All Things 2020 Minnesota Vikings In-Season Thread

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GO4INLALALAND said:
You think so? 1-4 and the defense looks horrible. I’d be surprised if he survives. I’m a Packer fan, so I don’t have a horse in the race, but this is a deflating loss. BTW, I was rooting for the Vikings.
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He's not getting fired this week. I'm not saying he'll be the coach next season. TBD.
 

Didn’t understand going for two so early, then kicking the Pat after that.
the 4th down call was right decision. Mattison just missed the hole.
 

I rarely watch the Vikings so I had to laugh out loud when I watched them snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. A classic failure to execute, despite having possession of the ball for 2/3rds of the game.
"If it weren't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all..."
 

The heartbreaking part of this is that, with the possible exception of qb play, I like how this team has improved and is coming together. I like this team! They could be / should be 3-2 and in the mix. Instead they're 1-4, and it's looking like a lost season. And with the team's salary cap situation, there'll be a need or at least a temptation to blow it up and rebuild.

They're good enough that they'll win plenty more games and avoid a top draft pick, too--basically a worst-case scenario.
 

Bad Gopher said:
The heartbreaking part of this is that, with the possible exception of qb play, I like how this team has improved and is coming together. I like this team! They could be / should be 3-2 and in the mix. Instead they're 1-4, and it's looking like a lost season. And with the team's salary cap situation, there'll be a need or at least a temptation to blow it up and rebuild.

They're good enough that they'll win plenty more games and avoid a top draft pick, too--basically a worst-case scenario.
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This has been the Vikings for about 30 years...somewhere in between 11-5 and 5-11. Never great and never horrendous.
 




Bad Gopher said:
The heartbreaking part of this is that, with the possible exception of qb play, I like how this team has improved and is coming together. I like this team! They could be / should be 3-2 and in the mix. Instead they're 1-4, and it's looking like a lost season. And with the team's salary cap situation, there'll be a need or at least a temptation to blow it up and rebuild.

They're good enough that they'll win plenty more games and avoid a top draft pick, too--basically a worst-case scenario.
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I said this earlier, and re-looking at their schedule, it really does seem like 7-9 or 8-8 is likely. There are some bad teams on the schedule that they will have a good chance of winning. One of them is this week against the Falcons.

Games I'm assuming at this point they will have a greater than 50% chance of winning:
Falcons (home)
Lions (home)
Cowboys w/o Dak (home)
Panthers (home)
Jaguars (home)
Lions (away)

I don't think this team necessarily needs to be "blown up" with a total rebuild. However, Spielman/Zim (who are fighting for their jobs every year) have band-aided things over and over again to the detriment of the long-term health. This has put them in the position of possibly needing a total rebuild. IF (big IF) they lose enough games to be close enough to draft or move up and draft a franchise QB this year, things don't look so bad. Cousins can be cut after 2021 and you save boatloads of money with a QB on a rookie deal. Barr is being paid edge rusher money, but not playing that position. He is easy to jettison. I think he has decent value on a 3-4 defensive team that he has some trade value. Harris is making way too much money for what he provides. Luckily he is franchised and you just don't resign him. I would say keep Kendricks, Smith, Hunter, Ngokue (sp?), Wilson, the rookie CB's and build around them. You have the advantage of having two good/elite pass rushers, which many teams don't. If you get rid of Harris and Barr, you have some money to get an experienced free agent CB to help out the rookies. Draft a safety in the third round where you can still get a good value at that position. You also presumably have the big DT coming back in 2021. After 2021 you can free up Cousins' money, which can go to the OL to protect your young QB. WR's and RB are signed to reasonable deals for multi-years that you don't have to address those. I'm assuming Irv Smith can be a serviceable TE.

I don't trust Spielman moving forward. I want to see him gone with all of these moves. We don't need to trade our higher draft picks for a bag of magic beans, which he does too often. I don't have a problem keeping Zim, but he can't have as much input on drafting and free agents.
 

Bad Gopher said:
For the second time this year, the difference in the game is an ill-advised 2-point conversion attempt too early in the game.

Not gonna criticize the decision not to kick the FG.
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agree 100%. When you go for 2 that early, there is so much that can happen in the game yet. You may very well need that point later and that's exactly what happened yesterday. I feel like pro coaches are worse at this than college coaches.
 




gopher7 said:
agree 100%. When you go for 2 that early, there is so much that can happen in the game yet. You may very well need that point later and that's exactly what happened yesterday. I feel like pro coaches are worse at this than college coaches.
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I think part of this is that Zimmer is impulsive. He wanted the closure of a tie, and he wanted an Oompa Loompa, and he wanted one now.
 

forever a gopher said:
WOW. That's bad. Cook doesn't make that mistake.
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Or at least Cook doesn't nose dive into the block thinking he could gain the first down by a centimeter, which is how I interpret Mattison's body language. Cook stays upright, and he keeps his feet moving, and it may have taken second or third effort, but Cook gets the job done in that situation.
 

Cousins is making way too much money, to make a really poor throw like he did on the interception. His career record vs winning teams, and on Monday night games, is historically bad.
 



Bad Gopher said:
The heartbreaking part of this is that, with the possible exception of qb play, I like how this team has improved and is coming together. I like this team! They could be / should be 3-2 and in the mix. Instead they're 1-4, and it's looking like a lost season. And with the team's salary cap situation, there'll be a need or at least a temptation to blow it up and rebuild.

They're good enough that they'll win plenty more games and avoid a top draft pick, too--basically a worst-case scenario.
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I think we are (or were) getting the worst of the salary situation over with this year. If the D can keep improving and then you add Pierce, Hunter and Barr back into it, you could be back to having a top 5 defense next year. Huge unknown: How much the cap comes down because of COVID.
 

LakevilleBro said:
Cousins is making way too much money, to make a really poor throw like he did on the interception. His career record vs winning teams, and on Monday night games, is historically bad.
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His record in primetime is awful, but outside of the interception, it's hard to put last night on him. We appeared to be in full meltdown mode after the 21 point outburst and he drove us to back-to-back TD's and had us in position to win the game.
 


forever a gopher said:
I said this earlier, and re-looking at their schedule, it really does seem like 7-9 or 8-8 is likely. There are some bad teams on the schedule that they will have a good chance of winning. One of them is this week against the Falcons.

Games I'm assuming at this point they will have a greater than 50% chance of winning:
Falcons (home)
Lions (home)
Cowboys w/o Dak (home)
Panthers (home)
Jaguars (home)
Lions (away)

I don't think this team necessarily needs to be "blown up" with a total rebuild. However, Spielman/Zim (who are fighting for their jobs every year) have band-aided things over and over again to the detriment of the long-term health. This has put them in the position of possibly needing a total rebuild. IF (big IF) they lose enough games to be close enough to draft or move up and draft a franchise QB this year, things don't look so bad. Cousins can be cut after 2021 and you save boatloads of money with a QB on a rookie deal. Barr is being paid edge rusher money, but not playing that position. He is easy to jettison. I think he has decent value on a 3-4 defensive team that he has some trade value. Harris is making way too much money for what he provides. Luckily he is franchised and you just don't resign him. I would say keep Kendricks, Smith, Hunter, Ngokue (sp?), Wilson, the rookie CB's and build around them. You have the advantage of having two good/elite pass rushers, which many teams don't. If you get rid of Harris and Barr, you have some money to get an experienced free agent CB to help out the rookies. Draft a safety in the third round where you can still get a good value at that position. You also presumably have the big DT coming back in 2021. After 2021 you can free up Cousins' money, which can go to the OL to protect your young QB. WR's and RB are signed to reasonable deals for multi-years that you don't have to address those. I'm assuming Irv Smith can be a serviceable TE.

I don't trust Spielman moving forward. I want to see him gone with all of these moves. We don't need to trade our higher draft picks for a bag of magic beans, which he does too often. I don't have a problem keeping Zim, but he can't have as much input on drafting and free agents.
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9-7 is still within reach, and is very likely to be good enough to make the play-offs. They have to win all remaining home games and steal two road wins. Considering one of those can be the Lions, it shouldn't be that hard to find another one.

I kind of like Zimmer and Kubiak in tandem. I would prefer to keep them and get a new GM.
 
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Bad Gopher said:
Or at least Cook doesn't nose dive into the block thinking he could gain the first down by a centimeter, which is how I interpret Mattison's body language. Cook stays upright, and he keeps his feet moving, and it may have taken second or third effort, but Cook gets the job done in that situation.
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Agreed, or just run to the area where there no other players wearing glow-in-the-dark-green.

They Vikes did cover the 6.5 though! :cool:
 


Ope3 said:
Agreed, or just run to the area where there no other players wearing glow-in-the-dark-green.

They Vikes did cover the 6.5 though! :cool:
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Kind of a meaningless stat, although there has to be SOMETHING to it in regards to coaching acumen but I've heard from the Vegas wise guys on multiple occasions on the betting podcasts that since Zimmer became HC of the Vikings, the Vikings are the number 1 team in the NFL ATS (against the spread) and it is not even close, he's light years ahead of the next guy, who I think is Belichick. Zim against the spread is like 65-70% I think.

After that I got nuthin
 


I didn’t see the game. Watched the highlights.

there was a challenge that is mind boggling to me.

the incomplete/fumble- the whistles blows, then multiple whistles follow. There is absolutely no question.

Seattle picks up the ball and runs it in.

NFL rule states whistles blows thats it. dead ball. What was the logic they gave for awardin

Coversely, If it didn’t blow, and is a fumble, then why is it not a TD?

What was the logic they gave for awarding Seattle the ball on the 15?
 

If there is a fumble and the whistle blows, the other team can get the ball if there is a clear recovery. But because the whistle blew, the play is dead so they get the ball where they recovered it and nothing else counts.
 

WilliamsArenaGuy said:
If there is a fumble and the whistle blows, the other team can get the ball if there is a clear recovery. But because the whistle blew, the play is dead so they get the ball where they recovered it and nothing else counts.
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They recovered after the whistle blew.
 




Bad Gopher said:
Jesus balls, he could've walked into the end zone. This gd team is cursed.
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Thanks for posting this.

It has pretty much all been said by others in this thread, but would like to point out one thing. That is: based on the technique used and the location of the hand-off, this does not seem like an outside zone play. It looks like the hole was supposed to be right over or off the Tackle. And for a moment, that lane was there. But then their LB slammed hard into that hole to plug it up.

In real time, things move so fast. RBs are taught not to dance in the hole, and to hit it hard.

I know, sounds like an apology. Hindsight, he might've easily scored a TD if he somehow would've gone to the right of the block. And the million dollar question is, would Cook have made that read and done it?
 

I still like the chances for this team. I know I'm crazy.

Cousins only made the one bad mistake. It was a bad play on him, he knew that. But guess what ...... so did Russell. He made a "bad" choice too, leading to a pick. Still won the game, and he is so dangerous with his feet.

Our rag-tag defense played pretty well most of the game. Eric Wilson suddenly played like an all-Pro. Rookie corners. Even the rookie DT got a sack, hope he gets to play more.

Cook gets hurt a lot, and it is a shame, he is an outstanding player. Still not sure if he was worth that much money.


It's our OL, and has been. You can almost boil it down to Samia. Ranked last for guards in the league by PFF, even called out several times by the announcers, either for stupid penalties or poor performance.

But naturally, our last play -- and yeah I'm sure there was little chance of getting into FG range -- O'Neill randomly decides to get badly beat, when he had played great all game.


On the early 2pt ... most of that is dictated by the score. Pretty sure I've heard time and again that coaches have it basically boiled down to a spreadsheet on what the scores are when you should go for it. As far as not kicking the FG late, I would've definitely gone for it. Should get it, if not, pinned deep and defense played pretty well. That's how you have to play. You start playing to not lose, you for sure get beat. Just gotta execute.
 

MplsGopher said:
Thanks for posting this.

It has pretty much all been said by others in this thread, but would like to point out one thing. That is: based on the technique used and the location of the hand-off, this does not seem like an outside zone play. It looks like the hole was supposed to be right over or off the Tackle. And for a moment, that lane was there. But then their LB slammed hard into that hole to plug it up.

In real time, things move so fast. RBs are taught not to dance in the hole, and to hit it hard.

I know, sounds like an apology. Hindsight, he might've easily scored a TD if he somehow would've gone to the right of the block. And the million dollar question is, would Cook have made that read and done it?
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This is totally valid and true, but a couple things:

What separates the good ones from the very good ones is the ability to improvise on your feet and do what it takes.

His fatal error was going down prematurely and trying to tunnel for a first down. Seattle's calling card is their defensive soundness and tenacity. They're not going to let you make that mistake.
 

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