Wisconsin made a bold move, do we have the nerve to do the same?

Some guy

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Ok, fair enough. And my point is that our CEO needs to be a better CEO.
That may be true but it is not what you said in the post I responded to

**I even noted that I wasn’t saying fleck was as good as Saban like this so you wouldn’t get confused by what I was saying**
 

Whytetale

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I said he hasn't learned from his mistakes.
That may be true but it is not what you said in the post I responded to

**I even noted that I wasn’t saying fleck was as good as Saban like this so you wouldn’t get confused by what I was saying**
 

Some guy

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I wonder if his CEO type of leadership has a lower ceiling compared to an Xs and Os type of head coach?
You said this

And that’s what I responded to


You said other things too, but this is what I responded to.
 

Steady

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Do we think Iowa or Wisconsin would tolerate as many consecutive losses to Minnesota as we have to Iowa?

Do we think Iowa or Wisconsin would tolerate as many consecutive losses to Minnesota as we have to Iowa?
I do not post here often, but you are an obvious troll. Go back to your mom's basement if you have this much time to post your garbage, seriously. Fleck is a great coach for us. We love him and look forward to many years of competitive football. Go Gophers!
 

Whytetale

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You said this

And that’s what I responded to


You said other things too, but this is what I responded to.
His not learning from his mistakes is what was driving my post. The end.
 


Some guy

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His not learning from his mistakes is what was driving my post. The end.
His biggest mistake or the game was throwing the ball instead of punting at the end there. So I hope he doesn’t learn from his mistake and tries to throw more next year
 


Gophers_4life

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Michigan fans wanted to run Jim Harbaugh out of town due to his record vs. OSU. Would that have been a bold move?
Well, what had Michigan achieved prior to last year? Not a lot.

Saved himself last year. Having another great year.
 

Gophers_4life

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I will say this again, Wisconsin firing their HC may be their "Nebraska firing Bo Pelini" moment. Only time will tell, and I would much rather wait and see how it turns out for them before following them into the fire.
I really don't get this.

This would mean you never fire a head coach, ever. You just wait for them to choose to leave or retire.
 




Gophers_4life

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after a bunch of 7, 8, and 9 win seasons they’re barely better than the Mn job.
In what sense?

Obviously wins is a clear way.
We already pay basically as well as Iowa and Wisc.

But Iowa and Wisc unquestionably have better fan support. Now, in the past, and 5 years from now. Need only look at their stadiums and crowds, compared to ours, to see that.

Recruiting is another interesting comparison. But unless it's a special circumstance, I would still say Wisc and Iowa can pretty much beat us head-to-head for most any recruit.
 

Whytetale

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His biggest mistake or the game was throwing the ball instead of punting at the end there. So I hope he doesn’t learn from his mistake and tries to throw more next year
Change your best.
 

GoForGold

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Iowa hasn't made a "bold" move since 1979, with a grand total of 2 coaches in that time. I'd say it's worked out well for them. Ferentz and some great seasons and some mediocre seasons in between. For example, after the 11-2 season in 2009 they went 8-5, 7-6, 4-8, 8-5, and 7-6. They stuck with him and had a 12-2 the following season. Can we expect this program to do any better?
 



howeda7

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Stop it.

Not comparable, even an iota, to Wisc firing Chyrst.

That would be like Wisc firing Barry
Not really. Iowa was good under Hayden Frye too. Wisconsin was a dumpster fire for 30 years before Barry.

The point is that the Iowa fan base has been disgruntled with Ferentz several times over the years and wanted him gone. The administration has resisted. I think they were right.
 

Some guy

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In what sense?

Obviously wins is a clear way.
We already pay basically as well as Iowa and Wisc.

But Iowa and Wisc unquestionably have better fan support. Now, in the past, and 5 years from now. Need only look at their stadiums and crowds, compared to ours, to see that.

Recruiting is another interesting comparison. But unless it's a special circumstance, I would still say Wisc and Iowa can pretty much beat us head-to-head for most any recruit.
Correct
But 4-5 more years of Wisconsin not making a big ten title game and perceptions can start to change. I would say they’re already changing
Wisconsin clearly not the cream of the west anymore.
4 teams in the west have been ranked more recently than wisconsin.
 

Some guy

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Not really. Iowa was good under Hayden Frye too. Wisconsin was a dumpster fire for 30 years before Barry.

The point is that the Iowa fan base has been disgruntled with Ferentz several times over the years and wanted him gone. The administration has resisted. I think they were right.
Minnesota will be MUCH better off when Ferentz retires.
There is a small chance they get a little better.
A small chance they stay the same.
They’re as likely to drop as they are to get better or stay the same.

I love a 50/50 shot they get worse
 

Some guy

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Well, what had Michigan achieved prior to last year? Not a lot.

Saved himself last year. Having another great year.
Yup. Exactly his point I’m pretty sure.
If they had cut and run when the coach was doing well anyways (apart from Covid harbaugh had won 8+ games each season and 10+ in 3/5)

He saved himself last year. If the mob had their way he would’ve already been out because he went 2-4 during Covid.


Hell, if Michigan wins on Saturday there’ll start to be calls from fans to fire Ryan (born on third) day.
 

Word

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I will say this again, Wisconsin firing their HC may be their "Nebraska firing Bo Pelini" moment. Only time will tell, and I would much rather wait and see how it turns out for them before following them into the fire.
Wisconsin fired chryst because they wanted to give Leonard a try. People (not you) are making way too much about the boldness of the move.
 

GopherWeatherGuy

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I will say this again, Wisconsin firing their HC may be their "Nebraska firing Bo Pelini" moment. Only time will tell, and I would much rather wait and see how it turns out for them before following them into the fire.

Wisconsin may struggle for the next several years, but things were headed in the wrong direction under Chryst. They have nowhere near the talent or depth that they used to, especially at LB, RB, and the oline. When Nebraska fired Pelini, the trendline was flat, not down like Wisconsin.

When Chryst was fired, Wisconsin was 33-19 since the beginning of 2018. Over that same period, Fleck was 34-16, and look at how frustrated fans are with PJ currently. That's coming from MN expectations which are far lower than Wisconsin expectations.
 

Mr. 131

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There is passionate and then there is ridiculous. Being frustrated, upset, critical, is all understandable. Losing to Iowa sucks, especially when we out played them most of the game….again

but the small group calling for Fleck’s head aren’t being passionate, they are being ridiculous.
I totally understand your position - but without getting into to fine a debate over what words actually mean, I'm going to just say that ridiculous and passionate def overlap but aren't mutually exclusive.
Bottom line - this is a football forum, and if all the posts were sensible and rational, it would be pretty bland.
Fleck's job absolutely is safe, as it should be :) -AND- I totally understand hot takes and why they happen...people care, sometimes they care too much - but that's what also fills seats.
 

Live in the now

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Stop it. Iowa also resisted "bold moves" several times when Ferentz had a down year. We are all disappointed in this season, but the fire Fleck talk is so ridiculous.
It’s completely ridiculous, most rubes love the backup qb and the next coach. For those rubes if you can’t be Ohio state or Alabama the coach sucks and must be fired. It’s patently absurd
 
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Live in the now

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Wisconsin may struggle for the next several years, but things were headed in the wrong direction under Chryst. They have nowhere near the talent or depth that they used to, especially at LB, RB, and the oline. When Nebraska fired Pelini, the trendline was flat, not down like Wisconsin.

When Chryst was fired, Wisconsin was 33-19 since the beginning of 2018. Over that same period, Fleck was 34-16, and look at how frustrated fans are with PJ currently. That's coming from MN expectations which are far lower than Wisconsin expectations.
And I think mostly it’s just the Mertz experiment. Great guy but just killing the team. They will be just fine once they get a qb.
 

Gophers_4life

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Iowa was good under Hayden Frye too. Wisconsin was a dumpster fire for 30 years before Barry.
Not even close to a valid counter-argument, when Ferentz has been the Iowa HC since 1999!

1999!!!

Even if you're talking their 4-8 season in 2012 (in the Legends division) ... he had still been the HC at Iowa the previous 13 seasons, and so 2012 was the 14th season.

Even then I don't think it's a great comparison to Wisc firing Chryst when he had been HC for 7 prior season (6 non-covid seasons).

The point is that the Iowa fan base has been disgruntled with Ferentz several times over the years and wanted him gone. The administration has resisted. I think they were right.
Your best chance is after the 2012 season.

Maybe you have a reasonable point then. But that doesn't really hold water compared to Chryst or Fleck now, IMO.
 

Gophers_4life

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Correct
But 4-5 more years of Wisconsin not making a big ten title game and perceptions can start to change. I would say they’re already changing
Wisconsin clearly not the cream of the west anymore.
4 teams in the west have been ranked more recently than wisconsin.
Won the West under Chryst in 2016, 17, and 19. Won Cotton and Orange in the two earlier, then went to the Rose and lost in the year we should've gotten to go (but they embarrassed us at home in the snow).

Since then, you are absolutely correct, though granted 2020 was covid. Last year, definitely not the cream, this year definitely not the cream.

Fanbase/boosters must've been worried it was a trend, pulled the trigger.


We'll see if it pays off for them.
 

Gophers_4life

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Yup. Exactly his point I’m pretty sure.
If they had cut and run when the coach was doing well anyways (apart from Covid harbaugh had won 8+ games each season and 10+ in 3/5)

He saved himself last year. If the mob had their way he would’ve already been out because he went 2-4 during Covid.


Hell, if Michigan wins on Saturday there’ll start to be calls from fans to fire Ryan (born on third) day.
Not sure what the point is, then.

Covid doesn't count for any comparison. I'm pretty sure it being the covid year saved Harbaugh, just like it saved Pitino for us ( :( ).

2018 - they won 10 games. Just a sour end of the season, losing to OSU and then the bowl. Also lost to ND to open the season.
2019 - very similar to 2018, but one loss worse. Lost at Wisc, lost at PSU, then OSU, and the bowl at the end. Still 9 wins.

I disagree those are reasonable comparisons to firing Chryst this year or if we were going to consider firing Fleck this year (which I doubt anyone really is).
 

PMWinSTP

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Stop it.

Not comparable, even an iota, to Wisc firing Chyrst.

That would be like Wisc firing Barry
Umm, no. Chryst was their perfect HC candidate. They wanted him earlier but couldn't get him because he had just taken the Pitt HC job. Heard of Hayden Fry?
 

Gophers_4life

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Umm, no. Chryst was their perfect HC candidate. They wanted him earlier but couldn't get him because he had just taken the Pitt HC job. Heard of Hayden Fry?
See above posts

Chryst was their perfect HC candidate?? Lol no
 

Gophers_4life

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And I think mostly it’s just the Mertz experiment. Great guy but just killing the team. They will be just fine once they get a qb.
This could well be true.

But just like it is for us, and Iowa -- what great QB wants to go to a team that mostly focuses on running the ball?
 

Some guy

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Not sure what the point is, then.

Covid doesn't count for any comparison. I'm pretty sure it being the covid year saved Harbaugh, just like it saved Pitino for us ( :( ).

2018 - they won 10 games. Just a sour end of the season, losing to OSU and then the bowl. Also lost to ND to open the season.
2019 - very similar to 2018, but one loss worse. Lost at Wisc, lost at PSU, then OSU, and the bowl at the end. Still 9 wins.

I disagree those are reasonable comparisons to firing Chryst this year or if we were going to consider firing Fleck this year (which I doubt anyone really is).
If it wasn’t Covid Michigan wouldn’t have gone 2-4
They probably would’ve gone 8-5
 

Gophers_4life

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If it wasn’t Covid Michigan wouldn’t have gone 2-4
They probably would’ve gone 8-5
It's a very interesting alternate universe to peer into if they do go 8-5, lose to PSU and PSU, lose a mid-major bowl game against a P5. Does Harbaugh get fired?

That would be a trend of going from 10-3, to 9-4, to 8-5, losing to OSU all three, probably losing bowl game all three.

I think he does. Wild guess
 




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