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Wally said:
I looked up Marxism, I can see how it would be an ideal, not realistic but as an overarching goal it isn't the worst thing in the world. I mean if your a disenfranchised group with the goal to be equal it is attractive. I think it's kind of sad how vitriolic everyone is to what is a cry for an equal shake in life.
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Absolutely. This is why people have a vitriolic response to it. The idea is intoxicating for people who have slightly less than other people. I do not even mean that in a condescending manner. The Bernie coalition tended to come from wealthier backgrounds than Biden coalition. Socialism and ergo Marxism are more of a product of a snobby upper middle class. To gain traction, they will have to then sell it to the disenfranchised groups (hey, here is free stuff, we'll save you). But the initial attraction is almost always upper middle class.

The vitriolic response is that it isn't seen by opponents as giving disenfranchised people an "equal shake". It's seen as using disenfranchised people to push an agenda. I'm not trying to rehash a Capitalism/Marxism debate, I'm sure we disagree and know where we both stand.
 

zman said:
Equal shake or equal result?
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Marxism really isn't about either. It's about consolidation of power with an elite group and it results in equality of results for those outside the group (they get nothing, equally).
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Absolutely. This is why people have a vitriolic response to it. The idea is intoxicating for people who have slightly less than other people. I do not even mean that in a condescending manner. The Bernie coalition tended to come from wealthier backgrounds than Biden coalition. Socialism and ergo Marxism are more of a product of a snobby upper middle class. To gain traction, they will have to then sell it to the disenfranchised groups (hey, here is free stuff, we'll save you). But the initial attraction is almost always upper middle class.

The vitriolic response is that it isn't seen by opponents as giving disenfranchised people an "equal shake". It's seen as using disenfranchised people to push an agenda. I'm not trying to rehash a Capitalism/Marxism debate, I'm sure we disagree and know where we both stand.
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Yep, you nailed. That absurdly complicated "double agent" take, must be the truth. It can't be something much simpler, like, some people subscribe to the ideal of "equality". Nope, that can't be it.

Occam's razor
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Marxism really isn't about either. It's about consolidation of power with an elite group and it results in equality of results for those outside the group (they get nothing, equally).
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It says absolutely nothing of the sort.

Just your weak attempt to mischaracterize it, in the hopes of scaring away people who want to be told what to think.
 



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