What is Coyle's, "keep Ben, win tally?"

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bga1

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Not yours, not mine, but what is going to be the bar Ben has to cross in Big Ten wins to get Coyle to keep him?

I am guessing 7 or 8 wins and he convinces Coyle to stay the course. To get to 8- he would have to go 5-6 the rest of the way and he could claim he went 8-6 down the stretch.
 

bga1 said:
Not yours, not mine, but what is going to be the bar Ben has to cross in Big Ten wins to get Coyle to keep him?

I am guessing 7 or 8 wins and he convinces Coyle to stay the course. To get to 8- he would have to go 5-6 the rest of the way and he could claim he went 8-6 down the stretch.
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I think 7
 



Coyle basically said it's NCAA or bust. But I'll say NIT with a semi final or bust. Hard to go on though with another new team next year.
 


There shouldn't be one. Winning 7 conference games to miraculously finish 10th is meaningless.

Johnson is a failure. He's never going to be successful. He's starting all over again next year from this year's debacle compounding a disaster of a 4 year tenure.

This isn't rocket science. If the idea is to be an afterthought, never ever in the discussion even for conference relevance--much less national relevance--then sure, keep CBJ.

We can do better than that.
 

bga1 said:
Reminder: We are talking about the U of M here.
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Yes and everyone is so excited about beating two ranked teams at home back to back for the first time since......the year Pitino was fired. Pitino beat 5 ranked teams at home that season and was still fired.
 
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mngolf said:
Coyle basically said it's NCAA or bust. But I'll say NIT with a semi final or bust. Hard to go on though with another new team next year.
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There is no way I am going to be Ben's defense attorney here, because it really should be NCAAs or bust...but the logic from Ben's side will be:

-Had a good team and lost it due to lack of NIL
-Have a solid frosh class incoming (the big guy appears to be legit)
-Lost Cochran and may get him another year here
-Revenue sharing will help compete on a level playing field for the first time
-Great comeback after 0-6 start (assumes 7-8 BT Ws). The team improved and never quit
-Didn't have Mitchell for 6 games
-Team developed a gritty, defensive identity as the season went on
 




GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yes and everyone is so excited about beating two ranked teams at home back to back for the first time since......the year Pitino was fired. Pitino beat 5 ranked teams at home that season and was still fired.
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So, is the lack of $$ impacting the play the past three games? Been told repeatedly Mn can't compete without far more $$.

Any clarity is appreciated.
 


mngolf said:
Coyle basically said it's NCAA or bust. But I'll say NIT with a semi final or bust. Hard to go on though with another new team next year.
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I would be SHOCKED if the NIT ever meant anything to an AD anymore. This isn't 1983 where you could use that as a building block and got young guys experience. The NIT is an absolute joke and should not factor into keeping a coach in the least.
 

Wins need to be enough to make the NCAA tournament. Anything less than the Dance results in Ben being terminated and his contract revoked.
 



Gophers7633 said:
20 regular season wins and Id be fine with him coming back.
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What would Coyle be fine with? To get to 20 regular season wins (not counting BTT) he'd have to go 9-2 the rest of the way. We would ALL be happy to welcome him back at 12-8. What if he goes 7-4 the rest of the way (9-11 in conference)? Does Coyle re-up him?
 

bga1 said:
What would Coyle be fine with? To get to 20 regular season wins (not counting BTT) he'd have to go 9-2 the rest of the way. We would ALL be happy to welcome him back at 12-8. What if he goes 7-4 the rest of the way (9-11 in conference)? Does Coyle re-up him?
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Likely gets reupped with close games counted as ‘improvement’.
 

bga1 said:
What would Coyle be fine with? To get to 20 regular season wins (not counting BTT) he'd have to go 9-2 the rest of the way. We would ALL be happy to welcome him back at 12-8. What if he goes 7-4 the rest of the way (9-11 in conference)? Does Coyle re-up him?
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No. 9-11 was fine last year with Hawkins, Payne, Mitchell, Garcia and Fox returning. If Hawkins and Payne were backfilled with decent players who had multiple years left then yes. But, Ben reloaded with mid major one year of eligibility types. Roster construction going into this season basically sealed his fate.
 

I'd like to remind everyone we are 3-6 in the big 10

about to go 3-7

They are not keeping Ben.
 


The win total should be whatever it takes to get them into the NCAA tournament. A couple of nice wins shouldn't change that.

As GWG pointed out.....Pitino's last team won some games against ranked teams as well. We are still a ways away from any sort of real discussions about year 5.
 

bga1 said:
Not yours, not mine, but what is going to be the bar Ben has to cross in Big Ten wins to get Coyle to keep him?

I am guessing 7 or 8 wins and he convinces Coyle to stay the course. To get to 8- he would have to go 5-6 the rest of the way and he could claim he went 8-6 down the stretch.
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Not good enough
 

It should be 12-8, which is likely the # required to make the NCAA tournament. It will be at most 10-10 and probably something like 6-7.

This is why I wanted a move made earlier. There are times when wins do more harm than good. It happened in 2019 when beating Purdue clinched an NCAA bid, saved Pitino for two more years and cost likely us Musselman. It could happen again this year. We shouldn't be put in a position where we have to choose between wins and prolonging long-term agony for the program.
 

bga1 said:
There is no way I am going to be Ben's defense attorney here, because it really should be NCAAs or bust...but the logic from Ben's side will be:

-Had a good team and lost it due to lack of NIL
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Part of the reason they lack NIL is that he's lost a ton of games and has no charisma or fundraising ability.
bga1 said:
-Have a solid frosh class incoming (the big guy appears to be legit)
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This point is vastly over-rated. First it's like #50 nationally. Hardly the Fab 5. And freshman recruits mean less than ever in 2025.
bga1 said:
-Lost Cochran and may get him another year here.
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Injuries happen to every team. We have no idea what he would have been this team. Overall they've been healthier than most this year.
bga1 said:
-Revenue sharing will help compete on a level playing field for the first time
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Maybe. I suspect the legal system will delay this for at least another year.
bga1 said:
-Great comeback after 0-6 start (assumes 7-8 BT Ws). The team improved and never quit
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OK
bga1 said:
-Didn't have Mitchell for 6 games
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See above
bga1 said:
-Team developed a gritty, defensive identity as the season went on
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He said that in his opening press conference. Why did it take 3.5 years?
 


Ben would consistently win at MN if he could recruit and most importantly, retain, players. He gets his guys ready to play and the X's and Os are pretty good. He has a terrible time managing players minutes and rotations, which has contributed to the exodus of talent. I dont think he's back under any circumstances, which is too bad. I wanted him to succeed but all the upheaval in his program and CBB in general has been too much to overcome. Glad to see the team is competing hard though.
 


howeda7 said:
There are times when wins do more harm than good. It happened in 2019 when beating Purdue clinched an NCAA bid, saved Pitino for two more years and cost likely us Musselman.
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So beating Purdue, making that nice run in the BTT, and beating Louisville for our 2nd tournament win since the scandal did "more harm than good"...got it!

Think we've now heard it all.
 

Before the season I was a tourney bid or new coach time guy, like most everyone else.

But now...if we somehow finish 10-10 this season after starting 0-6, I could be convinced/could see a world where that buys Ben another year. Not saying I'd support that, but would that be super outrageous?

With a brand new roster yet again next season it wouldn't make sense, but...
 

Zeppelin Gopher said:
So beating Purdue, making that nice run in the BTT, and beating Louisville for our 2nd tournament win since the scandal did "more harm than good"...got it!

Think we've now heard it all.
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Yes. IMO. If you believe Coyle would have pulled the plug if they missed the tournament and that Musselman wanted to come here it certainly did. Instead Pitino got two more futile years and now we've had 4 years of this. That's a steep price to pay for an NCAA bid and one win.
 


howeda7 said:
Yes. IMO. If you believe Coyle would have pulled the plug if they missed the tournament and that Musselman wanted to come here it certainly did. Instead Pitino got two more futile years and now we've had 4 years of this. That's a steep price to pay for an NCAA bid and one win.
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Oh god put your erection away for Musselman and get over it. He was never coming here in 2019 or last year.

The only time it could have been an option was hiring him instead of Pitino after Tubby. But even then, the U was never hiring Eric with his personality and the prior issues with his dad.
 

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