If both are healthy, who do you wan to start: Gray or Shortell?

If both are healthy, who do you wan to start: Gray or Shortell?

  • Gray

    Votes: 90 61.6%

  • Shortell

    Votes: 56 38.4%
  • Total voters
    146
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afurry91 said:
That's irrelevant. The average fan is an idiot. In fact, the people who vote in those star tribune polls are hardly ever fans. I trust a gopher hole pole much more. This is one of the most negative boards i've seen. If gray is still being supported by the majority here, then I think starting him is the right decision.
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Do you believe the results of this poll will be used by Coach Kill to make his decision?
 



As tremendous of athlete that MG is, he does NOT have the prototypical QB IQ.
 

We run the multiple offense. If you don't have a QB that can do something with his legs, you're in trouble (see 58-0). WMU took some time to adjust because they game-planned to put 8 or 9 men in the box. Then all of a sudden, Shortell comes out slinging.
 


I'm not sure it matters much who we start, but I'd sure find a way to incorporate both into the game plan. Different skill sets, and could give opposing defensive coordinators a lot to think about. Need to get Q back healthy first.
 



station19 said:
I have a hunch it is not Coach Kill looking for help with his decision making.

Just a hunch though.
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I guess you must be right! I have been waiting by the phone for his call and he still hasn't called.
 



If we had a legitimate running threat, I could see the argument for Shortell.

I think against most Big 10 teams, if we have Shortell in at QB, we are essentially going to become a passing team. I think we actually have a smaller playbook with Shortell than Gray.

He was fantastic yesterday though.
 

BHgrappler said:
I'm not sure it matters much who we start, but I'd sure find a way to incorporate both into the game plan. Different skill sets, and could give opposing defensive coordinators a lot to think about. Need to get Q back healthy first.
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That will never fly with GopherHoler's! Even though it is always good to have options your suggestion makes way too much sense to actually be considered here.
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
Oh!! That's right!! Almost forgot! You're right on the money though, a true freshman starting at the Big House pretty much the same as a senior starting at Sam Boyd.
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I do not see why you are so upset with me. I am simply saying 60% of a game against a team who gameplanned for a completely different QB is not reason to crown a guy the next coming of anything.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
If we had a legitimate running threat, I could see the argument for Shortell.

I think against most Big 10 teams, if we have Shortell in at QB, we are essentially going to become a passing team. I think we actually have a smaller playbook with Shortell than Gray.

He was fantastic yesterday though.
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I agree it was very encouraging. Last year after people saw more of Max, he had less success. Hopefully that won't be the case this year.
Max does run a little better than people give him credit for.


One of my biggest complaints is that Limegrover seems to simplify the game for Max by letting him do a lot of play action and rolls, where most of Grays passing is 5 step and 3 step.
I know Gray is a senior and he should be able to handle more, but it would be nice if Limegrover put gray into those easier throwing situations as well. You would think Shortell would be the dropback passer and Gray would throw on the move. Limegrover lets Max throw on the move quite a bit more just from my casual observation.
 




Rosemountian said:
I agree it was very encouraging. Last year after people saw more of Max, he had less success. Hopefully that won't be the case this year.
Max does run a little better than people give him credit for.


One of my biggest complaints is that Limegrover seems to simplify the game for Max by letting him do a lot of play action and rolls, where most of Grays passing is 5 step and 3 step.
I know Gray is a senior and he should be able to handle more, but it would be nice if Limegrover put gray into those easier throwing situations as well. You would think Shortell would be the dropback passer and Gray would throw on the move. Limegrover lets Max throw on the move quite a bit more just from my casual observation.
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Here's what I think:

- The coaching staff clearly is not comfortable with Gray's ability to make very many of the throws in their offense
- Gray bailing from well-protected pockets to try to make a play with his feet, and CONSISTENTLY not looking downfield after he breaks the pocket is maddening to me
- I think Gray just does too much free-lancing, doing things on his own, like it was some kind of HS game
- I'm not enough of an expert but it doesn't appear to me that he's very proficient at the read option
- I just don't think Gray has the head for the position, as harsh as that sounds
- I agree, I think Shortell can run better than some give him credit for
- Contrary to what some think, I think Shortell HELPS the run game by removing a defender (or two) from the box defensively
- Shortell completes throws within the rhythm and timing of the offense, to the right receiver, and usually on target.

I'm more disappointed with what it seems Gray is incapable of than I am excited with what I think Shortell is capable of. Shortell will make plenty of mistakes this year, no doubt about it. He's a true sophomore and there will be a learning curve.

I'm not pining for Shortell to start because of how awesome I think he could be. It's because I know what we have with Gray. He's a very limited QB and against Big Ten defenses, I think they will eat him alive if/when he can't throw.

I'm not impressed with Shortell because he's completed a bunch of passes and throws a nice ball. The offense has a flow when he's in there. He completes passes on TIME, he moves well in the pocket, he makes a decision to throw the ball quickly and when he does, he delivers it with conviction.

At this point, if offensive line doesn't play with a little more consistency, neither QB will have much success against better athletes and better defenses. That much I DO know.
 


Rosemountian said:
I do not see why you are so upset with me. I am simply saying 60% of a game against a team who gameplanned for a completely different QB is not reason to crown a guy the next coming of anything.
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That's a fair point, but 40% of a game where the only score you generate is on a drive starting on the other team's 8 yard line and you turn it over inside you own 20 while playing against a weak opponent is a problem.
 




It goes back to the old axiom that a starter doesn't lose his job because of an injury. When Gray is ready, he has to go back in as first string, and he will either succeed or fail.

I'll grant you that Shortell is a better thrower than Gray, but that doesn't mean he's a better quarterback in the offense that coach Kill wants to run.
 

Start Gray. The problems he creates for the opposing defense is significant.
 

I was just trying to look up a line for the game next week at vegasinsider.com, and it listed both Shortell and Gray as out for next weekend. I googled Shortell and could not find any independent confirmation, so I am assuming that is an editorial error by vegasinsider. Can anyone confrim that they are wrong?
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
I was just trying to look up a line for the game next week at vegasinsider.com, and it listed both Shortell and Gray as out for next weekend. I googled Shortell and could not find any independent confirmation, so I am assuming that is an editorial error by vegasinsider. Can anyone confrim that they are wrong?
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They are wrong regarding Shortell - Error on their part.
 

Looks like I'm the only one who thinks the best option would be to let them both play at QB. Teams have had success rotating QBs before. They both offer something different.
 

btowngopher said:
Looks like I'm the only one who thinks the best option would be to let them both play at QB. Teams have had success rotating QBs before. They both offer something different.
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Travis Cole and Abdul-Kaliq (his freshmen year, maybe sophomore too) come to mind. But that was mostly because both were inconsistent at the time, one would look great and the other terrible and it would switch from game to game if I remember correctly.

Sent from my PLAYSTATION PHONE using tapatalk
 

BHgrappler said:
I'm not sure it matters much who we start, but I'd sure find a way to incorporate both into the game plan. Different skill sets, and could give opposing defensive coordinators a lot to think about. Need to get Q back healthy first.
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I like playing both, they're so unique in skill sets, I can see the benefit of doing a combo thing. Like last game, clearly we needed a spark in the passing game, and Max brought it. I thought there were also times though, later on, when we could have used the legs of Gray. As the senior leader, I'd probably start the game off with Gray, our first drives have been pretty good lately from my recollection, we move the ball pretty well. But I would definitely give Max some burn out there. Plus, gives teams more to think about in preparation.
 

Another case of "Backup Quarterback Syndrome."

If the starting QB isn't perfect, a certain % of the fans always want to see the backup QB get the job, because the backup quarterback has mystical powers that will allow him to out-perform the starter in game situations - EVEN THOUGH that same backup has not performed well enough in practice, in the eyes of the coaches, to beat out the starter.

Please list 1 coach in the country who would willingly start a lesser player at QB...........Not going to happen.........the coaches are going to start the QB who (in their expert opinion) gives the team the best chance to win. Does anyone honestly think that Kill and Limegrover are sitting around, saying to themselves: "Shortell is really a better QB, but we're going to start Gray, even though he doesn't give us a better chance of winning the game."

The starter is the starter for a reason, and the backup is the backup for a reason.

I fully expect that, when Gray is healthy, he will be the starter again - no matter what Shortell does in the ensuring games.

And I fully expect that, if Shortell goes out and stinks up the joint against Syracuse, there will be people on this board next week screaming for Nelson to be the starter.
 

everybody knows my name said:
It goes back to the old axiom that a starter doesn't lose his job because of an injury. When Gray is ready, he has to go back in as first string, and he will either succeed or fail.

I'll grant you that Shortell is a better thrower than Gray, but that doesn't mean he's a better quarterback in the offense that coach Kill wants to run.
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+1 I couldn't agree more if I tried. Regarding some of the other posts, there are too many variables to say for sure what would have happened against W. Michigan if Gray would have stayed in the game.
 

STPGopher said:
+1 I couldn't agree more if I tried. Regarding some of the other posts, there are too many variables to say for sure what would have happened against W. Michigan if Gray would have stayed in the game.
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What would have happened if Gray had stayed in the game or what is going to happen against Syracuse is nowhere near as important as how you treat a highly recruited QB who made a huge commitment to the Minnesota Gophers and stuck with the program through a very rocky couple of years when the program struggled and he received a huge amount of very public criticism and personal insults. Gray deserves the appreciation and loyalty of every Gopher fan for how he has conducted himself and what he has done in his Gopher career so far. His leadership and determination during the victories over Iowa during the last two years will be among my favorite Gopher memories of all time. I will remain firmly in Grays corner when he comes back from his injury. This is college football after all, and it should have values and loyalties that have never existed in pro football.
 

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