Police say Alabama star Brandon Miller delivered gun to former teammate Darius Miles before shooting; Oats said Miller 'wrong spot at the wrong time'


Holy Man

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The NCAA for you. I hope someone at the UofM grows some stones and puts up the 1997 final four banner. Tell the NCAA to bleep themselves and come take it down if you dare.
Absolutely bureaucratically insane. What is the matter with these people?

Wondering if the coaches knew the minimum swimmer rule before they had a qualifier. Seems like a dumb rule anyway, especially in individual events.
 



MNVCGUY

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The beauty of this whole thing is St Thomas can’t play in the post season for like 4 years after moving to division 1. Not just team spots but an individual athlete can’t even compete. That’s their punishment for trying to improve their athletics and their university. Here you have a murderer on a team and they are going to play for a national championship. The NCAA loves to say schools have a “Lack of Institutional Control” all the time when handing out punishments. Would having a murderer on your team not be a “Lack of Institutional Control”?
To be fair to Miller he is not the murderer. We can all debate what if any punishment he should receive for his involvement in transporting the eventual murder weapon but he was not the one that pulled the trigger and as far as I have seen there is no evidence that he knew the weapon was going to be used for that purpose.

I am in the camp that he deserves some sort of punishment for his involvement and of course we all know that Alabama has clearly decided continuing to win is more important that holding him accountable for his actions.

Miller doesn't deserve to have his life blown up by this, but no punishment of any kind for his involvement sends the wrong message as well.
 


goldengophers

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Miller doesn't deserve to have his life blown up by this, but no punishment of any kind for his involvement sends the wrong message as well.
Are we sure he doesn't? Does a free society built on personal responsibility not require it? I believe in his intelligence and ability to discern the right call at 1:30am, irresponsibility should be met with significant punishment in this case.
 
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MNVCGUY

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Are we sure he doesn't? Does a free society built on personal responsibility not require it?
Apparently his actions in the matter didn't break the law so at that point it is up to the team in terms of how to handle a case of really bad judgement and associating with bad people.

I feel like he should have faced a suspension of some kind, at least for a game or two while all the details were sorted out. If he were not a star player that almost certainly would have happened. But Alabama is making it clear that winning is the most important thing here so they are doing nothing.

He is facing some consequences from the standpoint of having his name and reputation tarnished because of this. Won't stop some NBA team from giving him millions next year but at least there are some social consequences.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Apparently his actions in the matter didn't break the law so at that point it is up to the team in terms of how to handle a case of really bad judgement and associating with bad people.

I feel like he should have faced a suspension of some kind, at least for a game or two while all the details were sorted out. If he were not a star player that almost certainly would have happened. But Alabama is making it clear that winning is the most important thing here so they are doing nothing.

He is facing some consequences from the standpoint of having his name and reputation tarnished because of this. Won't stop some NBA team from giving him millions next year but at least there are some social consequences.
I am not talking specifically about Miller because I don't know enough about this situation but things can be within the law that society has every right to judge.

There are suicide websites that are careful to not break the law but IMO push suicide. There are people who cheat on their spouses while they are sick. There are people who pretty much ignore their children. There are people who lose their entire careers for saying bad things (see: Kramer).

I'm not really arguing against anything you said, I just have heard people say things like "he didn't technically break the law" like that is the only standard.
 

MNVCGUY

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I am not talking specifically about Miller because I don't know enough about this situation but things can be within the law that society has every right to judge.

There are suicide websites that are careful to not break the law but IMO push suicide. There are people who cheat on their spouses while they are sick. There are people who pretty much ignore their children. There are people who lose their entire careers for saying bad things (see: Kramer).

I'm not really arguing against anything you said, I just have heard people say things like "he didn't technically break the law" like that is the only standard.
Yeah, situations like Miller's and the ones you mentioned are tricky. Some will take the tone where they will excuse the actions because they didn't break the law (Alabama is 100% using this tactic with Miller to keep him on the court). Others will call him a murderer and act like he was the one that pulled the trigger and should have his life ruined (chanting "lock him up" everytime he touches the ball is way overboard).

As with most things the truth is always somewhere in the middle. Bama did him no favors by not punishing him in any way in my opinion because the court of public opinion is clearly against him.
 



Bob_Loblaw

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Yeah, situations like Miller's and the ones you mentioned are tricky. Some will take the tone where they will excuse the actions because they didn't break the law (Alabama is 100% using this tactic with Miller to keep him on the court). Others will call him a murderer and act like he was the one that pulled the trigger and should have his life ruined (chanting "lock him up" everytime he touches the ball is way overboard).

As with most things the truth is always somewhere in the middle. Bama did him no favors by not punishing him in any way in my opinion because the court of public opinion is clearly against him.
I agree with you here 100%. Playing him put it under a massive microscope.

I don't know if anyone here knows, but did Bama know about the texts prior to Oats saying "wrong place/wrong time"? The texts are really the damning piece.
 

Holy Man

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Yeah, situations like Miller's and the ones you mentioned are tricky. Some will take the tone where they will excuse the actions because they didn't break the law (Alabama is 100% using this tactic with Miller to keep him on the court). Others will call him a murderer and act like he was the one that pulled the trigger and should have his life ruined (chanting "lock him up" everytime he touches the ball is way overboard).

As with most things the truth is always somewhere in the middle. Bama did him no favors by not punishing him in any way in my opinion because the court of public opinion is clearly against him.
Pretty clear that Bama and Oats thought it would go away without anyone noticing. An immediate suspension while waiting for the the cops to investigate would have sent a message that they cared at least a little and it was early enough in the season that the impact on wins and losses would have been minimal.

Pure speculation, but I bet Miller has a history of not separating himself from the wrong crowd, making the whole argument of "wrong place, wrong time" even more laughable. The youth will mock me, but there is truth to the "nothing good happens after 10, Midnight, whatever."

As noted above, this gives me, and I bet a lot of others, more reason to cheer against them.
 

cjbfbp

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Pure speculation, but I bet Miller has a history of not separating himself from the wrong crowd, making the whole argument of "wrong place, wrong time" even more laughable. The youth will mock me, but there is truth to the "nothing good happens after 10, Midnight, whatever."

I remember an interesting documentary short about professional athletes being armed. A number of the athletes in the documentary said that they carried because they may go places that have a potential for danger and they can be susceptible targets. Appearing in the documentary as a counter view was Karl Malone. He had little sympathy for this argument and asked the question "Why are you going to these types of places?"
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Absolutely bureaucratically insane. What is the matter with these people?

Wondering if the coaches knew the minimum swimmer rule before they had a qualifier. Seems like a dumb rule anyway, especially in individual events.
This is what inept systems (and people) do. They try to frantically control the people who cannot fight back because they are utterly toothless against the things that really matter.
 



From the Parkinglot

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To be fair to Miller he is not the murderer. We can all debate what if any punishment he should receive for his involvement in transporting the eventual murder weapon but he was not the one that pulled the trigger and as far as I have seen there is no evidence that he knew the weapon was going to be used for that purpose.

I am in the camp that he deserves some sort of punishment for his involvement and of course we all know that Alabama has clearly decided continuing to win is more important that holding him accountable for his actions.

Miller doesn't deserve to have his life blown up by this, but no punishment of any kind for his involvement sends the wrong message as well.
I’m not saying he should be punished individually, but maybe the entire team needs to sit the next few games out.
 


MNVCGUY

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I remember an interesting documentary short about professional athletes being armed. A number of the athletes in the documentary said that they carried because they may go places that have a potential for danger and they can be susceptible targets. Appearing in the documentary as a counter view was Karl Malone. He had little sympathy for this argument and asked the question "Why are you going to these types of places?"
There is something to be said for not putting yourself into bad situations. It is like the athletes that get pulled over for drunk driving.....you have tons of money.....if you want to go party then hire someone to drive you around.....get a friggin limo.....
 

From the Parkinglot

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You want to punish the whole team for the actions of a few individuals?
Yea they do it all the time. Entire teams are punished by the ncaa all the time because of the actions of the coaches. Even when the coaches are no longer employed there. You


The is directly from the story.
The Falcons have not released the names of the coaches who were involved in the infractions, though former defensive assistant Bill Sheridan cited his investigation as a reason for resigning from Wisconsin. He had joined the Badgers staff this past offseason after leaving Air Force.

It is believed that at least four of the assistants involved are no longer with the Air Force program.


The report – which involves former fencing head coach Vladimir Nazlymov, former women’s golf coach Therese Hession and former women’s basketball associate head coach Patrick Klein – noted they violated head coach responsibility rules and/or ethical conduct rules by not fully cooperating with the investigation.
 


short ornery norwegian

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setting basketball aside - let's say your cousin or your brother-in-law called you at 1:30am and said "I left my gun in your car. bring it to me right now."

I have to think that most people in that situation would ask some questions. Like, why do you need it right now? are you in some kind of trouble? what are you planning to do with it?

for any adult to just say "OK" in that situation indicates - let us say - a certain lack of critical thinking.
 

From the Parkinglot

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Brandon hasn’t been in any type of trouble, nor is he in any type of trouble in this case,” Alabama coach Nate Oats said earlier this week. On Friday he added, “I feel like we’ve done the right thing.”

What exactly have they done? I know Nate said they prayed after practice the other day. He didn’t say what they prayed about, just that they prayed.
 




DelawareGopher

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Would be a shame if this year’s Cinderella team just happened to meet up with Bama in the first round.
 

WoodburyTim

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He is at least part of a young woman getting murdered and he does a pat down routine before he is introduced. Sorry, dude is garbage.
 



atsgopher

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He is at least part of a young woman getting murdered and he does a pat down routine before he is introduced. Sorry, dude is garbage.
If I was Jamea Brown’s father….. I’d hope my friends would take any weapons and booz from me.

I cannot believe that there are not only ignoring it, they are openly mocking it.
 




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