) and now he's canned from OC of the Bucs and he won't be even getting another OC gig more than likely; he'll have to try to latch on somewhere as a QB Coach.

Lesson learned there for a lot of other prospective HC's... it may not be the best gig but in a world where the opportunities just don't come up very often (there's only 32 of them), when the chance is there, you should probably take it.
 

howeda7

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Would would you expect them to say about the firing? They're not going to go into details so it would just be the standard "we want to go in a different direction" statement.
"Coach Zimmer why aren't you bringing back coach X?" "Because I didn't want to" was a good one. But O'Connell would just give a boring 30 second answer that says the same thing I imagine
 

Ogee Ogilthorpe

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I can definitely get behind someone like Flores for DC, although he'll get some HC looks this cycle as well; I think the Cardinals are looking at him for HC.

The real question for Flores is, did you learn anything about your time in Miami, particularly in regards to how you treat people? I'm not sure how easy it will be to glean that information in an interview but by all accounts, he was an insufferable f'ng asshole to everyone in the building in Miami. He created just an intensely hostile work environment with people everywhere walking on eggshells.

A very, very good defensive coach, hopefully he lands somewhere and it works out and he's learned from past experiences.
 






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