2020 Depth Chart predictions

[MNVCGUY]

You missed my point. We aren’t going to be starting a bunch of guys like Sori Marin that had no experience. You don’t need to be a starter to aquite a lot of experience. Like I said the only guy that I project to start at this point that has little experience is Nubin, and that’s if Winfield does indeed leave. So I don’t see tons of inexperience like you do.

It really is no use. Veritas equates not being a starter to not having played. The fact that we are returning a ton of guys on defense that played a lot of minutes doesn't matter because they were not in the game on the first play therefore they will be in over their heads early in the season due to not having been a starter this year.

 

[MNVCGUY]

Yes, and each has gotten better as the year has progressed, my point exactly. Sori Marin made all sorts of serious errors earlier in the season. Remember the Iowa TE running past him as he stood still for a TD, as an example. I am not saying we can not replace the starters lost, ONLY that the replacements will need time to get up to full speed and that period may cost us some wins early in the year. Basic college football stuff.

I love that you talk about early season mistakes then reference a play from the Iowa game which was of course not early in the season.

There may be a few growing pains as new players take on bigger roles but I really think you are discounting the amount of returning experience we have on D and the fact that there is serious potential (especially along the D-Line) for the defense to be even better next season as opposed to taking a step back.

 

[Veritas]

I love that you talk about early season mistakes then reference a play from the Iowa game which was of course not early in the season.


There may be a few growing pains as new players take on bigger roles but I really think you are discounting the amount of returning experience we have on D and the fact that there is serious potential (especially along the D-Line) for the defense to be even better next season as opposed to taking a step back.

Quote a person correctly. I did not reference the Sori Marin play as "early" but as "earlier". It he is better in game 13 than he was in game 10 does it not follow that growth is progressive and not there from game 1?

You are right, I do expect "growing pains" on D given the turnover. That none of the guys you are counting on next year to be "better" could break into a D that could not generate an average pass rush all season long was a real warning sign to me. I will be absolutely delighted and surprised if the D next September and early October is as good as it was this November. Delighted by Gopher success as always. You will, of course, be perfectly within your rights to point out my error in logic if that should be the case.

 

[Johnob2]

yeah it’s going to take a lot of practice reps and game time before the defense gels together.

A quick question, please bear in mind I have no experience of football apart from watching games as a fan* ...

If, as seems likely, the offense returns more capable, more accustomed to each other/the scheme and playbook etc. - will this help the Defense improve quicker when the 1s and 2s etc practice against each other or does it not really make a difference (or could it even slow their improvement down if they are outmatched)?






* (we had a kidsFootball team in our local area around 35 years ago when the sports first started gaining Teresa in the UK - I played but we were so clueless it doesn't count).

 

[Gophergrandpa]

You missed my point. We aren’t going to be starting a bunch of guys like Sori Marin that had no experience. You don’t need to be a starter to aquite a lot of experience. Like I said the only guy that I project to start at this point that has little experience is Nubin, and that’s if Winfield does indeed leave. So I don’t see tons of inexperience like you do.

Sori-Marin is big and fast and has high football IQ. As a true sophomore, he was tasked with playing all three linebacker positions in different games—a huge challenge. In 2020, he will settle into one LB position, probably Mike, having lots of game experience under his belt. He’ll be good.

 

[btowngopher]

Also we open with FAU and Tennessee Tech. The defense should have nothing to worry about with Tennessee Tech and FAU loses like their top five receivers and will have to overhaul everything with a new coaching staff, so it’s a good two games to open the season.

 

[MNVCGUY]

I am pretty sure I saw him without pads in street clothes standing on the sidelines.

just went and found the pregame blog from the Strib and has him listed as out:

Star Tribune

Your source for Minnesota news today. Read articles, view photos or watch videos about news in Minneapolis, St. Paul, Duluth, St. Cloud, Rochester, and beyond.

m.startribune.com

Very strange. Not sure why Gophersports would list him as having played if he didn't. But again, no clue where that participation report comes from or how official it is.

 

[MNVCGUY]

You are right, I do expect "growing pains" on D given the turnover. That none of the guys you are counting on next year to be "better" could break into a D that could not generate an average pass rush all season long was a real warning sign to me.

Want to make sure I quoted you correctly. You keep acting like the replacements for Coughlin, Barber, Renner, Martin, DeLattiboudiere and Williamson never played. As has been pointed out many many many times, all of the replacements for these guys got significant playing time this season.

All will have another off season to improve and most will be becoming upper classmen. On top of all that they are not replacing all world players, they are replacing solid experienced Big Ten players. Unless these guys are all stiffs they should be able to maintain a similar level on defense and then for the team to really take off they can hopefully improve upon what was there before.

The only guy who will be really hard to replace will be Winfield if he goes pro. All the others, while great guys and solid players were not all-world talents.

I feel extremely confident that Otomewu, Mafe, Teague, Schad, and MDT can at minimum keep the D-Line play the same as it was this year and hopefully (yes I know hope is a tough thing for some) those guys along with some of the other up and coming players will be able to actually start generating a legit pass rush.

 

[mkAz]

I think the defense will be fine, lots of talent ready to step up. IMO, replacing Tyler Johnson will be the biggest challenge, need someone to really step up their game (Eric Gibson?).

 

[WriterGoph]

I think the defense will be fine, lots of talent ready to step up. IMO, replacing Tyler Johnson will be the biggest challenge, need someone to really step up their game (Eric Gibson?).

Tons of options at WR. It's a position where a frosh can come in and make an impact right away. Daniel Jackson is a 4-star and Emilien has a ton of great offers. Let us not forget what our last 4-star WR did as a freshman.

 

[btowngopher]

Tons of options at WR. It's a position where a frosh can come in and make an impact right away. Daniel Jackson is a 4-star and Emilien has a ton of great offers. Let us not forget what our last 4-star WR did as a freshman.

Lot of options but I think it’s highly unlikely someone plays on TJs level (besides Bateman of course). Maybe a variety of guys can pitch in for similar production though.

 

[Gophergrandpa]

Also we open with FAU and Tennessee Tech. The defense should have nothing to worry about with Tennessee Tech and FAU loses like their top five receivers and will have to overhaul everything with a new coaching staff, so it’s a good two games to open the season.

FAU is a trap game. They destroyed SMU (which had been ranked in the top 25 during the year) in their bowl game. FAU finished 2019 ranked 30th in the CBS top 100 ranking. They might lose a lot of talent, but you don’t do as well as FAU did this year unless you a lot of talent beyond the seniors. I think the FAU game could be a test for our defense, which will have a lot of new starters.

 

[btowngopher]

FAU is a trap game. They destroyed SMU (which had been ranked in the top 25 during the year) in their bowl game. FAU finished 2019 ranked 30th in the CBS top 100 ranking. They might lose a lot of talent, but you don’t do as well as FAU did this year unless you a lot of talent beyond the seniors. I think the FAU game could be a test for our defense, which will have a lot of new starters.

Like I said they graduate like their top five receiving options and have a new coaching staff. Yes they had a nice year, but programs at that level can fluctuate greatly, I think they drop off big time. Yes they beat SMU, but that’s the only team of note they beat. They got worked by OSU and UCF and also lost to Marshall. They had an 11-3 year just two years ago then won only five games last year.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Quote a person correctly. I did not reference the Sori Marin play as "early" but as "earlier". It he is better in game 13 than he was in game 10 does it not follow that growth is progressive and not there from game 1?

You are right, I do expect "growing pains" on D given the turnover. That none of the guys you are counting on next year to be "better" could break into a D that could not generate an average pass rush all season long was a real warning sign to me. I will be absolutely delighted and surprised if the D next September and early October is as good as it was this November. Delighted by Gopher success as always. You will, of course, be perfectly within your rights to point out my error in logic if that should be the case.

I do hear your point and I think it is somewhat valid.

But don't you expect that progression to continue to Mafe, Otumweo, Teague, Schad, Oliver, MSM, Nubin, Howden, Gordon, and Willis?

 

[Livingat45north]

A quick question, please bear in mind I have no experience of football apart from watching games as a fan* ...

If, as seems likely, the offense returns more capable, more accustomed to each other/the scheme and playbook etc. - will this help the Defense improve quicker when the 1s and 2s etc practice against each other or does it not really make a difference (or could it even slow their improvement down if they are outmatched)?






* (we had a kidsFootball team in our local area around 35 years ago when the sports first started gaining Teresa in the UK - I played but we were so clueless it doesn't count).

Are you still living in the UK? Yes, having a better offense helps the defense prep for games. In general, at the start of the year if you have new players on both sides of the ball the defensive side comes together quicker than the offensive side. A lot of that has to do with the experience of the OL playing together, which in our case is solid. So yes, the coming year's practices will start at a much higher level than they did say two years back. Of course, this assumes there aren't a lot of changes on the offensive scheme, which there well could be...

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Very strange. Not sure why Gophersports would list him as having played if he didn't. But again, no clue where that participation report comes from or how official it is.

Yeah, he was in street clothes.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

We are losing seven starters on D and they played the most minutes precisely because they were the best, most ready guys we had. The backups were backups for exactly the same reasons: less ready, less able. So, IMHO, we will have several games, at least, where the D will be short of where we were this year. I hope I am wrong, but my experience is that you do not replace seven starters without taking a step backwards unless you have a mighty stable of high school All Americans waiting on the bench like Ohio State has.

Good Lord, you're still banging this drum? Might be time to give it a rest.

 

[Veritas]

I do hear your point and I think it is somewhat valid.

But don't you expect that progression to continue to Mafe, Otumweo, Teague, Schad, Oliver, MSM, Nubin, Howden, Gordon, and Willis?

Yes, but we will see. Clearly, I do not expect wonders from them in September. By November they will be veterans. Howden is a veteran now, but does not knock off my socks, yet.

 

[Off-GridTNgopher]

I'm not surprised by veritas remarks... He was to busy bitching about the fans being fans than to concentrate on the games

 

[Gophergrandpa]

Like I said they graduate like their top five receiving options and have a new coaching staff. Yes they had a nice year, but programs at that level can fluctuate greatly, I think they drop off big time. Yes they beat SMU, but that’s the only team of note they beat. They got worked by OSU and UCF and also lost to Marshall. They had an 11-3 year just two years ago then won only five games last year.

I don’t want to argue with you about the future. I am just a cautious guy. I believe that “pride goeth before the fall.” Auburn just got a big surprise from a team they probably marginalized somewhat. I am very wary of the FAU game. You needn’t be. We can still both be good Gopher fans.

 

[Johnob2]

Are you still living in the UK? Yes, having a better offense helps the defense prep for games. In general, at the start of the year if you have new players on both sides of the ball the defensive side comes together quicker than the offensive side. A lot of that has to do with the experience of the OL playing together, which in our case is solid. So yes, the coming year's practices will start at a much higher level than they did say two years back. Of course, this assumes there aren't a lot of changes on the offensive scheme, which there well could be...

Thanks for reply. Great to hear that success likely to breed further success in all areas. Will continue to live in the UK but will keep watching the games via streaming services, check into GopherHole daily for updates and hope to make a Bowl next year all being well.

 

[WhoFellDownTheGopherHole?]

This was a very good offense this year and they're not losing enough to not see even more improvement next year. They'll obviously need some help from the home crowd vs Iowa, but the defense might otherwise have time to figure things out through the first five games of the schedule while the offense totally carries them.

 

[btowngopher]

I don’t want to argue with you about the future. I am just a cautious guy. I believe that “pride goeth before the fall.” Auburn just got a big surprise from a team they probably marginalized somewhat. I am very wary of the FAU game. You needn’t be. We can still both be good Gopher fans.

Oh I am by no means saying they can be overlooked, as we saw this year the early season games were anything but smooth sailing. Some teams have a history of getting out of the gate very slowly, that has not been the trend for Fleck despite this past year. I don’t think trap game is the right phrase though since it is the opener, I think the team will be fully focused. However the talent gap isn’t so great that we can just show up and win, we will still need to play decent.

 

[hungan1]

This is where the rubber meets the road as far as Defense is concerned. It will be interesting to see how the new defensive lineup will be.

Hopefully, their burn-in cycle is short and all will pick up where the 2019 Defense left off.

A more important question: Who are going to emerge as team leaders on defense?

 

[short ornery norwegian]

If Senior starters were irreplaceable, then almost every team in D1 would be experiencing big swings from year-to-year.

The fact is that most teams lose Senior starters - or NFL draftees - every year. And yet, most teams in the top-25 range are relatively consistent. they may go from 10 wins to 9 or 8 some years, but it's not like teams are going from 10 wins to 5 wins because they could not replace the Seniors.

Fleck has said his job is to recruit players who are better than the current starters - or at least at the same level. That is how a team achieves consistency.

So - bottom line - if you think the Gophers are going to take a big step backwards because they cannot replace the Seniors and Winfield - then you are in essence saying that Fleck has failed as a recruiter, because he has not brought in enough talent to replace the Seniors.

 

[gophernut1]

In my opinion there is about equal reason for optimism and pessimism when it comes to the Gopher defense. Is there a lot of unknowns? YES. Does what we know about the replacements give us reason for optimism? YES. Does what we know about our coaching staff give us reason for optimism? YES. Does our first 5 games of the year give me concern as to how our defense will gel? YES. Defense is always about how each part works as a collection of the whole. While individual talent helps to make up for other mistakes having everyone understand where they need to be with different looks is important - hence why experience matters. I do like that some of our replacements seem to be better athletes than what they are replacing, but it will be interesting to see how our defense responds as a whole when they will be learning so much together. Glad that many of them have at least some experience. What I will look for in the spring game is how our DL does against our OL. The DL has the most to prove and they will be going up against a solid and experienced line.

 

[hungan1]

The team has enough players that have playing experience, and with new blood they can lock and load.

There will be growing pains. Failure is growth. This is true of every individual player. The guys that practice well, they will be pressed into the lineup . These guys like what Sori-Marin or Tyler Nubin did will play as true Freshman if they are good enough and there is a need at certain positions at least for depth. They will learn from mistakes, but will get better with experience.

 

[btowngopher]

Our first five games are FAU, Tenn Tech, Iowa, BYU, Maryland. I don't really expect these teams to be offensive juggernauts, and all but Iowa should be pretty poor defensively.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I think guys like Winfield are sort of an anomaly. He was one of the best defensive players in the country. We can't expect to easily replace those types of players. I think OSU is going to have a hard time replacing their run of Boses and C. Young. Georgia struggled replacing their WRs last year.

All of that said, I think our defense can be really similar. We might not have the playmaker we had in Winfield, but those guys aren't common.