So what now at QB - 2019 Class?

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Another Chicken-and-egg situation.

You don't need to have an "elite" QB to have a competitive team - IF you are sound in the other areas.

but, if you want to be a consistent top-25 team, play for conference titles, etc, it is awfully tough to pull that off without a really good QB. Great QB play can elevate a team - and poor QB play can pull a team down.

With all due respect, the Gophers do not have a great QB on the team. They may have 2 or 3 QB's who can be serviceable, but the best players on offense are Smith and Johnson. To really move the team up to the top rank of college FB, at some point the QB has to be at least one of the best, if not THE best players on offense. they're not there yet.
 


GopherWeatherGuy said:
Is it? Our temperatures and snow cover so far in April have been typical to what we see in late February or early March? :)
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I am running in the Get-In-Gear Race on April 28. The early weather forecast is 62/44 degrees with a possibility of evening showers. I would expect most of the white stuff will be gone.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Another Chicken-and-egg situation.

You don't need to have an "elite" QB to have a competitive team - IF you are sound in the other areas.

but, if you want to be a consistent top-25 team, play for conference titles, etc, it is awfully tough to pull that off without a really good QB. Great QB play can elevate a team - and poor QB play can pull a team down.

With all due respect, the Gophers do not have a great QB on the team. They may have 2 or 3 QB's who can be serviceable, but the best players on offense are Smith and Johnson. To really move the team up to the top rank of college FB, at some point the QB has to be at least one of the best, if not THE best players on offense. they're not there yet.
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How do you know that? None of them have played in a game for the Gophers
 



GopherWeatherGuy said:
How do you know that? None of them have played in a game for the Gophers
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Based on what I saw in the Spring Game, no, the gophers do not have a Great QB on the team - at this time. Maybe one of the current candidates will show great improvement by the fall, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

Again - you can win with a good QB, if other areas of the team are strong. There's nothing wrong with having a good QB - but having a great QB is better.

At this point, if you're a B1G coach, and you're game-planning for the Gophers, your #1 concern is stopping Smith or Johnson. It's not stopping the QB.

Just once, it would be fun if other teams' #1 concern was "how do we stop the Gopher's QB?"

Do you honestly think that any team in the B1G is going to say that about any of the QB's on the Gopher roster today?

Again - NOT saying they're bad. Just don't believe they are - or will be - great.
 

We're a long ways from next year's signing day. If we're in this position, two weeks out from signing day, I'll be concerned. But I wouldn't be to worried, as of now. I'm sure they will identity new targets. The recruitment, under Fleck, has been quite impressive so far. So I'm holding some optimism.

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short ornery norwegian said:
Based on what I saw in the Spring Game, no, the gophers do not have a Great QB on the team - at this time. Maybe one of the current candidates will show great improvement by the fall, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

Again - you can win with a good QB, if other areas of the team are strong. There's nothing wrong with having a good QB - but having a great QB is better.

At this point, if you're a B1G coach, and you're game-planning for the Gophers, your #1 concern is stopping Smith or Johnson. It's not stopping the QB.

Just once, it would be fun if other teams' #1 concern was "how do we stop the Gopher's QB?"

Do you honestly think that any team in the B1G is going to say that about any of the QB's on the Gopher roster today?

Again - NOT saying they're bad. Just don't believe they are - or will be - great.
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For the record, they could have the best Gopher QB in 50 years (maybe ever) and not have a "great QB". I believe they've had one QB ever that played more than a couple downs in the NFL as a QB. I'd love to see someone beat Adam Weber's records, which would likely lead to a lot of wins, but wouldn't require a "great" QB.
 

If Max Duggan had committed to us this week, we'd all be worried about him changing his mind.

So at least we aren't worried about that.
 



Lordshawesome said:
We're a long ways from next year's signing day. If we're in this position, two weeks out from signing day, I'll be concerned. But I wouldn't be to worried, as of now. I'm sure they will identity new targets. The recruitment, under Fleck, has been quite impressive so far. So I'm holding some optimism.

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Exactly, it’s April...
 

Just so I understand, locking up Guys early is not as important this year as it was last year, right?


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Regarding great Quarterbacks.... Hungan posted this the other day:A couple of considerations if I were Max:

Quarterback Rosters: Who is on the current roster? Who is your competition?

Nebraska:
Andrew Bunch, 6' 1", 200 lbs, SO, Unrated, Thompson Station TN
Tristan Gebbia, 6' 3", 180 lbs, RS FR, 0.9217, Calabasas CA
Adrian Martinez, 6' 2", 205 lbs, FR, 0.9423, Fresno CA
Matt Masker, 6' 1", 205 lbs, FR, Unrated, Kearney NE
Patrick O'Brien, 6' 4", 230 lbs, RS FR, 0.9189, San Juan Capistrano CA

Minnesota:
Zack Annexstad, 6' 3", 215 lbs, FR, 0.8355, Norseland MN
Tanner Morgan, 6' 1", 205 lbs, RS FR, 0.8375, Union KY
Sam Pickerign, 6' 4", 224 lbs, RS FR, Unrated, Alpharetta GA
Jon Santaga, 6' 1", 192 lbs, RS FR, Unrated, Green Bay WI
Vic Viramontes, 6' 1", 215 lbs, SO, 0.8851, Riverside CA

TCU:
Michael Collins, 6' 5", 210 lbs, SO, 0.7667, New Canaan CT (Transferred from Penn)
Grayson Muehlstein, 6' 4", 210 lbs, SR, 0.8550, Decatur TX
Karson Ringdahl, 6' 3", 205 lbs, SO, Unrated, Columbia MO
Shawn Robinson, 6' 2", 225 lbs, SO, 0.9222, DeSoto TX
Justin Rogers, 6' 4", 210 lbs, FR, 0.9772, Bossier City LA

Just two other teams for comparison but our QB's for a long time are rated in the 83 neighborhood. The other guys have multiple guys in the 90's. Chances that we end up with a great QB starting with guys rated low to mid 80's has shown it's tough to find great with that starting line.

We have to recruit higher rated QB's and get them on our roster...I think it's that simple. No ratings are not gospel, infallible or any guarantee but I can see in an hour we don't have great at QB this spring.

It's important. Jerry was stubborn enough to think he could mold a QB into great. It seemed he sought out low rated guys to play QB just to prove he could coach. I think PJ at least wants higher rated QB's.
Jerry/Tracy seemed to value running over passing. PJ seems the opposite. I'm hoping one of our guys becomes good. I agree with SON, great is unlikely to be on the roster. Great requires consistency...not just one game.
 




60's Guy said:
Regarding great Quarterbacks.... Hungan posted this the other day:A couple of considerations if I were Max:

Quarterback Rosters: Who is on the current roster? Who is your competition?

Nebraska:
Andrew Bunch, 6' 1", 200 lbs, SO, Unrated, Thompson Station TN
Tristan Gebbia, 6' 3", 180 lbs, RS FR, 0.9217, Calabasas CA
Adrian Martinez, 6' 2", 205 lbs, FR, 0.9423, Fresno CA
Matt Masker, 6' 1", 205 lbs, FR, Unrated, Kearney NE
Patrick O'Brien, 6' 4", 230 lbs, RS FR, 0.9189, San Juan Capistrano CA

Minnesota:
Zack Annexstad, 6' 3", 215 lbs, FR, 0.8355, Norseland MN
Tanner Morgan, 6' 1", 205 lbs, RS FR, 0.8375, Union KY
Sam Pickerign, 6' 4", 224 lbs, RS FR, Unrated, Alpharetta GA
Jon Santaga, 6' 1", 192 lbs, RS FR, Unrated, Green Bay WI
Vic Viramontes, 6' 1", 215 lbs, SO, 0.8851, Riverside CA

TCU:
Michael Collins, 6' 5", 210 lbs, SO, 0.7667, New Canaan CT (Transferred from Penn)
Grayson Muehlstein, 6' 4", 210 lbs, SR, 0.8550, Decatur TX
Karson Ringdahl, 6' 3", 205 lbs, SO, Unrated, Columbia MO
Shawn Robinson, 6' 2", 225 lbs, SO, 0.9222, DeSoto TX
Justin Rogers, 6' 4", 210 lbs, FR, 0.9772, Bossier City LA

Just two other teams for comparison but our QB's for a long time are rated in the 83 neighborhood. The other guys have multiple guys in the 90's. Chances that we end up with a great QB starting with guys rated low to mid 80's has shown it's tough to find great with that starting line.

We have to recruit higher rated QB's and get them on our roster...I think it's that simple. No ratings are not gospel, infallible or any guarantee but I can see in an hour we don't have great at QB this spring.

It's important. Jerry was stubborn enough to think he could mold a QB into great. It seemed he sought out low rated guys to play QB just to prove he could coach. I think PJ at least wants higher rated QB's.
Jerry/Tracy seemed to value running over passing. PJ seems the opposite. I'm hoping one of our guys becomes good. I agree with SON, great is unlikely to be on the roster. Great requires consistency...not just one game.
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Recruits pick schools for dozens of reasons, but one that doesn't come up often is the desire for immediate playing time. Duggan would have been our highest rated QB recruit in quite a while, but he's a run of the mill recruit for a program like TCU. Given that they have two higher rated players on the team that are a sophomore and freshman, there is a strong chance he doesn't play until he's a senior. He obviously knows this, but still chose the school he is most comfortable with.
 

John Galt said:
Recruits pick schools for dozens of reasons, but one that doesn't come up often is the desire for immediate playing time. Duggan would have been our highest rated QB recruit in quite a while, but he's a run of the mill recruit for a program like TCU. Given that they have two higher rated players on the team that are a sophomore and freshman, there is a strong chance he doesn't play until he's a senior. He obviously knows this, but still chose the school he is most comfortable with.
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Yeah the whole "hey you can start here" thing just doesn't seem to be much of a selling point.

If it mattered you wouldn't see Bama, Ohio St, and such stack up super high recruits one after another at the same positions year after year.

And the handful of guys who get "wanted to go there because he could start" also sometimes have the "doesn't want to have to compete" label attached, and that's a bad reason...
 

It's likely going to take another season or maybe two, to show Fleck's system and philosophy is for real. Might get lucky on a top tier recruit taking a flyer on the potential, but, reality.

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50PoundHead said:
Very well said. Claeys' defenses performed better, but had the same problems in the middle against power-running teams. Losing Elmore kind of put us behind the 8-ball last season.
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This! Elmore was the key cog. He was a great point man who could control the edge more often than he lost it. If we had him last yr or this yr(if he had redshirted) we could have a very successful dline.
 


A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Pretty sure 2019 crooting isn't over just yet.
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No but it's late for a school like ours to get in on a top QB - better hope for Hank or be satisfied with another low 3* guy.


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Oregon Gopher said:
No but it's late for a school like ours to get in on a top QB - better hope for Hank or be satisfied with another low 3* guy.


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I just watched PJ sign 2 4-star out of state linemen in December. Quit talking out of your ass.
 

John Galt said:
I just watched PJ sign 2 4-star out of state linemen in December. Quit talking out of your ass.
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....because a kid from Norseland Minnesota decided to transfer down to IMG Academy. If not for that, they wouldn't be here. Sure, Fleck closed the deal so deserves a fraction of the credit. But, if you're going to equate that random/lucky scenario to Fleck assuredly bringing in a top tier QB this year, you're the one with the talking ass, my friend.

PJ got beat out for his initial top target by his biggest rival (Mertz to Wisconsin), the next (Hank B.) has gone cold and apparenrly his old man thinks it's a terrible idea to come here, and he just got beat out for Duggan by Patterson, who put a minuscule fraction of the effort into the kid that PJ did (swooped in a few months ago, and Fleck had been on the kid since he got here). Kids aren't exactly lining up to play QB for the U.

Ill wait for some real evidence that he can land a premier QB, instead of talking out of my ass. It's not even an indictment of Fleck's recruiting ability. This program is a virtual laughing stock, especially when it comes to QB development. Kirk Siracha isn't someone the kids are swooning over, either.
 

Heracles said:
....because a kid from Norseland Minnesota decided to transfer down to IMG Academy. If not for that, they wouldn't be here. Sure, Fleck closed the deal so deserves a fraction of the credit. But, if you're going to equate that random/lucky scenario to Fleck assuredly bringing in a top tier QB this year, you're the one with the talking ass, my friend.

PJ got beat out for his initial top target by his biggest rival (Mertz to Wisconsin), the next (Hank B.) has gone cold and apparenrly his old man thinks it's a terrible idea to come here, and he just got beat out for Duggan by Patterson, who put a minuscule fraction of the effort into the kid that PJ did (swooped in a few months ago, and Fleck had been on the kid since he got here). Kids aren't exactly lining up to play QB for the U.

Ill wait for some real evidence that he can land a premier QB, instead of talking out of my ass. It's not even an indictment of Fleck's recruiting ability. This program is a virtual laughing stock, especially when it comes to QB development. Kirk Siracha isn't someone the kids are swooning over, either.
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fiery post, must be from hot taek land.
 

Heracles said:
....because a kid from Norseland Minnesota decided to transfer down to IMG Academy. If not for that, they wouldn't be here. Sure, Fleck closed the deal so deserves a fraction of the credit. But, if you're going to equate that random/lucky scenario to Fleck assuredly bringing in a top tier QB this year, you're the one with the talking ass, my friend.

PJ got beat out for his initial top target by his biggest rival (Mertz to Wisconsin), the next (Hank B.) has gone cold and apparenrly his old man thinks it's a terrible idea to come here, and he just got beat out for Duggan by Patterson, who put a minuscule fraction of the effort into the kid that PJ did (swooped in a few months ago, and Fleck had been on the kid since he got here). Kids aren't exactly lining up to play QB for the U.

Ill wait for some real evidence that he can land a premier QB, instead of talking out of my ass. It's not even an indictment of Fleck's recruiting ability. This program is a virtual laughing stock, especially when it comes to QB development. Kirk Siracha isn't someone the kids are swooning over, either.
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User claims thing can't happen.

When provided evidence of it happening ... throws fit...
 

Heracles said:
....because a kid from Norseland Minnesota decided to transfer down to IMG Academy. If not for that, they wouldn't be here. Sure, Fleck closed the deal so deserves a fraction of the credit. But, if you're going to equate that random/lucky scenario to Fleck assuredly bringing in a top tier QB this year, you're the one with the talking ass, my friend.

PJ got beat out for his initial top target by his biggest rival (Mertz to Wisconsin), the next (Hank B.) has gone cold and apparenrly his old man thinks it's a terrible idea to come here, and he just got beat out for Duggan by Patterson, who put a minuscule fraction of the effort into the kid that PJ did (swooped in a few months ago, and Fleck had been on the kid since he got here). Kids aren't exactly lining up to play QB for the U.

Ill wait for some real evidence that he can land a premier QB, instead of talking out of my ass. It's not even an indictment of Fleck's recruiting ability. This program is a virtual laughing stock, especially when it comes to QB development. Kirk Siracha isn't someone the kids are swooning over, either.
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Lol delusional as usual from you. Sure, Fleck has never recruited well, he just gets lucky...:rolleyes:
 

I might sing the rouser at IMG home games after every TD they score. Sounds like PJ could use the help.
 

John Galt said:
I just watched PJ sign 2 4-star out of state linemen in December. Quit talking out of your ass.
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What does that have to do with recruiting a top flight QB JG? And what did I say that was anywhere close to talking out of my rectum? There have been ~45 4* QB recruits over the last 2 years by 247 ratings. Of those at least 41 had long-term relationships (pre April) with the schools they ultimately signed with (possibly more) and the only schools that may have swooped in successfully at a later date were ones like USC, Oregon and Ole Miss. Thus the likelihood of PJ being successful in wooing a new recruit at this time is remote. I've been a PJ supporter for most things and I've previously enjoyed your posts but you're becoming almost as much a PJ apologist as a couple other infamous posters and the reality is that PJ got schooled by TCU and is now unlikely to find another highly ranked QB unless Hank returns. More likely PJ is going to scramble to find another low ranked QB option or go back on his assertion that he wants 2 QBs this year. If this was a prior coaching staff you'd be lamenting their inability to procure greater QB talent (as I was as well). So quit being a d!ck.[emoji12]


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Oregon Gopher said:
What does that have to do with recruiting a top flight QB JG? And what did I say that was anywhere close to talking out of my rectum? There have been ~45 4* QB recruits over the last 2 years by 247 ratings. Of those at least 41 had long-term relationships (pre April) with the schools they ultimately signed with (possibly more) and the only schools that may have swooped in successfully at a later date were ones like USC, Oregon and Ole Miss. Thus the likelihood of PJ being successful in wooing a new recruit at this time is remote. I've been a PJ supporter for most things and I've previously enjoyed your posts but you're becoming almost as much a PJ apologist as a couple other infamous posters and the reality is that PJ got schooled by TCU and is now unlikely to find another highly ranked QB unless Hank returns. More likely PJ is going to scramble to find another low ranked QB option or go back on his assertion that he wants 2 QBs this year. If this was a prior coaching staff you'd be lamenting their inability to procure greater QB talent (as I was as well). So quit being a d!ck.[emoji12]


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Boom.
 

Heracles said:
....because a kid from Norseland Minnesota decided to transfer down to IMG Academy. If not for that, they wouldn't be here. Sure, Fleck closed the deal so deserves a fraction of the credit. But, if you're going to equate that random/lucky scenario to Fleck assuredly bringing in a top tier QB this year, you're the one with the talking ass, my friend.

PJ got beat out for his initial top target by his biggest rival (Mertz to Wisconsin), the next (Hank B.) has gone cold and apparenrly his old man thinks it's a terrible idea to come here, and he just got beat out for Duggan by Patterson, who put a minuscule fraction of the effort into the kid that PJ did (swooped in a few months ago, and Fleck had been on the kid since he got here). Kids aren't exactly lining up to play QB for the U.

Ill wait for some real evidence that he can land a premier QB, instead of talking out of my ass. It's not even an indictment of Fleck's recruiting ability. This program is a virtual laughing stock, especially when it comes to QB development. Kirk Siracha isn't someone the kids are swooning over, either.
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Mertz wanted to be the only 2019 QB. Once Kramer committed to MN, Mertz moved on. Burns' podcast alluded to the fact that while Mertz is verbally committed to WI, he may not end up signing there. The good news is that 2019 recruiting season is not over.
 

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