This team is fun on paper, but why does it look so bad? | Gopherhole

Allshade

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Ben’s really strong offensively knowledge wise. Thorson is also very strong offensively in all motion concepts. Jenkins worked under Mooney (really good offensively) at Richmond for 5 years. I don’t think knowledge is the issue. Our offensive efficiency was better than our defensive efficiency last year.
Good to know. Thank you.
 

march madness

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Early last year I was impressed with the Gopher's offense. They moved the ball crisply and created open shots. There was lots of motion. This year, not so much. I assume it is the difference in experience. But, last year, they had a bunch of guards and no dominant center. This year, pretty much just the opposite - they are trying to pound the ball inside. Lot less passing and not nearly as much movement - fewer good shots. I hope they get back to more of last year's offense. AND, I hope they keep playing a lot of players. They are not going to win the BIG this year. Last year was year 0, this is year 1. Lot of players with no college experience but a lot of promise - need to develop and get experience.
Last years team was filled with guards lacking athleticism but had tons of smarts and intangibles. They did move the ball well. Cooper is a great pg but this young team will not look like last years team, even then they can improve at moving the ball.
 

ecoperson

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Some of you must be very unpleasant to spend time with in person. The constant negativity and endless nit-picking is just so tiring. I would hate to be your child or spouse who fails to meet expectations day in and day out. It would also really suck to have you as a supervisor as nothing is likely ever good enough because its not exactly how you would do it.

The coaches and team are trying as hard as they can on and off the court. If you don't like a 4-1 record for nearly a full roster of new players, go follow another team. Maybe you can come back next year when Evans and Christie lace 'em up. Of course, I am sure they will disappoint you as well so maybe just watch the #1 team in the country each week as I am sure that will bring you greater joy and match your basketball acumen.

I know many of you are still chaffed about Johnson being hired. We are stuck with Johnson and company for a few more years so you may want to move past this. Or maybe share some of your expertise with the staff and AD. I am sure they would love to hear from you.

I might also recommend that you and your bobos cough up some major cash so Coyle can hire the biggest name coach out there and so we can pay the NIL necessary to attract the can't miss talent.

While you are doing that, I am going to sit back and watch this young team grow, gel, and IMPROVE. There is a lot of room for that but fortunately we have 25+ more games to go.
 

march madness

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People need to stop with this nonsense. They are projected to be a middle of the pack team in a weak conference. This team lost their first game to Dan Monson's LBSU by 15 this season. The Gophers were up 15-0 to start, and were still two inches from losing in regulation after only scoring 53.

A win is a win but Cal Baptist is a team most other B1G teams would destroy.
They are a decent team that beat Washington at Washington.

Most of the big ten would probably crush them, I agree, that’s why we are picked to be in the bottoms 3 teams in the league.

For us it was a decent measure of where this young team is at.

On another note, anyone sick of all the jacking up of three’s while Baptist made their run? Seemed like Payne was getting easy baskets all day until they stopped finding him.
 



ecoperson

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2027 is the target season. Condolences to those older fans. They have been stalwarts but this is gonna take some time.
You misheard... it is 2037. Have patience, my friend. I still think that you would really enjoy the UNC board. It gets about 3x the traffic that we get and they get to argue about whether they should have won by 10 points or 20 points every single game. You should try it on for size... I really think it suits you!
 

kix4kix

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Eh as usual the answer lies somewhere in the middle between the depressive folks and the half full guys. There was complete turnover a little over a year ago, I think we can all assume we won't be winning conference titles this year. But considering where we ended last year, we should be able to pick up a few more conference victories. That imo would be progress. Next year we should expect a winning record in BIG competition.
 

60's Guy

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
 

fan of Ray Williams

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
He logged over 20 a couple of games. Also had 17 and 18. Averaging over 16 even with only the 4 against the much hated rival, Lancers of Cal Baptist. Think you are going to be disappointed on seeing him get 20 minutes per game.
Henley over 25
Payne over 24
Carrington 23
Ola-Joseph over 16
Looks good to me on getting the freshmen minutes thus far.
 



Gopherfan84

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
What if the freshman we bring in next year are better players? What if Battle and Garcia come back? Most importantly, what if he’s not ready? Win was most important Monday.
 

Gopherfan84

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He logged over 20 a couple of games. Also had 17 and 18. Averaging over 16 even with only the 4 against the much hated rival, Lancers of Cal Baptist. Think you are going to be disappointed on seeing him get 20 minutes per game.
Henley over 25
Payne over 24
Carrington 23
Ola-Joseph over 16
Looks good to me on getting the freshmen minutes thus far.
Yeah we are plying them all plenty for the non con. Minutes will get tighter in conference play.
 

Gophs24

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Yeah we are plying them all plenty for the non con. Minutes will get tighter in conference play.
yeah big ten play we are going to see minutes much like this last go around....JOJ's minutes are going to be tough to come by when you have Battle/Garcia eating most of the position minutes you play

i would expect as the year goes on that Payne will inch closer to 30 minutes a game
Carrington/Henley both will remain around the 20 minutes per game and may be a bit of whos got the hot hand

but as surprising as JOJ's play has been this year once Battle came back it was obvious JOJ's minutes were going to go way down


BJ proved last year hes not afraid to play guys lots of minutes....and with Battle, Garcia, Cooper we will see that again. But i do hope he finds a way to get meaningful minutes to JOJ
 

Gopher_In_NYC

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People need to stop with this nonsense. They are projected to be a middle of the pack team in a weak conference. This team lost their first game to Dan Monson's LBSU by 15 this season. The Gophers were up 15-0 to start, and were still two inches from losing in regulation after only scoring 53.

A win is a win but Cal Baptist is a team most other B1G teams would destroy.

Sorry that someone pissed in your cheerios Mr. Grinch.
 



Spaulding!No!

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
We are going to stink this year!
 

MennoSota

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
No, they don't. What the freshmen need is more practice. This is why Betts is redshirting. Next season we have more freshmen coming in and...hopefully... Ihnen and Fox competing for minutes along with Battle, Garcia, and Cooper. Practice is where you hone your skills. Games are where you show them off. It's no different than a band concert or a play. You get good during rehearsal, not during showtime.
 

Dupreefor3

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We are not going to be good this season.
Ola-Joseph played 4 minutes last night.
If we are going to be dramatically better next year the four freshman need to play at least 20 minutes every night this year. We can be good next year if those guys get experience this year.
Three of them will, Payne played 40, Henley and Carrington are averaging over that number as well. I disagree with JOJ, he's a 10-12 minute energy guy, especially with Dawson and Battle on the roster and that's okay, he got a little out of control vs Baptist, two fouls in four minutes, missed some D assignments, think Ben was sending a message there. I expect him to play 10-12 vs UNLV. I was a little surprised we didn't see Ramburg for a stretch when Armstrong went on his heat check.. Would of been a good time to get him out for some hustle plays and his team D, give a Battle a breather
 

Chico Gopher

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No, they don't. What the freshmen need is more practice. This is why Betts is redshirting. Next season we have more freshmen coming in and...hopefully... Ihnen and Fox competing for minutes along with Battle, Garcia, and Cooper. Practice is where you hone your skills. Games are where you show them off. It's no different than a band concert or a play. You get good during rehearsal, not during showtime.
I like your analogy, and absolutely agree with the idea that practice is where you get better. I think most coaches would agree with you there. One caveat, unlike performing in a play or playing a concert, where nobody is trying really hard to PREVENT you from playing or performing well, you have to deal with that in sports. That's where game experience is helpful.

Of course, most coaches will try their best to make sure you've faced the same type of obstacles in as many situations as possible in practice every day, to get an idea of how you'll perform when facing them in an actual competition. The last thing a coach wants to do is throw a player into a situation they've never seen and aren't prepared for.

Some would say that there is no way to replicate everything you might see in a game in practices. They are likely correct, but that's another reason that coaches want everybody going all out every day in practice, so that things like the speed of the game, pressure, scramble situations aren't a big surprise to the new guy on the floor.
 
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march madness

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Eh as usual the answer lies somewhere in the middle between the depressive folks and the half full guys. There was complete turnover a little over a year ago, I think we can all assume we won't be winning conference titles this year. But considering where we ended last year, we should be able to pick up a few more conference victories. That imo would be progress. Next year we should expect a winning record in BIG competition.
If everyone returns next season, and Ben can recruit 1 quick player under 6-4 who can contribute, especially on defense,I think we have a chance to have a winning B 1 G record. Again we will be even more frontcourt heavy if the two injured guys return.

Carrington looked quicker this game to me which is great! But Cooper is crafty but slow. Foot speed at the guard spot is a real weakness.
 


jovs

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I am going to sit back and watch this young team grow, gel, and IMPROVE. There is a lot of room for that but fortunately we have 25+ more games to go.
This team is going to improve as the season progresses, not great right now but it will start to gel eventually. Talent is better than it has been for a while and add in the depth it should be fun to watch.
 

kix4kix

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If everyone returns next season, and Ben can recruit 1 quick player under 6-4 who can contribute, especially on defense,I think we have a chance to have a winning B 1 G record. Again we will be even more frontcourt heavy if the two injured guys return.

Carrington looked quicker this game to me which is great! But Cooper is crafty but slow. Foot speed at the guard spot is a real weakness.
Cooper is not a Big10 pg, I get it, apparently he is serviceable but he should not be starting based off of what I saw

Payne looks 1st team B10 caliber potential honestly, if you have one of those you always have a chance
 

60's Guy

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Ben has stated he prefers to play 7 guys.
We have different philosophies.

To improve, guys need practice and game experience. Not just practice. To be motivated and mentally engaged they need game minutes. It's not 1975…the mindset of players is different.

Pitino played 7. Never had a bench. Never had a guy ready to contribute when somebody got hurt.

No matter what we are going to be in the bottom half of the conference. Develop players, build team chemistry this year. Be good next year.

Playing Battle that many minutes off injury was pretty dumb! If you want logic examples of not looking beyond today. Battle, Garcia, Cooper expect to play 40 minutes. They expect it. It’s not how I’d do it. Ben can do it however he wants. I just don’t think we’ll be good this year or next year doing that.
 

Spaulding!No!

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Is building a four year team now a flawed strategy? It seems like we might get caught fighting the last war.
 

fan of Ray Williams

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If everyone returns next season, and Ben can recruit 1 quick player under 6-4 who can contribute, especially on defense,I think we have a chance to have a winning B 1 G record. Again we will be even more frontcourt heavy if the two injured guys return.

Carrington looked quicker this game to me which is great! But Cooper is crafty but slow. Foot speed at the guard spot is a real weakness.
Yeah, one of the first things I noticed. That was a welcome sight.
 


Gopherfan84

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Ben has stated he prefers to play 7 guys.
We have different philosophies.

To improve, guys need practice and game experience. Not just practice. To be motivated and mentally engaged they need game minutes. It's not 1975…the mindset of players is different.

Pitino played 7. Never had a bench. Never had a guy ready to contribute when somebody got hurt.

No matter what we are going to be in the bottom half of the conference. Develop players, build team chemistry this year. Be good next year.

Playing Battle that many minutes off injury was pretty dumb! If you want logic examples of not looking beyond today. Battle, Garcia, Cooper expect to play 40 minutes. They expect it. It’s not how I’d do it. Ben can do it however he wants. I just don’t think we’ll be good this year or next year doing that.
Most teams play 7 guys more than 10 minutes with an 8/9th getting under 10. In close games most play 7 guys over 95% of the minutes. I’d argue shorter benches are more modern now than ever. Not knocking your philosophy, just saying Ben’s isn’t that uncommon.
 

Dupreefor3

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Most teams play 7 guys more than 10 minutes with an 8/9th getting under 10. In close games most play 7 guys over 95% of the minutes. I’d argue shorter benches are more modern now than ever. Not knocking your philosophy, just saying Ben’s isn’t that uncommon.
Agreed, I think Battle, Garcia, Cooper those three will be 34+. Then Carrington, Henley and Payne, will all be 22-28. Treyton probably a 12-15 minute type. JOJ, Samuels and at times Ramburg are probably 4-6 minute rotation in the first half types, maybe more if it's going well. Those seem to be what the tiers are going to be with this squad if everyone is available.
 

Bayfieldgopher

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Cooper is not a Big10 pg, I get it, apparently he is serviceable but he should not be starting based off of what I saw

Payne looks 1st team B10 caliber potential honestly, if you have one of those you always have a chance
PP needs touches. Something he didn't get the second half against CBU. That's on BJ. That must change against UNLV.
 

60's Guy

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No, they don't. What the freshmen need is more practice. This is why Betts is redshirting. Next season we have more freshmen coming in and...hopefully... Ihnen and Fox competing for minutes along with Battle, Garcia, and Cooper. Practice is where you hone your skills. Games are where you show them off. It's no different than a band concert or a play. You get good during rehearsal, not during showtime.
There is so much in basketball you can't duplicate in practice. Practice the first 10 weeks...what you say is true. Season starts and you are load managing guys, especially depending on the schedule. How many minutes do you think the team practices in December? and in February?
I bet Battle and Garcia and Payne might be available for Ola-Joseph to practice against for 5 or 10 minutes on a good day. You are doing walk throughs, film study, blackboard discussions, shooting, stretching, weight training and rarely 5 on 5. That is not how you get better as an inexperienced player.
Sure, like your music example, you spend time on individual skills, ball handling, shooting, strength training. Two on two with the other guys who don't play. To get experience once the season starts, you need game minutes. They ain't scrimmaging 5 on 5 in December but rarely and Jan, Feb less to none. You are saving legs for the guys who play 40 minutes. So no, Ola-Joseph is not learning how to play Big Ten basketball in practice. He can improve his individual skills but that is 180 from being comfortable, confident, productive in a Big Ten game.

And I get that LOTS of coaches play 7 guys. At Minnesota we never (I suppose it is almost never)
have our best 7 guys healthy for an entire season. 2 of those 7 (or 9) didn't get through fall practice. Battle and Carrington missed weeks. You gotta play 9 now so you can play 7 IF two get hurt.

Again, just my experience from 40 years of successful coaching. Another guy, you, Ben can win only playing 7. Last year we probably didn't have the next guy up. Okay, this year we do. It's just how I'd do it, did it to win titles and fight at the top for them when we didn't. Not live on the bottom.
 




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