Suggs craps on Pitino in strib article

[BarnBurner]

UVA,UW,Viilanova,Gonzaga

Lumping in Wright with the others (K, Slick, Willy) is shameful, badger, downright shameful.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Who ? Who cheats with bag man and cash. Very few schools are even in play for the one and done players. If Suggs had picked here would we be thinking we paid. Jealous fans and assistant coaches of loser programs just make up lies. Those that cheated, like Pitino sr. will get caught and punished. Not even 10 coaches implicated total ! Lets not throw all the clean programs under the bus. The coaching staffs i have either represented, scouted for would never conduct themselves in the way the scum has. They deplore cheaters but beat em anyway.

Built, with Michigan State being one of the teams I follow, I'm curious what your thoughts are on Izzo?

 

[Parcival]

Badger throws out the "loser programs" easily. He hasn't slipped - yet - on his true feelings of the MN program. He has come close, just not called MN a loser program.

"Legendary" coaches, according to Badger. Willy Self and K. Slick Cal. ALL winners of CONF titles and NCAA Championships. Conf Titles and NCAA titles are what matters, right badger?

We should turn this thread into a GoperHole reality TV show. The drama is real ?

 

[BarnBurner]

We should turn this thread into a GoperHole reality TV show. The drama is real ?

 

[Bad Gopher]

. WOW the opinion of a coddled teenager is your compass to determine how the Uof M basketball is regarded

I hate to say it, but if this weren't a broad reflection of a local opinions among players and coaches, then Pitino would have recruited more than zero local 5-star players in his 7-year tenure.

 

[WoodburyTim]

First of all I read the article and to me the thread title stating he crapped on Pitino is misleading. I think some of you read too much between the lines. From the article he stated that from day one Gonzaga was his choice as he felt it was the right place for him. Good for him. From what I know about Gonzaga it seems to be a great school. Would I have liked him to play for the Gophers, sure. I always like to watch Mn kids play for the U. Am I going to dish him for leaving, no. I like the players we have now and I think with the players coming in we can be even better next year especially if Oturu stays. Go Gophers.

Yeah I agree, I didn't see anything to get all up in arms about.

 

[alchemy2u]

builtbadgers seems to love teams/coaches/programs that win a lot of meaningless games, vs good competition(Virginia), and vs creampuffs(Gonzaga), and then go on to NOT live up to the hype in the NCAA tourney.

Oh, but wait, didn't built just express how awesome Gonzaga has done under Few?


Well, I have to add something in here, someone made the comment that Pitino has had 7 seasons now, isn't that enough time for him to have proven himself yet?

Looking at Few's FIRST FIFTEEN seasons, so TWICE as many as Pitino's had so far, his most successful NCAA tourney's in comparison to their seed, were his first two. How much of that might have been his benefitting from what Monson helped build before he left? I mean, Monson got the Zags to the Elite 8, but it took Few SIXTEEN YEARS to get back there.


As for years #3 through #15?

5 EARLY EXITS, a #1, a #2 and a #3 seeded team that didn't get out of the 2nd round. And a #6 and a #7 seed would couldn't get out of the 1st round.

6 times where they exited where their seed would predict they should, which accounted for their only 2 Sweet 16s in the entire 13 year period.

And just 2 times where they exceeded expectations, with one of those being their being a #9 seed beating an overrated #8 seeded Cincy team(Cincy has an even worse record of underperforming in post season play).


So their most impressive performance in those 13 years, was a single 1st round upset as an #11 seed over a #7 seed, which is the most common matchup that results in upsets.



Btw, over that 15 year period, The Zags winning percentage over Top 25 teams was only .333

22-44 by my count. And 3 of those victories were over a St Mary's team that got into the rankings by beating even a weaker slate of creampuffs than Gonzaga usually does.



Few and Zaga finally got back to the Elite 8 and since then has done VERY WELL. Good for him. But the Zags are still only basically matching their seed, with 1 of the last 5 years being an early exit, and 1 of them being an over achieving tourney, each of those by just 1 round, so nothing incredibly significant.

But it did take him SIXTEEN YEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!




Difference between Zaga and Minny/Few and Pitino?

Zaga got the benefit of some great press that Monson brought the program, and then 90% of their scheduled opponents are creampuffs, easy to beat, and so they got LOTS of chances to prove themselves in the NCAA tourney, BEFORE they matched the success of the previous coach.

Minny did not gain the benefit of a previously successful coach, instead the previous coach slacked off on his recruiting and left Pitino with fairly empty cupboards to work with. And Minnesota plays a much tougher schedule year in and year out, so there is very little room for dealing with, say, a season with lots of injuries, or players leaving early for the NBA, or a combination of the two.

Another difference is Gonzaga is a tiny school, with nothing else going for it, nothing that I know of. How many sports do they even have? So Few got them to 2 Sweet 16s back to back to start his time there, and was basically made King of Hill, and they kept him on despite making only 2 more Sweet 16s over the next 13 seasons, probably because they knew they couldn't do better, and now their patience has been rewarded.
Here at Minnesota, we have higher expectations, if our Football coach(Mason) comes up short of expectations come the post season, we fire him, we'd have fired Few after the 05 season or if not then, then after the 2013 season for sure, getting a #1 seed and not even getting to the Sweet 16? Another example is our former Hockey Coach. Back to Back NCAA Titles early on wasn't good enough, like it was for Few, getting back to the Frozen Four a couple times also wasn't good enough, like 2 Sweet 16s over 13 seasons WAS good enough for Gonzaga. And we fired a lot of cbb coaches despite their getting us to the NCAA tourney, because that wasn't enough, unlike it was for Few. We want more, so a portion of Gopher fans have been talking about firing Pitino since the day it was announced he was hired. And bad seasons are intolerable even if they are riddled by injuries, or the combo of injuries and players leaving early for the NBA or something like that.




And we don't keep enough of the locals?

Want to know how many of Zaga's current roster are not even from AMERICA, much less from the NW?

SIX FOREIGNERS, and 3 Texans. Just 4 players from the NW.




It's simple, very few schools out there are loaded with all the local talent, kids often like the idea of going off and out in the world, away from parents, away from their home state. And if they are super good, with the ability to go to the NBA after 1 or 2 seasons, then they NEED to go to a school that is VERY VERY GOOD, to increase their chances of getting to the Final Four.



And how well did the last three 1-2 doners we brought in do for us?

Rickert, Pryzbilla, Humphries?

All 3 only cared about themselves. Rickert left after 2 when he was obviously not ready to, and for what? He never even made it to the NBA. Pryzbilla didn't even finish his 2nd season, did he? I hope having a lackluster NBA career was worth it? And Humphries? He was a huge cancer on that team, and all his efforts got him was being known as the butt of a lot of jokes and as Mr Kardashian.

Signing those 3 did NOT bring in a flood of other instaters.

Excellent post. The Zags are not who people think they are. Just look at the Zags remaining schedule for this year! If we had 3 of these games on our schedule, fans would be demanding their money back for not playing anybody.

DATE	OPPONENT	TIME	TV	TICKETS
Thu, Jan 9	@San Diego	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $42
Sat, Jan 11	@Loyola Marymount	3:00 PM		Tickets as low as $18
Thu, Jan 16	vsSanta Clara	10:00 PM		Tickets as low as $374
Sat, Jan 18	vsBYU	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $509
Sat, Jan 25	vsPacific	9:00 PM
Thu, Jan 30	@Santa Clara	9:30 PM	CBSSN	Tickets as low as $42
Sat, Feb 1	@San Francisco	3:00 PM		Tickets as low as $156
Thu, Feb 6	vsLoyola Marymount	10:00 PM	CBSSN
Sat, Feb 8	@Saint Mary's	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $106
Sat, Feb 15	@Pepperdine	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $33
Thu, Feb 20	vsSan Francisco	10:00 PM		Tickets as low as $452
Sat, Feb 22	@BYU	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $12
Thu, Feb 27	vsSan Diego	8:00 PM
Sat, Feb 29	vsSaint Mary's	9:00 PM

Top that with the weaker NCAA tournament opponents that a high seed will play and you can see why they should expect to make it to the SweetSixteen every year. ( #1 has to beat the #16 & #8 or #9), (#2 has to beat #15 & #7 or #10).

They would be a middle of the pack B1G team at best!

 

[bga1]

Suggs wants to contend for the national title and play games against powerhouse teams. I am a Gopher fan through and through, but that isn't us right now and it isn't likely to be us during the course of Suggs' career. The arena at Gonzaga is smaller, but it's always full. The Bulldogs have a weak WCC slate compared to what the Big Ten offers, but outside the league have played or will play North Carolina, Arizona, Washington, Oregon, Michigan, and Texas A&M. In recent seasons they've played Duke, Tennessee, Villanova, Florida, Texas, UCLA, and other teams of note. They're ranked #1 at the moment, made the Elite 8 last season, the Sweet 16 the season before that, and another year back played for the National Championship. Look at how we compare.

The announced crowd for the Northwestern game was 9,574. It was 9,854 for the Ohio State game and 10,148 for the Clemson game. The crowds for most of the nonconference home games need to have significant numbers of no shows subtracted. That looks bad in a 14,000 plus building. Pitino in the Strib over the weekend was just short of begging fans to come to games. We had a great tourney run last season, but have had too many seasons as underachievers. A lot of the problems with attendance and fan interest long predate Richard Pitino. I see them as being an issue back to the academic scandal from which attendance never recovered. Suggs didn't grow up in that early 1970s to late 1990s period when Gopher Basketball was such a huge deal around here, at times arguably the #2 local sport behind the Vikes during some low Twins periods. The ties aren't there for him. Of course we need guys like him to get good enough to attract the future recruits, but regardless, just being local isn't enough.

Suggs is a great player. If would have come here next year- darn near every game would be sold out. His games would have been on TV while most of America is still awake. At least 20 of his games would be against teams rated far better than the teams they play in conference. If he came and Oturu stayed we would be as good as Gonzaga next year.

So...in my view none of your arguments above work. If you want to say that Few is the better coach- fine, that is fair.

For me though the issue is not that he went there. I really have no issue with that. He says that Gonzaga was where he wanted to go from day one. Then make the choice, skip arranging the parade in your own honor and don't throw shade on the hometown team in the process.

 

[ltf]

He does not excel at player development. He is below average in that area and, because he is below average in that area, I wouldn't say that he gets the most out of his teams.

Agree to disagree.

 

[builtbadgers]

Built, with Michigan State being one of the teams I follow, I'm curious what your thoughts are on Izzo?

He is a great teacher,great motivator , kids love him. He offers no cash but i am not happy with him protecting players from the trouble they have been into. Love how tough his guys have played mentally and physically.

 

[builtbadgers]

Lumping in Wright with the others (K, Slick, Willy) is shameful, badger, downright shameful.

I think of Wright and Bennett above those guys, do not speak for me. Try and form your own opinions. Who are your choices of best coaches that play it clean ?

 

[MennoSota]

Did Suggs not choose Minnesota because he would play behind Marcus Carr?

 

[BarnBurner]

I think of Wright and Bennett above those guys, do not speak for me. Try and form your own opinions. Who are your choices of best coaches that play it clean ?

Didn’t speak for you. YOU lumped those coaches together based on YOUR criteria badger. Using your own stuff, badger, and now you dont like it.

 

[builtbadgers]

Excellent post. The Zags are not who people think they are. Just look at the Zags remaining schedule for this year! If we had 3 of these games on our schedule, fans would be demanding their money back for not playing anybody.

DATE	OPPONENT	TIME	TV	TICKETS
Thu, Jan 9	@San Diego	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $42
Sat, Jan 11	@Loyola Marymount	3:00 PM		Tickets as low as $18
Thu, Jan 16	vsSanta Clara	10:00 PM		Tickets as low as $374
Sat, Jan 18	vsBYU	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $509
Sat, Jan 25	vsPacific	9:00 PM
Thu, Jan 30	@Santa Clara	9:30 PM	CBSSN	Tickets as low as $42
Sat, Feb 1	@San Francisco	3:00 PM		Tickets as low as $156
Thu, Feb 6	vsLoyola Marymount	10:00 PM	CBSSN
Sat, Feb 8	@Saint Mary's	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $106
Sat, Feb 15	@Pepperdine	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $33
Thu, Feb 20	vsSan Francisco	10:00 PM		Tickets as low as $452
Sat, Feb 22	@BYU	9:00 PM		Tickets as low as $12
Thu, Feb 27	vsSan Diego	8:00 PM
Sat, Feb 29	vsSaint Mary's	9:00 PM

Top that with the weaker NCAA tournament opponents that a high seed will play and you can see why they should expect to make it to the SweetSixteen every year. ( #1 has to beat the #16 & #8 or #9), (#2 has to beat #15 & #7 or #10).

They would be a middle of the pack B1G team at best!

Few has been to the sweet 16 and beyond 9 times. Three elite 8's, runner up. 31 ncaa victories. He has really developed a lot of wonderful players. John Stockton and Jerry West think he is a great coach. Yes, that schedule is garbage but adjusted for strength of schedule year after year they are wildly efficient. He has built a huge national brand, players and families love him and he is still making them better. Getting extraordinary players in that recruiting pipeline. My opinion, they are not middle of the pack Big 10.

 

[BarnBurner]

He is a great teacher,great motivator , kids love him. He offers no cash but i am not happy with him protecting players from the trouble they have been into. Love how tough his guys have played mentally and physically.

Protecting players from trouble is the definition of cheating!!!!

wwmd? What. Would. Minnesota. Do.

 

[builtbadgers]

Didn’t speak for you. YOU lumped those coaches together based on YOUR criteria badger. Using your own stuff, badger, and now you don’t like it.

No my criteria includes winning clean, winning a National Title like Bennett did clean. From a teaching standpoint those others are top shelf. Have you ever seen a clinic or a practice by any of them ? Again, what is your own criteria for a great coach. Do they even need a winning record ? Have they ever had scum in the program, won conference titles ?

 

[builtbadgers]

Protecting players from trouble is the definition of cheating!!!!

wwmd? What. Would. Minnesota. Do.

He did not ask that question.

 

[Roland Brooks]

Bennett’s teams have been painful to watch until last year. He finally got some shot makers and he let them play a bit. He coaches boring ass Hickory High basketball. Painful he would go Four corners if he could.

He got his ring took a few miracles but congrats. Jerome and Guy were big time and I bet Bennett deep down didn’t like Guy jacking up shots at times. UVA’s style on O and D is fun if you are over 70...

 

[BarnBurner]

He did not ask that question.

And you didn’t bring it up, either mr morals.

 

[builtbadgers]

Bennett’s teams have been painful to watch until last year. He finally got some shot makers and he let them play a bit. He coaches boring ass Hickory High basketball. Painful he would go Four corners if he could.

He got his ring took a few miracles but congrats. Jerome and Guy were big time and I bet Bennett deep down didn’t like Guy jacking up shots at times. UVA’s style on O and D is fun if you are over 70...

Better do you research. Top 5 offense 2016, top 2 last year , way better than ours several years. Pitino's dad will not miss a UVA game. Coaches love watching teams that take good shots, do not turn it over and play lockdown defense. The barn would be sold out with that record here. 4 ACC titles in 6 years. Numerous national coach of the year awards. Not the least bit concerned with Guys shot selection, encouraged taking more. Hunter was actually the big dog, not bad for a 92 ranked recruit that redshirted. To each his own on style. He would never go four corners as a prolific scorer as he was. It was always about maximizing the opportunity to win. I realize that some fans would rather lose 80-78 than win to 65-55. Talk to college coaches, talk to high school coaches, go to clinics to see the level and gift of great teaching.

 

[Roland Brooks]

First off who is ours? I don’t play for the Gophers. Second like I said Pitino is close to 70. Last year I noted their success it was the funnest UVA team to watch to date. They had guys with some pizzazz and shot makers thanks for making my point.

 

[Roland Brooks]

Few gets extraordinary talent at Gonzaga and develops them that’s the post I read. If that is the case the NBA should have tons of great Zags players in the NBA... I guess I don’t see many.. their players success in the NBA mirror the underachievement in the NCAA tourney

 

[Roland Brooks]

Now Jay Wright is the man.

 

[builtbadgers]

First off who is ours? I don’t play for the Gophers. Second like I said Pitino is close to 70. Last year I noted their success it was the funnest UVA team to watch to date. They had guys with some pizzazz and shot makers thanks for making my point.

Guy did not take 5 bad shots in his UVA career. Young Pitino loves watching UVA, so does Beard, Jay Wright, tons of guys under 70. Players as well. Klay Thompson records the games. He just had more offensively gifted players last year. He simply coaches to get the best chance of winning in a way that fits the skills of the players.

 

[Roland Brooks]

Research not needed. Check the box score Guy and Jerome balled in the Purdue and Auburn games..outplayed Hunter.

 

[builtbadgers]

Research not needed. Check the box score Guy and Jerome balled in the Purdue and Auburn games..outplayed Hunter.

Check Hunter in the title game , check his defense every game. Went to a couple dozen UVA practices and games so very aware of those three and saw a great deal of them in high school.

 

[builtbadgers]

Few gets extraordinary talent at Gonzaga and develops them that’s the post I read. If that is the case the NBA should have tons of great Zags players in the NBA... I guess I don’t see many.. their players success in the NBA mirror the underachievement in the NCAA tourney

Read carefully. The extraordinary player part is in the pipeline and about making them even better. Besides not being a fan of how Suggs announced he thinks he picked a better program and a better coach by a mile.

 

[Roland Brooks]

How many times has UVA scored in the 40’s this year?

 

[Roland Brooks]

Agree he announced a better program/ coach never argued that. He is going pro been saying for 6 months thus the Zag commitment will be irrelevant thus increasing the chances of the Zags nutting up in 20-21...

 

[GoodasGold]

Let’s put this thread to bed...Just a suggestion.