Warren suggests Divisions could be gone when USC/UCLA join

[fmlizard]

For sure. I think that’s a given.
They are going to adopt a 5 locked 5 random schedule

Minnesota will play Iowa, wisconsin, Michigan, Nebraska + 1 every year
Cycle through the other 10 home and home every 4 years.


This is the only way you can build a schedule that has only small chances for 3 way ties of teams that doesn’t play each other.
Also the only way USC plays penn state and Ohio state every year without having them in the same “division”


I predict:

Illinois - northwestern, Purdue, Indiana, Maryland, Ohio state

Indiana - purdue, Illinois, Rutgers, Maryland, Michigan state

Iowa - Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, northwestern, USC

Maryland - penn state, Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan

Michigan - Ohio state, Michigan state, Minnesota, Maryland, Rutgers

Michigan state - Michigan, penn state, northwestern, Indiana, Minnesota

Minnesota - Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan, Nebraska, Michigan state

Nebraska - Iowa, UCLA, USC, Minnesota, wisconsin

Northwestern - Wisconsin, Iowa, Illinois, Michigan state, Purdue

Ohio state - penn state, Michigan, USC, UCLA, Illinois

Penn state - Maryland, Rutgers, Ohio state,
Michigan state, USC

Purdue - Illinois, Indiana, UCLA, Rutgers, northwestern

Rutgers - penn state, Maryland, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan

UCLA - Nebraska, wisconsin, USC, Purdue, Ohio State

USC - Penn State, Nebraska, Iowa, Ohio State, UCLA

Wisconsin - Minnesota, Iowa, northwestern, Nebraska, UCLA

This would be a death knell for Gopher football based on anything we know today. Our problem with a protected rivalry system is that most of Minnesota's rivals are good at football. We've got the top historical programs (ex OSU) among our rivals. It's not like Minnesota can't beat these teams, but the steady, annual grind of upper tier foes when other teams are playing lower tier foes is a lot to overcome.

If they passed this, they will rejoice at Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern...who just so happen to have nearby rivalries with traditionally lower-end opponents. Minnesota would be the biggest loser.

It's been my position for years that Indiana should promote the end of divisions more than any other school because it gets them out of the East and into a bunch of protected games with (traditionally) lower-division programs like Purdue and Illinois.

 

[Plato]

It is not a death knell for MN football. MN has won 2/4 against WI and regularly beats NE.
What would MN football be without regularly playing IA and MI?
Before casting stones at Purdue and ILL as being inferior to MN just look back one year at the ILL game and this year at the Purdue game.
The message I read on this board is that PJ has on a trajectory that means they can compete with anyone.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

This would be a death knell for Gopher football based on anything we know today. Our problem with a protected rivalry system is that most of Minnesota's rivals are good at football. We've got the top historical programs (ex OSU) among our rivals. It's not like Minnesota can't beat these teams, but the steady, annual grind of upper tier foes when other teams are playing lower tier foes is a lot to overcome.

If they passed this, they will rejoice at Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern...who just so happen to have nearby rivalries with traditionally lower-end opponents. Minnesota would be the biggest loser.

It's been my position for years that Indiana should promote the end of divisions more than any other school because it gets them out of the East and into a bunch of protected games with (traditionally) lower-division programs like Purdue and Illinois.

With an expanded playoff, a top 3 B1G finish and a playoff trip should be a realistic goal for the Gophers once a decade. Even with those 5 common games.

Assuming our program doesn’t revert back to 70s-2000s Gophers. Though if the playoff committee goes rogue (which I’m sure they will) and takes liberties to rank 4th-5th place B1G teams higher than a 3rd place team then it is kind of out of our hands.

Michigan is a historic super power, but will they get back to that level? Maybe. Avoiding Penn State and OSU would be helpful. And we should be aspiring to be better than Wisconsin, Iowa, and Nebraska on a regular basis. Michigan State is meh. They were great the last 10-12 years. Not sure they’re historically a program that we should be afraid of.

 

[USAF]

What gives you that idea? Also what do you have to back that up? Warren has been atrocious since the day he came, from the Covid handling, losing out on Texas / OU, and once did, sat on his hands until USC fell in his lap and he was forced to act. He has done B1G no favors

He handled Covid perfectly, despite a couple conference achools acting irresponsibly. He gets USC/UCLA and the SoCal TV markets, and can poach other schools at any time of his choosing. He negotiates a massive TV deal that includes 3 major over the air networks and positions the B1G to dominate college FB on TV for the forseeable future.

 

[Johnny Olson]

What will we be playing for in November? As we found out last year, win, loss record doesn't mean that much when it comes to the Bowls.

 

[Some guy]

This would be a death knell for Gopher football based on anything we know today. Our problem with a protected rivalry system is that most of Minnesota's rivals are good at football. We've got the top historical programs (ex OSU) among our rivals. It's not like Minnesota can't beat these teams, but the steady, annual grind of upper tier foes when other teams are playing lower tier foes is a lot to overcome.

If they passed this, they will rejoice at Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern...who just so happen to have nearby rivalries with traditionally lower-end opponents. Minnesota would be the biggest loser.

It's been my position for years that Indiana should promote the end of divisions more than any other school because it gets them out of the East and into a bunch of protected games with (traditionally) lower-division programs like Purdue and Illinois.

You still are playing half the other people per year. The schedules would be a lot more balanced than people think.

But yes, some teams would have tougher schedules than others. That’s the case regardless of the scheduling arrangement once you get to 16 teams. (Kind of already true).

Already kind of true in 14
Purdue and northwestern have a much easier schedules than the rest of the west this year.

 

[Zeppelin Gopher]

Adding USC and UCLA to the West (and moving the boilers to the East) is the perfect way to counteract the fact that Wisconsin and Nebraska have slowly deteriorated over the last decade from the from the perennial contenders they were expected to be back in 2014.

And never play the teams in the other division? That's not a real conference.

Divisions are going away across college football, might as well get used to it. They simply aren't tenable in leagues with 16 schools.

 

[mngolf]

I still think B1G will move to a pods situation like the NFL at some point. And have a schedule set up the same as the NFL. So you play teams in your pod every year, and other pods on a rotating basis.

 

[Goldmember]

And never play the teams in the other division? That's not a real conference.

Divisions are going away across college football, might as well get used to it. They simply aren't tenable in leagues with 16 schools.

No. Every team plays every team in the other division once every 4 years.

Eliminating divisions solves nothing. The whole “pods” concept was cooked-up by sports pundits who struggle with math.

The reality is, it’s untenable to eliminate divisions with a conference as large as 16 teams with 9 games if there is more than 1 protected rivalry. Without adding semifinals you would not be able to determine a conference champion. You could easily end up with 3 identical teams at the top of the conference standing with no logical tie-breakers because of a lack of common opponents in any given year.

 

[fmlizard]

It is not a death knell for MN football. MN has won 2/4 against WI and regularly beats NE.
What would MN football be without regularly playing IA and MI?
Before casting stones at Purdue and ILL as being inferior to MN just look back one year at the ILL game and this year at the Purdue game.
The message I read on this board is that PJ has on a trajectory that means they can compete with anyone.

It's not that Minnesota can't win these games. Of course, they can.

Over the long run, having lots of protected games with high resource teams like Michigan, Nebraska. Wisconsin, Iowa, etc. grinds a program down and makes bigger goals difficult.

It's not that the games are impossible. It's how games that Minnesota might have had a 75% win probability in are replaced with 40% win probability, to pull numbers out of the air.

Those changes would add up and combine with a "top 2 no matter what" system for the title game and it just becomes harder.

 

[Calgoph]

Adding USC and UCLA to the West (and moving the boilers to the East) is the perfect way to counteract the fact that Wisconsin and Nebraska have slowly deteriorated over the last decade from the from the perennial contenders they were expected to be back in 2014.

Yes, 2 divisions of 8 teams, divided East & West. Did we not learn anything with the Legends & Leaders fiasco? Putting both CA teams in the West & moving Purdue to the East solves much of the balance issue and allows virtually all (if not all) long standing rivalries to play every year.

It also makes sense to me to have the same divisional set-up for all Big Ten teams when there are at least 6 teams in each division. With all the money floating around the Big Ten office there is no reason they can't figure out how to fairly equalize travel cost factors in the conference.

 

[Ope3]

Yes, 2 divisions of 8 teams, divided East & West. Did we not learn anything with the Legends & Leaders fiasco? Putting both CA teams in the West & moving Purdue to the East solves much of the balance issue and allows virtually all (if not all) long standing rivalries to play every year.

It also makes sense to me to have the same divisional set-up for all Big Ten teams when there are at least 6 teams in each division. With all the money floating around the Big Ten office there is no reason they can't figure out how to fairly equalize travel cost factors in the conference.

That makes perfect sense from the fans point of view, especially for teams in the West.

Not happening though. Get used to it.

 

[howeda7]

For sure. I think that’s a given.
They are going to adopt a 5 locked 5 random schedule

Minnesota will play Iowa, wisconsin, Michigan, Nebraska + 1 every year
Cycle through the other 10 home and home every 4 years.


This is the only way you can build a schedule that has only small chances for 3 way ties of teams that doesn’t play each other.
Also the only way USC plays penn state and Ohio state every year without having them in the same “division”


I predict:

Illinois - northwestern, Purdue, Indiana, Maryland, Ohio state

Indiana - purdue, Illinois, Rutgers, Maryland, Michigan state

Iowa - Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, northwestern, USC

Maryland - penn state, Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan

Michigan - Ohio state, Michigan state, Minnesota, Maryland, Rutgers

Michigan state - Michigan, penn state, northwestern, Indiana, Minnesota

Minnesota - Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan, Nebraska, Michigan state

Nebraska - Iowa, UCLA, USC, Minnesota, wisconsin

Northwestern - Wisconsin, Iowa, Illinois, Michigan state, Purdue

Ohio state - penn state, Michigan, USC, UCLA, Illinois

Penn state - Maryland, Rutgers, Ohio state,
Michigan state, USC

Purdue - Illinois, Indiana, UCLA, Rutgers, northwestern

Rutgers - penn state, Maryland, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan

UCLA - Nebraska, wisconsin, USC, Purdue, Ohio State

USC - Penn State, Nebraska, Iowa, Ohio State, UCLA

Wisconsin - Minnesota, Iowa, northwestern, Nebraska, UCLA

I wouldn't assume Michigan/Minnesota is protected nor would I want it to be. Between the laughably lopsided history and the fact that it hasn't been played regularly for over a decade, it's not a real rivalry, even if it has the coolest trophy.

Also, these pods are terribly unbalanced. Indiana's is a joke. MN and Nebraska's are brutal. The only fair way to do "pods" is go to 4 divisions instead of 2 and have semi-finals before the B1G Championship. That might be the only option at 20 teams, but at 16, keeping two 8 team divisions seems more logical. Otherwise, just give everyone two protected rivalry games and schedule the other 7 or 8 at random.

 

[Goldmember]

That makes perfect sense from the fans point of view, especially for teams in the West.

Not happening though. Get used to it.

Getting rid of divisions, if it happens, will be like another COVID-season disaster for the B1G. Get used to it.

 

[Ope3]

Getting rid of divisions, if it happens, will be like another COVID-season disaster for the B1G. Get used to it.

I'm just the messenger, it's happening and has been evident for several months. Also, personally, I hate it.

Regarding "COVID-season disaster", I don't think it was any worse than the other conferences in the end. Also still got a team (Ohio St) into the CFP Playoffs.

 

[FanSinceTheFifties]

They’d do the top 2 play for the championship. It’s basically a way for them to guarantee the title game be against 2 top 10 teams.

Would that game be in February?

 

[Panthadad2]

I wouldn't assume Michigan/Minnesota is protected nor would I want it to be. Between the laughably lopsided history and the fact that it hasn't been played regularly for over a decade, it's not a real rivalry, even if it has the coolest trophy.

Also, these pods are terribly unbalanced. Indiana's is a joke. MN and Nebraska's are brutal. The only fair way to do "pods" is go to 4 divisions instead of 2 and have semi-finals before the B1G Championship. That might be the only option at 20 teams, but at 16, keeping two 8 team divisions seems more logical. Otherwise, just give everyone two protected rivalry games and schedule the other 7 or 8 at random.

If the conference gets to 20 teams, this last scenario is probably the most plausible. Just play the games and let the standings and tie-breakers determine the champions and any auto-bid to the playoffs. A 20 team conference with multiple pods while retaining a championship game would be a mess. The BG10 went 115 years without a championship game, so it wouldn't bother me if that game was scrapped.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

Would that game be in February?

Same time as it is now. First weekend after Thanksgiving.

 

[Goldmember]

The BG10 went 115 years without a championship game, so it wouldn't bother me if that game was scrapped.

CCGs for the B1G and SEC will make no sense at all once there is a 12 team playoff format. The game will seem ridiculous to fans. But they are making too much money from these games to eliminate them. And people will keep watching.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

They are long gone, never to be seen again.
The emergence and dominance of tOSU, the rise of MI, and the persistence of PSU have made the divisions completely unbalanced for years.

But adding USC and UCLA to the West, where they would logically belong, would balance things out. I'm all for keeping regional divisions.

 

[Panthadad2]

But adding USC and UCLA to the West, where they would logically belong, would balance things out. I'm all for keeping regional divisions.

That's true, but I don't think that will happen. USC and UCLA didn't join the conference to play Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota (and other west teams) every year, then only play MI/OSU/PSU once a decade.

 

[Ope3]

But adding USC and UCLA to the West, where they would logically belong, would balance things out. I'm all for keeping regional divisions.

That's true, but I don't think that will happen. USC and UCLA didn't join the conference to play Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota (and other west teams) every year, then only play MI/OSU/PSU once a decade.

Divisions are not what the media partners are paying Billions of bucks for.

They are gone.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

This would be a death knell for Gopher football based on anything we know today. Our problem with a protected rivalry system is that most of Minnesota's rivals are good at football. We've got the top historical programs (ex OSU) among our rivals. It's not like Minnesota can't beat these teams, but the steady, annual grind of upper tier foes when other teams are playing lower tier foes is a lot to overcome.

If they passed this, they will rejoice at Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern...who just so happen to have nearby rivalries with traditionally lower-end opponents. Minnesota would be the biggest loser.

It's been my position for years that Indiana should promote the end of divisions more than any other school because it gets them out of the East and into a bunch of protected games with (traditionally) lower-division programs like Purdue and Illinois.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

The whole enterprise is bad for the Gophers - with super programs like tOSU, Michigan, Penn State, UCLA and USC, not to mention Iowa, Wisconsin, Illinois now, and a likely improvement at Nebraska, the Gophers will be lost in the middle. This greed that is driving football today is going to end up creating a pro-league of about 40-50 teams and the rest of the field dropping to a more old-fashioned student athlete, school-first outlook. The 12-team national playoff is terrible, too - 4 teams sit out the first round, conference champions are in regardless of ranking in polls, etc., loads of complaining from fans is inevitable.

 

[Ope3]

The whole enterprise is bad for the Gophers - with super programs like tOSU, Michigan, Penn State, UCLA and USC, not to mention Iowa, Wisconsin, Illinois now, and a likely improvement at Nebraska, the Gophers will be lost in the middle. This greed that is driving football today is going to end up creating a pro-league of about 40-50 teams and the rest of the field dropping to a more old-fashioned student athlete, school-first outlook. The 12-team national playoff is terrible, too - 4 teams sit out the first round, conference champions are in regardless of ranking in polls, etc., loads of complaining from fans is inevitable.

UCLA a super program? That's news to Bruins fans, I'm sure. They are having a good 2022 though.

 

[Plato]

The top four in the BIG will be guaranteed a spot in the championship games.
Each team will play 10 BIG games and there will be no divisions.
Of course, there will be outrage and bitching about the criteria for choosing the four.
I suspect Sagarin's computer will be used.
Times they are achanging.
Warren and the TV networks do not care a whit if some fans hate the whole idea.

 

[Bring back the Axe]

Make the last week's scheduling flexible to create a semifinal of the top 4.

Remaining teams can paired off to fill out the slate. Bump rivalry week up a week.

 

[Some guy]

If the conference gets to 20 teams, this last scenario is probably the most plausible. Just play the games and let the standings and tie-breakers determine the champions and any auto-bid to the playoffs. A 20 team conference with multiple pods while retaining a championship game would be a mess. The BG10 went 115 years without a championship game, so it wouldn't bother me if that game was scrapped.

20 team schedule is REALLY easy to schedule with a 9 game schedule.

4 pods of 5
Play your pod plus another pod of 5

You basically have rotating divisions.
POD 1
UCLA
Washington
Oregon
USC
Stanford/Colorado

POD 2
Minnesota
Iowa
Wisconsin
Nebraska
Illinois

POD 3
Ohio state
Michigan
Michigan state
Purdue
Indiana

POD 4
Notre Dame
Penn state
Rutgers
Maryland
Northwestern


Play everyone in the conference twice every 6 years.


The logistics are simple. I think if you had Notre Dame committed you take a couple more west coast teams and do it. Without notre dame not sure it makes more money than you have to pay out the newcomers

 

[Panthadad2]

20 team schedule is REALLY easy to schedule with a 9 game schedule.

4 pods of 5
Play your pod plus another pod of 5

You basically have rotating divisions.
POD 1
UCLA
Washington
Oregon
USC
Stanford/Colorado

POD 2
Minnesota
Iowa
Wisconsin
Nebraska
Illinois

POD 3
Ohio state
Michigan
Michigan state
Purdue
Indiana

POD 4
Notre Dame
Penn state
Rutgers
Maryland
Northwestern


Play everyone in the conference twice every 6 years.


The logistics are simple. I think if you had Notre Dame committed you take a couple more west coast teams and do it. Without notre dame not sure it makes more money than you have to pay out the newcomers

Pods are fine without a championship game. The pods would be meaningless for deciding a championship game.

 

[PMWinSTP]

Pods are fine without a championship game. The pods would be meaningless for deciding a championship game.

My understanding is they wouldn't be divisions so to speak, just a way to schedule the games, and the top two would play in the championship. If the divisions go away, I think the next step is each school getting three protected yearly rivals, and scheduling around them.