StarTrib: How plunging ticket sales have changed Gophers sports

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Schnauzer said:
People with season tickets can no longer expect to break even when they sell their tickets because the secondary market is awash with cheap discounts. So, being a season ticket holder sometimes means paying more for seats that other are getting for far less. That conspires to be the exact opposite of a season ticket holder perk.
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Again, the "idea" or "principle" behind it, I have to guess, is that it was supposed to be about MORE than just buying tickets to the game. It was supposed to be about donating to the athletic dept.

If you completely discount the latter part of it from the equation -- which I'm not at all saying is invalid! -- then of course it makes it look silly to buy season tickets, considering just purely the price. Especially if you don't care how good your seats are, but rather just want to get into the stadium (and perhaps "move down" later on). If that's all you cared about, then yes just get frozen pizza tickets.

But that's not what they envisioned for it, when instituting it, I have to guess.

The LONG waits for video reviews and forced TV timeouts also detract from the in-person experience. Those TV timeouts are important for the big TV cash cow but they help to make the experience of going to the game a diminished one. It isn't just HD widescreens. The game has evolved in multiple ways to cater to TV over in-stadium viewing. It will be hard if not impossible to get the money genie back in the bottle.
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Impossible.

The Big Ten gives Minnesota $51M a year. That's gotta be like 50%-ish of the athletic dept revenue. Almost all of that money comes from things which are built solely or mostly upon TV revenue (March Madness credits, CFP payouts, bowl game payouts, Big Ten's TV contracts with ESPN, FOX, and BTN, etc.).

Football tickets revenues are now like $10M.

To say "not even close" doesn't do it justice. The genie is out of the bottle .... and on a flight to Australia. Gone. It'll never be like it was before TV.
 
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GFBfan said:
You’re delusional
Nobody, I repeat nobody has said it has been a waste of 18 months.
PJ has improved the already high academics which is a great thing. He has promoted the community service that the players do-other staffs had the kids doing that as well, they just didn’t promote it as much. He has brought in some recruits that the recruiting sites like and increased our ranking. Which many others have stated, including those who don’t support all the RTB stuff that has superseded the U of M, Golden Gophers and Ski-U-Mah.
The slogan is a great story, but it is not the U of M’s, and it should not be more or equally as prominent on any official Gopher Football gear.
PJ walked into a great situation with an almost new stadium, a soon to be finished Athletes Village at the time of his signing and a team that had some success prior to him being here and good character players for the most part.
He’s also been given the largest contract ever for a HC and more support from the admin than any of the previous coaches ever had.
Win some more games and not have games like the last two they played and the support will be there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Absolutely nailed it.
 

We had plenty of support for the Orlando football Missouri game. It was really over whelming... Great turnout despite many who said the gophers fans dont travel well... Then we get thouroughly out coached in the loss (fake punt and on-side kick-off) among the worst AND then they slapped on the extra fees after that game... I believe Fleck will get the excitement back and I think hoops will have a very good season. Last year we filled Williams Arena up for the Miami game but of course lost. We need to win a marquee home football game - Personally I still would rather attend a Gopher football and bb game (no matter how crummy we are) then go to a pro game.
 

Pete smith said:
For all you supposed Gopher fans in your 30’s,40’s,50’s whatever age, take a hike. If you can’t support PJ and his RTB culture, then you can’t support the Gophers. In just a very short time on campus, he has done MORE for Gopher football, Gopher athletics than Kill, Claeys, Brewster, Mason as well as the past coaches combined. Gopher football is close to being relevant once again. Something I witnessed back in the sixties. So complain all you want but PJ is the right coach at the right time. My suggestion to you is find something else to do during the fall on Saturdays, but for me I will be at TCF cheering as loud as I can for the Gophers.
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I am with Pete, unless you are willing to scream in a high pitched voice and throw your underpants at PJ when he runs out of the tunnel, We Don't Need You!
 

hungan1 said:
My daughter doesn't want to go to Gopher games with me any more. It will be so much of a hassle with the baby now and having to put everything in plastic bags. It is too long for my grand kids to drive there, park, wait in line, and then wait too long for traffic to go back home. Particularly, night games are tougher. Ideally, you'd want an afternoon game. It is not a very friendly young family experience.

There. You lose potential future Gopher football fans.

It would have been fun if they expanded the tail gating, and have something setup up more things for kids to do. We would've come early and enjoy the festivities. It is not as enjoyable an experience according to my daughter. They'd rather go to a Saints game.
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What do places like Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska do for young families?

I have to imagine a college football gameday isn't exactly the ideal event for young families, no matter the situation. The game itself is a long event. Nevermind if you're trying to pre-game. Traffic for any P5 won't be lickity-split, no matter how well planned. It's a long day, no matter what, and young kids get cranky, etc.
 


hungan1 said:
My daughter doesn't want to go to Gopher games with me any more. It will be so much of a hassle with the baby now and having to put everything in plastic bags. It is too long for my grand kids to drive there, park, wait in line, and then wait too long for traffic to go back home. Particularly, night games are tougher. Ideally, you'd want an afternoon game. It is not a very friendly young family experience.

There. You lose potential future Gopher football fans.

It would have been fun if they expanded the tail gating, and have something setup up more things for kids to do. We would've come early and enjoy the festivities. It is not as enjoyable an experience according to my daughter. They'd rather go to a Saints game.
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I have the opposite problem. We took our daughters to many basketball games and a few football games while they grew up. They want to continue going, but their biggest problem is finding friends to go with. My younger daughter is entering her junior year at the U. She had season tickets her first two years, but dropped them this year because the older students don't go. She'll party at the frats with them and skip the game this year. My older daughter just graduated from UND (sorry). She considered getting her own season ticket, but it costs too much for her to sit near us, and she didn't think she could find anyone else who wanted to pay to sit with her in up high in a corner. She did get tickets to one game at the state fair, and I'm buying pizzas for dinner today to help her get to another.

Unlike other sports, football can be a group experience for many. It's more fun if you have people to go with, but it needs to be easy to get others to go. And if you make it harder for people to stay in and a few bail, others in the group tend to follow.
 

Gophers_4life said:
RTB is Fleck's personal brand. He owns the brand, and will take it wherever he goes. It's just part of the deal, when you sign Fleck. That's how he runs his program, so you either live with it, or you find someone else.

As I've said many times, IF he wins ... then he can run around the field naked for all I care. Just win
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Yes, but that's not the point I'm making. Brick by Brick was the brand Kill brought in. It has also been/is currently used by other coaches and did not originate in Minnesota. Yet Kill incorporated that onto our jersey's with far less outrage. It came and went with Kill/Claeys. RTB can be tied to Ski-U-Mah just as much if not more than Brick by Brick is tied to Memorial Stadium.

RTB has not supplanted Ski-U-Mah, not even close. Fleck continues to combine the two and promote Ski-U-Mah more than many of his predecessors.
 

the thing is - I always thought the rationale behind buying season tickets was that you got a price break compared to people who bought single-game tickets. the idea was you saved money by buying season tickets (assuming you planned to attend every game.) And, you were guaranteed a seat for the game (in case it was a sell-out).

Well, that might have been true once, but now, it sure looks like buying season tickets is more expensive than buying single-game tickets on the secondary market, or waiting for a deal like the pizza offer. so, the only reasons to buy season tickets are to
1. support the University with a donation, or
2. guarantee a ticket in case of a sell-out.
and 3. guarantee you sit in the same seats for every game, if that is a priority.

seeing that #2 is becoming a rarity, the only real reason left to buy season tickets is because you want to support the U of MN. But - you can also support the U of MN with a donation without buying football tickets. so, that leaves the only real reason to buy season tickets is if you really want to sit in the same seats every week.

Unless the Gophers suddenly turn into a FB juggernaut and start winning 10 or 11 games a year, I suspect you will see a continued decline in season ticket sales, and more people just picking up single-game tix on the secondary market (or from season ticket holders who are dumping their seats for that week.)
 

hungan1 said:
My daughter doesn't want to go to Gopher games with me any more. It will be so much of a hassle with the baby now and having to put everything in plastic bags. It is too long for my grand kids to drive there, park, wait in line, and then wait too long for traffic to go back home. Particularly, night games are tougher. Ideally, you'd want an afternoon game. It is not a very friendly young family experience.

There. You lose potential future Gopher football fans.

It would have been fun if they expanded the tail gating, and have something setup up more things for kids to do. We would've come early and enjoy the festivities. It is not as enjoyable an experience according to my daughter. They'd rather go to a Saints game.

One thing that will make going to the game more palatable is to have organized designated Gopher Shuttles from the suburbs or the interstate Park N Rides. When you order your tickets online, you can purchase a shuttle ticket at the same time. This will minimize the traffic bottleneck to some degree, and help move crowds in and out of the games without the hassle of having to find parking.
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Not sure what you mean by expanding tailgating. There are plenty of lots for that around TCF. There is a place set up for kids with games and events on Oak Street...always has been there and they expanded it last year when the band's pregame was moved to in front of the stadium gates.

When I had a parking pass in the Oak street ramp, it was 10 minutes from my door in DT St. Paul to being parked. I got there 1:30 to 1:15 hours before kickoff. Light rail runs every 10 minutes, park somewhere close to a stop and ride that to and from the stadium. The traffic bottleneck is from those who are getting there close to kick off. If you don't want to arrive earlier and stay a bit after before heading home, yes, you will experience traffic.
 



GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yes, but that's not the point I'm making. Brick by Brick was the brand Kill brought in. It has also been/is currently used by other coaches and did not originate in Minnesota. Yet Kill incorporated that onto our jersey's with far less outrage. It came and went with Kill/Claeys. RTB can be tied to Ski-U-Mah just as much if not more than Brick by Brick is tied to Memorial Stadium.

RTB has not supplanted Ski-U-Mah, not even close. Fleck continues to combine the two and promote Ski-U-Mah more than many of his predecessors.
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Kill used Brick by Brick at No. Ill?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yes, but that's not the point I'm making. Brick by Brick was the brand Kill brought in. It has also been/is currently used by other coaches and did not originate in Minnesota. Yet Kill incorporated that onto our jersey's with far less outrage. It came and went with Kill/Claeys. RTB can be tied to Ski-U-Mah just as much if not more than Brick by Brick is tied to Memorial Stadium.

RTB has not supplanted Ski-U-Mah, not even close. Fleck continues to combine the two and promote Ski-U-Mah more than many of his predecessors.
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I'm with you. I just don't get such angst over a slogan. I rolled my eyes at "brick by brick" and all of the others. Same thing now with RTB. Thing is...it really doesn't matter that much to me. I'm just guessing the 'fans' who left because of a slogan were half-way out the door already.
 

Pete smith said:
For all you supposed Gopher fans in your 30’s,40’s,50’s whatever age, take a hike. If you can’t support PJ and his RTB culture, then you can’t support the Gophers. In just a very short time on campus, he has done MORE for Gopher football, Gopher athletics than Kill, Claeys, Brewster, Mason as well as the past coaches combined. Gopher football is close to being relevant once again. Something I witnessed back in the sixties. So complain all you want but PJ is the right coach at the right time. My suggestion to you is find something else to do during the fall on Saturdays, but for me I will be at TCF cheering as loud as I can for the Gophers.
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"In just a very short time on campus, he has done MORE for Gopher football, Gopher athletics than Kill, Claeys, Brewster, Mason as well as the past coaches combined. Gopher football is close to being relevant once again."

I am willing to bet a quarter you have no idea where Stub & herbs is located. Neither does your boy PJ.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yes, but that's not the point I'm making. Brick by Brick was the brand Kill brought in. It has also been/is currently used by other coaches and did not originate in Minnesota. Yet Kill incorporated that onto our jersey's with far less outrage. It came and went with Kill/Claeys. RTB can be tied to Ski-U-Mah just as much if not more than Brick by Brick is tied to Memorial Stadium.

RTB has not supplanted Ski-U-Mah, not even close. Fleck continues to combine the two and promote Ski-U-Mah more than many of his predecessors.
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Maybe true, but the next time Fleck says "Ski-U-Mah" before he says "Row the Boat" will be the first time he does it.

Understand where "Row the Boat" came from. What Fleck and his former Wife Tracie went through was hideous. Got a close friend that lost a child over the weekend and the grief he's been going through seems unbearable. He and his families lives will be changed forever. It's just that for the vast majority of people "RTB" is a marketing slogan and mantra for Fleck and the team. Only those that take the trouble to understand it's origins get what it's about. And that ain't easy. I quick google search brought up one article that talked about Heather as the Mother of Colt, not Tracie.

The slogan is understandably very important to P.J. and it works as a mantra for the team too. He should keep it because it means way more to him than Ski-u-Mah.

It should and that's okay too.
 



short ornery norwegian said:
the thing is - I always thought the rationale behind buying season tickets was that you got a price break compared to people who bought single-game tickets. the idea was you saved money by buying season tickets (assuming you planned to attend every game.) And, you were guaranteed a seat for the game (in case it was a sell-out).

Well, that might have been true once, but now, it sure looks like buying season tickets is more expensive than buying single-game tickets on the secondary market, or waiting for a deal like the pizza offer. so, the only reasons to buy season tickets are to
1. support the University with a donation, or
2. guarantee a ticket in case of a sell-out.
and 3. guarantee you sit in the same seats for every game, if that is a priority.

seeing that #2 is becoming a rarity, the only real reason left to buy season tickets is because you want to support the U of MN. But - you can also support the U of MN with a donation without buying football tickets. so, that leaves the only real reason to buy season tickets is if you really want to sit in the same seats every week.

Unless the Gophers suddenly turn into a FB juggernaut and start winning 10 or 11 games a year, I suspect you will see a continued decline in season ticket sales, and more people just picking up single-game tix on the secondary market (or from season ticket holders who are dumping their seats for that week.)
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The other consider you have left out, is if you want "good" seats in the stadium, as opposed to just getting in the door. Might be a minor consideration, when people weigh the cost of that that versus watching on TV.
 

Iceland12 said:
Maybe true, but the next time Fleck says "Ski-U-Mah" before he says "Row the Boat" will be the first time he does it.

Understand where "Row the Boat" came from. What Fleck and his former Wife Tracie went through was hideous. Got a close friend that lost a child over the weekend and the grief he's been going through seems unbearable. He and his families lives will be changed forever. It's just that for the vast majority of people "RTB" is a marketing slogan and mantra for Fleck and the team. Only those that take the trouble to understand it's origins get what it's about. And that ain't easy. I quick google search brought up one article that talked about Heather as the Mother of Colt, not Tracie.

The slogan is understandably very important to P.J. and it works as a mantra for the team too. He should keep it because it means way more to him than Ski-u-Mah.

It should and that's okay too.
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Well and good. I don't even care if it's used within the program. Don't care if he says it every presser, interview, etc. It's a fine personal slogan, for him, and for the team too.

But does he have to slap RTB on the helmet, jerseys, tshirts, etc?? Is his personal slogan more important than the history of the university and the university's branding?? He did the same thing at WMU. They had oars on their helmet or uniform, can't quite remember, maybe both.

Makes it seem like he's making a buck off it ... even if he doesn't at all, or even if he donates it all to charity.
 

How many oars will we have in the water this year, do you suppose:confused:
 

Gophers_4life said:
Well and good. I don't even care if it's used within the program. Don't care if he says it every presser, interview, etc. It's a fine personal slogan, for him, and for the team too.

But does he have to slap RTB on the helmet, jerseys, tshirts, etc?? Is his personal slogan more important than the history of the university and the university's branding?? He did the same thing at WMU. They had oars on their helmet or uniform, can't quite remember, maybe both.

Makes it seem like he's making a buck off it ... even if he doesn't at all, or even if he donates it all to charity.
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You need to talk to this guy:

Gophers_4life said:
RTB is Fleck's personal brand. He owns the brand, and will take it wherever he goes. It's just part of the deal, when you sign Fleck. That's how he runs his program, so you either live with it, or you find someone else.

As I've said many times, IF he wins ... then he can run around the field naked for all I care. Just win
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GopherWeatherGuy said:
Yes, but that's not the point I'm making. Brick by Brick was the brand Kill brought in. It has also been/is currently used by other coaches and did not originate in Minnesota. Yet Kill incorporated that onto our jersey's with far less outrage. It came and went with Kill/Claeys. RTB can be tied to Ski-U-Mah just as much if not more than Brick by Brick is tied to Memorial Stadium.

RTB has not supplanted Ski-U-Mah, not even close. Fleck continues to combine the two and promote Ski-U-Mah more than many of his predecessors.
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Kill came in 2011, 2012 is when Brick by Brick started. There was a subtle reference to it on the uniform, in the numbers and you could not see it unless up close to the jersey. It was a slogan the team went by. The focus of everything on the uniforms, helmets, etc was still U of M, Golden Gophers and Ski-U-Mah.
That is not the case with RTB. Ski-U-Mah has been supplanted by RTB. When PJ references it, it is always RTB, then Ski-U-Mah and Go Gophers. That certainly is supplanting. Yes, it is on the number, like bricks were previously, but there is also an oar on the helmet, along with RTB. In a couple more years, if he is successful here how much more is he going to want to add of RTB to the uniforms? As I stated in the uniform thread, the gold chrome helmet is my favorite, because it doesn't have the beaver tail looking oar stripe on it.
Look at the RTB shirts that are sold. What is the most prominent thing on the shirt? The oars and RTB. They are front and center while the M and Ski-U-Mah are not. Supplanted. It's a nice slogan and a great rallying point not only with the team but also for those in tough situations, but it should not be supplanting Golden Gophers and or the M or Ski-U-Mah and it already has.
 

GFBfan said:
Kill came in 2011, 2012 is when Brick by Brick started. There was a subtle reference to it on the uniform, in the numbers and you could not see it unless up close to the jersey. It was a slogan the team went by. The focus of everything on the uniforms, helmets, etc was still U of M, Golden Gophers and Ski-U-Mah.
That is not the case with RTB. Ski-U-Mah has been supplanted by RTB. When PJ references it, it is always RTB, then Ski-U-Mah and Go Gophers. That certainly is supplanting. Yes, it is on the number, like bricks were previously, but there is also an oar on the helmet, along with RTB. In a couple more years, if he is successful here how much more is he going to want to add of RTB to the uniforms? As I stated in the uniform thread, the gold chrome helmet is my favorite, because it doesn't have the beaver tail looking oar stripe on it.
Look at the RTB shirts that are sold. What is the most prominent thing on the shirt? The oars and RTB. They are front and center while the M and Ski-U-Mah are not. Supplanted. It's a nice slogan and a great rallying point not only with the team but also for those in tough situations, but it should not be supplanting Golden Gophers and or the M or Ski-U-Mah and it already has.
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Thank you for summarizing this well.

My hope is that if Fleck is receiving royalties on tshirt, jersey & other merch sales having his RTB trademark, that he donates that money back to the university and/or an appropriate charitable cause! I have no idea if he receives any royalties, just saying. He may not receive anything for it.
 

GFBfan said:
Kill came in 2011, 2012 is when Brick by Brick started. There was a subtle reference to it on the uniform, in the numbers and you could not see it unless up close to the jersey. It was a slogan the team went by. The focus of everything on the uniforms, helmets, etc was still U of M, Golden Gophers and Ski-U-Mah.
That is not the case with RTB. Ski-U-Mah has been supplanted by RTB. When PJ references it, it is always RTB, then Ski-U-Mah and Go Gophers. That certainly is supplanting. Yes, it is on the number, like bricks were previously, but there is also an oar on the helmet, along with RTB. In a couple more years, if he is successful here how much more is he going to want to add of RTB to the uniforms? As I stated in the uniform thread, the gold chrome helmet is my favorite, because it doesn't have the beaver tail looking oar stripe on it.
Look at the RTB shirts that are sold. What is the most prominent thing on the shirt? The oars and RTB. They are front and center while the M and Ski-U-Mah are not. Supplanted. It's a nice slogan and a great rallying point not only with the team but also for those in tough situations, but it should not be supplanting Golden Gophers and or the M or Ski-U-Mah and it already has.
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Correct. B by B slogan also had a direct tie-in to the past success at Memorial. Anyone who either followed the Gophs or grew up in a family with alum going back to the 1940-60s immediately got the connection.
 

GFBfan said:
Kill came in 2011, 2012 is when Brick by Brick started. There was a subtle reference to it on the uniform, in the numbers and you could not see it unless up close to the jersey. It was a slogan the team went by. The focus of everything on the uniforms, helmets, etc was still U of M, Golden Gophers and Ski-U-Mah.
That is not the case with RTB. Ski-U-Mah has been supplanted by RTB. When PJ references it, it is always RTB, then Ski-U-Mah and Go Gophers. That certainly is supplanting. Yes, it is on the number, like bricks were previously, but there is also an oar on the helmet, along with RTB. In a couple more years, if he is successful here how much more is he going to want to add of RTB to the uniforms? As I stated in the uniform thread, the gold chrome helmet is my favorite, because it doesn't have the beaver tail looking oar stripe on it.
Look at the RTB shirts that are sold. What is the most prominent thing on the shirt? The oars and RTB. They are front and center while the M and Ski-U-Mah are not. Supplanted. It's a nice slogan and a great rallying point not only with the team but also for those in tough situations, but it should not be supplanting Golden Gophers and or the M or Ski-U-Mah and it already has.
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Yet I see it on these two helmets:

9122909_orig.jpg


2925140_orig.jpg
 

PMWinSTP said:
Correct. B by B slogan also had a direct tie-in to the past success at Memorial. Anyone who either followed the Gophs or grew up in a family with alum going back to the 1940-60s immediately got the connection.
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Because it was called the brick house? Maybe I'm not digging hard enough but I can't find anything that says Kill and staff were relating it to Memorial Stadium.

Maybe Butch Jones and Tennessee were talking about Memorial Stadium?


Maybe the Arizona Cardinals are too?

https://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2018/7/30/17631466/arizona-cardinals-brick-by-brick-tennessee-fans

Most casual college football fans think of Jones and Tennessee when hearing Brick by Brick. I know there are others that have used it too.

Like it or not RTB is synonymous with only the University of Minnesota Football today. And it will be that way as long as Fleck is here. That wasn't the case with Brick by Brick.
 


Gophers_4life said:
What do places like Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska do for young families?

I have to imagine a college football gameday isn't exactly the ideal event for young families, no matter the situation. The game itself is a long event. Nevermind if you're trying to pre-game. Traffic for any P5 won't be lickity-split, no matter how well planned. It's a long day, no matter what, and young kids get cranky, etc.
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At TCU kids are on the field prior to kick off. They form two lines so the players can run through them as they come out of the tunnel. The kids get to be on the field and close up to the players, what a thrill and a great tradition. You have to sell the kids on wanting to come to Gopher games. Give them an experience they won't get at a Vikings game.
 

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