Lil Ricky Cannot Coach

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dpodoll68 said:
Also incorrect. He had the most successful season for Minnesota basketball in 23 years. He took Minnesota to 3 Tournaments in 6 years, which had never been done before. He didn't have success by Kentucky standards, but you'll be waiting a few lifetimes if that's your standard for the Gophers.
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1997 happened get over it. I know you can't type that first line with a straight face. Just because the NCAA won't count it doesn't mean it didn't happen
 

The NCAA is practically the public-relations and marketing firm for Duke and UNC. They won't make them vacate anything!
 

60's Guy said:
The idea that Pitino might be fired after this season barring a scandal is highly unlikely. I'm not going to look it up but Teague extended his contract to 6 years I'm pretty sure? I complained loudly and was told by all it was necessary to keep him from moving, to let recruits know he had the backing of administration etc.

There was no need to extend his contract and give him a raise. He can coach. He can't manage a roster and I'd definitely agree it seems he needed a better assistant to replace McHale. But you can't have 3 scholarships unavailable voluntarily at the same time.
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I'm assuming you are talking about the two transfers and Johnson? You can't blame the coaching staff for the Jarvis Johnson situation.
 

Gopher2017 said:
I'll be impatiently waiting.
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Do you sell your car every time the "check engine" light comes on?

When people are saying be patient, it's not saying "do nothing". It means it takes some time to evaluate the coach, and the prudent path is to see how this season plays out as well as the next class and those sitting out this season.

I have yet to see any evidence of quickly turning over coaching staffs as a remedy.
 

AHH Iowa hired a young realtively inexperienced coach in the Lick(albeit more than Pitino) and fired him after 3 years to go with an expereinced guy seems to have worked realtively well for them. If a guy is in over his head he is in over his head no players or future players are worth having the wrong head coach at the college level.


Unregistered User said:
Do you sell your car every time the "check engine" light comes on?

When people are saying be patient, it's not saying "do nothing". It means it takes some time to evaluate the coach, and the prudent path is to see how this season plays out as well as the next class and those sitting out this season.

I have yet to see any evidence of quickly turning over coaching staffs as a remedy.
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rivergopher said:
AHH Iowa hired a young realtively inexperienced coach in the Lick(albeit more than Pitino) and fired him after 3 years to go with an expereinced guy seems to have worked realtively well for them. If a guy is in over his head he is in over his head no players or future players are worth having the wrong head coach at the college level.
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Lickliter was the head coach at Butler for 6 years, went to 2 Sweet 16s and was named coach of the year just before being hired by Iowa. And he was 52 at the time of his hire at Iowa.

But yes, they fired him after 3 years with 4 years remaining on his contract.

So who is on your short list, that will come here and turn this around?
 

dpodoll68 said:
Right, so correct. Thanks. "Accomplishments" gained via cheating aren't worth celebrating or remembering. Also, the NCAA took those "accomplishments" away, so they never happened on paper. Good talk.
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So much for reality.

The only ones cheating are those that are caught. And punished. Good talk.
 

rivergopher said:
AHH Iowa hired a young realtively inexperienced coach in the Lick(albeit more than Pitino) and fired him after 3 years to go with an expereinced guy seems to have worked realtively well for them. If a guy is in over his head he is in over his head no players or future players are worth having the wrong head coach at the college level.
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Lick was 52 years old when Iowa hired him, four years older than Fran. And I don't think hiring a guy who had six years as a head coach at butler and was national coach of the year in his final season is a big risk of a hire.
 



BarnBurner said:
So much for reality.

The only ones cheating are those that are caught. And punished. Good talk.
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Other schools, what they did, and whether or not they're punished are 100% immaterial to what the U did and was rightfully punished for. Of course, you already knew that.
 

Ok his age is really not the important in this matter just pointing out that it has been done and I am sure there are other expamples just one that is close to home. Just pointing out that they knew that they hired the wrong guy and did not worry about recruits or currently rostered guys. This season is a disaster and I do believe that he prolly deserves one more year just pointing out firing a guy after 3 years is not all doom and gloom like you said.
QUOTE=Unregistered User;1160032]Lickliter was the head coach at Butler for 6 years, went to 2 Sweet 16s and was named coach of the year just before being hired by Iowa. And he was 52 at the time of his hire at Iowa.

But yes, they fired him after 3 years with 4 years remaining on his contract.

So who is on your short list, that will come here and turn this around?[/QUOTE]
 

rivergopher said:
Ok his age is really not the important in this matter just pointing out that it has been done and I am sure there are other expamples just one that is close to home. Just pointing out that they knew that they hired the wrong guy and did not worry about recruits or currently rostered guys. This season is a disaster and I do believe that he prolly deserves one more year just pointing out firing a guy after 3 years is not all doom and gloom like you said.
QUOTE=Unregistered User;1160032]Lickliter was the head coach at Butler for 6 years, went to 2 Sweet 16s and was named coach of the year just before being hired by Iowa. And he was 52 at the time of his hire at Iowa.

But yes, they fired him after 3 years with 4 years remaining on his contract.

So who is on your short list, that will come here and turn this around?
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[/QUOTE]

Deflect Deflect Deflect! Iowa also had an AD in place too, not to mention guys like Tucker were causing problems in Iowa City. Guessing if Lickliter had control of his team he would've received another year
 

Wait so you feel Pitino has control of this team? Just asking it is opinion based.
 




Unregistered User said:
Lickliter was the head coach at Butler for 6 years, went to 2 Sweet 16s and was named coach of the year just before being hired by Iowa. And he was 52 at the time of his hire at Iowa.

But yes, they fired him after 3 years with 4 years remaining on his contract.
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That is correct. He wasn't inexperienced. He was just bad. Being an Iowa alum, I watched him closely (sort of like the train wreck you can't stop watching). Personally, I think he was a somewhat better coach than Pitino but he was a pretty terrible recruiter and he really didn't seem to understand the kind of roster personnel he needed to be successful in the Big Ten.

Actually, a combination of things led to Lickliter's quick demise. I'd say the three biggest were: 1) poor performance, 2) numerous roster losses, mostly from outbound transfers (including four after year 2 alone); and 3) a really boring style of play highlighted by taking the air out of the ball and jacking up threes with the shot clock expiring. So far, Pitino has "achieved" only one of those three conditions and, depending upon how you look at it, maybe none because Lickliter had three consecutive losing seasons. In his first two years, Lickliter actually had three starters transfer.
 

rivergopher said:
Wait so you feel Pitino has control of this team? Just asking it is opinion based.
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If I had to guess we may have differing opinions on control. I view control in terms of if the kids are going to class, if they're buying into the mission, and if they're are clear expectations and the coach follows up on the consequences. In Pitino two plus years it seems like whatever his expectations are, he has a quick hook if you're not in line. He seems willing to sit Buggs, Mason and everyone else if the effort isn't there. He sat Dorsey down for missing a class or tutoring session. Whatever Lofton did, suppose will never know, Pitino made an example of him too. McNeil, he did the only thing you can do in that situation IMO, can't keep a guy like that around. I think Pitino's a coach that knows what he wants and he seems like the type that doesn't put up with any bull. His players don't seem to be quitting on him either, the underclassmen are taking their lumps having to play bigger roles than they're ready for because the upperclassmen just aren't good enough. I think as the young guys keep progressing, the transfers become eligible and next year's class bringing in more talent, there's still plenty of hope in the program, compared to say the 06 and 07 teams where the best players were the upperclassmen and we still stunk up the joint
 


Pitino started out at Minnesota pretty strong and his winning has tapered each year, this probably has more to do with the fact that he had his best talent the first year and it has progressively deteriorated sense then, part of that was the legacy Tubby left, a couple of really bad recruiting years and part was Pitino's fault, the transition year you can discard but his roster management the next year has been so bad that it added to the problem.

With the defections/problems last years recruiting class was marginal at best, hopefully this year's class will stay together, and next years things look to be turning upward. With improved talent I think you will see improved results, but he is still pretty inexperienced playing in a very tough conference, can he produce a top four conference finish in the next three years, maybe but it will be very tough. This year will be the low point, the issue is how much better will it get.

I guess I just have to brace myself for what is about to happen and keep my belief that things will start improving next year.
 

Just wondering if you go to many games or if by your handle if you live in Bemidji. If you watch the body language during hudles either he does not have their full attention or respect or he allows a loose huddle. Just my opinion but I sit very close. This year has been a little more stable but see Lofton, Martin, Mcniel the previous year. To me everything I see and hear screams in over his head.

bemidjigopher said:
If I had to guess we may have differing opinions on control. I view control in terms of if the kids are going to class, if they're buying into the mission, and if they're are clear expectations and the coach follows up on the consequences. In Pitino two plus years it seems like whatever his expectations are, he has a quick hook if you're not in line. He seems willing to sit Buggs, Mason and everyone else if the effort isn't there. He sat Dorsey down for missing a class or tutoring session. Whatever Lofton did, suppose will never know, Pitino made an example of him too. McNeil, he did the only thing you can do in that situation IMO, can't keep a guy like that around. I think Pitino's a coach that knows what he wants and he seems like the type that doesn't put up with any bull. His players don't seem to be quitting on him either, the underclassmen are taking their lumps having to play bigger roles than they're ready for because the upperclassmen just aren't good enough. I think as the young guys keep progressing, the transfers become eligible and next year's class bringing in more talent, there's still plenty of hope in the program, compared to say the 06 and 07 teams where the best players were the upperclassmen and we still stunk up the joint
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Went to BSU hence the Bemidji moniker. Live in MPLS and go to around five games a year. I am not a golden dunker like you so I don't sit behind the bench, usually behind a hoop. To me bad body language is a lack of confidence and when you're losing that tends to be contagious. I would be more concerned about effort and the players don't seem to be checked out, just lack of talent. Pitino needs to and I am sure does own the Martin blunder if he were pressed on it, but I guess I am not sure what else you want him to do in the McNeil situation. Keeping him around would've been toxic under the circumstances. If he can't get to the tourney with next years team than I'll agree he may be over his head, but I think he will have a good squad next year and I am willing to get through the muck of this year to see it through. There is no upperclassmen leadership on this team and unless you're Kentucky or duke, bot going to win relying on underclassmen
 




Was not trying to offend you at all was just curious if you go to games. I am not a golden dunker by any means either. I actually played fb for a year at Bemidji. As for Mcneil and Lofton he choose to recruit knuckleheads so that is on him as well. While the team will be bette(cant be much worse) they still will have a rough year in my opinion. Like you said while it is a good class it is not a win now class and also who will be a leader next year? Just dont think they make a huge jump next year.

bemidjigopher said:
Went to BSU hence the Bemidji moniker. Live in MPLS and go to around five games a year. I am not a golden dunker like you so I don't sit behind the bench, usually behind a hoop. To me bad body language is a lack of confidence and when you're losing that tends to be contagious. I would be more concerned about effort and the players don't seem to be checked out, just lack of talent. Pitino needs to and I am sure does own the Martin blunder if he were pressed on it, but I guess I am not sure what else you want him to do in the McNeil situation. Keeping him around would've been toxic under the circumstances. If he can't get to the tourney with next years team than I'll agree he may be over his head, but I think he will have a good squad next year and I am willing to get through the muck of this year to see it through. There is no upperclassmen leadership on this team and unless you're Kentucky or duke, bot going to win relying on underclassmen
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rivergopher said:
As for Mcneil and Lofton he choose to recruit knuckleheads so that is on him as well. While the team will be bette(cant be much worse) they still will have a rough year in my opinion. Like you said while it is a good class it is not a win now class and also who will be a leader next year? Just dont think they make a huge jump next year.
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How exactly would he have known McNeil was a knucklehead? Is this your 20/20 hindsight?
 

It is certainly on Pitino that he whiffed on Lofton, McNeal and Martin. Maybe Gaston too who knows. But Tubby also had two really poor recruiting classes after Andre Hollins' class which was part of the problem. (Already pointed out in this thread). But now everyone but Buggs is a Pitino kid so he needs to start coaching these kids up and needs to show improvement soon. Last year was a total failure in my book (with all the seniors, coming off the NIT championship) to not even make the NiT is embarrassing. I am willing to sit back on this year and ride it out. But next year Lynch and Fitzgerald better deliver, Coffey needs to be the stud he appears to be and all the players better take a step forward. If they don't then Pitino should be done.
 

Also per the thread title and the common practice by a small number of posters......personally I dislike it when people refer to coach as Little Ricky. Just disrespectful.
 

As is the case with Chip Kelly in Philly, bad players make good coaches lose jobs. Of course, Kelly ran all his studs out of town.

Pitino has tried to make a couple of home run signings with Gas and Konate. Trying to get a Dieng type like his dad did at Louisville. If Jonathon had been able to play here with Jarvis we may of seen better front court play, but we wouldn't have Murphy who was a sort of scramble recruit.

The two projects and the two transfers are a big cause for our record. I think he sacrificed the now for the future, so let's just hang in there and give him a chance. If he can free up another scholly for the Trent, Mar, and John class we could be looking very good in two years! And then we will see how good of a coach he is.
 

rivergopher said:
Was not trying to offend you at all was just curious if you go to games. I am not a golden dunker by any means either. I actually played fb for a year at Bemidji. As for Mcneil and Lofton he choose to recruit knuckleheads so that is on him as well. While the team will be bette(cant be much worse) they still will have a rough year in my opinion. Like you said while it is a good class it is not a win now class and also who will be a leader next year? Just dont think they make a huge jump next year.
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Not offended at all Always good to run into a fellow BSU Beaver. Again I think we just see things differently. I think Mcneil is 20/20 hindsight and it was handled the only way a coach should handle that. Lofton I can se your point he had baggage coming in, probably never know why he was dismissed. As for next year I think were a bubble team, not world beaters by any means. I think our back court will be good with Mason and Cofffey, with Dorsey and MCBreyer coming off the bench. Curry should be able to spell Murphy at the four and Lynch will give us the rim protector we desperately need this year. I am worried about the three, can Buggs step up and be a consistent senior, How good is Fitz? Can Gilbert or Hurt crack the rotation as a three point shooter? A lot of options will see who steps up. As for who will be the leader. I think they'll look to Mason when they need a bucket, he's the guy this year IMO, tough for a sophomore to take that responsibility, but I'll think he'll be better prepared for it as an upperclassmen. Always liked his poise
 

XMan said:
Also per the thread title and the common practice by a small number of posters......personally I dislike it when people refer to coach as Little Ricky. Just disrespectful.
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I agree X. I might add that it started very early in his tenure here.
 

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