It would be interesting to see you argue with the recruiting coordinators at Ohio State and Michigan about how much you think he sucks to see how big of an idiot they could make you look.
Q&A: Cretin's James Onwualu Talks Gophers, Jerry Kill and His Upcoming Visit to the U
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It would be interesting to see you argue with the recruiting coordinators at Ohio State and Michigan about how much you think he sucks to see how big of an idiot they could make you look.
royal, who are "all the running backs getting more hype"... beside JO of course?
and dont forget that the top RB's with the gophers right now are the size of Junius.... he isn't from some 9-man school.
RC: 'we like this kid as a running back'.
dboy: 'well, against a slow, midwest defense, in a big game, he was stoned.. no big runs.. and doesn't do smash-mouth very well..too tall... also, next year he is switching back to WR to accomodate a friend of a friend's younger brother. So that tells me he doesn't like the position anyway'.
RC: 'what about WR?".
dboy: 'doesnt play hoops.. so you cant get a good read on how his timing, jumping, etc are.. does he have 'ball skills'?.. id have to say 'no' or he'd be a double/double machine like Floyd was. also, many of his catches are of the bread-basket variety so i have to question his hands.. and many of his catches are lobs against slow, midwest d-backs.. no way that can happen in d1. and as a downfield threat, i haven't seen a 'next gear'.
RC: 'how about PR or KR'?
dboy: 'according to our own royalgopher, he's poor in the open-field'.. and CDH doesn't have him return punts or kicks so why would you think he'd do that in d1?
RC: 'how about D? SS?'..
dboy: 'some from the easters burbs have called him "soft"'.. but let CDH speak: they don't have him play inside on D... just on the outside to stop deep thorows."
RC: 'okay, "ATH" it is...
DrunkGopher
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Floyd just ran a 4.42 today
Bob_Loblaw
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As appreciative as I am of the nickname, I didn't post this article, I don't have any ins with Michigan, Stanford, Notre Dame, Michigan State and Arizona in order to get this kid so many offers. Could you imagine the amount of money I would be making if I could get an undeserving HS athlete 10 offers by Feb of their JR season? I do appreciate that you think I have that kind of power, but I really don't. My brain just functions enough to know that Michigan, Stanford, Notre Dame, Michigan State, etc....would not offer the kid unless they thought he was a pretty good football player.
Bob_Loblaw
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You are obsessed with this kid. It's actually kind of Pantherhawk-esque the amount this kid is in your head.
But yeah, Cretin was absolutely dominated by Wayzata and James did next to nothing. (Similar to how the entire Woodbury football team was shut down by Cretin, yet you seem to think a couple guys on that team deserve offers).
It happens. It happened to Michael Floyd (as a SR) against EP when they were waxed by EP in the State Championship in 2007. It simply happens all the time. It happened to Andre McDonald against EP this year (as a SR).
Cretin ran into a much better football team and they shut the entire team down. It was actually a pretty dominating game.
Are you ever going to answer why Michigan, Stanford, Michigan State, and Notre Dame would offer this kid if it was pure hype?
Bob_Loblaw
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He doesn't let facts get in the way of his irrational obsession with James Onwualu.
actually, Bob, i'm still waiting for a few 'facts' from you.
my facts are published. my narration with the RC is posted...( btw, does JO run track?... seriously, i have no idea.. but you'd think a WR type would.. my guess that he doesn't want track to "interfere" with his WR workouts.. keep drinking the koolaid, bob )... but i've put my rational reasons out there.. you just keep falling back to the old, "nah-nah-nah-nah-nah, he has big10 offers" chant. and i'm the one who is irrational?
i guess we'll agree to disagree.
but you are in a great spot.. its all 'measureables'... no need for on-the-field performance ( "CDH didn't have a good line his senior year, didn't have a good QB, didn't have a running game to balance the passing game", etc, etc )..
so we know JO's senior year will be a bust... and we already know the reasons why.
also:
"Similar to how the entire Woodbury football team was shut down by Cretin, yet you seem to think a couple guys on that team deserve offers). "..
wrong/wrong/wrong.. 1.) junius wilson didn't play, out with a knee injury.. 2.) "couple"?.. please cut/paste from my past postings of where i said a 'couple' of Woodbury guys 'deserve offers'.. 3.) i have never said JW deserved a gopher offer.. i have only said JW is a better football player right now than JO, and JO doesn't deserve big10 offers from what i have seen.
anyway, i'll stop.
i'll let the 'holers hope for a verbal from this guy.. and we'll watch him head East... all the while the hype spins and guys in the metro like Derek Earls go unnoticed because their high schools don't have athletic marketing depts like CDH.
Bob_Loblaw
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I'll answer your questions to the best of my ability, but then I'm honestly done talking about James Onwualu with you. I think you're blinded by your hatred for CDH, and you're saying irrational things....
#1: Does he run track? I don't know. I don't really think it's important if he does or not, there are plenty of good players who do run track and plenty of them who don't run track.
#2: You shouldn't quote the "nah-nah" part, because I never said that. I bring up the offers because they are the result of people who get paid millions of dollars to evaluate HS football players. They are sometimes wrong, but I will take their opinion over my own (and especially yours). It's the same reason why I never ripped on Kill for not offering Harden, even though from my novice eyes, I thought he looked good enough. At the end of the day, I believed that all of these coaches probably know more than I do. Maybe you should experiment with that kind of humility...
#3:All I really said about the Cretin team is that they didn't have great QB play. I wouldn't have called it bad, but Onwualu didn't play with a Nance, Alt, Mauer, etc.
#4: We don't know that James won't have a big SR season, in fact, barring injury, i'd be shocked if he wasn't All State. CDH's offense should be pretty good next season and James will be the best player on the entire team.
#5: You're entitled to your opinion that JW is a better player than JO, that's fine. All I said is that I disagree (but I don't really know much about him, so I could be wrong on JW). Not only do I disagree, but so do the staffs of every college football team in the entire country. So be it...everyone disagrees.
#6:There is no CDH Hype Machine....Almost every kid who has left CDH with a ton of hype has turned out. Ryan Harris played in the NFL. Joe Mauer is Joe Mauer. Seantrel Henderson was a freshman All American. Michael Floyd is Michael Floyd. It isn't hype, it's just recognition for being extremely good athletes. If there is a CDH hype machine, you should believe in it, because they've been more accurate than the recruiting of the rest of the kids in the state.
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Why would anyone even begin to answer dboy?
Total waste of web space.
Total waste of web space.
no JO:
i agree Harden was the most dominate DT i've seen in a decade... unblockable.. but like JW, maybe his frame wouldn't support much more.. i think harden is 5'8"?
Modern CDH is not Joe Mauer's CDH.. Totino, wayzata, etc all have better coaching, spread offenses ( of course i would name the 2 that dont ) than they did a decade ago.. but my point is there aren't the compelling reasons to go to CDH like there were in the past. Other than Seantrel, the CDH talent has been down since Floyd graduated.
wasn't there a 'bust' year for CDH.. dont have time to google it.. but i thought they had 3 of the top 5 recruits in the state one year.. some OT who went to wisky, and two others.. maybe nance and shady? not 100% sure.. but that would be a bust year.
also, you never answered my 'hype' point on why on rivals.com, after filtering out the jucos, guys with offers, etc that you end up with about 10 guys.. 3 from Breck and 3 from CDH.. how do they end up on rivals.com??? private school marketing? if so, more power to them.. but then don't deny 'hype/marketing'.
Bob_Loblaw
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Nope, I agreed with Coach Kill, I would have loved to have seen what Harden could have done, but I assumed those coaches know more about what will succeed in college. I will say that Harden was a better HS player than Onwualu, but this entire thread was about why certain guys got offers over other guys. Guys like Harden (who was backed by that dynamic CDH hype machine) didn't get an offer and JO has them flooding in, so there is more to it than who is simply the better HS football player. Which is why JO has gotten so many offers.
I think you have a warped idea of CDH's history. Cretin has 2 State Championships, and one of them was AFTER Michael Floyd, it was 3 years ago. To say CDH isn't as good as they used to be is bizarre, because going to the State Semi-Finals is a success for CDH football. Despite what some people think, CDH has never racked up the State Championships, most seasons we go to the State and eventually get beaten by powerhouse suburban teams. That's happened way more times than we've won it, we've only won it twice. So to say the talent level hasn't been the same since Floyd left is bizarre, because since Floyd left they've won 50% of their State Championships, had the 1(2) rated recruit in the country, now have a kid who has 10 offers by February, and it's only been four years!!! The talent level isn't down. CDH last year wasn't a bad CDH team, it was an average CDH team (including the Mauer years when we got drilled by EP in the State Championship).
The Nance - Schafer - Salamon - Nance season was the same season as Michael Floyd. Floyd might end up being the best football player to ever come out of Cretin, so I wouldn't call that season a flop.
Wait, I thought it was me, the hypemaster who was wrangling these offers for James Onwualu?
Maybe they do put more money into it, I have no idea. However, even if they do, that has ZERO impact on James Onwualu. A private school's marketing department does not get a player 10 offers by February. That same marketing department didn't get the best defensive player in the state a Big 10 offer this year. All they do is put the kid's names out there, the offers are a totally different thing. Especially for offers this early in the process from the best programs in the country. Like I said, if there is a Cretin Hype Machine, it failed Harden, it failed Kendrick Brewster, it failed Zach Mottla, and it failed Mark Alt. Furthermore, it is a spot on hype machine....the most highley recruited CDH players (Floyd, Seantrel, Binns, Eubanks, Freeman, B. Archer, Mauer, RPN, Royston, Carufel, Ryan Harris......their hype seems to magically follow the players who turn out.
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Back to the topic, JO apparently really enjoyed his visit after deciding last minute to attend.
John Galt
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It will be interesting to watch his recruitment play out. Many on here have said we have no shot, similar to how it didn't seem we had a chance with Nelson last year. Let's see what the staff can do....
Winona Gopher
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That awkward moment when Floyd runs a 4.47 at the combine.
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That's great! If he decides to go to a top tier program, that's tough, but it happens. All you can ask is that he gives the U a fair look.
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What? I never said Onwualu was poor in the open-field. Way back when I said that Woodbury's Wilson was an excellent open-field runner, but I haven't commented on Onwualu's open-field running, or really any aspect of his game, because I haven't seen him enough.
I have only seen Onwualu play three quarters, and I never said Onwualu was bad in any way. Based purely off his offer list and from what I've heard, Onwualu is probably the best player in the state. If you don't think he's the best player in the state, that's fine. I respect that. You've seen him play many more times than I have.
westcoastgopher11
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Jeez the last few pages of this thread have been ̶i̶n̶f̶o̶r̶m̶a̶t̶i̶v̶e̶ entertaining. Overall I think JO will be the MN kid with the most BCS level offers when all is said and done. Just as a matter of public perception we need to go out and make a run at the kid and try and get him to come here. I went to a rival school of CDH and god while it pains me to say it they have had some good talent come through those doors. Not every kid who excels in HS at CDH is a BCS prospect for that matter. Some kids just don't have the high ceilings for talent that coaches at the next level look for. Harden is a good example, great motor and very good HS player, but he is limited in how good of a player he could become in relation to other prospects.
The reason why the borderline BCS kids dominate in Minnesota HS football is simple, its not very good quality. Minnesota HS kids are in general slower, smaller, and the whole state places less emphasis on the game then most other major players in CFB, period. That being said Minnesota can, and will on occasion produce high to elite level athletes that could compete anywhere. The perception for so long has been that if you a serious BCS prospect you should go elsewhere to play against and compete with the best. If coach Kill can wrestle JO away from the juggernauts like ND, Stanford, etc then I'll really start believing that he is changing the culture of the program. A major hurdle in that change though is making the U a legitimate alternative for high level play, and making the public believe it.
Think about it, if the best players from your own state don't want to stay there to play football, why would top prospects from anywhere else?
The reason why the borderline BCS kids dominate in Minnesota HS football is simple, its not very good quality. Minnesota HS kids are in general slower, smaller, and the whole state places less emphasis on the game then most other major players in CFB, period. That being said Minnesota can, and will on occasion produce high to elite level athletes that could compete anywhere. The perception for so long has been that if you a serious BCS prospect you should go elsewhere to play against and compete with the best. If coach Kill can wrestle JO away from the juggernauts like ND, Stanford, etc then I'll really start believing that he is changing the culture of the program. A major hurdle in that change though is making the U a legitimate alternative for high level play, and making the public believe it.
Think about it, if the best players from your own state don't want to stay there to play football, why would top prospects from anywhere else?
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Good post. However, I also think it's important to keep in mind that the sun doesn't rise and set with JO. The fact is that even real good programs will lose out on local prospects who are that heavily recruited. The key is for guys like Will Johnson and (if JO leaves) for them to be the exception to the rule.
westcoastgopher11
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Very true. Top talent is top talent, and schools from far and wide will show up even if a kid is in someone's backyard. Think about the secondary player from just outside Baton Rouge that committed to Alabama. One recruit doesn't make or break a class but missing on top guys consistently, like we've been doing in the past, fuels the fire of the nay-sayers. Like you said, if guys like Will Johnson become the exception to the rule, Minnesota will be able to find its way back to the higher levels of the B1G I believe. If not... well we've been living that the last 50 or so years huh?
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Let me guess, Dboy played on a team who got biatch slapped around a bit by CDH??? Let it go big guy, let it go.....
Does anyone really think that the coaches from some of the best programs would make an offer JO without watching him in person or at lest seeing him at the combines. Under the big player/big game/big stats theory, Tom Brady would have never made it out of Michigan and every nine man half back who runs for billions of yards would be bound for LSU!
2008 not a flop??
floyd, 5* 27th nationally. spot on.
salamon. 3* 32nd best 'all-purpose back'. measureables: 4.55 40, bench 285. 35 vert. 2 BCS offers. BUST
schafer. 3* 37th best OT. 6 ( six ) ( SIX ) bcs offers. s-i-x. MEGA BUST.
nance 2*. 1 bcs offer. slight bust
based on the hype, this class was a huge BUST for CDH.
now look down the list.. way down.. Derek Earls. n/r. JUCO all-american. two year starter at LB in pac-12. NO BUST. so had Earls played at CDH, his recruitment, offers would be EXACTLY the same???? if you answer 'no', then you admit there is hype.... and you admit JO might become a bust.
lesson1: dont go off what you 'have heard'.
question1: i thought you said in an earlier post that JW was a better football player?...
Bob_Loblaw
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Huh?
Who knows how his recruiting would have went. Jonah Pirsig, Maxx Williams, Phil Nelson are all outstate guys who got a lot of attention. John Harden is a Cretin kid who did everything you could possibly do and he didn't get an offer. It happens. Are you really arguing that because 1 player went unnoticed in the same year that Cretin kids got scholarship offers that there is a hype machine? Seriously? You don't honestly believe that do you?
If it makes you feel better, I do agree that everyone missed on Derek Earls. He did go JuCo, so I don't know if there was a grade issue or not, but assuming there wasn't, yep, everyone missed on Earls. It happens. But blaming his lack of recruitment on a CDH hype machine is laughable. If there is anything, there is a bias towards guys playing in the spotlight. It isn't a hype machine or anything absurd like that, it's that the EP's, Wayzata's, and Cretins of the world, usually have more good players and usually are playing in bigger games. So yeah, it's easier to get noticed at Cretin than it is at Waconia. But that isn't a hype machine, it's just the nature of playing for a larger school. It's like with the NFL draft, most of us are more familiar with the best BCS players than we are with the smaller school athletes. That's not to say that some of them aren't way better.
You're blinded by your hatred for CDH.
Your argument is illogical. We all know it already...
Cretin is dirty...
James Onwualu isn't any good....
CDH hype machine runs everything and gets lousy players scholarships from all over the country....
Somebody you happen to know who lives in the East Metro said James Onwualu is soft.....
Because Derek Earls went to a Junior College and schools missed on him, that is proof of the CDH hype machine......
The Post-Michael Floyd CDH teams aren't very good, even though they've won 50% of their championships since then.....
your non-answer on the 2008 bust/nobust question speaks loudly.. "bust"... nice how you try to cherry pick..
post MF: STA and other private schools are now getting guys that would drive 40 miles one-way to CDH back in the day. a few years ago, a kid like JO wouldn't even see the field for CDH... now he's the 2nd coming??? and with the top 2013 recruit and one of the top 2012 recruits, wayzata still blows them up 42-0?? say it aint so, Joe.
also, how is my 'hatred illogical'.. yes, CDH is dirty.. at least they were vs. woodbury.. at least 5 unsportsman-like penalties in that game.. cherry pick that. your denial of that FACT is illogical.
and you still haven't addressed the rivals.com inventory?
Bob_Loblaw
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It's not a non-answer, it's up to interpretation. Michael Floyd will probably go down as the best position player to ever play at CDH. But yeah, Schafer didn't really turn out. Shady and Nance weren't very heavily recruited. If you want to call them flops, that's up to interpretation.
You're DEAD wrong about the talent level of CDH. It is on average better now than it was 10 years ago. I wish I could say differently as I am a 2000 grad and I played on probably the best Cretin team. However, outside of the one team (1999), Cretin's recent run is their best, ever. We've only won 2 State Championships, ever, and they were the Mauer team and the Alt / Henderson team. The historical dominance of Cretin is largely overblown, we've always been good, but most years we weren't better than we were last year. That's a fact.
Also, how crazy is it to call it the post-Michael Floyd era of Cretin football, he graduated in 2008, and since then we've won a State Championship. We've usually been second fiddle to the top suburban schools. It used to be Lakeville, Stillwater, Anoka and now it's Eden Praire and Wayzata. Not much has changed, except we play in a way better conference.
JO would always see the field for every single Cretin team. You're arguing that he would be second string is just dumb. It doesn't make any sense. He is the best WR since Floyd and before that, I can't think of many better WRs in Cretin history (Bowser was good).
And YEP, the team with the top JR in the state lost to Wayzata 42-0. Wayzata was a way better team. It's not that complicated. It's almost exactly like when CDH lost to Eden Praire with Floyd 52-14. It happens all the time.
If they had 5 unsportsman-like penalties in that game, i'd be shocked. I highly doubt it happened but you can keep crying about that game. The only game I saw Woodbury play was when they got dismantled by Eagan, a game that Woodbury had a couple unsportsmanlikes. I don't really hold it against Woodbury as i've always liked their program. I've known Beau for years and after he left, I still kind of rooted for them. You say CDH had 5 unsportsmens in that game, ok, i've never noticed anything like that. However, i'd guess with the amount of whining and hysterical obsession with Cretin, i'd have to think you're full of it. I could be wrong on that though.
Nope, I didn't. It's a nonsensical argument.
You're completely illogical. I am done talking about this with you on here. If you feel the need to continue your "my son's team got beat by CDH" therapy, you can private message me. I'm sure everyone is sick of seeing us go back and forth. But keep in mind, it's ok that your son got beat by a Cretin team. It's not that big of a deal. I don't hate Wayzata for destroying Cretin, it happens, it's HS football.
westcoastgopher11
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SMH sometimes...
Dboy, the first thing that popped into my head after reading your post was this.
I'm only gonna post once about this to you just because I don't want to feed this troll any longer. However I gotta set you right quick just as a service to you and the GH community.
You gotta get off this CDH thing man, its making you look like a clown. You don't seem to know much about the team you seem to despise so vocally. Saying that JO wouldn't see the field "like a few years ago" (#2WR I guess...) might make sense in your head but it just isn't translating to the rest of us here brother. Be that as it may, lay off it man. Getting your kicks from trolling about a high school is pretty weak, but just making ish up to try and win an argument on GH is flacid. Come on we're all Gopher fans here.
If Onwualu keeps piling up gaudy amounts of BCS offers what head coach would have to offer for you too say to yourself "ok maybe this kid isn't all hype"? Mack Brown? Les Miles? Nick Saban? At what point does the combined experience of all these "duped" coaching staffs outweigh what you saw on one crisp fall night?(Rhetorical for the layman)
@Bob_Loblaw: Cretin really? Guess I can forgive ya, none of us are perfect haha. Admitting when you get beat by the Raiders on the field without being [too] bitter about it counts for something though right?
Oh Dboy, last thing about CDH that kinda just sums up your whole spiel, stating things like
just reinforces your laughable ignorance about this situation in particular as well. Conveniently enough for you, Onwaulu's older brother transferred to Cretin from one of those "other private schools", with James enrolling at Cretin later. The CDH hype/football/conspiracy/rivals/illuminati machine is so widespread and powerful that it proved you wrong half a decade before you even typed those words. Now I don't know about you, but I haven't had that EVER happen to me before. My only advice to you would be simple, rest your fingers and take the next few threads off, its for your own good.
Dboy, the first thing that popped into my head after reading your post was this.
I'm only gonna post once about this to you just because I don't want to feed this troll any longer. However I gotta set you right quick just as a service to you and the GH community.
You gotta get off this CDH thing man, its making you look like a clown. You don't seem to know much about the team you seem to despise so vocally. Saying that JO wouldn't see the field "like a few years ago" (#2WR I guess...) might make sense in your head but it just isn't translating to the rest of us here brother. Be that as it may, lay off it man. Getting your kicks from trolling about a high school is pretty weak, but just making ish up to try and win an argument on GH is flacid. Come on we're all Gopher fans here.
If Onwualu keeps piling up gaudy amounts of BCS offers what head coach would have to offer for you too say to yourself "ok maybe this kid isn't all hype"? Mack Brown? Les Miles? Nick Saban? At what point does the combined experience of all these "duped" coaching staffs outweigh what you saw on one crisp fall night?(Rhetorical for the layman)
@Bob_Loblaw: Cretin really? Guess I can forgive ya, none of us are perfect haha. Admitting when you get beat by the Raiders on the field without being [too] bitter about it counts for something though right?
Oh Dboy, last thing about CDH that kinda just sums up your whole spiel, stating things like
just reinforces your laughable ignorance about this situation in particular as well. Conveniently enough for you, Onwaulu's older brother transferred to Cretin from one of those "other private schools", with James enrolling at Cretin later. The CDH hype/football/conspiracy/rivals/illuminati machine is so widespread and powerful that it proved you wrong half a decade before you even typed those words. Now I don't know about you, but I haven't had that EVER happen to me before. My only advice to you would be simple, rest your fingers and take the next few threads off, its for your own good.
Man... some of the posts on here are bizarre.... There isn't one program in this state that produces as much college football talent as CDH. Period. That doesn't mean that CDH is the best TEAM - just produces more college level players then any other high school in Minnesota. No one even mentioned the Bins kid who also came from that 08 team.
Eden Prairie has had some great TEAMS - and way too many kids that go bust in college to count. Wayzata has had a lot of kids that had huge college careers. Probably 2nd to CDH.
Eden Prairie has had some great TEAMS - and way too many kids that go bust in college to count. Wayzata has had a lot of kids that had huge college careers. Probably 2nd to CDH.