Wow - Marcus: Johnson is arguably at a point in his tenure when he might also need for people to be patient with him.

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The universal support across many of the local media members is certainly surprising and frankly concerning if you are in the camp that would like to see a change. We can all dismiss Doogie/Shooter/Marcus/LEN/others for their viewpoints but the fact remains they all have better access to this program than those of us that post on this board. I'm sure it is easier to work with somebody that is as friendly as Ben. I mean who would want to cover somebody like Cronin with his 500 wins and tons of success at multiple stops. That surly attitude! But is it more than that? I suppose the articles are timely as we head to the end of the season but are we starting to see hints that the decision to retain Bem Johnson has already been made?
 

golfing18now said:
The universal support across many of the local media members is certainly surprising and frankly concerning if you are in the camp that would like to see a change. We can all dismiss Doogie/Shooter/Marcus/LEN/others for their viewpoints but the fact remains they all have better access to this program than those of us that post on this board. I'm sure it is easier to work with somebody that is as friendly as Ben. I mean who would want to cover somebody like Cronin with his 500 wins and tons of success at multiple stops. That surly attitude! But is it more than that? I suppose the articles are timely as we head to the end of the season but are we starting to see hints that the decision to retain Bem Johnson has already been made?
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The fact that we aren't hearing anything from Coyle makes me think he has made the decision to move on.

I just don't see anyway that they can justify keeping Ben for another year at this point. It will crush whatever season ticket base is left and the barn will be even more deserted than it already is.
 

MNVCGUY said:
The fact that we aren't hearing anything from Coyle makes me think he has made the decision to move on.

I just don't see anyway that they can justify keeping Ben for another year at this point. It will crush whatever season ticket base is left and the barn will be even more deserted than it already is.
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I might agree with you in general but we never hear anything from Coyle so that is par for the course with him.
 



golfing18now said:
The universal support across many of the local media members is certainly surprising and frankly concerning if you are in the camp that would like to see a change. We can all dismiss Doogie/Shooter/Marcus/LEN/others for their viewpoints but the fact remains they all have better access to this program than those of us that post on this board. I'm sure it is easier to work with somebody that is as friendly as Ben. I mean who would want to cover somebody like Cronin with his 500 wins and tons of success at multiple stops. That surly attitude! But is it more than that? I suppose the articles are timely as we head to the end of the season but are we starting to see hints that the decision to retain Bem Johnson has already been made?
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There is no way Coyle retains him at this point.

Your post addresses something that I think is in play here. It's not racial and it's not DEI (oops, bad word!). Ben is basically a good dude, so the media has given him the benefit of the doubt. He hasn't produced, so he's gone, but I think the people who have covered him regularly have found him easy to work with. That's why we still see these kinds of articles.

Cronin is obviously an asshat. I haven't followed him but I'll bet he's gotten bumpy coverage even though he's clearly produced.

Even our PJ, who's so full of bluster and wants to be covered like a top 10 coach instead of the top 35 coach that he is. He doesn't get Ben's friendly coverage, even though he's lapped Ben 10 times over, because of his theatrics and self importance.

Until AI completely takes over, it's a human process.
 

jamiche said:
There is no way Coyle retains him at this point.

Your post addresses something that I think is in play here. It's not racial and it's not DEI (oops, bad word!). Ben is basically a good dude, so the media has given him the benefit of the doubt. He hasn't produced, so he's gone, but I think the people who have covered him regularly have found him easy to work with. That's why we still see these kinds of articles.

Cronin is obviously an asshat. I haven't followed him but I'll bet he's gotten bumpy coverage even though he's clearly produced.

Even our PJ, who's so full of bluster and wants to be covered like a top 10 coach instead of the top 35 coach that he is. He doesn't get Ben's friendly coverage, even though he's lapped Ben 10 times over, because of his theatrics and self importance.

Until AI completely takes over, it's a human process.
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I hope you are right and I'm not necessarily making a prediction. I'm just not nearly as confident as others that a change is imminent. I've felt for a long time the NIL landscape will offer him a longer leash as opposed to a shorter one. What's he going to do after all? Poor Ben!

I actually think Ben Johnson is a decent coach. We have seen flashes in games where he has made adjustments that have paid off. The UCLA/USC games are examples of that. But he is clearly better equipped as an assistant coach at this point in his career. He's a terrible CEO. He's a terrible promoter of his program and a perpetual expectations wet blanket. He's the antithesis of PJ Fleck in that regard. Fan enthusiasm and looser wallets are probably also necessary to move this program forward. The current guy doesn't bring that.
 




kg21 said:
I'm sorry, but the only way to explain this is racial.

There can be no other explanation.

Do they not watch this team?
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Ben Johnson is a glowing example of the psychological failure of DEI initiatives. If you get a job largely because you are black, firing that person feels racial. The thing Ben brought to the table that distinguished him from other candidates was his ethnicity. It was clearly never really about his resume. Even though they won't admit it, even his supporters were really supporting his ethnicity. When you fire someone, you typically fire them for not fulfilling their end of the bargain. Ben is still an African American local guy. To these folks, because they supported the hire through a racial lens, critique's of Ben/discussions of firing Ben will always be somewhat racial. It creates the absolute absurdity like this article and LEN's article.
 

Mind blowing that anyone would believe he should be retained. There is absolutely nothing positive being built. I think the students should instead f dressing up as barnyard animals dress up as doctors, dead people, and zombies because the barn is a morgue currently.
 

Even in the most charitable scenario, (Marcus thinks Ben is just a real swell guy and enjoys working with him) he still loses all credibility as someone who covers Gophers basketball, whatever credibility he may or may not have had in the first place. No one who watches Gopher basketball regularly would agree, so who are these articles really for?
 

jamiche said:
There is no way Coyle retains him at this point.

Your post addresses something that I think is in play here. It's not racial and it's not DEI (oops, bad word!). Ben is basically a good dude, so the media has given him the benefit of the doubt. He hasn't produced, so he's gone, but I think the people who have covered him regularly have found him easy to work with. That's why we still see these kinds of articles.
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Not saying he isn't, but how were Tubby and Richard not good dudes? I found both miles more interesting and engaging than Ben.
 



Bob_Loblaw said:
Ben Johnson is a glowing example of the psychological failure of DEI initiatives. If you get a job largely because you are black, firing that person feels racial. The thing Ben brought to the table that distinguished him from other candidates was his ethnicity. It was clearly never really about his resume. Even though they won't admit it, even his supporters were really supporting his ethnicity. When you fire someone, you typically fire them for not fulfilling their end of the bargain. Ben is still an African American local guy. To these folks, because they supported the hire through a racial lens, critique's of Ben/discussions of firing Ben will always be somewhat racial. It creates the absolute absurdity like this article and LEN's article.
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It is a tough topic. Most would agree that historically there have not been enough coaching opportunities for minority coaches (has gotten better but still plenty of work to do). But part of the issue and something that might keep ADs from hiring minority coaches is that if/when they need to fire that coach there are people that will try and paint them as racist and claim the decision is based on race and not merit.

Coyle absolutely should fire Johnson, team is backsliding in year 4 and there is nothing that indicates it is on the verge of getting better. If anything the prospects for next year are even worse because the one really good player on the current roster won't be there next year and there is not much of proven value potentially returning.

But we all know that if he does make the move there will be at least a few local outlets that will say it was because of race.
 


Bad Gopher said:
What is this power that Ben has over the local media? And how can P.J. Fleck get a piece of that action? Seriously, my head spins trying to make any sense of this.
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I honestly think they are mad Fleck didn't either:

A) flame out like they thought he would
B) ditch out like they definitely hoped he would

Johnson is the "Local Boy Done Good" who has had relationships with the local media (pretty sure he was Doogie's source during the Pitino Years) so he gets all the grace. Fleck is an interloper who is good at self promotion and knows the fans don't really care what the average sports writer thinks.

Plus Fleck teams never get in trouble (nor do Johnsons) so they can't get clicks because of that either.
 
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Dave H said:
I honestly think they are mad Fleck didn't either:

A) flame out like they thought he would
B) ditch out like they definitely hoped he would

Johnson is the "Local Boy Done Good" who has had relationships with the local media (pretty sure he was Doogie's source during the Pitino Years) so he gets all the grace. Fleck is an interloper who is good at self promotion and knows the fans don't really care what the average sports writer thinks.

Plus Fleck teams never get in trouble (nor do Johnsons) so they can't get clicks because of that either.
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And Fleck manages to keep almost all of his most important talent. He's very rarely losing guys to the portal that matter. The players he wants buy into his system and what he's selling them. He may be a self-promoter, but he's been the most successful coach here in my lifetime.
 

It's probably not the solution, but it's also not out of the question. There is truth to allowing coaches to truly grow a culture and program. Its seems nearly impossible in this day and age, however.

Richard got 8 years with one winning conference record.
Tubby got 6 years with zero winning conference records.
Monson got 7 years with two winning conference records.
 

MaxyJR1 said:
It's probably not the solution, but it's also not out of the question. There is truth to allowing coaches to truly grow a culture and program. Its seems nearly impossible in this day and age, however.

Richard got 8 years with one winning conference record.
Tubby got 6 years with zero winning conference records.
Monson got 7 years with two winning conference records.
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I don't think having a culture and program with an identity is possible anymore it's all year to year. Not to mention we've had 2 winning conference seasons this century. Coyle/regents better pony up or this program will be in the 15-18th territory for the rest of time.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
I don't think having a culture and program with an identity is possible anymore it's all year to year. Not to mention we've had 2 winning conference seasons this century. Coyle/regents better pony up or this program will be in the 15-18th territory for the rest of time.
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Does Houston and their defensive mind set under Sampson come to mind? I certainly think it is possible with the right ingredients. I would agree with you however that it is harder in todays landscape.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
I don't think having a culture and program with an identity is possible anymore it's all year to year. Not to mention we've had 2 winning conference seasons this century. Coyle/regents better pony up or this program will be in the 15-18th territory for the rest of time.
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Disagree on the identity part. But the way you establish that identity and build the roster has shifted drastically. Instead of finding guys that fit your mold in high school and developing them you now have to go out and find guys who will fit your system that did their developing under someone else. Much tougher but doable if you know what you are looking for and more importantly have the resources to go get them.
 

MaxyJR1 said:
It's probably not the solution, but it's also not out of the question. There is truth to allowing coaches to truly grow a culture and program. Its seems nearly impossible in this day and age, however.

Richard got 8 years with one winning conference record.
Tubby got 6 years with zero winning conference records.
Monson got 7 years with two winning conference records.
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All with a higher winning percentage than the current HC.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Disagree on the identity part. But the way you establish that identity and build the roster has shifted drastically. Instead of finding guys that fit your mold in high school and developing them you now have to go out and find guys who will fit your system that did their developing under someone else. Much tougher but doable if you know what you are looking for and more importantly have the resources to go get them.
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I don't think that's true. I know our team isn't good but they play entirely different than last year due to personnel. Same thing with Wisconsin this year compared to last year. I think you get the players that you can and try mold a system around them. Maybe if you're an elite program you can pay the players to fit your system but for a program like ours i think you take the best players that our attainable and try to mold a system around them.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
I don't think having a culture and program with an identity is possible anymore it's all year to year. Not to mention we've had 2 winning conference seasons this century. Coyle/regents better pony up or this program will be in the 15-18th territory for the rest of time.
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Tend to agree. Need a coach that can recruit to a system and blend things together quickly. Need 8-10 solid on the roster each year. You can take some projects/freshmen in #'s 11-15, but they need to be guys that have the potential to develop.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
I don't think having a culture and program with an identity is possible anymore it's all year to year.
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Took the words right out of my mouth. Then I thought about PJ Fleck and "Row the boat". Although one could argue that the identity changed after PJ discovered the forward pass in 2024.
 


Was Marcus watching the same game? The laundry list of stuff that is bad with that team that could be fixed with COACHING is too long to list here. Nothing makes sense in the Ben Johnson offense.
 

GopherTheJugular said:
You just agreed with someone who was disagreeing with your previous post?

@Johnnyboy18 sets the record for fastest conversion in GH history.
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I agree that culture is less important than it used to be. An AD might have another thought on it. I was throwing out that it's not out of the question to allow more time. I wouldn't do it however.
 



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