Settle the @$#% down, please.

goldengophers

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 25, 2009
Messages
3,261
Reaction score
1,552
Points
113
Thank you. People need to stop with the Whalen comp. The only similarity is no head coaching experience. Aside from that, the roads travelled are completely different.

The only person even comparable on the men's side would be someone like Kevin McHale.
I agree but I would also argue the U doesn't go with Ben without going through the Whalen process having played out on the Women's side.
 

MNJay

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 8, 2022
Messages
536
Reaction score
395
Points
63
I disagree that bashing Coach Johnson and the team is better than indifference. Especially when the bashing is misguided (to put it mildly) and/or from closeted Badger fans.

This is a ground-up rebuild. Starting with our 4 freshmen. If they're not doing well by the end of the year...that will raise red flags. But bashing the coach & team now is misguided.
 

MennoSota

Banned
Joined
Dec 14, 2015
Messages
11,774
Reaction score
3,162
Points
113
Please, articulate his plan… or anyone who thinks they know what his plan is articulate it.

Is the plan to hope on the transfer portal for a stud guard to come to a last place big ten team? Other than that, I don’t see it.and I don’t think that is a good plan.
Why do I care? Honestly, you and I aren't owed any information about Ben's plan. If you think that Ben and the entire coaching staff have no plan, then you are being extremely disrespectful of Ben and his staff.
Like I have done with every coaching staff at UMN, and that goes back to Musselman, I trust them to do their jobs and that they are well paid adults who have a plan to succeed.
Since none of those coaches has ever divulged their plans to me, I don't expect Ben to do so either.

It strikes me that you aren't very good at dealing with life when it throws you a curve ball. Am I right?
 

GopherBlood666

Well-known member
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
2,985
Reaction score
2,904
Points
113
I disagree that bashing Coach Johnson and the team is better than indifference. Especially when the bashing is misguided (to put it mildly) and/or from closeted Badger fans.

This is a ground-up rebuild. Starting with our 4 freshmen. If they're not doing well by the end of the year...that will raise red flags. But bashing the coach & team now is misguided.
By your logic this board is like 85% badger fans. Weird.
 

formerlybis

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 12, 2015
Messages
381
Reaction score
460
Points
63
I will refer you to the list of comparable year 2 coaches. This is the age of free agency.
Also, FYI, the Mississippi State coach is in his first year with only 3 players from last year's team that was under .500 in conference under Ben Howland (and lost to MN at home in Starkville). They seem to be doing pretty well....
 


Wet_Blanket_Guy

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
946
Points
113
Thank you. People need to stop with the Whalen comp. The only similarity is no head coaching experience. Aside from that, the roads travelled Why do I care? Honestly, you and I aren't owed any information about Ben's plan. If you think that Ben and the entire coaching staff have no plan, then you are being extremely disrespectful of Ben and his staff.
Like I have done with every coaching staff at UMN, and that goes back to Musselman, I trust them to do their jobs and that they are well paid adults who have a plan to succeed.
Since none of those coaches has ever divulged their plans to me, I don't expect Ben to do so either.

It strikes me that you aren't very good at dealing with life when it throws you a curve ball. Am I right?
Why do I care? Honestly, you and I aren't owed any information about Ben's plan. If you think that Ben and the entire coaching staff have no plan, then you are being extremely disrespectful of Ben and his staff.
Like I have done with every coaching staff at UMN, and that goes back to Musselman, I trust them to do their jobs and that they are well paid adults who have a plan to succeed.
Since none of those coaches has ever divulged their plans to me, I don't expect Ben to do so either.

It strikes me that you aren't very good at dealing with life when it throws you a curve ball. Am I right?
Do you know what made Steve Jobs so great, he sold a vision. In business, being able to sell a vision is what makes or breaks CEOs and brands.

Ben should be selling his vision to everyone. Fans (his customers), his current players (who he has to recruit for next year), along with future gopher basketball players (whether high schoolers or youth basketball players.

If he can’t / won’t do that…he’s choosing to steer the titanic into the iceberg.

Maybe take a business course on the importance of a vision / mission statement and the impact it can have on your brand.
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
946
Points
113
Also, FYI, the Mississippi State coach is in his first year with only 3 players from last year's team that was under .500 in conference under Ben Howland (and lost to MN at home in Starkville). They seem to be doing pretty well....
But that’s impossible. Wins shouldn’t be expected for 5 years.
 

MennoSota

Banned
Joined
Dec 14, 2015
Messages
11,774
Reaction score
3,162
Points
113
Do you know what made Steve Jobs so great, he sold a vision. In business, being able to sell a vision is what makes or breaks CEOs and brands.

Ben should be selling his vision to everyone. Fans (his customers), his current players (who he has to recruit for next year), along with future gopher basketball players (whether high schoolers or youth basketball players.

If he can’t / won’t do that…he’s choosing to steer the titanic into the iceberg.

Maybe take a business course on the importance of a vision / mission statement and the impact it can have on your brand.
You know Steve Jobs died don't you?
We have a nice recruiting class coming in to which Ben sold them a scholarship at UMN. That's all he has to worry about on his end. He believes in the product and he will see positive results.
You strike me as one of the boneheads that gave up on Steve Jobs while he was working from his garage.
 




Wet_Blanket_Guy

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
946
Points
113
You know Steve Jobs died don't you?
We have a nice recruiting class coming in to which Ben sold them a scholarship at UMN. That's all he has to worry about on his end. He believes in the product and he will see positive results.
You strike me as one of the boneheads that gave up on Steve Jobs while he was working from his garage.
You know Steve Jobs died don't you?
We have a nice recruiting class coming in to which Ben sold them a scholarship at UMN. That's all he has to worry about on his end. He believes in the product and he will see positive results.
You strike me as one of the boneheads that gave up on Steve Jobs while he was working from his garage.
Dean Smith, Red Auerbach, Chuck Daly, Jerry Sloan are all dead. I guess people can’t say they know anything about basketball if we are to follow your logic.

Also, in your mind Ben doesn’t care about fans or attendance…only the four freshmen.
 


MNJay

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 8, 2022
Messages
536
Reaction score
395
Points
63
Dean Smith, Red Auerbach, Chuck Daly, Jerry Sloan are all dead. I guess people can’t say they know anything about basketball if we are to follow your logic.

Also, in your mind Ben doesn’t care about fans or attendance…only the four freshmen.
You keep asking what the plan is. And I and a few others keep telling you. A ground-up rebuild. Starting with this freshmen class...and adding 3 good recruits next year.

But you don't want to hear it.
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
946
Points
113
You keep asking what the plan is. And I and a few others keep telling you. A ground-up rebuild. Starting with this freshmen class...and adding 3 good recruits next year.

But you don't want to hear it.
Aimed at what kind of style of basketball? When a coach says we want to be gritty that’s the equivalent of a politician saying we want to reduce crime (everyone wants that).

If you asked a bunch of people to define what style of basketball the gophers play or what style Ben is striving to play… gritty doesn’t really fit and when answering for attempting to play (they answer complete rebuild style isn’t an applicable answer).

There should still be an end vision even if it is a complete rebuild with freshmen and portal players here and there.
 
Last edited:




PhiloVance

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
2,194
Reaction score
1,330
Points
113
Believe he's already visited Iowa and Iowa State.
On the PG, it looks like they are really going all-out on recruiting Isaac Asuma from Cherry. (a 2024 recruit)

there was a big showcase event in the Twin Cities last weekend. Johnson was there with his entire coaching staff and about 5 players to watch Asuma.

the kid is one heck of an athlete. looked really good at last year's State Tournament.
 

PhiloVance

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
2,194
Reaction score
1,330
Points
113
Could of, should have, would have...in the mean time we are in the here and now. So either except the reality and hope for a better outcome or waite for Coyle to fire and hire and then say "I told you so".
 



MennoSota

Banned
Joined
Dec 14, 2015
Messages
11,774
Reaction score
3,162
Points
113
Dean Smith, Red Auerbach, Chuck Daly, Jerry Sloan are all dead. I guess people can’t say they know anything about basketball if we are to follow your logic.

Also, in your mind Ben doesn’t care about fans or attendance…only the four freshmen.
You didn't really read what I wrote, did you.
However, I wager to guess you are not very high on Ben list of people he cares about.
 


holereader

Active member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
604
Reaction score
135
Points
43
You keep asking what the plan is. And I and a few others keep telling you. A ground-up rebuild. Starting with this freshmen class...and adding 3 good recruits next year.

But you don't want to hear it.
A ground up rebuild of what? This program has been dysfunctional for over 20 years. Maturi hired Monson under duress and he was a non event then we go to Tubby (sans Molanari) who achieved mediocrity at best. Norwood Teague then brings in Pitino who really was a poor coach - i am not sure what Coyle saw in him that let him stay for as long as he did. And when he did leave we literally had no players on the roster

What has all this resulted in? Six tournament appearances since 1999. Now let’s look at the rest of the conference.. Purdue, MSU, WI, IA, MD, OSU, Michigan, IN etc - sorry (i don’t have exact stats) but these teams have gone to the tournament essentially every year since 1999. With multiple final four appearances. So Ben and his freshmen develop into what? Do you think all these other conference foes are not recruiting and developing outstanding freshman? Ben has never even been a head coach - do you see him developing these players like Painter, Izzo, McCaffrey etc - we are ground up rebuild against a moving target with a coach who will struggle to keep up with the coaching talent elsewhere in the conference - so what are we rebuilding against - there was never anything there to begin with.
 

Bayfieldgopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
8,750
Reaction score
1,113
Points
113
There is zero reason this team can’t play better defense. That is my main gripe right now. Coaching and effort can give you good defense despite age or transfer status.
There are many reasons. Could it be that the current roster is void of players capable of being strong defenders??? Battle is our only strength from last season and D was not his forte. He got lit up by the MS guys. TT? Forget that one.

I watched a few of Cooper's games last season and had legitimate concerns regarding his ability to defend the PG. Good D starts with the ability to guard the other teams PG. Cooper can't do that.

Same with Garcia as it was obvious to me that he lacked the strength, footwork and lateral quickness to defend BIG type players. I posted on here numerous times how Purdue's WIlliam's totally destroyed him in the paint last year. Samuel's? tThe same although he did a bit better but still not close to being the answer.

So we were counting on raw Frosh to step, be game ready BIG defenders and fill the glaring voids by our experienced players?? I hope you have been watching the games.

I give Ben a free pass with the D for this team. It just isn't there. I do see the effort but not the results.

My gripe however is Ben's approach to the offensive end. Clearly this is where he is failing.
 


cjbfbp

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 23, 2014
Messages
12,852
Reaction score
7,743
Points
113
You knew this team was going to be bad so why are people losing their minds?

Well, in fairness, we didn't know the team would be as bad as it has performed so far. But, your point is well taken. This situation is no cause for "losing our minds."
 


Ope3

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2008
Messages
6,231
Reaction score
4,140
Points
113
A ground up rebuild of what? This program has been dysfunctional for over 20 years. Maturi hired Monson under duress and he was a non event then we go to Tubby (sans Molanari) who achieved mediocrity at best.
Maturi was at Miami of Ohio when Monson was hired by Minnesota in 1999. Mark Dienhart was the AD, followed by Tom Moe then Maturi (2002).
 
Last edited:




cjbfbp

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 23, 2014
Messages
12,852
Reaction score
7,743
Points
113
Now let’s look at the rest of the conference.. Purdue, MSU, WI, IA, MD, OSU, Michigan, IN etc - sorry (i don’t have exact stats) but these teams have gone to the tournament essentially every year since 1999.

I sympathize with your post but that assertion is flat out wrong for most of these teams. Iowa has missed 13 tournaments since the 1998-99 year. Indiana has missed 10. Michigan has missed 11. Ohio State has missed 6. Purdue has missed 7. Maryland has missed 9.

Wisconsin has missed only 1 and Michigan State hasn't missed any.

I don't think you understand how difficult it is to make the NCAA tournament "every year" or even "essentially every year." This is a common misunderstanding among many basketball fans because of the fairly large number of teams that make the tournament each year. I did an analysis of this about a dozen years ago to prove to some fans who think like you that making the tournament "almost every year" is harder than they think. I seem to recall that I found only about 11 D1 teams that made the tournament in at least 8 of the 10 previous years.
 
Last edited:




Top Bottom