Wow: Kirk Ciarrocca Takes OC Job at Rutgers

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Some guy said:
Excluding garbage time:
The team was
5-1 With Morgan playing
2-2 With AK playing
2-1 With both playing

Just for some context.


Including garbage time because it’s too hard to separate out for this:
Morgan 66% of passes complete
AK 54%

Morgan 9 touchdowns and 5 ints
AK 3 touchdowns and 4 ints

Morgan 5.6 yards per attempt
AK 5.2 yards per attempt


In losses:
Morgan 22/45 278 0 and 4
AK 18/43 279 1 and 4


I’m not saying Morgan is better.
I’m not saying AK isn’t good with high potential.
I’m not saying that AK shouldn’t have been starting at the end of the year.

I’m just saying I’m not sure your claim holds true at all
It’s actually pretty amazing how similar the QB’s played in losses.
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But how was the game flow? Maybe you with all your genius can explain it to us mere mortal, idiot fans.
 

Should be pretty easy to not include home games against NM State, Western Illinois, and Colorado, when assessing Morgan. :sneaky:
 

matt said:
But how was the game flow? Maybe you with all your genius can explain it to us mere mortal, idiot fans.
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In Tanner's 5 wins the games were never in doubt.

In his one loss, he threw bad interceptions, but the Gophers were missing Mo.

In their combined games, Tanner got a concussion against Illinois and both QBs were bad. Tanner got another concussion against Nebraska, but Athan did open up the defense. Tanner played very well against Syracuse and won that game.

Athan was bad against PSU, played bad against Iowa, and played well against Northwestern, who won one game this year.
 

hello-world said:
played bad against Iowa
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:rolleyes:

The one drive they called passing plays, was the one drive we scored a TD. 60+ yards passing on 4/4, if I recall correctly.

Every other drive, they mainly ran the ball, until the very end when he was suddenly called upon to throw on 3rd and long.


Come on
 

Gophers_4life said:
:rolleyes:

The one drive they called passing plays, was the one drive we scored a TD. 60+ yards passing on 4/4, if I recall correctly.

Every other drive, they mainly ran the ball, until the very end when he was suddenly called upon to throw on 3rd and long.


Come on
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I'll stop when y'all stop dragging Morgan.
 



MNVCGUY said:
Can't really answer the first part because there are so many teams out there that I have zero visibility in regards to what kind of offense they run. But I would agree that the past few years we have most likely trended towards being one of the more risk adverse offenses.

I also think we have done that in large part because the strength of the offense has been the RB and the strategy of controlling the clock has worked very well for us.

To your last line, I have already said I would like to see us open things up more and I think we will as the offense evolves from one that was built around the RB to one that is built around the QB. I expect to see more balance next year but I still think the overall framework of the offense will stay the same in terms of trying to control the clock as much as possible.

We are 29-10 over the last 3 full season. Our style of play might not be the most exciting out there but it is working for the most part.
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Well put. I think we have covered it.
 

This is what you will get with AK over the next few years, a QB that has been groomed for 3 years, he should be comfortable with the system support of the coaches and team. He will be more athletic then Morgan. He as a stronger arm, if his track record follows him, his injury at the end of the last game will continue through his career. I believe he missed most of his Junior year with injures and a left shoulder surgery. Morgan like Cousins lack of mobility saves them from contact injuries.
 

Tommyboy said:
This is what you will get with AK over the next few years, a QB that has been groomed for 3 years, he should be comfortable with the system support of the coaches and team. He will be more athletic then Morgan. He as a stronger arm, if his track record follows him, his injury at the end of the last game will continue through his career. I believe he missed most of his Junior year with injures and a left shoulder surgery. Morgan like Cousins lack of mobility saves them from contact injuries.
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I don't know the official stat but Morgan got sacked a lot at Minnesota and lost his job this year because of it.
 



hello-world said:
I don't know the official stat but Morgan got sacked a lot at Minnesota and lost his job this year because of it.
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He was able to start 4 years without significant injury, that is pretty good.
 

Tommyboy said:
This is what you will get with AK over the next few years, a QB that has been groomed for 3 years, he should be comfortable with the system support of the coaches and team. He will be more athletic then Morgan. He as a stronger arm, if his track record follows him, his injury at the end of the last game will continue through his career. I believe he missed most of his Junior year with injures and a left shoulder surgery. Morgan like Cousins lack of mobility saves them from contact injuries.
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Cousins has gotten the shit beat out of him this year with the bad o-line. He must be a genetic freak in terms of joint strength.
 


on Morgan and Athan.

When there are any questions about the starting QB, the backup QB is always going to seem like a better option.

In this case, the backup QB appeared to be more athletic and a better runner with a stronger arm. He flashed some skills in limited duty.

But - we have not seen Athan at QB for a full season. We really need to see him play more against different opponents to make it a fair comparison.
 



Gophers_4life said:
Should be pretty easy to not include home games against NM State, Western Illinois, and Colorado, when assessing Morgan. :sneaky:
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I mean they played the same in losses.
Morgan played really well against Michigan state
AK played really well against wisconsin

I wonder who would’ve won if Michigan state and Wisconsin played?
 




Some guy said:
I just think it’s funny people argue with what literally happened
I posted real stats lol
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If you want one that's really going to bug people.

Tanner Morgan threw the ball 1,062 times at Minnesosta for 9,454 yards (avg 8.9) with a completion percentage of 62% with 65 TDs on 32 INTs.

Kirk Cousins threw the ball 1,128 times at MSU for 9,131 yards (avg 8.1) with a completion percentage of 64% with 66 TDs to 30 INTs.
 

hello-world said:
If you want one that's really going to bug people.

Tanner Morgan threw the ball 1,062 times at Minnesosta for 9,454 yards (avg 8.9) with a completion percentage of 62% with 65 TDs on 32 INTs.

Kirk Cousins threw the ball 1,128 times at MSU for 9,131 yards (avg 8.1) with a completion percentage of 64% with 66 TDs to 30 INTs.
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My understanding is he was going to play Div III football and he received the offer from MSU at the end. Turned out well for him.
 

Tommyboy said:
My understanding is he was going to play Div III football and he received the offer from MSU at the end. Turned out well for him.
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Also had offers from Colorado, Toledo, Western Michigan, and Northern Illinois. Had plenty of D1 options.
 

Panthadad2 said:
It's funny when a thread eventually devolves into people bitching about how a team wins.
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I think some of the the bitching is how we have lost several very close games, games in which we feel we could have won had we opened up a the offensive playbook just a bit--had we included more of our playmakers in the offense rather than using them primarily as blockers and decoys. Had we not been so stubbornly predictable. Had we not run play after play into stacked boxes when our announced philosophy is to "take what the defense gives us." Had we not essentially forfeited most of the realistic potential for explosive plays when our coach numbers explosive plays as one of the key ways, statistically, that teams win football games.

People's bitching about our manner of winning close games is secondary. It is the "use it or lose it" comment. If we abandon entire parts of the offense in winning efforts (thankfully the majority of games), we deprive those parts of valuable game experience and emotional involvement as key playmakers (which is very different than in practice)--we don't develop them. Some believe it is more difficult for those underused offensive elements to suddenly come alive and communicate well and have their timing down on precision passing plays when, suddenly, in a "behind" situation, they are called upon to shake off the rust and save the day.
 
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Gophergrandpa said:
I think some of the the bitching is how we have lost several very close games, games in which we feel we could have won had we opened up a the offensive playbook just a bit--had we included more of our playmakers in the offense rather than using them primarily as blockers and decoys. Had we not been so stubbornly predictable. Had we not run play after play into stacked boxes when our announced philosophy is to "take what the defense gives us." Had we not essentially forfeited most of the realistic potential for explosive plays when our coach numbers explosive plays as one of the key ways, statistically, that teams win football games.

People's bitching about our manner of winning close games is secondary. It is the "use it or lose it" comment. If we abandon entire parts of the offense in winning efforts (thankfully the majority of games), we deprive those parts of valuable game experience and emotional involvement as key playmakers (which is very different than in practice)--we don't develop them. Some believe it is more difficult for those underused offensive elements to suddenly come alive and communicate well and have their timing down on precision passing plays when, suddenly, in a "behind" situation, they are called upon to shake off the rust and save the day.
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👏
 

Here, I'll do it for you, it's not hard.

Morgan:

DateSchoolOpponentCmpAttPctYdsTDInt
2022-09-24Minnesota@Michigan StateW232688.526830
2022-10-01MinnesotaPurdueL183354.525703
2022-10-15Minnesota@IllinoisL41233.32101
2022-10-29MinnesotaRutgersW142166.712200
2022-11-05Minnesota@NebraskaW6875.03800
2022-12-29MinnesotaNSyracuse*W4757.15820
6910764.476454

Kaliakmanis:
DateSchoolOpponentCmpAttPctYdsTDInt
2022-10-15Minnesota@IllinoisL2633.31702
2022-10-22Minnesota@Penn StateL92240.917511
2022-11-05Minnesota@NebraskaW61250.013700
2022-11-12MinnesotaNorthwesternW71353.86400
2022-11-19MinnesotaIowaL71546.78701
2022-11-26Minnesota@WisconsinW192965.531920
2022-12-29MinnesotaNSyracuse*W7977.88000
5710653.887934
 

Illinois - he only came in at the end
PSU - first real start, got thrown to the wolves, is what it is
Nebraska - he saved and won the game
NW and Iowa - coaches hamstrung him

Wisc - they unleashed him and this is the future
Syracuse - was also going to be another nice day, until early injury
 

Gophers_4life said:
Illinois - he only came in at the end
PSU - first real start, got thrown to the wolves, is what it is
Nebraska - he saved and won the game
NW and Iowa - coaches hamstrung him

Wisc - they unleashed him and this is the future
Syracuse - was also going to be another nice day, until early injury
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This is true
If you write off one quarterbacks bad performances but not the other quarterbacks. The one appears to be much better and more consistent lol
 

Morgan doesn't get to be rewarded for playing tomato-cans with DIII level defenses. Sorry

Not dragging Morgan in the slightest. Just laying it on the table in a true manner.


Made some really nice throws to win the bowl game. Is going to get to play in a college all-star game, will get a spring try-out and hopefully get a call-back to a fall camp. Hope he can make a practice squad. If not, would love to have him as a GA coach next year, to help out Greg.
 

Gophers_4life said:
Morgan doesn't get to be rewarded for playing tomato-cans with DIII level defenses. Sorry

Not dragging Morgan in the slightest. Just laying it on the table in a true manner.


Made some really nice throws to win the bowl game. Is going to get to play in a college all-star game, will get a spring try-out and hopefully get a call-back to a fall camp. Hope he can make a practice squad. If not, would love to have him as a GA coach next year, to help out Greg.
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Yup. Just compare how they played in losses.
Compare how they played in big ten wins + Syracuse


In big ten games + Syracuse
Morgan 69-108 (64%) 743 5TDs 4Ints 6.9 yards per attempt



kaliakmanis 57-106 (54%) 879 3TDs 4Ints 8.3 yards per attempt


Pretty clear that the offense made bigger plays with AK in the game. Also pretty clear that the difference was closer to slight than major.
After Nebraska game it was pretty clear the team shouldn’t go back to Morgan. And they didn’t except due to injury.
 
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Word said:
Also had offers from Colorado, Toledo, Western Michigan, and Northern Illinois. Had plenty of D1 options.
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I w
Some guy said:
Yup. Just compare how they played in losses.
Compare how they played in big ten wins + Syracuse


In big ten games + Syracuse
Morgan 69-108 (64%) 743 5TDs 4Ints 6.9 yards per attempt



kaliakmanis 57-106 (54%) 879 3TDs 4Ints 8.3 yards per attempt


Pretty clear that the offense made bigger plays with AK in the game. Also pretty clear that the difference was closer to slight than major.
After Nebraska game it was pretty clear the team shouldn’t go back to Morgan. And they didn’t except due to injury.
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Kramer probably could have done just as good, if given a chance most of the QB would do fine.
 

Tommyboy said:
Kramer probably could have done just as good, if given a chance most of the QB would do fine.
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I am not sure I believe in Kramer.
I’ve never seen him throw the ball effectively. Even in high school it was all under center waggle pretty much
 

Gophergrandpa said:
I think some of the the bitching is how we have lost several very close games, games in which we feel we could have won had we opened up a the offensive playbook just a bit--had we included more of our playmakers in the offense rather than using them primarily as blockers and decoys. Had we not been so stubbornly predictable. Had we not run play after play into stacked boxes when our announced philosophy is to "take what the defense gives us." Had we not essentially forfeited most of the realistic potential for explosive plays when our coach numbers explosive plays as one of the key ways, statistically, that teams win football games.

People's bitching about our manner of winning close games is secondary. It is the "use it or lose it" comment. If we abandon entire parts of the offense in winning efforts (thankfully the majority of games), we deprive those parts of valuable game experience and emotional involvement as key playmakers (which is very different than in practice)--we don't develop them. Some believe it is more difficult for those underused offensive elements to suddenly come alive and communicate well and have their timing down on precision passing plays when, suddenly, in a "behind" situation, they are called upon to shake off the rust and save the day.
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Yes, I think the "use it or lose it" theory totally had an impact on the passing offense. And yet, it took a ball bouncing off a receiver's pads directly into the hands of a DB as MN was driving for the winning score vs. Iowa to lose that game (the game where the "use it or lose it" issue was most glaring). Here's hoping for more balance next year.
 

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