Murray Warmath Retirement Reason

[WAGopher]

Another thread prompted me to wonder why Murray Warmath retired at age 59? Was he forced out, or decide he had enough coaching? We seem to be able to discuss why all the other coaches left, but it seems a bit of a mystery as to why Murray retired at a seemingly young age, especially for a man that had enough left in the tank to live at least another 40 years after he quit coaching.

 

[mnboiler]

I think coaches in general retired earlier back in that day. Maybe the greatest coach of that generation-Bud Wilkenson-retired from coaching the Oklahoma Sooners at the old age of 47 with a career winning percentage of 81%(HOLY #$@# that is high) and 3 National Titles in only 16 years of being a head coach.

Side note, but the athletic department needs to do a MUCH better job claiming him as a Gopher, granted he will always be remember as a Sonner but they need to make sure everyone knows that he grew up in Minnesota and played QB for the University of Minnesota Golden Gophers.

It was just a different culture back then, life expectancy wasn't nearly as long and a lot less predicable. I would guess that there were many many factors that went into the decision that no one will ever know except for Warmath and those closest to him.

 

[Wahoo McDaniel]

Another Dark Horse Candidate?

Could be the second coming of Murray Warmath.

Likes football and could socialize with the players.

Connected to Deep Southern States in terms of recruiting.

Likely would bring the "Tater Salad" offense to TCF Bank Stadium!

 

[Gopher Fan]

Could be the second coming of Murray Warmath.

Likes football and could socialize with the players.

Connected to Deep Southern States in terms of recruiting.

Likely would bring the "Tater Salad" offense to TCF Bank Stadium!

I agree.

97 is the new 87. Just look at how good of shape Joe Paterno is in.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

Murray was fired, basically, after three straight losing seasons. He was coach for 16 years. Worse was the firing of Bierman, who was also relatively young - in his fifties - for one bad season (in which the Gophers still led the Big Ten in defense, despite winning only one of nine games). He was fired for the year before, when the legendary "49ers," (Bud Grant, Leo Nomellini, Clayt Tonemaker, Gordy Soltau, Billy Bye and gang) lost the championship and Rose Bowl when upset at Homecoming by a Purdue team that finished with a losing season. The Gophers went 7-2, but the disappointment was so great, combined with a one-win season in 1950, that the U canned a coach who had won five national and seven Big Ten championships in his first ten years on the job.

 

[RodentRampage]

Then there was the firing of Stoll. I probably wouldn't have hired Stoll in the first place, his record wasn't that impressive. But he did give is the best Big Ten record we have had in decades. He gave us our last 6 win Big Ten season, finished with three consecutive 4-4 Big Ten seasons. We've had only 4 winning Big Ten seasons since he was fired, all of them 5-3 seasons. And we haven't had three consective non-losing Big Ten seasons since then. Stoll's non-conference record wasn't padded with creampuffs either.

That led to Joe Salem, who had done well as coach of D-II South Dakota and D-II Northern Arizona (D-II at the time, not they are in the FCS). He was hired because he had been a player here. This is what I point to when people make too much of a coach with local ties. If he isn't the right coach, it's a mistake no matter how strong the local ties are.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

Good points. I have a friend who says Minnesota's biggest mistake was firing Bierman; second biggest mistake, firing Warmath; third biggest mistake, firing Stoll. I knew Cal and if he'd had the facilities of today (and Mason's schedules), he would have been a winner here and a very successful recruiter. Cal was a very brave guy - his heart was destroyed by a virus and he had to have a heart transplant, then lived a long time with that condition. He played for Bierman and loved Gopher football. I remember how thrilled he and his staff were when they made the Hall of Fame Bowl in Birmingham in '77. That was the year they upset Washington, UCLA and no. 1 Michigan.

 

[diehard]

The string of coaches since Warmath (he was "nudged" out) has been exactly what the U wanted. Alternating, can't make it to the next level, abject failure. We are due for a can't take it to the next level coach. Holtz is the only one in the group not fired. Just what the "Great Research Institution" has wanted beginning with Malcolm Moos and has not changed. Plenty of "Gopher fans" have been fooled before you guys. Now it is your turn. The program is in terrible shape and it started 40 years ago. We are way beyond needing a new coach. Believe Maturi if you are dumb enough.

 

[Iceland12]

Then there was the firing of Stoll. I probably wouldn't have hired Stoll in the first place, his record wasn't that impressive. But he did give is the best Big Ten record we have had in decades. He gave us our last 6 win Big Ten season, finished with three consecutive 4-4 Big Ten seasons. We've had only 4 winning Big Ten seasons since he was fired, all of them 5-3 seasons. And we haven't had three consective non-losing Big Ten seasons since then. Stoll's non-conference record wasn't padded with creampuffs either.

That led to Joe Salem, who had done well as coach of D-II South Dakota and D-II Northern Arizona (D-II at the time, not they are in the FCS). He was hired because he had been a player here. This is what I point to when people make too much of a coach with local ties. If he isn't the right coach, it's a mistake no matter how strong the local ties are.

True. All the credit for Salem's hiring goes to the boosters and the "M Club" guys. They wanted "one of their own" and they knew ho the right guy was. Remind you of any present day website?

 

[RodentRampage]

The string of coaches since Warmath (he was "nudged" out) has been exactly what the U wanted. Alternating, can't make it to the next level, abject failure. We are due for a can't take it to the next level coach. Holtz is the only one in the group not fired. Just what the "Great Research Institution" has wanted beginning with Malcolm Moos and has not changed. Plenty of "Gopher fans" have been fooled before you guys. Now it is your turn. The program is in terrible shape and it started 40 years ago. We are way beyond needing a new coach. Believe Maturi if you are dumb enough.

Did the people in the black helicopters tell you this? You're seriously claiming that the U is intentionally making the football program bad? If the U was trying to destroy football, as you claim, then TCF Bank Stadium would not exist, we would be languishing in the dome forever. Moos isn't here any longer, he's long gone.

We're not fooled. The program isn't in nearly as bad a shape as you think. Sure, the team is bad, but that's typical when a coach is fired. We have first-class facilities, and that counts for a lot. What this program needs is the right hire. You seem to think that the U won't make the right hire because the right hire hasn't been made before, and that furthermore, they intentionally made bad hires. But most of the names under consideration seem like good options to most observers.

 

[RodentRampage]

True. All the credit for Salem's hiring goes to the boosters and the "M Club" guys. They wanted "one of their own" and they knew ho the right guy was. Remind you of any present day website?

If you boosters want to push hard for their own choice, they should own that choice and take some responsibility for it. The boosters' choice isn't always the right one. Granted, going too far in the other direction is a mistake too, you don't want to end up hiring Brewster.

 

[Iceland12]

If your boosters want to push hard for their own choice, they should own that choice and take some responsibility for it. The boosters' choice isn't always the right one. Granted, going too far in the other direction is a mistake too, you don't want to end up hiring Brewster.

Well said.

 

[diehard]

Did the people in the black helicopters tell you this? You're seriously claiming that the U is intentionally making the football program bad? If the U was trying to destroy football, as you claim, then TCF Bank Stadium would not exist, we would be languishing in the dome forever. Moos isn't here any longer, he's long gone.

We're not fooled. The program isn't in nearly as bad a shape as you think. Sure, the team is bad, but that's typical when a coach is fired. We have first-class facilities, and that counts for a lot. What this program needs is the right hire. You seem to think that the U won't make the right hire because the right hire hasn't been made before, and that furthermore, they intentionally made bad hires. But most of the names under consideration seem like good options to most observers.

You do not appear to have any understanding of the U. Why do you think they hired this idiot named Maturi as AD? The atmosphere of the U administration is pointy headed academics, not people who understand the need for accomplished revenue generating sports programs. Why do you think you ended up with a mini-stadium? They don't plan to fill that either.

 

[dpodoll68]

Why do you think you ended up with a mini-stadium?

Hmm. "You"? Interesting...

And to the point of the question, why on earth would a team that hasn't done anything in 40+ years build a 80,000+ seat stadium? Wishing yourself a greater following doesn't make it so.

 

[RodentRampage]

You do not appear to have any understanding of the U. Why do you think they hired this idiot named Maturi as AD? The atmosphere of the U administration is pointy headed academics, not people who understand the need for accomplished revenue generating sports programs. Why do you think you ended up with a mini-stadium? They don't plan to fill that either.

Yes, I do understand it. The U is run by academics? Don't you realize that academics are the sole reason that universities even exist? If you don't like academics, perhaps you would find the NFL more to your liking, no pesky academics there.

We do not have a "mini stadium". It's an average sized D-I stadium. It is not as large as other stadiums in the Big Ten, but looking at Big Ten stadiums gives a skewed view, as we have some of the largest stadiums in the country.

But why is TCF the size that it is, instead of being larger? A couple reasons. For one, it's what we could afford. We would never have gotten the funding for an 80,000 seat stadium. But the stadium was built with expansion in mind. The second reason is that 50,000 meets our needs. If we had built an 80,000 seat stadium, it would have 30,000 empty seats, and it would do us no good. 50,000 people in a 50,000 seat stadium is a fantastic environment, 50,000 in an 80,000 seat stadium is like playing in a crypt. If this secret cabal wanted to undermine the Gophers, building an 80,000 seat stadium would be a better way of doing it than building a 50,000 seat stadium.

But if the U had wanted to undermine football, there is no way they would ever have built a new stadium in the first place. The stadium is proof that your conspiracy theory is wrong.

 

[diehard]

Hmm. "You"? Interesting...

And to the point of the question, why on earth would a team that hasn't done anything in 40+ years build a 80,000+ seat stadium? Wishing yourself a greater following doesn't make it so.

U grad from the 70s. Warmath, Stoll, and the U administrations are not unfamiliar to me. Followed the Gophers since 1960. Since 1960 there was never ever going to be another instituion I was going to. Father grad. Brother grad (MS and PhD), etc. etc. Hmm. "You"? Interesting... M<oron. It's idiots like you that have supported the mini football program without a clue of what is really going on. Congrats. Ignorance is bliss for some, I guess.

 

[dpodoll68]

U grad from the 70s. Warmath, Stoll, and the U administrations are not unfamiliar to me. Followed the Gophers since 1960. Since 1960 there was never ever going to be another instituion I was going to. Father grad. Brother grad (MS and PhD), etc. etc. Hmm. "You"? Interesting... M<oron. It's idiots like you that have supported the mini football program without a clue of what is really going on. Congrats. Ignorance is bliss for some, I guess.

I'm still trying to ascertain what any of that has to do with: 1) the word choice of "you" vs. "us" or "they" or any number of other words you could have chosen; 2) the rationale for a "small" 50,000 seat stadium

Good job quickly editing "Moron", "idiots", and "Ignorance" out of your post, by the way.

 

[diehard]

They were well deserved. "You" is because you believe in a 50,000 seat program. You will have what you deserve.

 

[dpodoll68]

They were well deserved.

Link?

"You" is because you believe in a 50,000 seat program. You will have what you deserve.

Please show me where I said, or insinuated any of these things.

I wish the Gophers didn't have a 50,000 seat stadium. That doesn't mean that I think it would be wise to have an 80,000 seat stadium.

I'd also love to know how USD, Northern Illinois, NDSU, Florida Atlantic, etc. beat us these last few seasons. After all, we have a much bigger football budget than any of them.

 

[Iceland12]

They were well deserved. "You" is because you believe in a 50,000 seat program. You will have what you deserve.

I hate even the the damn idea of 5 or 6 thousand Iowa fans at TCF. You wanted to have 30,000 of them there!

 

[diehard]

Yes, I do understand it. The U is run by academics? Don't you realize that academics are the sole reason that universities even exist? If you don't like academics, perhaps you would find the NFL more to your liking, no pesky academics there.

We do not have a "mini stadium". It's an average sized D-I stadium. It is not as large as other stadiums in the Big Ten, but looking at Big Ten stadiums gives a skewed view, as we have some of the largest stadiums in the country.

But why is TCF the size that it is, instead of being larger? A couple reasons. For one, it's what we could afford. We would never have gotten the funding for an 80,000 seat stadium. But the stadium was built with expansion in mind. The second reason is that 50,000 meets our needs. If we had built an 80,000 seat stadium, it would have 30,000 empty seats, and it would do us no good. 50,000 people in a 50,000 seat stadium is a fantastic environment, 50,000 in an 80,000 seat stadium is like playing in a crypt. If this secret cabal wanted to undermine the Gophers, building an 80,000 seat stadium would be a better way of doing it than building a 50,000 seat stadium.

But if the U had wanted to undermine football, there is no way they would ever have built a new stadium in the first place. The stadium is proof that your conspiracy theory is wrong.

You have just re-enforced your belief that Minnesota should just have average D1 aspirations, not BT competitive goals.

Your argument that academics and research are exclusive to successful athletic programs is silly at best. Look around.

You just made the argument that you are one of the reasons Minnesota football sucks. We need better fans. Fans that support improving the football program.

 

[RodentRampage]

They were well deserved. "You" is because you believe in a 50,000 seat program. You will have what you deserve.

I believe in a 50,000 seat program? I don't have any idea what that even means. What IS a 50,000 seat program?

Even if we could have gotten funding for an 80,000 seat stadium - which we could not - an 80,000 seat stadium would not have made demand greater, it would have made it less. An 80,000 seat stadium would have led to a glut in seating. With a 50,000 seat stadium, people can't be assured of even getting a ticket. With an 80,000 seat stadium, there would be no urgency at all, everyone would be assured of getting a seat if they just walk up on gameday.

The stadium was designed to be expanded in increments of 10,000 to a maxiumum capacity of 80,000 if demand is sufficient.

 

[diehard]

"I believe in a 50,000 seat program? I don't have any idea what that even means."

+1

 

[RodentRampage]

You have just re-enforced your belief that Minnesota should just have average D1 aspirations, not BT competitive goals.

No, I have not. A stadium with a larger capacity than demand does not help our aspirations one bit. "If you build it, they will come" is fiction. Expand the stadium if demand increases, by all means, but an 80,000 seat initial capacity makes no sense for a team with a demand of 50,000.

Your argument that academics and research are exclusive to successful athletic programs is silly at best. Look around.

I have made no such argument. I never said not implied that academics and athletics can't coexist. You were the one raving against academics.

You just made the argument that you are one of the reasons Minnesota football sucks. We need better fans. Fans that support improving the football program.

Conspiracy theories don't improve the football program.

 

[RodentRampage]

"I believe in a 50,000 seat program? I don't have any idea what that even means."

+1

To say '+1' is to signify agreement, but I get the feeling you aren't actually agreeing with me.

 

[diehard]

"I have made no such argument. I never said not implied that academics and athletics can't coexist. You were the one raving against academics."

I did not knock academics (studies). I was criticizing the pointy headed academics (people) at the U that hate football and dominate policy that retards the resurgence of the football program. Why do you think Joel remains AD? He is easy to punk.

 

[diehard]

To say '+1' is to signify agreement, but I get the feeling you aren't actually agreeing with me.

Read what I agreed with. I don't believe you do understand what a 50,000 seat program is. It's pinnacle is mediocrity in the BT.

 

[RodentRampage]

If the U hated football, TCF Bank Stadium would not exist.
TCF Bank Stadium exists.
Therefore, the U does not hate football.

 

[50PoundHead]

Warmath was pretty much chased out by the M Club, as was his successor, Cal Stoll. Murray was the best Gopher coach I've seen in my lifetime, but it always has to be remembered that Murray recruited the Deep South before African-American high school players were recruited by the SEC. Darn, that Wilbert Jackson ruined everything!

 

[RodentRampage]

Read what I agreed with. I don't believe you do understand what a 50,000 seat program is. It's pinnacle is mediocrity in the BT.

I have no idea what in the world YOU mean by "50,000 seat program". Do you mean a football program which can draw no more than 50,000? I certainly do not agree with that, but it is a fact that 50,000 is about what demand is currently. That is why the stadium was built with expanability in mind.

Do you think we could have gotten funding for a larger stadium?